- Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] SPEC and Athens

by kilon alios

"Am I supposed to advertise Pharo the same way? To a beginner?" yes, as they say "truth will set you free". Don't try to lie to a beginner, dont try to exaggerate , dont try to make Pharo into a holy grail. Be sincere , be accurate. The begineer may not like Pharo but at least will respect it and the community. The community and include myself in it have been working hard to improve the situation for beginners. I think things are in the right road. Pharo-users mailing list has exploded lately and that shows that people care about Pharo. Still a ton can be done but things are always way harder than they look and this why they always take time. And no you cannot replace Pharo with Swift, Pharo is irreplaceable really . There is no software out there that does what Pharo does and does it better, so Pharo is unique. The question is that if you care about what Pharo offers, if not then obviously you will choose another languages and other tools. Pharo comes with its own set of disadvantages as well as all solutions out there. In the end it comes down to making a choice. I love the Pharo workflow , I decided to stick around. But someone else will chose something else, thats fine. I think what Stef is trying to say is that if the user really loves Pharo , then he will want Pharo to improve and contributing is the best way to ensure a better future for Pharo. Personally I dont think we need to be reminded of this, I think its dead obvious if someone falls in love with an open source software he or she will contribute to it sooner or later, in a small or big way. This is why afterall open source has been so extremely succesfull.

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] New book for Pharo :)

by Ignacio Sniechowski

I think SciTalk is a nice name :p *Lic. Ignacio Sniechowski, MBA* *Prosavic SRL* *Tel: (011) 4542-6714* On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 5:14 PM, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: > > I see and appreciate your effort really, but there is no reason to hide > NumericalMethods from the book announcement. > > I do not know NumericalMethods. I vaguely recall that you were no happy > that serge wants to change the code > because it would not be in sync with the book. Now we can co-evolve them. > Every I do is open-source and freely accessible so position yourself and > join effort (I do not like SciSmalltalk as a name). > Now we have the possibility to make on nice library but you need to sync. > > I am trying to avoid what the Python community did with NumPy and SciPy > which is a mess. > > Ah you see you have to sync with Serge. I think that Serge was not > aware about that you publish the code in your repository. > Now we want to rename the acronym (because DHB is not good) and probably > improve the code > of the library while keeping the book in sync (like using String > streamContents for printing). > I personally hate to see all the comment with a copyright and a commit > dates. > > Stef > > HernÃ¡n > > > 2015-01-28 16:16 GMT-03:00 stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr>: > >> Hernan >> >> This is 8 months that I push didier to release it. I spent my week-end to >> edit it. >> So when you talk about respect use your energy th right way. >> >> Stef >> >> >> >> 2015-01-28 14:21 GMT-03:00 stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr>: >> >>> Didier Besset offered his great book "Object-Oriented Implementation of >>> Numerical Methods >>> An Introduction with Smalltalk and Java" to the community. >>> >>> We would like to thank Didier Besset for his great book and for his gift >>> of the source and implementation to the community. >>> >>> >> This is indeed, great news. >> >> >>> >>> You can find >>> â¢ Archive of the original book, with code in both Java and Smalltalk >>> https://github.com/SquareBracketAssociates/ArchiveOONumericalMethods >>> >>> >>> https://github.com/SquareBracketAssociates/ArchiveOONumericalMethods/blob/m… >>> >>> >>> â¢ An abridged version of Didierâs book, without the Java >>> implementation and reference; our goal is to make the book slimmer and >>> easier to read. The implementation presented in this book is part of the >>> SciSmalltalk library. >>> >>> >> The implementation presented in his book is part of the >> NumericalMethods library. >> >> You want to promote SciSmalltalk, then first respect others. >> NumericalMethods could be part of SciSmalltalk, but it is the library where >> code was originally released. >> >> Cheers, >> >> HernÃ¡n >> >> >> > >

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] SPEC and Athens

by Sebastian Heidbrink

Seems we wrote at the same time... Well, Steph here is what I do. - I attend, organize Smalltalk meet ups. - I contribute to the open source community of Gemstone, Amber and VAST - I attend conferences like ESUG and STIC and burn funds to make the community look bigger - I host Smalltalk Inspect - I organized the VanIsle CampSmalltalk last October - I provide feedback and write open source boards - I started a Software Group here in town that meets weekly and Smalltalk is always part of it. We didn't promote it yet, but are about to. For all these actions I need to prepare for questions that I might encounter like: - "Where do I get started?" - "Is there an example for...." - "Which Smalltalk distribution shall I start with?" - "Why does the Pharo 3.0 distribution not work with Moose 3.0 even though it is advertised?" - "How can I add more flavour to an application, which framework shall I use?" So what does Pharo community currently do for me? I report bugs and ask for help and fixes, introductions, examples. The answers I get is "load the most current 4.0 development. There it should work", "I don't know that doesn't work for me either..." Am I supposed to advertise Pharo the same way? To a beginner? I find it very strange that after 30 years one can not easily implement a modern looking GUI without too much hassle. Even the tool support for Pharo is inconsitant and unstable. I reported that several times. Unit tests are great, but UI tests are needed too. I can only tell you that a beginner in Smalltalk is not conditioned like us and he suffers much more problems as we do and even think of. e.g. it is difficult enough for them to understand what tools are available and how to navigate the code. But searching for a simple menu like "browse implementors" can even be challenging. I know 3 different implementations/spots in one release... There are so many developers out there that already heard of Smalltalk and would love to try it out. The only problem is.... there is no real support for them. Once you outgrow the Pharo tutorial it is extreemly difficult to go on with more serious stuff. Why do stable Configuration oftern not work and dev has to be loaded? That does not make sense in a One-Click-Image... I tried the experiement and started an application from scratch and it is really not easy to get started. First question was "Which UI framework do I actually have to use? There are "MANY" out there" But I have to tell all contributers here in the forum. The support and will to help is great! I realized that past months some of the questions I had had already been answered several times. I still got helpful answeres again and was able to go on. There should be a collection of useful tutorials that are maintained and tested before every release. I found several great tutorial that I can point Beginners at, but many of them do not work anymore. What you, board and the community currently built is a great eco sytem for tools and it is getting better every month. That is something that one can really tell. Please do not forget to take care of the upcoming Smalltalkers and their problems. There should be a timechart on Pharo.org that shows when (during which Pharo release) which framework was/is supported or considert feasable. Is BLoc old, or new? Is is deprecated or upcoming? Do the Pharo maintainers consider it usable with the current release and if not with which? "Welcome to the world of Smalltalk!" You don't like that reaction? Well this is the reaction I get,.... and well, what should I reply then? "If you don't like it, then contribute?" A beginner is shy and insecure,... they simply give up and download information on SWIFT... I propose that the community collects information on what Pharo is used for. What are it's strength and what kind of application is it the perfect abse for. This would help guys like me to advertise it with less surprise for the interested I am sorry, I won't currently be able to contribute code to the Pharo community since it is not part of my current stack. But I release chucnk of thought useful implementations that I encounter in my other dialects. The only thing that I can provide you with are critical questions that I encounter. That might change, but it is all I can do so far. Go on! But don't forget the beiggner and the basic ui. Sebastian Am 28.01.2015 um 12:23 schrieb stepharo: > It was a bit easy to say that. > You can get frustrated by the state of certain libraries and I can > tell you that we are fighting daily > to improve the system (writing doc, fighting to get funds for > engineers, coding). > Now you should ask yourself how you can help pharo. > > Stef >> Welcome to the world of Smalltalk! >> >> >> Am 28.01.2015 um 07:27 schrieb Mark Rizun: >>> I have the same problem with PolygonMorph. It does not resize properly. >>> Also I couldn't find any event related with window resizing. >>> If you find a solution please let me know. >>> >>> Mark >>> >>> 2015-01-28 16:19 GMT+01:00 Sebastian Heidbrink <sheidev(a)yahoo.de >>> <mailto:sheidev@yahoo.de>>: >>> >>> Am 28.01.2015 um 07:07 schrieb Mark Rizun: >>>> >>>> First the svg does not resive properly while resizing the >>>> window. >>>> >>>> >>>> What do you mean by this? >>> >>> Well, I implemented the example window from spec.st >>> <http://spec.st> and added a ASVGMorph to it. >>> When I now resize the window, then the button changes his size >>> correctly but the svg somhow just seems to be put into the >>> background. >>> I then implemented a SVGMorpModel that includes a >>> ASVGMorpAdapter and adde dthis one to my example window but the >>> result is that the SVG resizes just half the speed... >>> >>> >>>> How can I also introduce an animated SVG? Like an svg that >>>> changes color during a mouse click? >>>> >>>> >>>> To work with events that are implemented in AthensSvgMorph you >>>> have to (as far as I know) access this morph. >>>> You can do it by sending #widget message to your model to times >>>> like this: >>>> >>>> svgModel widget widget ==> svgMorph >>>> >>>> Than morph can handle events like "changes color during a mouse >>>> click". >>>> >>>> Are there any particular Models that could be used as a >>>> container for this SVGMorphAdapter? >>>> >>>> >>>> SVGMorphAdapter is a class that represents a layer betwen >>>> SVGMorph and model of svg in spec. >>>> It allows model and morph to "communicate" with each other. >>>> >>>> Mark >>> >>> >> >

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] dirty packages

by Usman Bhatti

Esteban, I tried your script in my image. I did not help i.e. dirty packages are still present in Monticello browser ( and I still do not know why). On Wed, Jan 28, 2015 at 5:05 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm(a)gmail.com> wrote: > You can try rebuilding the rpackage structure. > > 1) close all browsers > 2) execute RPackageOrganizer default initializeFromMC > > Esteban > > > On 28 Jan 2015, at 16:50, Usman Bhatti <usman.bhatti(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Hello, > > > > I have two packages MyPackage and MyPackage-Ext. When I load > MyPackge-Ext, MyPackage becomes dirty and do not have any clue why. When I > try to see changes in MyPackage in Monticello Browser, the package becomes > clean again. > > > > There are two possibilities why MyPackage-Ext makes MyPackage dirty: > > -> There are names conflict of some sort (MyPackage-Ext can be seen as a > category for MyPackage). > > -> Overriding of the extension methods introduced on the third package. > Now I wrote a small script to verify it: > > firstCollection := (RPackage organizer packageNamed: 'MyPackage') > extensionMethods values flatten. > > secondCollection := (RPackage organizer packageNamed: 'MyPackage-Ext') > extensionMethods values flatten. > > (secondCollection intersection: firstCollection) > > The above script gives empty result so there are no overriding selectors. > > > > Any ideas how can I hack into Monticello to see what is causing > MyPackage to become dirty while I load the second one manually. May be by > logging the override load definitions on Transcript? > > > > In general, will it be possible to see overriding without these > disappearing when doing changes on a dirty package? > > > > > > tx in advance. > > > > Usman > > > > > > >

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] PostGIS in Pharo

by Esteban A. Maringolo

2015-01-28 17:17 GMT-03:00 stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr>: > Why would you have to do that in SQL? > PostGIS is a little more than SQL, SQL enables you to query it, but it provides you with a lot of GIS functionality. I woudn't load a million rows into Pharo memory to search nearby locations to a coordinate, or group results based on whether they are inside of a certain boundary. Why you cannot import PGPoint and PGPolygon in Pharo? > > Right now there is no PGPoint nor any of the PostGIS geometry objects in Pharo. Mainly because of that. If its worth, I might end up creating those abstractions. So I can also create the proper "converter" to map back and forth using GLORP. Regards, Esteban A. Maringolo

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo Sound of Silence

by stepharo

> > But I don't understand why we do not use the pulse plugin with pharo. > (vm-sound-OSS is working too, and the source is already in the source > tree) > I do not know either. Stef

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] SPEC and Athens

by Mark Rizun

It is in rewrite tool that I'm developing. You can download it here: http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~MarkRizun/RewriteTool The morph is used, for example, in RewriteRuleBuilder>>#statusBarForMatch Mark 2015-01-28 21:24 GMT+01:00 Sebastian Heidbrink <sheidev(a)yahoo.de>: > Hi Mark, > > can you send me an example implementation on this? > > I'll try to find a solution that might work for both of us. It is easier > to find the reason with a second reference implementation, I guess. > > Sebastian > > > > Am 28.01.2015 um 07:27 schrieb Mark Rizun: > > I have the same problem with PolygonMorph. It does not resize properly. > Also I couldn't find any event related with window resizing. > If you find a solution please let me know. > > Mark > > 2015-01-28 16:19 GMT+01:00 Sebastian Heidbrink <sheidev(a)yahoo.de>: > >> Am 28.01.2015 um 07:07 schrieb Mark Rizun: >> >> First the svg does not resive properly while resizing the window. >>> >> >> What do you mean by this? >> >> >> Well, I implemented the example window from spec.st and added a >> ASVGMorph to it. >> When I now resize the window, then the button changes his size correctly >> but the svg somhow just seems to be put into the background. >> I then implemented a SVGMorpModel that includes a ASVGMorpAdapter and >> adde dthis one to my example window but the result is that the SVG resizes >> just half the speed... >> >> >> >> >>> How can I also introduce an animated SVG? Like an svg that changes >>> color during a mouse click? >>> >> >> To work with events that are implemented in AthensSvgMorph you have to >> (as far as I know) access this morph. >> You can do it by sending #widget message to your model to times like this: >> >> svgModel widget widget ==> svgMorph >> >> Than morph can handle events like "changes color during a mouse click". >> >> >>> Are there any particular Models that could be used as a container for >>> this SVGMorphAdapter? >>> >> >> SVGMorphAdapter is a class that represents a layer betwen SVGMorph and >> model of svg in spec. >> It allows model and morph to "communicate" with each other. >> >> Mark >> >> >> > >

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo Sound of Silence

by stepharo

Could you add a bug report so that we add that to the list of esteban. Stef Le 25/1/15 22:43, Nicolai Hess a Ã©crit : > I don't know exaclty why we don't build the pulse audio plugin for > pharo. But you can > take a squeak vm (Squeak-4.3-all-in-one) for example and copy the > Squeak-4.3-All-in-One/Contents/Linux-i686/lib/squeak/4.4.7-2357/so.vm-sound-pulse > in your pharo-vm directory > pharo-vm/vm-sound-pulse > > after that, sound works at least on ubuntu 14.04 with latest pharo vm > and image and pharoextras/sound package > > > > > 2015-01-25 19:11 GMT+01:00 Evan Donahue <emdonahu(a)gmail.com > <mailto:emdonahu@gmail.com>>: > > 64-bit Arch linux 3.17.6-1-ARCH > > I seem to be running pulse-audio with alsa, and I believe I have > all the > 32-compadibility libraries installed, but my experience with linux > sound is > limited. What is Pharo expecting? > > Thanks, > Evan > > > > -- > View this message in context: > http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Sound-of-Silence-tp4801562p4801584.html > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at > Nabble.com. > >

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] SPEC and Athens

by Sebastian Heidbrink

Hi Mark, can you send me an example implementation on this? I'll try to find a solution that might work for both of us. It is easier to find the reason with a second reference implementation, I guess. Sebastian Am 28.01.2015 um 07:27 schrieb Mark Rizun: > I have the same problem with PolygonMorph. It does not resize properly. > Also I couldn't find any event related with window resizing. > If you find a solution please let me know. > > Mark > > 2015-01-28 16:19 GMT+01:00 Sebastian Heidbrink <sheidev(a)yahoo.de > <mailto:sheidev@yahoo.de>>: > > Am 28.01.2015 um 07:07 schrieb Mark Rizun: >> >> First the svg does not resive properly while resizing the window. >> >> >> What do you mean by this? > > Well, I implemented the example window from spec.st > <http://spec.st> and added a ASVGMorph to it. > When I now resize the window, then the button changes his size > correctly but the svg somhow just seems to be put into the background. > I then implemented a SVGMorpModel that includes a ASVGMorpAdapter > and adde dthis one to my example window but the result is that the > SVG resizes just half the speed... > > >> How can I also introduce an animated SVG? Like an svg that >> changes color during a mouse click? >> >> >> To work with events that are implemented in AthensSvgMorph you >> have to (as far as I know) access this morph. >> You can do it by sending #widget message to your model to times >> like this: >> >> svgModel widget widget ==> svgMorph >> >> Than morph can handle events like "changes color during a mouse >> click". >> >> Are there any particular Models that could be used as a >> container for this SVGMorphAdapter? >> >> >> SVGMorphAdapter is a class that represents a layer betwen >> SVGMorph and model of svg in spec. >> It allows model and morph to "communicate" with each other. >> >> Mark > >

Jan. 28, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] SPEC and Athens

by stepharo

It was a bit easy to say that. You can get frustrated by the state of certain libraries and I can tell you that we are fighting daily to improve the system (writing doc, fighting to get funds for engineers, coding). Now you should ask yourself how you can help pharo. Stef > Welcome to the world of Smalltalk! > > > Am 28.01.2015 um 07:27 schrieb Mark Rizun: >> I have the same problem with PolygonMorph. It does not resize properly. >> Also I couldn't find any event related with window resizing. >> If you find a solution please let me know. >> >> Mark >> >> 2015-01-28 16:19 GMT+01:00 Sebastian Heidbrink <sheidev(a)yahoo.de >> <mailto:sheidev@yahoo.de>>: >> >> Am 28.01.2015 um 07:07 schrieb Mark Rizun: >>> >>> First the svg does not resive properly while resizing the >>> window. >>> >>> >>> What do you mean by this? >> >> Well, I implemented the example window from spec.st >> <http://spec.st> and added a ASVGMorph to it. >> When I now resize the window, then the button changes his size >> correctly but the svg somhow just seems to be put into the >> background. >> I then implemented a SVGMorpModel that includes a ASVGMorpAdapter >> and adde dthis one to my example window but the result is that >> the SVG resizes just half the speed... >> >> >>> How can I also introduce an animated SVG? Like an svg that >>> changes color during a mouse click? >>> >>> >>> To work with events that are implemented in AthensSvgMorph you >>> have to (as far as I know) access this morph. >>> You can do it by sending #widget message to your model to times >>> like this: >>> >>> svgModel widget widget ==> svgMorph >>> >>> Than morph can handle events like "changes color during a mouse >>> click". >>> >>> Are there any particular Models that could be used as a >>> container for this SVGMorphAdapter? >>> >>> >>> SVGMorphAdapter is a class that represents a layer betwen >>> SVGMorph and model of svg in spec. >>> It allows model and morph to "communicate" with each other. >>> >>> Mark >> >> >

Jan. 28, 2015