August 2020 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] Text-Editing UI

by Russ Whaley

Yes, I played with my daughter's chromebook - was considering doing just what you're suggesting - a few weeks later it died - well not completely - but is finicky enough that she can't use it for her masters work any longer (too unreliable) - so she went back to a 2013 MacBookPro... (they just work). I recently bought a new iPad Pro - so after that investment, I'd really like to stick with it :) I do some drone piloting, guitar playing through my new Spark amp by positiveGrid... and the iPad is the right tool for me. I could have gone android - but I tired of the constant - which app / device supports which candy-of-the-month... hehe, I digress. Mostly, I just want one device that does it all... I could buy a MacBookPro or Air or whatever, but that doesn't work with my drone... I know, I know... first world problems. Thanks for the reminder on the Chromebook. Who knows, I may be back to that in a few months. On Sun, Aug 2, 2020 at 4:20 PM tbrunz <wild.ideas(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Not exactly the answer you're looking for, but... > > Take a look at the latest Chromebooks. They are *awesome*. Beats iPads & > iOS! > > There are "tablet" Chromebooks (the keyboard folds all the way underneath > the touchscreen, and is de-activated), as well as keyboard-detachable > models, as well as "clamshell" ultrabook models. > > Otherwise, you have a tablet with a sensible way to type on; many models > have touchscreens anyway. (Mine does, and I variously use the touchscreen, > the touchpad, and the arrow keys to scroll content.) > > Here's the home run: You can enable "Linux containers" on newer > Chromebooks, and then you can install *any* Linux app in the container. > Yes, including Pharo Launcher. > > So you can run Pharo images on Chromebooks, and of course program on your > Chromebook tablets in Pharo. > > Save your iPads for watching YouTube.. (Watch your YouTube Pharo tutorials > while you program Pharo on your Chromebook. :^) > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > > -- Russ Whaley whaley.russ(a)gmail.com

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Text-Editing UI

by tbrunz

Look at the keyboard -- that's a Chromebook, not a WinTel or Linux laptop. <http://forum.world.st/file/t372161/Pharo-on-Chromebook_2019-0127.jpg> That was about a year & a half ago. -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Text-Editing UI

by tbrunz

Not exactly the answer you're looking for, but... Take a look at the latest Chromebooks. They are *awesome*. Beats iPads & iOS! There are "tablet" Chromebooks (the keyboard folds all the way underneath the touchscreen, and is de-activated), as well as keyboard-detachable models, as well as "clamshell" ultrabook models. Otherwise, you have a tablet with a sensible way to type on; many models have touchscreens anyway. (Mine does, and I variously use the touchscreen, the touchpad, and the arrow keys to scroll content.) Here's the home run: You can enable "Linux containers" on newer Chromebooks, and then you can install *any* Linux app in the container. Yes, including Pharo Launcher. So you can run Pharo images on Chromebooks, and of course program on your Chromebook tablets in Pharo. Save your iPads for watching YouTube.. (Watch your YouTube Pharo tutorials while you program Pharo on your Chromebook. :^) -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Text-Editing UI

by Russ Whaley

+1 - platform specific defaults. Also, is there any document anyone can point me to on why Pharo is not viable for iOS? I have an iPad Pro and I'd LOVE to be able to code/test and run my apps when I travel... my old MacBookPro is getting long-in-the-tooth. On Sun, Aug 2, 2020 at 1:01 PM tbrunz <wild.ideas(a)gmail.com> wrote: > It might be best to have this be configurable/customizable for each user > (which is what I think you're getting at). > > The question is what should the default "out of the box" behavior be? > There > are conventions, although they're not exactly "standardized" (as they > should > be). > > Most of us have "muscle memory" for many of these operations: Go forward > one > word, select a paragraph, expectations of where the cursor will be when you > go forward/backward word-by-word, etc. and I don't think anyone enjoys > having to learn a different way for every tool they use. > > So the default probably should follow the most common conventions, while > still allowing a fairly easy way to change it to suit each user. > > The best approach might be to have the default adapt itself automatically > to > the platform the VM is running on, so that Windows users get Windows > conventions, Mac users get Mac conventions, Linux users get Linux > conventions. > > -t > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > > -- Russ Whaley whaley.russ(a)gmail.com

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Extract-method refactoring erratic behavior in Pharo 8

by Tim Mackinnon

I think these ones should be testable quite easily - I wrote (when prompted by Stef) a series of tests for the text selection expansion commands which use a similar ast/node based inferencing - so the refactorings should be written with an ast passed to them along with cursor and text selection positioning and that is all testable. (if its not this way, we should change it so it is unit testable like this). If I can get some time (hopefully my newish job starts to lighten up a bit), I will try and have a look if no-one else has stepped in. I'm quite passionate in making pharo more "intellij fluid-like" so we can have an enjoyable keyboard centric, and fast modern refactoring experience as we have all the right tooling to do this really well. Tim On Sun, 2 Aug 2020, at 3:45 PM, tbrunz wrote: > I found the same problem only yesterday when I tried "Extract method" in > Pharo 8 (for the first time). > > Comprehensive UI tests would be a great thing. But complicated to create. > Like writing tutorials for GUI-based applications. ;^) > > Is there a way to emulate a GUI user and the actions of mouse moves & clicks > (as well as keypresses)? And to capture the results of pointing, clicking, > right-click menu selections, etc? > > Is there a UI testing framework for Pharo that includes this? If not, > should we start building one? > > How much of the above is tied directly to Spec2 and how much is part of the > core elements of Pharo? > > -t > > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > >

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Intermediate-Level Tutorials for Pharo

by Russ Whaley

Well, the very next step in the tutorial says: How does this look? Now we can open our task list manager as follows: TODOApplication new run. However, TODOApplication has not yet been connected to anything... displaying the UI that is depicted in the tutorial is not achievable at this point... [image: image.png] So, at this point I have to stop. I've had similar issues with IMDB and other tutorials where very important steps have been left out and I cannot achieve the results depicted. Some I'm able to figure out, many others I'm just not experienced enough to know how best to proceed... sorry. Another item I noticed - as I was interested in the onActivation / onDeactivation... there appears to be a misspelling in the instvar in the SpCheckBoxTableColumn class - it says onDesactivation instead of onDeactivation - there is an added 's'. For now, I can change the tutorial to match the class - however, if you attempt to save the code in the tutorial, it would error. I'm really looking forward to completing this tutorial - there looks to be some great things I want to learn... but I can't get past the first few issues :( Russ On Sun, Aug 2, 2020 at 2:22 PM Russ Whaley <whaley.russ(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Here are a couple of items with my first 5 minutes with the TODO > tutorial... > > TODOListPresenter >> initializePresenters > > todoListPresenter := self newTable > addColumn: ((SpCheckBoxTableColumn evaluated: [:task | task isDone]) width: 20); > addColumn: (SpStringTableColumn title: 'Title' evaluated: [:task | task title]); > yourself. > > self layout: (SpBoxLayout newVertical > add: todoListPresenter; > yourself) > > > In this portion (Showing Tasks) - it does not define todoListPresenter.... > is it a local or a missed instVar. I tried it first as a local to enable > save, but then... > > TODOListPresenter >> updatePresenter > > todoListPresenter items: TODOTask selectAll asOrderedCollection > > > todoListPresenter isn't available for updatePresenter... so I'm assuming > it must be an instvar? I created accessors, then changed all the > todoListPresenter references to use the accessors (below). > > TODOListPresenter >> initializePresenters > > self todoListPresenter: (self newTable > addColumn: ((SpCheckBoxTableColumn evaluated: [:task | task isDone]) width: 20); > addColumn: (SpStringTableColumn title: 'Title' evaluated: [:task | task title]); > yourself). > > self layout: (SpBoxLayout newVertical > add: self todoListPresenter; > yourself) > > and... > > TODOListPresenter >> updatePresenter > > self todoListPresenter items: TODOTask selectAll asOrderedCollection > > > Also, in the first example - task isDone needs to be defined (and might be > defined later in the tutorial) - I'm assuming > SpCheckBoxTableColumn>>evaluated: is expecting a boolean, or do I need to > convert this somehow? I can check all these things out - but just curious > if I'm missing something? > > TODOTask >> done > > ^ done > > TODOTask >> isDone > > ^ self done > > > I'll go through a bit more and update you on my progress. Ted, I also > hope to get to take a look at Zebra today :) > > > > > On Sun, Aug 2, 2020 at 2:07 PM StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> > wrote: > >> >> >> On 2 Aug 2020, at 19:51, tbrunz <wild.ideas(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> I've been thinking lately that it would be nice to expand the number of >> Pharo tutorials we have available. But rather than (or along with) >> creating >> more "beginner" level tutorials, I'd like to see some good "intermediate" >> level Pharo tutorials. >> >> >> Me too :) >> >> >> Let's do it, then. I'll volunteer to do most of the work. :^) >> >> >> I will review anything you write :) >> >> >> My hope is that participating in this will make me capable of creating >> advanced tutorials all by myself. >> >> >> I usually like to write to learn and dump what I learned. >> >> >> I think that programmers who already know the Pharo >> syntax and messaging semantics could benefit from more advanced tutorials >> that demonstrate how to develop "real world" Pharo code for "real world" >> processing needs. >> >> >> Yes yes I would love that. >> >> >> That was part of my motivation for creating a Pharo app to solve the Zebra >> Puzzle. First, of course, I wanted to solve it. ;^) >> >> >> I will send you some feeedback and PR. >> >> >> What I'm talking about is something that assumes you know the language, >> the >> basics of the IDE (but not necessarily how to leverage its capabilities >> to >> aid development), and the basics of the foundation classes (but not its >> details). I'd like a tutorial for intermediate Pharo programmers who >> want >> to become experts with Pharo. Something that can show you how to apply >> the >> tools of the IDE and the features of the language and base classes to >> create >> solutions that solve complex problems. >> >> >> do you have ideas? >> >> >> I do! >> >> As I started building the Logic Puzzle app, it occurred to me that I could >> probably find several different, common structures in OOP (specifically, >> Pharo) to add to the solution. And then each would be its own example of >> "what real Pharo code looks like". I.e., be good examples. >> >> But first, I needed to explore "how to do it in Pharo" for myself, which >> naturally would have me working the IDE strongly. >> >> Then I thought, the entire application can/should be an example, so it >> should be a tutorial. >> >> That means that I need more than just a completed application (that's >> "just >> an example"). To be a *tutorial*, it means starting from scratch, showing >> how to approach the solution, how to start a Pharo app, how to use the >> IDE, >> how to write tests, how to refactor code, etc. >> >> Then I thought, this needs a GUI. Either a Spec2 UI or a web app UI (with >> Seaside or Teapot). But I would need help with that! So I'll start by >> creating a message-based solution, and maybe get help to add a UI later. >> >> I did some prototyping, then got what I think might be a good code >> structure >> (by version 4; it took a while to "think pure OOP"; old habits are hard to >> fight against). It runs, it works. >> >> But.. Is it "good Pharo code"? I'm not experienced enough to answer that >> question. I need a code review, criticism, guidance. Point me in the >> right >> direction and I'll keep working on it, and start thinking about how to >> express the "meta" elements (how to use the IDE to make/test the code, >> etc.). >> >> What does the community think of this idea? >> >> >> I love it. I did Pharo by example so that I can get of rid of the beginner >> >> parts. >> >> After I did learning OOP and Pharo with style so that I do not have to >> talk >> >> about it >> >> again. >> >> So definitively. >> >> >> Okay, great. I'll do most of the work. But I need help... >> >> I don't want to go any further without someone much more experienced than >> I >> am to review what I have and let me know what I'm doing right & what I'm >> doing "no quite so right". Yes, it runs, it works -- but that's *not* >> good >> enough. The goal here isn't to "hack out a solution and move on", the >> goal >> is to "create an example and tutorial that's high enough quality to use to >> teach Pharo to other people". I don't want to be teaching *my* bad >> habits! >> >> Also, I know next to nothing about Spec2 or Seaside/Teapot. I just know >> that I need to learn it, and I need to use it to give my tutorial a UI (or >> two). Newcomers will show up wanting to learn Pharo, and they need to be >> reassured that they can create nice (enough) UIs without a huge effort. >> (Not everyone is a command line hacker, and end-users certainly don't want >> to be.) >> >> The more I learn (from you), the more I can be independent, and the more >> tutorials I could produce -- without a lot of help. I'm willing to do the >> work, because that will help make me a Pharo "master programmer". (I >> don't >> want to be a hack, and I can't really be a trainer if I'm just a hack >> myself.) >> >> I'll pay back the community by helping to attract and advance more >> developers' skills. I just have to have the more advanced knowledge & >> skills myself. So, train the (future) trainer, anyone?? >> >> -Ted >> >> >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html >> >> >> -------------------------------------------- >> StÃ©phane Ducasse >> http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr / http://www.pharo.org >> 03 59 35 87 52 >> Assistant: Aurore Dalle >> FAX 03 59 57 78 50 >> TEL 03 59 35 86 16 >> S. Ducasse - Inria >> 40, avenue Halley, >> Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, BÃ¢t.A, Park Plaza >> Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650 >> France >> >> > > -- > Russ Whaley > whaley.russ(a)gmail.com > -- Russ Whaley whaley.russ(a)gmail.com

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Working directory and image directory

by tbrunz

You might like these, too (for newbies): https://gist.github.com/tbrunz/f1d74353bdff7d40031b10d4220daaa9 https://gist.github.com/tbrunz/02d9a2f62053f8dfa4c229e5075d6796 -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Class side vs instance side (variables and methods)

by tbrunz

Maybe more to the point: You do not want to *code a dependency on* what the implementing class may do as far as the returned result. :^) "Brittle code" will eventually break. Murphy's Law says that it will break at the worst possible time for you to have to deal with it. :^D -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Working directory and image directory

by tbrunz

Hi Russ, No, I haven't submitted it. I figured it would be good practice for you to do so! -Ted -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 2, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Working directory and image directory

by Russ Whaley

Ted, Thank you very much for these detailed instructions! I have copied them out for future use. I can see I'm going to very much enjoy your tutorials :) I hope to have time today to submit a couple issues I've run across. Did I see you submitted the workingDirectory/root bug? Thanks, Russ On Sun, Aug 2, 2020 at 11:50 AM tbrunz <wild.ideas(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Russ, > > Here's a link; I created a GitHub gist in your honor: > > https://gist.github.com/tbrunz/4209026fabc44c5baf0a502f677b708c > > Please provide comments, improvements, corrections, or anything that will > make it clearer for others who are in the same boat. > > Thanks! > -Ted > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > > -- Russ Whaley whaley.russ(a)gmail.com

Aug. 2, 2020