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Re: [Pharo-users] [Seaside] [ANN] ZÃ¼rich Smalltalk Meetup Nov 8th, 2016

by jtuchel＠objektfabrik.de

Hi Mariano, Would be good to have you, there's a lot to learn from your work ;-) Michal's full name is Michal Balda and honestly I have no idea yet if and how we'll learn more about his framework. I just know he's working on several very interesting things. If you ask: will there be any recordings or minutes? The answer is simple: if any of the attendees volunteers to take notes and blog and post or record the presentations, chances aren't too bad. I am not sure I want to or can do that at the moment... Joachim Am 18.10.16 um 14:38 schrieb Mariano Martinez Peck: > > > On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 1:35 AM, jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de > <mailto:jtuchel@objektfabrik.de> <jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de > <mailto:jtuchel@objektfabrik.de>> wrote: > > There are great news about the upcoming Smalltalkerâs Meetup in > ZÃ¼rich. > > Weâve found a conference room for the evening and will start off > with a âshow us your projectâ session in a room with a big screen > and start the social part after your input at a nice Australian > Steakhouse. > > The best thing is: we already have a first session: Michal is > going to show his new Gemstone-based persistence framework for > Pharo. It can be used to develop in Pharo and keep your objects > stored in Gemstone. > > > Hi, > > I would love to be in Zurich, but I obviously can't :( > So... is there a way to get some more info about that "Gemstone-based > persistence framework for Pharo"? And who is Michal? Last name? > > Thanks, > > > We need your input > > This new setup with a meeting room adds more value to all of us: > we can now not only talk about each othersâ epxeriences and > porjects, but see what theyâre up to and what they found. > > So to make this event an even better one than before, we need > people whoâd like to share their ideas, their latest work on some > hobby or professional project. Thereâs no need for a full-fledged > sales pitch with fog and visual effects and such, just bring your > laptop and show us what you do! The room is reserved for ca. 1 > hour, so we can have, say, 2-3 presentations before we leave for > beer and steaks. > > So if you have something interesting to show or would like to find > people to join on some early project youâre starting/planning, > give us a chance to learn about it. If youâve built some > interesting tool or use Smalltalk for something very special to > you, let us know and share your fascination and ideas. Weâll sure > appreciate that! > > But if you spontaneously decide you want to show something or > start some discussion, feel free to do so. You just need to be > prepared that we might have to leave the room before itâs your > turn. Timeslots are limited. > > It would be good if youâd pre-announce your demo to me for two > reasons: first, we can see if we need to rent tho room for a > little longer, but even better, your topic might attract even more > people so I can post your topic and make sure people get the message. > > > So where and when? > > Weâll meet at 7pm on Nov 8th, 2016 at > > Alpha Sprachwelt AG <http://alphasprachwelt.ch/kontakt.html> > Stadelhoferstrasse 10 > 8001 ZÃ¼rich > > Around 8-8:30 pm weâll walk over to the Outback Lodge where weâve > reserved a table. With Steaks and Drinks we can discuss ideas, > talk about the good old times or do some spontaneous hacking. For > directions to the Lodge visit > http://www.outback-lodge.ch/index.php/stadelhofen > <http://www.outback-lodge.ch/index.php/stadelhofen> > > > How to register? How much is it? > > This is a meetup of friends, so itâs free to come, we look forward > to meeting you and keeping in touch. You pay your meal and drinks, > but the rest is free. > > We ask you to register on our Doodle page at > http://doodle.com/poll/c9c7tatwqppyhkhq > <http://doodle.com/poll/c9c7tatwqppyhkhq> > > Please also indicate in a comment to your registration if you want > to give a short presentation. > > See you soon in ZÃ¼rich! > > > _______________________________________________ > seaside mailing list > seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > <mailto:seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org> > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > <http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside> > > > > > -- > Mariano > http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Oct. 19, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] CodeGenerator, your opinions?

by Otto Behrens

Sorry, I see there are some unresolved dependencies on our code. Let me know if I should work on that. On Wed, Oct 19, 2016 at 5:44 AM, Otto Behrens <otto(a)finworks.biz> wrote: >> Do you mean internal or embedded DSL? I am open to write an DSL if >> facilitates the job, the thing with the Trevor's paper is that he defines 6 >> implementations of FSM's (and in each implementation he considers several >> issues leading to sub-implementations) so I would like a DSL which let me >> express different implementations for the same FSM. Plus there are FSM >> implementations out there: HotDraw, Connectors, MIDIInputParser, XMIReader, >> SState, etc. I think a "correct" DSL would enable to define any of them >> right? > > I just meant some syntactically terse way of expressing a state > machine so that one can see the logic clearly. Representing a state > machine in a graphical way is ideal. We did this once, but the problem > is to make the state machine definition resilient to refactorings and > changes to the code. What I mean is that compiling something into code > is a one way thing; to keep it maintained, one would like to "reverse > compile" and draw the state machine from code. > > A "correct" DSL would be something like a Harel state diagram, which > should be able to express most requirements. > > I attach our state package, if you're interested. Not directly one of > the approaches in Trevor's paper. Perhaps another option. I would like > to extend it to use guards and actions and more. > >> The approach I am using now is a parametrized code generator, using >> templates (not in the form of T4 templates), so it's a long way. >> Maybe Helvetia could help? > > Out of my depth here; will have to read a lot more. > >> >> >>> >>> On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 9:29 AM, Julien Delplanque <julien(a)tamere.eu> >>> wrote: >>> > Hello, >>> > >>> > A generator for the visitor design pattern: >>> > - Generate methods in visited objects: VisitedObject>>#accept: (with the >>> > selector name configurable) >>> > - Generate empty methods (or methods with a "self >>> > subclassResponsability" if >>> > an abstract visitor is generated) >>> > called in #accept: methods of VisitedObjects in the Visitor i.e >>> > Visitor>>#acceptVisitedObject: (with the selector >>> > name configurable again). >>> > >>> > Each time this design pattern has to be used, it is annoying to write by >>> > hand all these methods. >>> > >>> > Regards, >>> > >>> > Julien >>> > >>> > >>> > On 18/10/16 07:24, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand wrote: >>> >> >>> >> Hi guys, >>> >> >>> >> I am writing a code generator, doing a few iterations right now. >>> >> I want your opinion, which most useful thing would you like to be >>> >> generated >>> >> automatically? It could be a pattern, an idiom, another language... >>> >> >>> >> For example my own wish (roadmap) list: >>> >> >>> >> - A "settings framework" settings class generator. >>> >> - A state machine generator (based in the excellent paper of Trevor P. >>> >> Hopkins) >>> >> - A Spec UI generator. >>> >> >>> >> Let me know your thoughts. >>> >> >>> >> Cheers, >>> >> >>> >> HernÃ¡n >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> >>

Oct. 19, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] CodeGenerator, your opinions?

by Otto Behrens

> Do you mean internal or embedded DSL? I am open to write an DSL if > facilitates the job, the thing with the Trevor's paper is that he defines 6 > implementations of FSM's (and in each implementation he considers several > issues leading to sub-implementations) so I would like a DSL which let me > express different implementations for the same FSM. Plus there are FSM > implementations out there: HotDraw, Connectors, MIDIInputParser, XMIReader, > SState, etc. I think a "correct" DSL would enable to define any of them > right? I just meant some syntactically terse way of expressing a state machine so that one can see the logic clearly. Representing a state machine in a graphical way is ideal. We did this once, but the problem is to make the state machine definition resilient to refactorings and changes to the code. What I mean is that compiling something into code is a one way thing; to keep it maintained, one would like to "reverse compile" and draw the state machine from code. A "correct" DSL would be something like a Harel state diagram, which should be able to express most requirements. I attach our state package, if you're interested. Not directly one of the approaches in Trevor's paper. Perhaps another option. I would like to extend it to use guards and actions and more. > The approach I am using now is a parametrized code generator, using > templates (not in the form of T4 templates), so it's a long way. > Maybe Helvetia could help? Out of my depth here; will have to read a lot more. > > >> >> On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 9:29 AM, Julien Delplanque <julien(a)tamere.eu> >> wrote: >> > Hello, >> > >> > A generator for the visitor design pattern: >> > - Generate methods in visited objects: VisitedObject>>#accept: (with the >> > selector name configurable) >> > - Generate empty methods (or methods with a "self >> > subclassResponsability" if >> > an abstract visitor is generated) >> > called in #accept: methods of VisitedObjects in the Visitor i.e >> > Visitor>>#acceptVisitedObject: (with the selector >> > name configurable again). >> > >> > Each time this design pattern has to be used, it is annoying to write by >> > hand all these methods. >> > >> > Regards, >> > >> > Julien >> > >> > >> > On 18/10/16 07:24, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand wrote: >> >> >> >> Hi guys, >> >> >> >> I am writing a code generator, doing a few iterations right now. >> >> I want your opinion, which most useful thing would you like to be >> >> generated >> >> automatically? It could be a pattern, an idiom, another language... >> >> >> >> For example my own wish (roadmap) list: >> >> >> >> - A "settings framework" settings class generator. >> >> - A state machine generator (based in the excellent paper of Trevor P. >> >> Hopkins) >> >> - A Spec UI generator. >> >> >> >> Let me know your thoughts. >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> >> >> HernÃ¡n >> >> >> > >> > >> >

Oct. 19, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] CodeGenerator, your opinions?

by Dimitris Chloupis

I would not hold my breath if I were you for 3 reasons 1) this idea will go through only if my direct bridge via shared memory between Pharo and Unreal fails are is proven very limited, which I highly doubt. 2) even if I proceed with it, I will certainly be specialised for Unreal and have little interest in covering C++, huge and ugly syntax. So it will probably be just a few steps further than CCodeGenerator than a full implementation. 3) I am interested in producing readable C++ code, which makes this project even harder long term though I could proceed with this anyway if I deem it useful under specific scenarios. To really make this tempting for C++ coders would need a full implementation. But in any case as I said, its very low priority for me, just a worse case scenario that I would try to avoid as much as I can. On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 6:03 PM HernÃ¡n Morales Durand < hernan.morales(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Dimitris, > > That would be certainly nice. C++ is hard, but if one start with a basic > instantiation template it could be easier to move forward to more complex > tasks like mapping data structures to STL, their containers and iterators. > And I think it would attract C++ developers to Smalltalk. > Cheers, > > HernÃ¡n > > > 2016-10-18 4:54 GMT-03:00 Dimitris Chloupis <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com>: > > There is the CCodeGenerator , which is basically Slang, Smalltalk that is > turned into basic C. I would like to expand it to generate C++ at some > point for converting pharo code to C++ code that I will be able to add to > Unreal. Though its a very low priority project for me. > > http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~PavelKrivanek/CCodeGenerator > > Personally I am against generalized solutions because they tend to be bad > for specialized cases , on the other hand I welcome any code that I can use > as inspiration for my own code generator. > > On Tue, Oct 18, 2016 at 8:25 AM HernÃ¡n Morales Durand < > hernan.morales(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi guys, > > I am writing a code generator, doing a few iterations right now. > I want your opinion, which most useful thing would you like to be > generated automatically? It could be a pattern, an idiom, another > language... > > For example my own wish (roadmap) list: > > - A "settings framework" settings class generator. > - A state machine generator (based in the excellent paper of Trevor P. > Hopkins) > - A Spec UI generator. > > Let me know your thoughts. > > Cheers, > > HernÃ¡n > > >

Oct. 18, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] Cog VM on Raspberry Pi ?

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Thanks, Esteban, that works: pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo-arm-vm/pharo --version 5.0-201610181220 Tue Oct 18 14:42:58 UTC 2016 gcc 4.9.2 [Production Spur VM] CoInterpreter VMMaker.oscog-rsf.1951 uuid: c714858a-7f63-47bd-a9ec-4bc1350eead2 Oct 18 2016 StackToRegisterMappingCogit VMMaker.oscog-rsf.1951 uuid: c714858a-7f63-47bd-a9ec-4bc1350eead2 Oct 18 2016 VM: 201610181220 https://github.com/estebanlm/opensmalltalk-vm.git $ Date: Tue Oct 18 14:20:17 2016 +0200 $ Plugins: 201610181220 https://github.com/estebanlm/opensmalltalk-vm.git $ Linux testing-gce-a8263b5d-fc45-4502-a6e9-cbf3483c9374 4.4.0-42-generic #62~14.04.1-Ubuntu SMP Fri Oct 7 23:15:48 UTC 2016 armv7l GNU/Linux plugin path: /home/pi/Pharo/pharo-arm-vm/ [default: /home/pi/Pharo/pharo-arm-vm/] pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo-arm-vm/pharo -vm-display-null Pharo.image printVersion [version] 5.0 #50581 pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo-arm-vm/pharo -vm-display-null Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' '167210973 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' Speed is similar to what I got before 160M bytecodes/s, 11M sends/s Maybe all the VMs that I tried before were all Cog VMs ? Is there still a stack VM (PharoS for ARM, 5.0) ? > On 18 Oct 2016, at 22:56, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi Sven, > > this vm: pharo-linux-i386.7237aa8.zip > > should work. Name is bad but is an ARMv6 VMâ¦ did you tried it? > > Esteban > >> On 18 Oct 2016, at 22:50, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >> >> >>> On 18 Oct 2016, at 22:16, Todd Blanchard <tblanchard(a)mac.com> wrote: >>> >>> There is a scratch on cog vm as part of the standard raspbian distro. >>> >>> Have you tried that? >> >> The Squeak VMs that come with raspbian seem to be of the older variant (I am using Pharo 5). >> >> You known, "This interpreter (vers. 6505) cannot read image file (vers. 6521)." >> >> Still, in order to be sure we are talking about the exact same VM, version info is needed. >> >>>> On Oct 18, 2016, at 09:27, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 18 Oct 2016, at 14:29, Henrik Johansen <henrik.s.johansen(a)veloxit.no> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> On 17 Oct 2016, at 8:43 , Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Does a (faster) Cog VM for the Raspberry Pi actually exist ? >>>>>> >>>>>> I tried comparing the latest OpenSmalltalk VM with some older ones, only to find that they are all equally fast (slow actually): >>>>>> >>>>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image printVersion >>>>>> [version] 5.0 #50581 >>>>>> >>>>>> "http://files.pharo.org/vm/pharoS/raspbian/latest.zip" >>>>>> >>>>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>>>> '167429692 bytecodes/sec; 11160247 sends/sec' >>>>>> >>>>>> "http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/VM.r3427/cogspurlinuxhtARM-15.33.3…" >>>>>> >>>>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./products/phcogspurlinuxhtRPi/pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>>>> '166992824 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' >>>>>> >>>>>> "https://bintray.com/opensmalltalk/vm/download_file?file_path=cog_linux32ARM…" >>>>>> >>>>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./products/phcogspurlinuxhtRPi/pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>>>> '166992824 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' >>>>>> >>>>>> That is no significant difference on a RPi 3, at all. Is this normal ? Am I missing something ? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thx, >>>>>> >>>>>> Sven >>>>>> >>>>>> PS: Just for reference, my Mac Book Pro is 10 times faster >>>>>> >>>>>> 1 tinyBenchmarks "'1323852617 bytecodes/sec; 174185794 sends/sec'" >>>>> >>>>> Are you 100% sure you benched different VM's? >>>>> A stack VM (PharoS) getting the same results as a Spur VM (cog_linux32ARMv6_pharo.cog.spur_201610142319.tar.gz) is rather suspicious... >>>>> >>>>> At least on my Pi3, the spur Cog VM gives numbers around 250M bytecodes/160M sends.... >>>>> which, while still "slow", is a decent bump in speed compared to what you're seeing. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Henry >>>> >>>> Hi Henry, >>>> >>>> That is exactly the kind of reference/experience I am looking for. >>>> Could you please point me to the exact download URL you downloaded ? >>>> I will happily test it ;-) >>>> >>>> Thx, >>>> >>>> Sven >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> >> >

Oct. 18, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] Cog VM on Raspberry Pi ?

by Esteban Lorenzano

Hi Sven, this vm: pharo-linux-i386.7237aa8.zip <https://bintray.com/estebanlm/pharo-vm/download_file?file_path=pharo-linux-…> should work. Name is bad but is an ARMv6 VMâ¦ did you tried it? Esteban > On 18 Oct 2016, at 22:50, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > >> On 18 Oct 2016, at 22:16, Todd Blanchard <tblanchard(a)mac.com> wrote: >> >> There is a scratch on cog vm as part of the standard raspbian distro. >> >> Have you tried that? > > The Squeak VMs that come with raspbian seem to be of the older variant (I am using Pharo 5). > > You known, "This interpreter (vers. 6505) cannot read image file (vers. 6521)." > > Still, in order to be sure we are talking about the exact same VM, version info is needed. > >>> On Oct 18, 2016, at 09:27, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >>> >>> >>>> On 18 Oct 2016, at 14:29, Henrik Johansen <henrik.s.johansen(a)veloxit.no> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> On 17 Oct 2016, at 8:43 , Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Does a (faster) Cog VM for the Raspberry Pi actually exist ? >>>>> >>>>> I tried comparing the latest OpenSmalltalk VM with some older ones, only to find that they are all equally fast (slow actually): >>>>> >>>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image printVersion >>>>> [version] 5.0 #50581 >>>>> >>>>> "http://files.pharo.org/vm/pharoS/raspbian/latest.zip" >>>>> >>>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>>> '167429692 bytecodes/sec; 11160247 sends/sec' >>>>> >>>>> "http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/VM.r3427/cogspurlinuxhtARM-15.33.3…" >>>>> >>>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./products/phcogspurlinuxhtRPi/pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>>> '166992824 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' >>>>> >>>>> "https://bintray.com/opensmalltalk/vm/download_file?file_path=cog_linux32ARM…" >>>>> >>>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./products/phcogspurlinuxhtRPi/pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>>> '166992824 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' >>>>> >>>>> That is no significant difference on a RPi 3, at all. Is this normal ? Am I missing something ? >>>>> >>>>> Thx, >>>>> >>>>> Sven >>>>> >>>>> PS: Just for reference, my Mac Book Pro is 10 times faster >>>>> >>>>> 1 tinyBenchmarks "'1323852617 bytecodes/sec; 174185794 sends/sec'" >>>> >>>> Are you 100% sure you benched different VM's? >>>> A stack VM (PharoS) getting the same results as a Spur VM (cog_linux32ARMv6_pharo.cog.spur_201610142319.tar.gz) is rather suspicious... >>>> >>>> At least on my Pi3, the spur Cog VM gives numbers around 250M bytecodes/160M sends.... >>>> which, while still "slow", is a decent bump in speed compared to what you're seeing. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Henry >>> >>> Hi Henry, >>> >>> That is exactly the kind of reference/experience I am looking for. >>> Could you please point me to the exact download URL you downloaded ? >>> I will happily test it ;-) >>> >>> Thx, >>> >>> Sven >>> >>> >>> >> >> > >

Oct. 18, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] Cog VM on Raspberry Pi ?

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

> On 18 Oct 2016, at 22:16, Todd Blanchard <tblanchard(a)mac.com> wrote: > > There is a scratch on cog vm as part of the standard raspbian distro. > > Have you tried that? The Squeak VMs that come with raspbian seem to be of the older variant (I am using Pharo 5). You known, "This interpreter (vers. 6505) cannot read image file (vers. 6521)." Still, in order to be sure we are talking about the exact same VM, version info is needed. >> On Oct 18, 2016, at 09:27, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >> >> >>> On 18 Oct 2016, at 14:29, Henrik Johansen <henrik.s.johansen(a)veloxit.no> wrote: >>> >>> >>>> On 17 Oct 2016, at 8:43 , Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Does a (faster) Cog VM for the Raspberry Pi actually exist ? >>>> >>>> I tried comparing the latest OpenSmalltalk VM with some older ones, only to find that they are all equally fast (slow actually): >>>> >>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image printVersion >>>> [version] 5.0 #50581 >>>> >>>> "http://files.pharo.org/vm/pharoS/raspbian/latest.zip" >>>> >>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>> '167429692 bytecodes/sec; 11160247 sends/sec' >>>> >>>> "http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/VM.r3427/cogspurlinuxhtARM-15.33.3…" >>>> >>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./products/phcogspurlinuxhtRPi/pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>> '166992824 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' >>>> >>>> "https://bintray.com/opensmalltalk/vm/download_file?file_path=cog_linux32ARM…" >>>> >>>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./products/phcogspurlinuxhtRPi/pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>>> '166992824 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' >>>> >>>> That is no significant difference on a RPi 3, at all. Is this normal ? Am I missing something ? >>>> >>>> Thx, >>>> >>>> Sven >>>> >>>> PS: Just for reference, my Mac Book Pro is 10 times faster >>>> >>>> 1 tinyBenchmarks "'1323852617 bytecodes/sec; 174185794 sends/sec'" >>> >>> Are you 100% sure you benched different VM's? >>> A stack VM (PharoS) getting the same results as a Spur VM (cog_linux32ARMv6_pharo.cog.spur_201610142319.tar.gz) is rather suspicious... >>> >>> At least on my Pi3, the spur Cog VM gives numbers around 250M bytecodes/160M sends.... >>> which, while still "slow", is a decent bump in speed compared to what you're seeing. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Henry >> >> Hi Henry, >> >> That is exactly the kind of reference/experience I am looking for. >> Could you please point me to the exact download URL you downloaded ? >> I will happily test it ;-) >> >> Thx, >> >> Sven >> >> >> > >

Oct. 18, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] Cog VM on Raspberry Pi ?

by Todd Blanchard

There is a scratch on cog vm as part of the standard raspbian distro. Have you tried that? > On Oct 18, 2016, at 09:27, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > >> On 18 Oct 2016, at 14:29, Henrik Johansen <henrik.s.johansen(a)veloxit.no> wrote: >> >> >>> On 17 Oct 2016, at 8:43 , Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Does a (faster) Cog VM for the Raspberry Pi actually exist ? >>> >>> I tried comparing the latest OpenSmalltalk VM with some older ones, only to find that they are all equally fast (slow actually): >>> >>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image printVersion >>> [version] 5.0 #50581 >>> >>> "http://files.pharo.org/vm/pharoS/raspbian/latest.zip" >>> >>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>> '167429692 bytecodes/sec; 11160247 sends/sec' >>> >>> "http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/VM.r3427/cogspurlinuxhtARM-15.33.3…" >>> >>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./products/phcogspurlinuxhtRPi/pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>> '166992824 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' >>> >>> "https://bintray.com/opensmalltalk/vm/download_file?file_path=cog_linux32ARM…" >>> >>> pi@raspberrypi ~/Pharo $ ./products/phcogspurlinuxhtRPi/pharo -nodisplay Pharo.image eval '1 tinyBenchmarks' >>> '166992824 bytecodes/sec; 11337746 sends/sec' >>> >>> That is no significant difference on a RPi 3, at all. Is this normal ? Am I missing something ? >>> >>> Thx, >>> >>> Sven >>> >>> PS: Just for reference, my Mac Book Pro is 10 times faster >>> >>> 1 tinyBenchmarks "'1323852617 bytecodes/sec; 174185794 sends/sec'" >> >> Are you 100% sure you benched different VM's? >> A stack VM (PharoS) getting the same results as a Spur VM (cog_linux32ARMv6_pharo.cog.spur_201610142319.tar.gz) is rather suspicious... >> >> At least on my Pi3, the spur Cog VM gives numbers around 250M bytecodes/160M sends.... >> which, while still "slow", is a decent bump in speed compared to what you're seeing. >> >> Cheers, >> Henry > > Hi Henry, > > That is exactly the kind of reference/experience I am looking for. > Could you please point me to the exact download URL you downloaded ? > I will happily test it ;-) > > Thx, > > Sven > > >

Oct. 18, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] CodeGenerator, your opinions?

by Todd Blanchard

Yes, this is another one and I would like to see a nice interface to clang that then generated all the glue code for a given library based on its public header files. Smalltalk Agents used to do something like this. You could point it at a library and it would open it and generate Smalltalk bindings to everything the library exported. Ben has been blogging about experiments with just this, I'm kind of following along in his footsteps. Being able to import pretty much any library with a few clicks and use it from Pharo would go a long way towards making it attractive for real development. It seems rather silly we are doing all this painstaking work to keep database drivers and such up to date when we might be able to automate the bulk of it. > On Oct 18, 2016, at 10:38, phil(a)highoctane.be wrote: > > > They are useful for writing VM plugins for example. The generic part.

Oct. 18, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] CodeGenerator, your opinions?

by Thierry Goubier

Le 18/10/2016 Ã 15:45, Otto Behrens a Ã©crit : >> for things like that, I would consider looking into the SmaCC visitor >> automatic generation. From an grammar, SmaCC creates the class, respecting >> an eventual inheritance constraint you specify, adds the instance variables, >> and generates the visitor (and an equality test too). > > Nice. Will have a look. Thanks. The thing is basically SmaCC is a automaton compiler, with two different generation strategies based on the type of automaton you are interested in. Plus a tree / visitor generation code. >> Regarding state machines generation, what class of automatons are you >> looking at? Because I'm looking at automatons generation by reusing SmaCC >> (for a tentative hardware architecture subject). > > We have some domain specific objects, for example investment > instructions, that go through some domain specific state transitions. > It is not enormous, but a state transition model helps to understand > what valid transitions there are. As a simplistic example, when we > receive an investment instruction, one user "submits" the instruction, > another "authorises". From there it moves into a processing state and > then complete when the investment is placed. > > What will be nice is to set up guards on transitions, entry / exit > actions and more nice things that can be done with a state machine. > Reading the state machine then gives a nice overview of the logic. > What will be nice is to see that in the form of a graph, with all the > annotations. > We do not currently use complexities like concurrency and nesting, but > have seen that working before. > > Does this answer what you're asking? Yes, I think I understand, including the need for a graphical representation. I'm interested in finding opportunities for automata as a way to compute (and synthesize hardware). I've seen very interesting results with synthesis of automata co-processors on FPGAs (and the Micron Automata processor as well). I suggested an internship in my lab, and it was bumped up to a possible post-doc opportunity. But I'm more into expressing them as a RE / as a Grammar than explicitely... studying a way to convert between the different representations could be interesting. Thierry

Oct. 18, 2016