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Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo image crash with Seaside App

by BrunoBB

Hi, It seems that the problem is fixed. Not sure why Pharo image went freeze because it was a Seaside problem. (maybe i should execute the same on GemStone/S to see the result). Also not sure why Control + "-" did not halt the execution. Even in one occasion make Windows 8 fail. The problem was the reuse of already created components in as argument of call. editComponent := WAEditComponent new. self call: editComponent. This inst var was store in a parent and at some point instead of creating a new component for the call we call again: self call: editComponent. After changing all call to a new fresh WAEditComponent the problem was fixed. It seems that Seaside went into a infinite rendering loop (after all :) because the already instantiated element. Any thought about this is welcome because i did not totally close this issue :) regards, bruno -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

April 10, 2019

Pharo image crash with Seaside App

by BrunoBB

Hi, Version: Pharo 7.0 OS: Windows 8. Which is the best way to get any error description when the Pharo image crash ? PharoDebug.log - does not have any information stderr - does not have any information Stoping the execution is not working ("Control" + "-") https://stackoverflow.com/questions/24788115/if-my-pharo-image-goes-into-an… The problem is a "self call: WAMyComponent new". ComponentA call ComponentB, then ComponentB call ComponentC, and last (here is the problem) ComponentC call ComponentA again. Is not an infinite loop because this cycle goes only one (well not even one because the last call crash the image). WASession allInstances size. "answer 6" WACache allInstances size. "answer 0" Maybe there is an issue in the call sequence with Seaside but this should not crash the image. Researching on this right now ... regards, bruno -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

April 10, 2019

tracking pharo environment activity

by Urbieta Matias

Hi, I would like to track the user's activity while he uses pharo. That is, I need to track if the user open a browser, access a given class definition, modify a method, etc. Is there any feature available? if not, what pharo hooks should I consider? Best regards -- Dr. Matias Urbieta LIFIA - UNLP Calle 50 y 150 - 1900 - La Plata - Buenos Aires - Argentina Phone: (+54) 221 4236585

April 10, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] Slots and Metalink

by Marcus Denker

> On 4 Apr 2019, at 15:04, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Steven: > > Oh! I was unaware of these methods under reflection protocol! I manage to make it work, and it is simply AWESOME!! :) > > Marcus: > > I wanted to intercept the store generally, with any kind of slot, kind of an AOP aproach. I did this: > > | slotLink | > > slotLink := (MetaLink new > metaObject: [Transcript show: 'ihaaaa!!!!']; > selector: #value; > arguments: #(); > control: #before). > > > > TestObject link: slotLink toSlotNamed: #b option: #write. > > > And it worked like a charm! By you explanation, this would lead to some performance penality, but it seems a really powerfull mechanism to me, and it's performance should be similar to that of extending a Slot, no? > >From a bytecode perspective it is the same as if you would make a Slot *and* implement bytecode generation. (with the slight overhead of the block execution). So yes, a nice solution. In general, MetaLinks are nice if you want to do âmagicâ that are not supposed to be visible. Making a Slot subclass makes a change more explicit. Both have their value, depending on the situation. Marcus

April 10, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] [OT] (slightly) What makes other dialects "enjoyable" for you? (WAS: difference between double dispatch...)

by Esteban Maringolo

I love this attitude coming from the very core of the Pharo dev-team, which felt to me as being blind to what other dialects were doing or did in the past, and these is days seems to be catching up quite quickly. Dolphin Smalltalk: Practically all "widgets" (aka "views") are the native ones, and they behave as expected by a Windows user, both in terms of shortcuts, styling, etc. It feels like a Smalltalk built by Microsoft itself. The MVP approach to build GUIs is, in my experience, the best of all available options, and the way the Presenters and Views are factored is great, for what I could see, Spec 2.0 is going in that direction and I like. Some could say this would restrict you from building "different" apps, but IMO that is another layer that must be built on top of the basic building blocks. It doesn't use pragmas (I particularly don't like them much), but there are "hooks" everywhere to add items to tooling menus, etc. The consistency and coherence of the whole system is outstanding, not only in terms of UI, and I think it is the result of two great developers (and I would argue only one in terms of UI), working for over a decade in refining, trimming and polishing every corner of the app while also using it for their own personal and business developments. Dolphin had both a commercial purpose and a utility purpose, the first as a vendor to fulfill developer needs, but the others for them as a business to develop their own applications. So in the end they were profiting from scratching their own itch. So what I would love to have in Pharo from Dolphin? The UX consistency that a workspace context menu is as similar as the one in the browser code or the one in the Debugger (e.g. Why I can't do an "extract method" refactoring within the debugger?). The concept of a SessionManager is great also, you could "deploy" your image to have a session manager that will handle headless command line application, a full blown UI or even be used an out of process COM server. There are many cons, but we're focusing only in what I'd like. I developed with Dolphin for more than +10 years , building business critical application with it. VisualWorks I use it every day and don't miss much from it, except that the UI is snappier than the current in Pharo. There is no lag the interaction with most widgets. Certain things such as breakpoints and bread and butter things "just work". What I would like in Pharo from VW?: Multiple windows, robust tooling and snappier UI. I don't miss the namespacing, because I understand there are better things in the makings for Pharo :) VisualAge/VAST: I have only used it up to v5.5, but the "Interrupt" button it has worked, I never understood how it was implemented, but no matter how tight the recursion loop was, you hit that "stop everything" button, and everything stopped. For those that don't know, the VAST IDE had an external small window that just had a button, that worked as a panic button to halt the execution of the image. Very much like the [Alt]+[.] of Pharo, but, again, it worked magically. What I would like in Pharo from VAST?: THAT BUTTON. :D Smalltalk/X It always feelt alien to me and it is more an "utility" dialect for themselves that they happened to make public. The nicest thing I found is that it had multiple windows where each window has it's own process! This is very much like Chromium/Chrome works, where you can kill a single tab and keep the other tabs working. What I would like: That capability, although I think this would require an overhaul of the current VM. Cuis Smalltalk: It is the most "approachable" of the Squeak spin-offs, it feels like the most "Dolphin like" of the them as in it is the only that can be understood as a whole by a single person and whose tools can be learnt by inference. They recently added LiveTyping and other "live info" capabilities <https://twitter.com/HernanWilkinson/status/1087325709289357312> than, AFAIU, can be easily added to Pharo as well as long as they add a few extensions to the VM. What I would like: LiveTyping and friends. Summarizing: There are many things out there, but even so, I find Pharo the most enjoyable of all existing dialects, and everyday when I come back to it to work on some personal project I notice how far it has gone from most of the above. But sometimes I enjoy it as I enjoy working out or playing golf: I enjoy it but not without effort and some pain from my side, maybe I finish the day saying I need to find an alternative and then the next day I'm there wanting to use it again. :) Regards, Esteban A. Maringolo El miÃ©., 10 abr. 2019 a las 3:26, Esteban Lorenzano (<estebanlm(a)gmail.com>) escribiÃ³: > > Hi, > > Time to time I hear people like Richard saying âDolphin is the dialect most beautiful Smalltalk he usedâ and others praising it in different levels. > As Pharo âarchitectâ (or whatever I am, but at least Iâm sure I have to pay attention to the IDE :P), Iâm interested to know what elements of Dolphin dialect you find âbeautifulâ, âenjoyableâ and productive. > What it is? > > - the MVP? > - integration with Windows? The way this integration is done? (If soâ¦ how is it done?) > â¦ > > I am very interested on knowing this with some detail level. That doesnât mean I will react and do something, but I want to have a better understanding and put it in my radar to take inspiration to enhance the Pharo experience :P

April 10, 2019

Why is it called #keysSortedSafely in Dictionary?

by Tim Mackinnon

Iâm curious why on Dictionary there is #keys and #keysSortedSafely ? Why isnât it just #keysSorted - do we normally provided a keysSortedDangerously? Looking deeper, it seems to duplicate the keys method, so Iâm wondering if this is ripe for some rework. Tim

April 10, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] [OT] (slightly) What makes other dialects "enjoyable" for you? (WAS: difference between double dispatch...)

by Esteban Lorenzano

Yeah, ok. But please do not take this thread as a way to defend/criticise other dialects (we all know there is a lot of passion around). My intention is more to ask âwhat is cool of dialect X that you would like Pharo to have tooâ or âhow can we make Pharo to be as beautiful and/or enjoyable as you think other dialects areâ. I know this is a very opinionated area. I believe Pharo looks and feels better than most of the other dialects, but Iâm not stupid, I know there are tons of things to improve and I know there are good ideas/implementations around and I want watch them, to see how can improve even more our Pharo. So please, stay cool :P Esteban > On 10 Apr 2019, at 14:06, Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Wed, Apr 10, 2019 at 6:21 AM jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de <mailto:jtuchel@objektfabrik.de> <jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de <mailto:jtuchel@objektfabrik.de>> wrote: > Richard, > > > as a comment on VA Smalltalk: you are referring to the Linux version, > which is also your Screenshot. I agree that Linux version of VA > Smalltalk is far from what I'd call enjoyable or beautiful. > If you take a look at the Windows version of VAST, you'll immediately > realize that Linux users miss a lot of nice stuff that has been added to > VA Smalltalk over the last few releases. > > The reason here is most likely that commercial Smalltalk projects mainly > target Windows. This has changed for headless servers and I think it is > slowly starting to happen for GUI clients, but it will take some time. > We developers like Linux, but most of our end users still live and > breathe on Windows. Not that I like it, but it's a fact, at least in the > commercial field. > > Joachim > > Hi, > > I was about to answer same thing. Differently than Pharo, VW etc where the rendering happens inside Smalltalk, in VA Smalltalk, its native. And so, there are differences in the implementations between Unix and Windows. The version in Windows is "much less ugly" than the one on Linux. In the upcoming release we have also added HiDPI, as you can see here: https://twitter.com/MartinezPeck/status/1063432539908571136 <https://twitter.com/MartinezPeck/status/1063432539908571136> > And in 9.1, we did fix many UI related things for the Linux flavor, included the shortcuts. If you are still facing issues, please contact us separately (not to spam Pharo list) > > Best, > > -- > Mariano Martinez Peck > Email: marianopeck(a)gmail.com <mailto:marianopeck@gmail.com> > Twitter: @MartinezPeck > LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mariano-mart%C3%ADnez-peck/ <https://www.linkedin.com/in/mariano-mart%C3%ADnez-peck/>

April 10, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] [OT] (slightly) What makes other dialects "enjoyable" for you? (WAS: difference between double dispatch...)

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Wed, Apr 10, 2019 at 6:21 AM jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de < jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de> wrote: > Richard, > > > as a comment on VA Smalltalk: you are referring to the Linux version, > which is also your Screenshot. I agree that Linux version of VA > Smalltalk is far from what I'd call enjoyable or beautiful. > If you take a look at the Windows version of VAST, you'll immediately > realize that Linux users miss a lot of nice stuff that has been added to > VA Smalltalk over the last few releases. > > The reason here is most likely that commercial Smalltalk projects mainly > target Windows. This has changed for headless servers and I think it is > slowly starting to happen for GUI clients, but it will take some time. > We developers like Linux, but most of our end users still live and > breathe on Windows. Not that I like it, but it's a fact, at least in the > commercial field. > > Joachim > Hi, I was about to answer same thing. Differently than Pharo, VW etc where the rendering happens inside Smalltalk, in VA Smalltalk, its native. And so, there are differences in the implementations between Unix and Windows. The version in Windows is "much less ugly" than the one on Linux. In the upcoming release we have also added HiDPI, as you can see here: https://twitter.com/MartinezPeck/status/1063432539908571136 And in 9.1, we did fix many UI related things for the Linux flavor, included the shortcuts. If you are still facing issues, please contact us separately (not to spam Pharo list) Best, -- Mariano Martinez Peck Email: marianopeck(a)gmail.com Twitter: @MartinezPeck LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mariano-mart%C3%ADnez-peck/

April 10, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] Screencasts on Debugger driven development

by Stephan Eggermont

Guillermo Polito <guillermopolito(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Thanks! we need more of this :) Working on it. You see me having to work around not being able to step into in the debugger. What is needed to make that work? Stephan

April 10, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] [OT] (slightly) What makes other dialects "enjoyable" for you? (WAS: difference between double dispatch...)

by jtuchel＠objektfabrik.de

Richard, as a comment on VA Smalltalk: you are referring to the Linux version, which is also your Screenshot. I agree that Linux version of VA Smalltalk is far from what I'd call enjoyable or beautiful. If you take a look at the Windows version of VAST, you'll immediately realize that Linux users miss a lot of nice stuff that has been added to VA Smalltalk over the last few releases. The reason here is most likely that commercial Smalltalk projects mainly target Windows. This has changed for headless servers and I think it is slowly starting to happen for GUI clients, but it will take some time. We developers like Linux, but most of our end users still live and breathe on Windows. Not that I like it, but it's a fact, at least in the commercial field. Joachim

April 10, 2019