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Re: [Pharo-users] Behold Pharo: The Modern Smalltalk

by phil＠highoctane.be

A Bluebook updated picture would be great. And I am sure Roassal could produce it right away. Phil On Oct 10, 2017 15:58, "horrido" <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Interestingly, I'm getting a fair amount of pushback on this. Personally, I > think it would be very helpful to have a live (updatable, so as to keep it > current) reference page for the class library, something that developers > can > easily look up what they need. After all, most of the power of Pharo comes > from the class library and we need to make it as accessible as possible to > less experienced Pharoers (i.e., beginners). > > Exploring the class library through the System Browser is very inefficient. > This is further exacerbated by the fact that many classes and methods are > simply not well-documented (containing a cursory remark which is just > barely > useful). > > I realize that creating a live reference page is not easy to do. In fact, > it's a lot of work. But the absence of such a page is a real obstacle to > Pharo acceptance. > > > > horrido wrote > > Thanks. I gave your answer verbatim. I also added the following > paragraph: > > > > The problem I find with todayâs developers is that they are rather > > closed-minded. They are rigid and inflexible, and not willing to adapt to > > new and different ways of doing things. In my generation (circa > > 1980â1990), > > people didnât have a problem with trying different technologies. Thatâs > > why > > I had no issue with learning Smalltalk 10 years ago, after I had retired > > from a 20-year-long career in C systems programming and FORTRAN > scientific > > programming. > > > > > > > > Sven Van Caekenberghe-2 wrote > >>> On 6 Oct 2017, at 14:54, horrido < > > > >> horrido.hobbies@ > > > >> > wrote: > >>> > >>> I received this comment from someone who complained: > >>> > >>> *What about the lack of documentation? From time to time Iâve checked > >>> some > >>> SmallTalk implementations like Squeak, GNU-Smalltalk and now Pharo. Of > >>> these, only GNU-SmallTalk appears to have a free, official programming > >>> guide > >>> and core library reference that any serious programmer expects from a > >>> language. > >>> > >>> https://www.gnu.org/software/smalltalk/manual-base/html_node/* > >>> > >>> I pointed to Pharo's documentation but then he came back with: > >>> > >>> *Then show me a link of the free, maintained reference documentation > for > >>> the > >>> classes that form âthe core libraryâ, like this one for Python > >>> (https://docs.python.org/3/library/index.html)* > >>> > >>> It's true, most Smalltalks do not have a core library reference, not > >>> even > >>> VisualWorks! So what is the proper response to this complaint? > >> > >> The first answer is that Pharo/Smalltalk is unique in that a running > >> system/IDE contains _all_ source code, _all_ documentation (class, > >> method, > >> help, tutorial), _all_ unit tests and _all_ runnable examples in a very > >> easy, accessible way. It takes some getting used to, but this is > actually > >> better and much more powerful than any alternative. > >> > >> The second answer is that there are lots of books and articles that take > >> the classic/structured book/paper approach. There is > >> http://books.pharo.org, http://themoosebook.org, > >> http://book.seaside.st/book, http://medium.com/concerning-pharo and > many > >> more. > >> > >>> Thanks. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > > >

Oct. 10, 2017

[Off topic] Re: FYI about Pharo MOOC

by Ben Coman

On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 9:19 PM, Offray Vladimir Luna CÃ¡rdenas < offray.luna(a)mutabit.com> wrote: > Probably is a English native speaker. > Next they'll be asking to covert the example from kilometres to miles ;) cheers -ben > It really amuse me the amount of complain about this. Is something like, > please don't show me anything other cultures, even if I just need to turn > on captions and read(!), like most of us did to learn English by ourselves. > Its the downside of being a native english speaker. There is less need to learn a second language. Thus we go crazy earlier while all you non-native english speakers continue to take over the world... https://www.livescience.com/12917-learning-language-bilingual-protects-alzh… cheers -ben > Whenever I have the opportunity, I see movies in their native language and > just add subtitles, to lost less in translation. Yes, English is the third > most spread language and is good for intercultural communication, because > is the most spread *second* language, but sadly, most English native > speaker don't even bother about experience the minimum of other language > and cultures, beyond the "tourist package" and even hear another language > seems too much effort. Fortunately there is a minority of native English > speakers that thinks different. > > Thanks for the voice translation. It improves a course that was already > good and totally doable with subtitles. > > Keep the good work. Cheers, > > Offray > > On 10/10/17 08:05, Serge Stinckwich wrote: > > The MOOC is completely dubbed in English this year, so you don't need > subtitles. > > > > On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 1:07 PM, horrido <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Somebody posted this about the Pharo MOOC: >> https://medium.com/@josephshirk/it-would-be-nice-if-it-were- >> in-english-b07f6445f23 >> >> To which I responded: >> https://medium.com/@richardeng/the-videos-are-like- >> lecturers-in-university-49a68c23cf01 >> >> Some food for thought. >> >> >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html >> >> > > > -- > Serge Stinckwich > UCN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) > Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk > http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ > > >

Oct. 10, 2017

Error loading Seaside Gettext support

by dario.trussardi＠tiscali.it

Ciao, Â Â Â i load correctly the Gettext support into:Â Â Â Pharo 6.1-64 Latest update: #60510 Â Â Â In the image was load the Seaside 3.2 Â Â Â Now i do: Â Â Â (ConfigurationOfSeaside3 project version: #stable ) Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â load: #( 'Seaside-Gettext-Core' 'Seaside-Gettext-Examples'). Â Â Â The system erase the error: NaturalLanguageTranslator class(Object)>>doesNotUnderstand: #domainRegistered: TextDomainManager class>>registerDomain: [ self registerDomain: domainName ] in TextDomainManager class>>domainInfoFor: in Block: [ self registerDomain: domainName ] [ self at: key put: aBlock value ] in Dictionary>>at:ifAbsentPut: in Block: [ self at: key put: aBlock value ] Dictionary>>at:ifAbsent: Dictionary>>at:ifAbsentPut: TextDomainManager class>>domainInfoFor: TextDomainManager class>>registerCategoryPrefix:domain: WAGettextExample class>>register WAGettextExample class>>initialize Â Â Â Some considerations ? Â Â Â Thanks, Â Â Â Â Â Â Dario

Oct. 10, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Behold Pharo: The Modern Smalltalk

by horrido

Interestingly, I'm getting a fair amount of pushback on this. Personally, I think it would be very helpful to have a live (updatable, so as to keep it current) reference page for the class library, something that developers can easily look up what they need. After all, most of the power of Pharo comes from the class library and we need to make it as accessible as possible to less experienced Pharoers (i.e., beginners). Exploring the class library through the System Browser is very inefficient. This is further exacerbated by the fact that many classes and methods are simply not well-documented (containing a cursory remark which is just barely useful). I realize that creating a live reference page is not easy to do. In fact, it's a lot of work. But the absence of such a page is a real obstacle to Pharo acceptance. horrido wrote > Thanks. I gave your answer verbatim. I also added the following paragraph: > > The problem I find with todayâs developers is that they are rather > closed-minded. They are rigid and inflexible, and not willing to adapt to > new and different ways of doing things. In my generation (circa > 1980â1990), > people didnât have a problem with trying different technologies. Thatâs > why > I had no issue with learning Smalltalk 10 years ago, after I had retired > from a 20-year-long career in C systems programming and FORTRAN scientific > programming. > > > > Sven Van Caekenberghe-2 wrote >>> On 6 Oct 2017, at 14:54, horrido < > >> horrido.hobbies@ > >> > wrote: >>> >>> I received this comment from someone who complained: >>> >>> *What about the lack of documentation? From time to time Iâve checked >>> some >>> SmallTalk implementations like Squeak, GNU-Smalltalk and now Pharo. Of >>> these, only GNU-SmallTalk appears to have a free, official programming >>> guide >>> and core library reference that any serious programmer expects from a >>> language. >>> >>> https://www.gnu.org/software/smalltalk/manual-base/html_node/* >>> >>> I pointed to Pharo's documentation but then he came back with: >>> >>> *Then show me a link of the free, maintained reference documentation for >>> the >>> classes that form âthe core libraryâ, like this one for Python >>> (https://docs.python.org/3/library/index.html)* >>> >>> It's true, most Smalltalks do not have a core library reference, not >>> even >>> VisualWorks! So what is the proper response to this complaint? >> >> The first answer is that Pharo/Smalltalk is unique in that a running >> system/IDE contains _all_ source code, _all_ documentation (class, >> method, >> help, tutorial), _all_ unit tests and _all_ runnable examples in a very >> easy, accessible way. It takes some getting used to, but this is actually >> better and much more powerful than any alternative. >> >> The second answer is that there are lots of books and articles that take >> the classic/structured book/paper approach. There is >> http://books.pharo.org, http://themoosebook.org, >> http://book.seaside.st/book, http://medium.com/concerning-pharo and many >> more. >> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html >>> > > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Oct. 10, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] FYI about Pharo MOOC

by Offray Vladimir Luna CÃ¡rdenas

Probably is a English native speaker. It really amuse me the amount of complain about this. Is something like, please don't show me anything other cultures, even if I just need to turn on captions and read(!), like most of us did to learn English by ourselves. Whenever I have the opportunity, I see movies in their native language and just add subtitles, to lost less in translation. Yes, English is the third most spread language and is good for intercultural communication, because is the most spread *second* language, but sadly, most English native speaker don't even bother about experience the minimum of other language and cultures, beyond the "tourist package" and even hear another language seems too much effort. Fortunately there is a minority of native English speakers that thinks different. Thanks for the voice translation. It improves a course that was already good and totally doable with subtitles. Keep the good work. Cheers, Offray On 10/10/17 08:05, Serge Stinckwich wrote: > The MOOC is completely dubbed in English this year, so you don't need > subtitles. > > > > On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 1:07 PM, horrido <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com > <mailto:horrido.hobbies@gmail.com>> wrote: > > Somebody posted this about the Pharo MOOC: > https://medium.com/@josephshirk/it-would-be-nice-if-it-were-in-english-b07f… > <https://medium.com/@josephshirk/it-would-be-nice-if-it-were-in-english-b07f…> > > To which I responded: > https://medium.com/@richardeng/the-videos-are-like-lecturers-in-university-… > <https://medium.com/@richardeng/the-videos-are-like-lecturers-in-university-…> > > Some food for thought. > > > > -- > Sent from: > http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > <http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html> > > > > > -- > Serge Stinckwich > UCN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) > Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk > http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/

Oct. 10, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] FYI about Pharo MOOC

by Serge Stinckwich

The MOOC is completely dubbed in English this year, so you don't need subtitles. On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 1:07 PM, horrido <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Somebody posted this about the Pharo MOOC: > https://medium.com/@josephshirk/it-would-be-nice-if-it-were-in-english- > b07f6445f23 > > To which I responded: > https://medium.com/@richardeng/the-videos-are- > like-lecturers-in-university-49a68c23cf01 > > Some food for thought. > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > > -- Serge Stinckwich UCN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/

Oct. 10, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] how to update a pane in a customized inspector

by Steven Costiou

It works :) Thanks :) Yes that is the video i was looking for :) Le 2017-10-10 13:26, Andrei Chis a Ã©crit : > Hi, > > On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 11:31 AM, Steven Costiou <steven.costiou(a)kloum.io> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> I am trying to customize an inspector with a code browser, and I have in a compose method of my own browser the following: >> >> [...] >> >> browser transmit >> from: #methods; >> fromOutsidePort: #entity; >> to: #source; >> when: [ :method | method notNil ]; >> andShow: [ :a :method :object | self sourceOf: method for: object in: a ]. >> >> browser transmit >> from: #links; >> fromOutsidePort: #entity; >> to: #selectedLink; >> when: [ :link | link notNil ]; >> andShow: [ :a :link | self inspectSelectedLink: link inPresenter: a ]. >> >> [...] >> >> Is there an easy way to update the #source pane whenever one of my links is selected in my #link pane ? >> >> In my case, the source code is displayed first, and when i select a link in the #link pane i want to highlight specific parts of this source code and the easiest way would be to re-trigger the first block above. I did not try it, but it seems that i could retrieve the #source pane and the selected method manually and re-trigger the method from the second block (i.e. when a link is selected), but i am not sure that is the right way to do it... > > If you know the interval that you want to highlight when selecting a link, you can create a transmission from the #selection port of the #link pane to the #selectionInterval port of the #source pane. If you go to GLMBasicExamples, textPortsExamples and textSelection show how to use the selectionInterval port. > >> Also i was wondering if there was a video of the moldable inspector tutorial from pharo days 17 somewhere on the web, because i did not find it on youtube. > Not sure if the Pharo Days videos are available but you can see the same presentation from ESUG here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wj5IWvAYSlw > > Cheers, > Andrei

Oct. 10, 2017

FYI about Pharo MOOC

by horrido

Somebody posted this about the Pharo MOOC: https://medium.com/@josephshirk/it-would-be-nice-if-it-were-in-english-b07f… To which I responded: https://medium.com/@richardeng/the-videos-are-like-lecturers-in-university-… Some food for thought. -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Oct. 10, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] how to update a pane in a customized inspector

by Andrei Chis

Hi, On Tue, Oct 10, 2017 at 11:31 AM, Steven Costiou <steven.costiou(a)kloum.io> wrote: > Hi, > > I am trying to customize an inspector with a code browser, and I have in a > compose method of my own browser the following: > > [...] > > browser transmit > from: #methods; > fromOutsidePort: #entity; > to: #source; > when: [ :method | method notNil ]; > andShow: [ :a :method :object | self sourceOf: method for: > object in: a ]. > > browser transmit > from: #links; > fromOutsidePort: #entity; > to: #selectedLink; > when: [ :link | link notNil ]; > andShow: [ :a :link | self inspectSelectedLink: link > inPresenter: a ]. > > [...] > > Is there an easy way to update the #source pane whenever one of my links > is selected in my #link pane ? > > In my case, the source code is displayed first, and when i select a link > in the #link pane i want to highlight specific parts of this source code > and the easiest way would be to re-trigger the first block above. I did not > try it, but it seems that i could retrieve the #source pane and the > selected method manually and re-trigger the method from the second block > (i.e. when a link is selected), but i am not sure that is the right way to > do it... > If you know the interval that you want to highlight when selecting a link, you can create a transmission from the #selection port of the #link pane to the #selectionInterval port of the #source pane. If you go to GLMBasicExamples, textPortsExamples and textSelection show how to use the selectionInterval port. > > > Also i was wondering if there was a video of the moldable inspector > tutorial from pharo days 17 somewhere on the web, because i did not find it > on youtube. > Not sure if the Pharo Days videos are available but you can see the same presentation from ESUG here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wj5IWvAYSlw Cheers, Andrei

Oct. 10, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Behold Pharo: The Modern Smalltalk

by Sean P. DeNigris

kilon.alios wrote > itâs clear the community is unwilling to deal with such discussions. I wouldn't say that... after all this thread has the most posts on this list since January 21 ;) I personally learned a lot and was glad to hear all the points. I thought the last two pretty much captured the situation, which is that you *can* do live programming in other languages, but the advantage of Pharo is that it's *about* live programming. I certainly didn't know it was even possible in some of the other languages mentioned. Yet, practically, it seems extremely difficult for a system that tacks something on as a feature to compete with a system that values that thing at its core. Ironically, the biggest barrier seems to be human, in the McLuhan sense that our medium determines how/what we can think/say. I feel lucky to have discovered Smalltalk and have cast off (most) of the brain damage from C and C++ ha ha. ----- Cheers, Sean -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Oct. 10, 2017