- Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Calendar Events?

by stepharo

Hi I would like to schedule some events automatically. I know that there was a package doing something like that. Any pointers? Stef

July 25, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] [OT] Bill Gross: The single biggest reason why startups succeed

by Jimmie Houchin

I am not a professional programmer, nor am I young, nor a graybeard. :) I found Smalltalk about 1999 in the form of Squeak. My biggest problems have been not in learning Smalltalk. But rather some of the projects I wanted to do needed to interface without outside libraries. Because I always felt more comfortable and productive in Smalltalk than anything else I have ever used. Even when I could not use Squeak/Pharo for whatever I was doing at the moment. I kept returning. And over time my requirements changed and the requirements Squeak/Pharo are able to fulfill keep improving. I think one thing that we really need to do when talking to people who have tried Smalltalk/Squeak/Pharo and were not able to use it for whatever reason. To periodically keep trying Squeak/Pharo. The magical intersection of experience, knowledge, understanding, project/personal requirements and Squeak/Pharo's abilities might wonderfully meet. Squeak and Pharo are in this for the long game. Keep trying. At some point more and more people will find that where they are in life and where Squeak/Pharo are at that time, things just click. Cog, Spur, Sista, 64bit plus all of the growing projects and libraries make for an ever increasingly attractive and powerful object environment empowering its users to accomplish great things. Jimmie Houchin On 07/23/2015 01:29 PM, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: > for me as a beginner a big turn off was the quality of documentation > and my fear that third party libraries will not be that well supported > because of the size of the community meaning more bugs less features > etc. It was certainly a much bigger struggle learning pharo than > learning python. > > After 2 years Pharo has gotten much better in both areas. > > I can't blame people who try Pharo and are turned off by these things, > but I still recommend it for at least giving it a try. > > In my case because I have found an easy way to combine python with > pharo made it easy to move to pharo. I still love to work with Pharo > and its getting better each year because of the passion of people > behind this and of course their hard work. > > I also like to support a project that follows my taste on how I like > to code , even if its not that popular. Actually its easier to feel > that you make a difference in a small community. > > Something tells me I will be sticking around for a long long time :) > > I dont think there is a secret to success or a simple advice. > > I once read that "success" is name of the tip of an iceberg called > "constant failure". success.jpg > > > > On Thu, Jul 23, 2015 at 8:25 PM stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr > <mailto:stepharo@free.fr>> wrote: > > Hi esteban > > we need to be much much better one talking to external libraries. > Our esteban is working on it. > > Stef > > Le 23/7/15 18:52, Esteban A. Maringolo a Ã©crit : >> Peter, >> At your joung age you might have very good reasons to have chosen >> Pharo over anything else as I did a lot of years ago. I >> discovered Smaltalk by chance when I was 21 years old and already >> had my years developing with Perl and was starting to learn Java. >> Fortunately I started making a living out of it since I was 22 >> until today. >> >> But if you want to make the community bigger you have to look >> into why people don't chose it, otherwise we'll be "preaching to >> the choir" as we many times are. >> >> These days FP is on the bull trend, having been there way before >> than Smalltalk (Lisp, Haskell, etc. and their reincarnations >> Clojure, Scala...). What makes them popular most of the times is >> not the techology per se, but who uses it. >> >> Regards! >> >> >> Esteban A. Maringolo >> >> 2015-07-23 13:06 GMT-03:00 Peter UhnÃ¡k <i.uhnak(a)gmail.com >> <mailto:i.uhnak@gmail.com>>: >> >> >> >> On Thu, Jul 23, 2015 at 4:51 PM, Esteban A. Maringolo >> <emaringolo(a)gmail.com <mailto:emaringolo@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> When I talk to "new programmers" (20-25 years old), >> almost all of them don't get attracted by it. >> Why? I couldn't tell. Mainly because they can't use the >> few tools/patterns they already learnt how to, barely, use. >> >> >> As someone who (still) falls into this range I see several >> (unrelated) reasons why they might not like it. >> >> For me personally I encountered Pharo in University in >> "Conceptual modeling" class, where it was introduced pretty >> much as "Oh, by the way, here is this completely new >> environment that you've never seen nor worked with that we >> will use, but we will not tell you much about it"... so my >> first experience was quite awful. I mean... I couldn't even >> write the code in my favorite text editor and I had to use >> this weird browser where system code and my own code were >> mangled up. Image crashing meant I lost my work. Now I know I >> can just replay changes but I didn't know it back then (the >> focus of the class was modeling, not Pharo). Bugs (this was >> Pharo 2 (and 3 beta)) were commonplace and since I had no >> experience I couldn't tell whether it was my fault or the >> system's fault... it was overall very unpleasant. >> I later (after the course) basically foced myself to look at >> Pharo again because I didn't understand why would people >> bother to use it... so clearly there must have been some >> value I've missed. And I don't regret that decision a bit, >> but I had to go look for it. So statistically speaking from >> the year I did the class only two or three students (to my >> knowledge) kept their interest out of 119 (so 2-3% maybe). >> Other years were no different. >> Next year there will be a dedicated class for Pharo so I'm >> curious if this will change somehow. >> >> But there may be other reasons why students may not like >> it... (looking again from my experience) >> From university experience perspective, the previous year >> (for us, and from what I talked with people it's not that >> different also for other universities) was a heavy massage in >> C and C++ where we were implementing very basic concepts >> (hashtables, and other data structures). A year where your >> main concern was to pass a automated checking system... so >> mostly memory management and creating write-only code. Plus >> warped concepts of OOP (so to use actual student quotes: "C++ >> is great for explaining OOP", "You can do OOP in pure C", or >> "OOP is useless, long confusing code, full of getters and >> setters, .. and slow. Inline assembler is much faster"). So >> with such concepts it's hard to give them OOP language, >> because they already made up their mind. >> >> Yet another reason I can see might be that when you are young >> you are more inclined to follow what's cool and modern and >> popular and shit (or has the word "game" in its name). >> So if today's world revolves around connectivity, internet, >> JavaScript and whatnot, then giving them a isolated >> environment with non-mainstream technology and a dead >> language they've never heard of (I thought that Smalltalk was >> an obscure language that died in '80s, before I found that >> actually it's alive and doing quite well) will not be met >> well with appreciation. >> >> But no reason to stop there... there market for Smalltalk is >> arguably small, so people will prefer language that is in >> demand by the market (after all, I pay my bills with >> JavaScript/PHP/webstuff, and not Pharo; because it's much >> easier to find a job; with Pharo I would have to basically >> start my own business to be profitable and then I would be >> doing business and not programming). >> >> And last (but not least), finding support for it is much >> harder, since the community is smaller. So it's almost all or >> nothing scenario. >> >> Also some of the arguments here can be applied also for >> functional programming (which I haven't (shame on me) even >> engaged with, besides messing with Haskell in XMonad (and >> multi-paradigm languages that have some functional concepts). >> >> Finally I don't think that you should expect the same >> behavior from young people (<26) as from adults. They will >> have different values, views, and whatnot... I mean that's >> the point of growing up and acquiring experience. All you can >> do is offer this alternative option and provide support. >> Being mainstream or non-mainstream is akin to self-fulfilling >> prophecy. (Of course exceptions happen, JavaScript was raised >> to glory because the language happen to be in the right place >> (browser) at the right time (boom of modern web)). >> >> Hmm... and this post ended up being much chaotic and longer >> than I intended to... but whatever. >> >> Peter >> >> p.s.: I like the music analogy since I was listening to k-pop >> while working (webtech), and now I am listening to ambient >> music when writing about Pharo :p >> >> >

July 25, 2015

Using geographic data

by Arturo Zambrano

Hi All, I would like to get some advice regarding which path I should take. Problem: Given a coordinate I want to know to which geographical object it belongs to. Path 1 Using Glorp to make a query to a Postgis instance containing the boundaries of the geobjects Path 2 Use the data form GADM data (according to this thread <http://forum.world.st/PostGIS-in-Pharo-td4802233.html>). I would avoid path 1 in order to avoid installation of postgi. From the thread mentioned above, I thing that it requires some development. Regarding Path 2, I don't see which framework or library should I use to import and query the data contained in the KMZ from GADM. Any advice is welcome. Best regards. Art

July 25, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] saving text files from inspector

by Andrei Chis

Another solution would be to add the action for saving as long as the content is not truncated. Cheers, Andrei On Fri, Jul 24, 2015 at 11:44 PM, Peter UhnÃ¡k <i.uhnak(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > On Fri, Jul 24, 2015 at 10:44 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> > wrote: > >> The problem is that if you have a larger text file (let's say 100Mb), >> Rubric still takes too long to open. Thus, we cannot show the whole file, >> and because of that, we also cannot provide complete editing options. This >> will change with TxText. >> >> I see... even though it sounds weird... I mean not only will most editors > irrespective of language choke on 100Mb files, but such file will be > obviously generated and why would you edit such a beast by hand? > > So if I want it I should write a custom presenter (or just copy the script > one). > > Thanks, > Peter >

July 25, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] saving text files from inspector

by Peter UhnÃ¡k

On Fri, Jul 24, 2015 at 10:44 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > The problem is that if you have a larger text file (let's say 100Mb), > Rubric still takes too long to open. Thus, we cannot show the whole file, > and because of that, we also cannot provide complete editing options. This > will change with TxText. > > I see... even though it sounds weird... I mean not only will most editors irrespective of language choke on 100Mb files, but such file will be obviously generated and why would you edit such a beast by hand? So if I want it I should write a custom presenter (or just copy the script one). Thanks, Peter

July 24, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] saving text files from inspector

by Tudor Girba

The problem is that if you have a larger text file (let's say 100Mb), Rubric still takes too long to open. Thus, we cannot show the whole file, and because of that, we also cannot provide complete editing options. This will change with TxText. Doru On Fri, Jul 24, 2015 at 10:40 PM, Peter UhnÃ¡k <i.uhnak(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > > it seems that I cannot save text files from inspector, only if they are > smalltalk (.st) files, in which case a different text editor tab (Script, > instead of Contents) is opened up. > > Is this an oversight or an intention? > > Thanks, > Peter > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

July 24, 2015

saving text files from inspector

by Peter UhnÃ¡k

Hi, it seems that I cannot save text files from inspector, only if they are smalltalk (.st) files, in which case a different text editor tab (Script, instead of Contents) is opened up. Is this an oversight or an intention? Thanks, Peter

July 24, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] Where do I find Bloc and how do I load it?

by stepharo

In the examples tag of the bloc package, you have around 20 classes full of examples. I do not see how you could miss them :) Le 20/7/15 14:28, H. Hirzel a Ã©crit : > Thank you for all answers. > > This is the one I was looking for > > https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/Bloc/ > > The latest Bloc in otherwise stable Pharo 4.0 environment. > > Where do I start exploring the examples? > > --Hannes > > > > > On 7/20/15, Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com> wrote: >> Hannes Hirzel wrote >>> I wonder where...https://ci.inria.fr/pharo/? >> The community server is at https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/ . There >> is a link to it on the left menu of the link you gave. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Cheers, >> Sean >> -- >> View this message in context: >> http://forum.world.st/Where-do-I-find-Bloc-and-how-do-I-load-it-tp4838110p4… >> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >> >> >

July 24, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] Personal wiki / information manager

by Bystroushaak

Hello. Thanks for reply, but this is not what I mean. Wiki is all about presentation of the informations to other users. On the other hand, personal wiki/PIM is tool for introspection of your own brain, microscope designed to look into yourself. It is meant to run in one thread on your computer, to organize files and ideas. There may be calendar to help you with your agenda, or maybe contact list and so on.. Another term for what I am looking for may be outliner: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outliner Dne 24.7.2015 v 19:06 stepharo napsal(a): > Hi > > You have pier http://piercms.com > Esteban is thinking about doing a minipier. > > Stef

July 24, 2015

Re: [Pharo-users] Class side vs instance side

by stepharo

What I like with having class is that you can attach behavior aTop opposite -> aBottom Le 23/7/15 02:40, Peter Uhnak a Ã©crit : > Hi, > > I am trying to figure out where to best place some mapping/data/stable > methods. > > For example imagine method > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > MyRectangle>>oppositeSides > ^ { #top -> #bottom. > #bottom -> #top. > #topLeft -> #bottomRight > .... > } asDictionary > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > And then the class might have some other related methods such as > ~~~~~~~~~~~ > MyRectangle>>oppositeSideFor: aSide > ^ self oppositeSides at: aSide > ~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > So it's a method returning a mapping between opposite sides/corners > and thus is really not going to change. > Now I could place this in instance-side and create a new instance > every time I wanted to use it (which doesn't seem practical), or I > could put it in class-side. > The problem I have with class-side is that naming is more like going > through minefield (more than once I corrupted my image by naming a > method or variable something I shouldn't have), and for whatever > reason it feels like either metaprogramming or procedural > programmming... That class side methods are pretty much global > functions/variables... and short of constructors I am avoiding static > methods even in other languages... but maybe using it is ok. Or maybe > have it object an use singleton? > > The only oop-like approach I see would be to extend symbols (#top > oppositeSide), or have separate objects for sides, but that seems like > overkill. > > MySide subclass: #Top > > Top>>oppositeSide > ^ Bottom new > > Are there any best practices regarding this? This is also true for > actual data stored in methods/attributes (such as icons). > > P.s.: For english natives... Should the second method be ned > "oppositeSideOf:" or "oppositeSideFor:"? > > Any ideas/pointers appreciated, > Peter

July 24, 2015