October 2010 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Hallo Pharoers.. namespaces in the system level ?
by StÃ©phane Ducasse Oct. 11, 2010

Oct. 11, 2010

On Oct 11, 2010, at 5:25 PM, Nick Papoylias wrote: > > > On Mon, Oct 11, 2010 at 5:11 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > > > For example there currently exist a setter in the class side for 'migratting' in a new environment, that just alters the class knowledge about the new namespace and does not erase it's record from the old namespace. > where? > > Class>>environment: (as far as I understand the class changes it's environment, without erasing itself from the old one and adding itself to the new one) clearly a bug. Cna you open a ticket? if you could write a test it would be excellent. In fact this method was never build with multiple environment in mind :) > > Is this intented ? What is the underlying design ? Should we add an environment: setter in the subclass message, so that we integrate namespaces with the current Browser ? Should Behavior always return Smalltalk globals, or there should be a setter to be able to migrate a whole hierarchy of classes elsewhere ? > > Normally a class should be able to return its environment and it can be different to Smalltalk globals, for example > we want to have to environments so that we can load Opal in one to modify the other Opal compiler that we will running. > > Up to now marcus was using the old compiler to compile the new but in the future we only want one compiler and still been able to > change it. > > Stef > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

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Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo by Example has moved to github
by StÃ©phane Ducasse Oct. 11, 2010

Oct. 11, 2010

Ok for me do the simplest thing for you. This was just a meta remark. Stef On Oct 11, 2010, at 5:32 PM, Lukas Renggli wrote: >>> Excellent, can I also push the Seaside Book there? >> >> If you want. Now I do not see the interest of git when we use it as svn. And I would prefer to host the book on an inria server >> because I know that this is backup by someboyd else than me. >> and for a book I do not want to fork it (or people can fork it but I do not care of what they will do with their fork). > > The problem is that the sync with Pier does not work with SVN. You can > only update and backup by using Git with the SVN backend. > > Lukas > > -- > Lukas Renggli > www.lukas-renggli.ch > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

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[Pharo-project] Squeak/Pharo port of Xtreams moved
by Nicolas Cellier Oct. 11, 2010

Oct. 11, 2010

After Julian demand, I moved Squeak/Pharo port of Xtreams to http://www.squeaksource.com/Xtreams.html Sorry for the inconvenience, but it's better to do it now. Please update your links. Nicolas

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[Pharo-project] License question
by Schwab,Wilhelm K Oct. 11, 2010

Oct. 11, 2010

Stef, Let's go forward in time. NativeBoost, Alien or FFI provide callbacks, I do some adaptation on my end, and out comes a pretty capable wrapper for the GNU Scientific Library. That sentence trivializes a LOT of work :( Details aside, is the wrapper code itself affected by GPL, or is it merely something unrelated that happens to invoke GSL if the latter is present on a system? What implications would that have for putting the wrapper in the inbox? This won't happen next week or next month, but depending on how easy it is to get going with callbacks, it shouldn't be years either. Bill

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Re: [Pharo-project] Compiler pedantic about ifNotNil: argument
by StÃ©phane Ducasse Oct. 11, 2010

Oct. 11, 2010

> personnally I do not like this form >> What does it do? >> >>> process ifNotNil: #terminate. >> >> >> for me it means passes the symbol #terminate as argument to the method ifNotNil: >> If it has a more magical behavior then I do not know it. >> >> Stef > > It's exactly the same as using collection do: #something. > > FWIW, in 1.2 we already included the compiler changes Levente suggested to me to remove this restriction, so > > nil ifNotNil: #squared -> nil > 4 ifNotNil: #squared -> 16. This is still not really readable compared to 4 ifNotNil: [:rec | rec squared] For select: #even why not Now to me this looks like a hack and again it works because now Symbol are valuable objects. Too many hacks will only make the system more hackish. And especially the iftrue: 'foo' ifFalse: 'zork' In Smalltalk this is simple you ut bracket when you do not know if a part should/will be executed. Now with such change this is not the case anymore. I think that we are focusing on the wrong point. Changing the language that way does not bring anything really useful. And I would veto such usage in the core for consistency reason. Stef

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Re: [Pharo-project] Compiler pedantic about ifNotNil: argument
by StÃ©phane Ducasse Oct. 11, 2010

Oct. 11, 2010

I think that for typing in a transcript experessions when you want to experiment with something selectors are fun but not in method body. But I know that this is not a really good argument. Just feeling. May be we get trapped in our way of thinking. >>>>>> > I personally don't like the ifTrue:ifFalse: related changes, though it's a logical change. I probably won't use that feature though. But I like the monadic block <-> keyword selector substitution. Maybe the best is to add a setting/preference to the compiler.

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Re: [Pharo-project] Hallo Pharoers.. namespaces in the system level ?
by StÃ©phane Ducasse Oct. 11, 2010

Oct. 11, 2010

Hi guys there is a HUGE HUGE HUGE difference between (1) namespace at the language level and we do not want that the way german did it. Give us some times and we will try different solutions and see what come out (2) systemDictionary at the infrastructure level. We are working on that since Squeak Kernel Cleaning Project here we want the tools to be able to use another environment so that we can - bootstrap the compiler with itself - load different version of code (for Moose) to build report on Pharo 1.2 from pharo 1.1 - bootstrap the kernel - build atomic loading. We are working on 2 and this is what nick needs. I will not talk about namespace at the lnaguage level. No time for that. Stef

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[Pharo-project] Hallo Pharoers.. namespaces in the system level ?
by Nick Papoylias Oct. 11, 2010

Oct. 11, 2010

*Hallo to all, * I am starting my Ph.D on 'languages and environments for autonomous robotics' -- and pharo will be a huge part of it. I am currently playing around with the system (to get the feel of it..) and testing it's programming tools in the context of different namespaces / environments. Specifically I am trying to find out what the implications of having a remote environment over rST for e.g (to browse, debug e.t.c). *Any pointers to related work, suggestions e.t.c are welcomed. * So my question: *Is anybody currently working on integrating namespaces in the system level ? I may have one or two questions and suggestions to make. *Thank you very much ! Nick Papoulias* *

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Oct. 11, 2010

Welcome and any help is welcome. On Oct 11, 2010, at 4:22 PM, Johannes Rasche wrote: > Thanks Alain, Stef and Mariano for fast answer. > > I assume that will help. > > Possibly I can contribute to improve documentation by carefull reading, trying and so on > > Johannes > > Am 11.10.2010 um 14:51 schrieb Mariano Martinez Peck: > >> >> >> 2010/10/11 Johannes Rasche <johannesrasche(a)mac.com> >> Hi Folks, >> >> I just wanted to install my work on version 1.1 and was surprised >> to discover changes which leave me alone to find out for myself how to change my code : >> >> WorldMenu (I wrote a subclass of PasteUpMorph) >> NaturalLanguageTranslator (what is the "gettext package" mentioned in the class comment? - cannot find a menu to edit translations - hidden sowhere?) >> >> >> http://book.pharo-project.org/book/Localisation/ >> >> possibly more surprises to come .... >> >> some backwardcompatibilty support would have been nice >> and >> some examples >> >> But I like to point out as well, that Pharo is improving from release to release - thanks for that !!!! >> >> Thanks in advance >> >> >> >> >> Johannes Rasche >> Hagelberger Str. 56 >> 10965 Berlin >> >> mail: johannesrasche(a)me.com >> skype: johannesrasche >> www: http://myNeat.de >> fon: +49-30-7469 4425 (skypeIn) >> fax: +49-30-315 66 821 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project

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Oct. 11, 2010

> > For example there currently exist a setter in the class side for 'migratting' in a new environment, that just alters the class knowledge about the new namespace and does not erase it's record from the old namespace. where? > Is this intented ? What is the underlying design ? Should we add an environment: setter in the subclass message, so that we integrate namespaces with the current Browser ? Should Behavior always return Smalltalk globals, or there should be a setter to be able to migrate a whole hierarchy of classes elsewhere ? Normally a class should be able to return its environment and it can be different to Smalltalk globals, for example we want to have to environments so that we can load Opal in one to modify the other Opal compiler that we will running. Up to now marcus was using the old compiler to compile the new but in the future we only want one compiler and still been able to change it. Stef

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