May 2020 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] UK Smalltalk User Group Meeting - Wednesday, May 27th

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

> On 20 May 2020, at 13:38, Giovanni Corriga <giovanni(a)corriga.net> wrote: > > The next meeting of the UK Smalltalk User Group will be on Wednesday, May 27th. > > Alan Jackson will talk to us about Kyma ( https://kyma.symbolicsound.com/ <https://kyma.symbolicsound.com/> ) an object-oriented sound design environment built with Smalltalk technology. Kyma looks super cool. I would love to see kyma running on our lovely system. > > Given the current COVID-19 restrictions, this will be an online meeting. > > If you'd like to join us, please sign up in advance at the meeting Meetup's page https://www.meetup.com/UKSTUG/events/cbklbrybchbkc/ <https://www.meetup.com/UKSTUG/events/cbklbrybchbkc/> to obtain the meeting details. > > See you there! -------------------------------------------- StÃ©phane Ducasse http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr / http://www.pharo.org 03 59 35 87 52 Assistant: Julie Jonas FAX 03 59 57 78 50 TEL 03 59 35 86 16 S. Ducasse - Inria 40, avenue Halley, Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, BÃ¢t.A, Park Plaza Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650 France

May 20, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on Chromebook

by tesonep＠gmail.com

Hi Jan, sorry about listening of your problems. Can you give me more details of the version that you are using? (Architecture, OS, Pharo and VM). It looks like a problem with the rendering. I will try to reproduce it in a VM. Thanks for the report. On Tue, May 19, 2020 at 7:52 PM Jan KurÅ¡ <kurs.jan(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, has anyone an experience with running Pharo on Chromebook (using > Crostini)? It worked reasonably well for me in the past (3 months ago), now > I see rendering issues: > [image: image.png] > > I tried with latest and greatest Pharo8 and fresh image, I see the same > rendering issue. > > Thanks, Jan > -- Pablo Tesone. tesonep(a)gmail.com

May 20, 2020

UK Smalltalk User Group Meeting - Wednesday, May 27th

by Giovanni Corriga

The next meeting of the UK Smalltalk User Group will be on Wednesday, May 27th. Alan Jackson will talk to us about Kyma ( https://kyma.symbolicsound.com/ ) an object-oriented sound design environment built with Smalltalk technology. Given the current COVID-19 restrictions, this will be an online meeting. If you'd like to join us, please sign up in advance at the meeting Meetup's page https://www.meetup.com/UKSTUG/events/cbklbrybchbkc/ to obtain the meeting details. See you there!

May 20, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Refactor without formatting

by Vitor Medina Cruz

Hello, Thanks for the reply. Yes, for me this behavior happens since ever. I can open an issue, but I will not be able to pinpoint the VCS commit where this behavior was introduced... One thing I don't understand is why reformat is needed in some refactor cases? I have never seen this behavior in any other IDE I have used. For example, why extract method should reformat the entire method? Shouldn't it replace the code extracted with the new message send? Sure, the new message sent replacing the old code might be formatted according to the default formatting configuration, but why does the refactoring process need to touch the rest of the method code? Also, the old code needs only to be pasted in the new method with some changes, does it need to be reformated? Regards, Vitor On Wed, May 20, 2020 at 6:52 AM jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de < jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de> wrote: > Am 20.05.20 um 10:45 schrieb Guillermo Polito: > > Hi, > > El 20 may 2020, a las 1:54, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> escribiÃ³: > > That seems to violate the Principal Of Least Surprise. > > > Yes, I happen to also not like that behaviour :( > > > me too. Although I am not on Pharo ;-) > > > Whether or not it ends up getting changed, I think its worthwhile entering > that directly in the issue tracker. > It would assist if you could bisect to isolate which commit introduced the > behaviour. > > > Opening an issue is a good start. > > I also wonder, I think refactorings work like this since the beginning? > > At least for the last 15 years. > > But if it was introduced at some point, it should be nice to know if it > can be easily reverted. > > Also, refactorings DO need to rebuild the source code after refactoring, > so maybe there are some cases where maintaining the old formatting is > difficult? > > > Yeah, that's why I think it would be great if the RB engine could be > extended with a(n optional) hook to call some "local/personal" formatter > instead of reformatting immediately. This way we could at least make sure > that the reformatting happens according to our taste and in line with > whatever we use to format our code. Preserving the old formatting is likely > to not be a good idea at least for some refactorings lie extract method, in > addition to possibly being difficult. > > The plus of such a plugin/hook approach is that this could probably be > maintainable cross-platform. Every dialect could plug their formatter > without changing RBs internals. I don't know if there still exists some > "common code base" of RB at all, so maybe this is just stupid blah blah > anyways... > > > Joachim > > > > > > > > cheers -ben > > On Wed, 20 May 2020 at 01:34, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> When I run a refactoring, Rename Method, for example, the refactoring is >> reformatting the code affected. Is it possible to configure Pharo to >> refactor without reformatting code? Depending on the refactoring, the >> reformat is so intrusive that make it more worth to make the refactoring by >> hand. >> >> Regards, >> Vitor >> > > > -- > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Objektfabrik Joachim Tuchel mailto:jtuchel@objektfabrik.de <jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de> > Fliederweg 1 http://www.objektfabrik.de > D-71640 Ludwigsburg http://joachimtuchel.wordpress.com > Telefon: +49 7141 56 10 86 0 Fax: +49 7141 56 10 86 1 > > > >

May 20, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] New user

by Vitor Medina Cruz

> > Something I'm not quite sure on, is whether using > repository: 'github://....'rather than a HTTPS connection > requires SSH keys to set up. > There is no need of SSH keys setup. On Wed, May 20, 2020 at 2:02 AM Vince Refiti < vince.refiti(a)trapezegroup.com.au> wrote: > Hi > > > > I prefer to clone every repo I use locally. > > > > I just did this with Seaside and then used Iceberg to load it into a new > Pharo8 image and it worked. > > > > Vince > > > > *From:* Pharo-users <pharo-users-bounces(a)lists.pharo.org> *On Behalf Of *Vitor > Medina Cruz > *Sent:* Wednesday, 20 May 2020 12:27 PM > *To:* Any question about pharo is welcome <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org> > *Subject:* Re: [Pharo-users] New user > > > > *EXTERNAL: Do not click links or open attachments if you do not recognize > the sender.* > > > > Hello, > > > > I feel your pain. > > > > Updated, consistent and centralized documentation is not strong in Pharo. > Things are changing fast and docs don't catch up, also there is an effort > to move projects to github, so usually updated stuff are there. I never use > Catalog anymore because often things goes wrong. Books are only good to > explain major concepts that are less likely to change over time, in order > to getting started I would recommend: > > > > 1- Seaside github project: https://github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside__;!!I_DbfM1…>. > Their readme and wiki page seems to be very good and updated, I just > evaluated this on playground and it worked as expected: > > > > Metacello new > baseline:'Seaside3'; > repository: 'github://SeasideSt/Seaside:v3.4.1/repository'; > load > > > > I avoid using master tag as it is usually development branch or frequently > has some commit that breaks everything up and and what I want is something > reliable, so I always use version tags (when the projects provides one). > > > > After that, I think using the wiki ( > https://github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside/wiki > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside/wiki__;!!I_…>) > or seaside web book (http://book.seaside.st/book > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/book.seaside.st/book__;!!I_DbfM1H!WXIAvRa…>) > can get you through all you need to know. > > > > 2- Pharo open documentation is a much better place to be getting started > with Pharo: https://github.com/pharo-open-documentation/pharo-wiki > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/github.com/pharo-open-documentation/phar…> > > > > 3- Then you can go and read Pharo by Example and Deep in Pharo books in > order to get more information after you can get started, if you are > interest, but by now you must be able to do most basic stuff with the > system.. > > > > Hope that helps you getting by and fuel you interest in Smalltalk and > Pharo. > > > > Regars, > > Vitor > > > > > > > > On Tue, May 19, 2020 at 7:38 PM G B via Pharo-users < > pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org> wrote: > > I am new to Pharo and liked that it is a cleaned up and modern Smalltalk, > but I think I'm done before I ever started. My biggest interest was in > Seaside, yet trying to install it from instructions on the Seaside GitHub > fails: > > > > Metacello new > baseline:'Seaside3'; > repository: 'github://SeasideSt/Seaside:master/repository'; > load > > > > Trying to load packages from the catalog browser like Magritte fails. Some > packages aren't updated for 8.0 and are only available for 7.0. Some are > only available for 4.0. Trying to follow the book for creating a blog has > ha me spend time trying to get something going to no avail. > > > > I'm not an expert programmer, but I've been in IT for 25 years and can do > some C, Racket, Pascal, shell languages, awk, Perl, but I am stymied at > every turn with Pharo. > > > > > >

May 20, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Refactor without formatting

by jtuchel＠objektfabrik.de

Am 20.05.20 um 10:45 schrieb Guillermo Polito: > Hi, > >> El 20 may 2020, a las 1:54, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com >> <mailto:btc@openinworld.com>> escribiÃ³: >> >> That seems to violate the Principal Of Least Surprise. > > Yes, I happen to also not like that behaviour :( me too. Although I am not on Pharo ;-) > >> Whether or not it ends up getting changed, I think itsÂ worthwhile >> entering that directly in the issue tracker. >> It would assist if you could bisect to isolate which commit >> introduced the behaviour. > > Opening an issue is a good start. > > I also wonder, I think refactorings work like this since the beginning? At least for the last 15 years. > But if it was introduced at some point, it should be nice to know if > it can be easily reverted. > > Also, refactorings DO need to rebuild the source code after > refactoring, so maybe there are some cases where maintaining the old > formatting is difficult? Yeah, that's why I think it would be great if the RB engine could be extended with a(n optional) hook to call some "local/personal" formatter instead of reformatting immediately. This way we could at least make sure that the reformatting happens according to our taste and in line with whatever we use to format our code. Preserving the old formatting is likely to not be a good idea at least for some refactorings lie extract method, in addition to possibly being difficult. The plus of such a plugin/hook approach is that this could probably be maintainable cross-platform. Every dialect could plug their formatter without changing RBs internals. I don't know if there still exists some "common code base" of RB at all, so maybe this is just stupid blah blah anyways... Joachim > >> >> cheers -ben >> >> On Wed, 20 May 2020 at 01:34, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com >> <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> Hello, >> >> When I run a refactoring, Rename Method, for example, the >> refactoring is reformatting the code affected. Is it possible to >> configure Pharo to refactor without reformatting code? Depending >> on the refactoring, the reformat is so intrusive that make it >> more worth to make the refactoring by hand. >> >> Regards, >> Vitor >> > -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Objektfabrik Joachim Tuchel mailto:jtuchel@objektfabrik.de Fliederweg 1 http://www.objektfabrik.de D-71640 Ludwigsburg http://joachimtuchel.wordpress.com Telefon: +49 7141 56 10 86 0 Fax: +49 7141 56 10 86 1

May 20, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Refactor without formatting

by Guillermo Polito

Hi, > El 20 may 2020, a las 1:54, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> escribiÃ³: > > That seems to violate the Principal Of Least Surprise. Yes, I happen to also not like that behaviour :( > Whether or not it ends up getting changed, I think its worthwhile entering that directly in the issue tracker. > It would assist if you could bisect to isolate which commit introduced the behaviour. Opening an issue is a good start. I also wonder, I think refactorings work like this since the beginning? But if it was introduced at some point, it should be nice to know if it can be easily reverted. Also, refactorings DO need to rebuild the source code after refactoring, so maybe there are some cases where maintaining the old formatting is difficult? > > cheers -ben > > On Wed, 20 May 2020 at 01:34, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: > Hello, > > When I run a refactoring, Rename Method, for example, the refactoring is reformatting the code affected. Is it possible to configure Pharo to refactor without reformatting code? Depending on the refactoring, the reformat is so intrusive that make it more worth to make the refactoring by hand. > > Regards, > Vitor

May 20, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Siren 9.0 Released

by Richard O'Keefe

Cincom still has a "Personal Use Licence". http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/main/community/product-portal/trying-cincom-… I am running vw8.3pul, and file ~/vw8.3pul/bin/linuxx86_64/visual /home/ok/vw8.3pul/bin/linuxx86_64/visual: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked, interpreter /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2, for GNU/Linux 2.6.9, stripped it is 64-bit. The paid version of VW is up to 9.0, but 8.3 works for me. On Fri, 15 May 2020 at 08:16, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > Thanks Steven this is cool to see that Siren is living and kicking. > Last year I was browsing the old site and I was sad because I thought it > was dead. > Your OSC looks better than the one in Pharo even if we used it > successfully to connect interactive tables with a HCI research group. > > If you need help to migrate from VW let us know because it would be great > to have Siren working in Pharo. > I did not see any Unit tests and the tests saved us when we migrated > Moose. Sometimes we even only kept them because they were > better than the implementation. It took us around six months and we got > free :) > And we have some contacts that would be interested in London. We could put > you in contact. > > Now just some questions and you may know the answer so I ask > > I was thinking but I may be totally wrong that it was forbidden to give VW > images and that the current license > was for personal use only. Long time ago the shrink process was removing > the compiler. Now I saw that your image is 42mb. > > Personally I do not want to download any VisualWorks distribution and sign > their licenses because I want to stay cristal clear > on ANY license and possible issues. I did not look at Visualworks since > 2008 and I feel clean and I will stay like that. > > So I imagine that Iâm not allowed to use your software. Iâm not good in > music sadly so there is no frustration from my side. > > You mention that people can use a non-commercial version of VW but this > license does not exist anymore. > Is there a 64 bits version of VW because VW7.5 starts to show its age and > on recent mac you only have 64 bits. > > > Some people may think that we are just over the top on open-source but > this is not by accident that we took the responsibility to create Pharo. > We could not distribute Moose our open-source platform so after 10 years > of hard work we had to do something. And we created Pharo. > And the problem we got were with the previous version (the non commercial) > of the Cincom license and the new one is even more restrictive. > Some friends of mine told me that some lawyers were starting to get picky > and send letters around. > So watch out. > > BTW I did not see the license of Siren on the git repo. If I may suggest > one, > BSD/MIT are nice, avoid GPL because it means that nobody serious on > Smalltalk will ever look at your system and contribute. > > S. > > On 14 May 2020, at 01:40, stephen(a)heaveneverywhere.com wrote: > > > Hello all, > > The Siren system is a general-purpose framework for music and sound > composition, processing, performance, and analysis; it is a collection of > about 350 classes written in Smalltalk-80 (40 kLOC or so). Siren 9.0 works > on VisualWorks Smalltalk (though the bulk has been ported to other dialects > as well); Siren supports streaming I/O via OpenSoundControl (OSC), MIDI, > and multi-channel audio ports. The Siren release is available via the web > from the URL http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren>. > > Siren is a programming framework and tool kit; the intended audience is > Smalltalk developers, or users willing to learn Smalltalk in order to write > their own applications. The built-in applications are meant as > demonstrations of the use of the libraries, rather than as end-user > applications. Siren is not a MIDI sequencer, nor a score notation editor, > through both of these applications would be easy to implement with the > Siren framework. > > There are several elements to Siren: > > * the Smoke music representation language (music magnitudes, events, event > lists, generators, functions, and sounds); > > * voices, schedulers and I/O drivers (real-time and file-based voices, > sound, score file, OSC, and MIDI I/O); > > * user interface components for musical applications (UI framework, tools, > and widgets); > > * several built-in applications (editors and browsers for Smoke objects); > and > > * external library interfaces for streaming I/O and DSP math (sound/MIDI > I/O, fast FFT, CSL & Loris sound analysis/resynthesis packages ) > > The best in-depth doc (book chapter) is in, > http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren/Doc/SirenBookChapter.pdf > <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Doc/SirenBookChapter.pdf> > > The read the demo code workbook (this text), go to, > http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren/Siren7.5.Workbook.html > <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Siren7.5.Workbook.html> > or > http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren/Siren7.5.Workbook.pdf > <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Siren7.5.Workbook.pdf> > > If you like to read manuals, take a look at, > http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren/Manual <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Manual> > > or watch the detailed Siren demo at, > https://vimeo.com/120751122 > > The links to get Siren9 are, > > Web site: http://fastlabinc.com/Siren > > Package download: http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Siren_9.0.zip > > Github repo: https://github.com/stpope/Siren9 > > > Comments solicited. > > Stephen Pope > > > -- > > Stephen Travis Pope Santa Barbara, California, USA > > <pastedGraphic.tiff> http://HeavenEverywhere.com > <http://heaveneverywhere.com/> http://FASTLabInc.com > <http://fastlabinc.com/> > https://vimeo.com/user19434036/videos *http://heaveneverywhere.com/Reflections > <http://heaveneverywhere.com/Reflections>* > > -- > > > > > -------------------------------------------- > StÃ©phane Ducasse > http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr / http://www.pharo.org > 03 59 35 87 52 > Assistant: Julie Jonas > FAX 03 59 57 78 50 > TEL 03 59 35 86 16 > S. Ducasse - Inria > 40, avenue Halley, > Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, BÃ¢t.A, Park Plaza > Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650 > France > >

May 20, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Siren 9.0 Released

by Todd Blanchard

It is interesting to see that Siren uses PortAudio. I was considering to recommend adopting it for Pharo in the other sound thread. It has been used in a lot of projects, but I am a little concerned it has not been recently updated. http://www.portaudio.com > On May 14, 2020, at 1:15 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > Thanks Steven this is cool to see that Siren is living and kicking. > Last year I was browsing the old site and I was sad because I thought it was dead. > Your OSC looks better than the one in Pharo even if we used it successfully to connect interactive tables with a HCI research group. > > If you need help to migrate from VW let us know because it would be great to have Siren working in Pharo. > I did not see any Unit tests and the tests saved us when we migrated Moose. Sometimes we even only kept them because they were > better than the implementation. It took us around six months and we got free :) > And we have some contacts that would be interested in London. We could put you in contact. > > Now just some questions and you may know the answer so I ask > > I was thinking but I may be totally wrong that it was forbidden to give VW images and that the current license > was for personal use only. Long time ago the shrink process was removing the compiler. Now I saw that your image is 42mb. > > Personally I do not want to download any VisualWorks distribution and sign their licenses because I want to stay cristal clear > on ANY license and possible issues. I did not look at Visualworks since 2008 and I feel clean and I will stay like that. > > So I imagine that Iâm not allowed to use your software. Iâm not good in music sadly so there is no frustration from my side. > > You mention that people can use a non-commercial version of VW but this license does not exist anymore. > > Is there a 64 bits version of VW because VW7.5 starts to show its age and on recent mac you only have 64 bits. > > > Some people may think that we are just over the top on open-source but this is not by accident that we took the responsibility to create Pharo. > We could not distribute Moose our open-source platform so after 10 years of hard work we had to do something. And we created Pharo. > And the problem we got were with the previous version (the non commercial) of the Cincom license and the new one is even more restrictive. > Some friends of mine told me that some lawyers were starting to get picky and send letters around. > So watch out. > > BTW I did not see the license of Siren on the git repo. If I may suggest one, > BSD/MIT are nice, avoid GPL because it means that nobody serious on Smalltalk will ever look at your system and contribute. > > S. > >> On 14 May 2020, at 01:40, stephen(a)heaveneverywhere.com <mailto:stephen@heaveneverywhere.com> wrote: >> >> >> Hello all, >> >> The Siren system is a general-purpose framework for music and sound composition, processing, performance, and analysis; it is a collection of about 350 classes written in Smalltalk-80 (40 kLOC or so). Siren 9.0 works on VisualWorks Smalltalk (though the bulk has been ported to other dialects as well); Siren supports streaming I/O via OpenSoundControl (OSC), MIDI, and multi-channel audio ports. The Siren release is available via the web from the URL http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren>. >> >> Siren is a programming framework and tool kit; the intended audience is Smalltalk developers, or users willing to learn Smalltalk in order to write their own applications. The built-in applications are meant as demonstrations of the use of the libraries, rather than as end-user applications. Siren is not a MIDI sequencer, nor a score notation editor, through both of these applications would be easy to implement with the Siren framework. >> >> There are several elements to Siren: >> >> * the Smoke music representation language (music magnitudes, events, event lists, generators, functions, and sounds); >> >> * voices, schedulers and I/O drivers (real-time and file-based voices, sound, score file, OSC, and MIDI I/O); >> >> * user interface components for musical applications (UI framework, tools, and widgets); >> >> * several built-in applications (editors and browsers for Smoke objects); and >> >> * external library interfaces for streaming I/O and DSP math (sound/MIDI I/O, fast FFT, CSL & Loris sound analysis/resynthesis packages ) >> >> The best in-depth doc (book chapter) is in, >> http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren/Doc/SirenBookChapter.pdf <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Doc/SirenBookChapter.pdf> >> >> The read the demo code workbook (this text), go to, >> http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren/Siren7.5.Workbook.html <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Siren7.5.Workbook.html> >> or >> http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren/Siren7.5.Workbook.pdf <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Siren7.5.Workbook.pdf> >> >> If you like to read manuals, take a look at, >> http://FASTLabInc.com/Siren/Manual <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Manual> >> >> or watch the detailed Siren demo at, >> https://vimeo.com/120751122 <https://vimeo.com/120751122> >> >> The links to get Siren9 are, >> >> Web site: http://fastlabinc.com/Siren <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren> >> >> Package download: http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Siren_9.0.zip <http://fastlabinc.com/Siren/Siren_9.0.zip> >> >> Github repo: https://github.com/stpope/Siren9 <https://github.com/stpope/Siren9> >> >> >> Comments solicited. >> >> Stephen Pope >> >> >> -- >> >> Stephen Travis Pope Santa Barbara, California, USA >> <pastedGraphic.tiff> http://HeavenEverywhere.com <http://heaveneverywhere.com/> http://FASTLabInc.com <http://fastlabinc.com/> >> https://vimeo.com/user19434036/videos <https://vimeo.com/user19434036/videos> http://heaveneverywhere.com/Reflections <http://heaveneverywhere.com/Reflections> >> >> -- >> >> >> > > -------------------------------------------- > StÃ©phane Ducasse > http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr <http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr/> / http://www.pharo.org <http://www.pharo.org/> > 03 59 35 87 52 > Assistant: Julie Jonas > FAX 03 59 57 78 50 > TEL 03 59 35 86 16 > S. Ducasse - Inria > 40, avenue Halley, > Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, BÃ¢t.A, Park Plaza > Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650 > France >

May 20, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] New user

by Vince Refiti

Hi I prefer to clone every repo I use locally. I just did this with Seaside and then used Iceberg to load it into a new Pharo8 image and it worked. Vince From: Pharo-users <pharo-users-bounces(a)lists.pharo.org> On Behalf Of Vitor Medina Cruz Sent: Wednesday, 20 May 2020 12:27 PM To: Any question about pharo is welcome <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org> Subject: Re: [Pharo-users] New user EXTERNAL: Do not click links or open attachments if you do not recognize the sender. Hello, I feel your pain. Updated, consistent and centralized documentation is not strong in Pharo. Things are changing fast and docs don't catch up, also there is an effort to move projects to github, so usually updated stuff are there. I never use Catalog anymore because often things goes wrong. Books are only good to explain major concepts that are less likely to change over time, in order to getting started I would recommend: 1- Seaside github project: https://github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside__;!!I_DbfM1…>. Their readme and wiki page seems to be very good and updated, I just evaluated this on playground and it worked as expected: Metacello new baseline:'Seaside3'; repository: 'github://SeasideSt/Seaside:v3.4.1/repository'; load I avoid using master tag as it is usually development branch or frequently has some commit that breaks everything up and and what I want is something reliable, so I always use version tags (when the projects provides one). After that, I think using the wiki (https://github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside/wiki<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/github.com/SeasideSt/Seaside/wiki__;!!I_…>) or seaside web book (http://book.seaside.st/book<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/book.seaside.st/book__;!!I_DbfM1H!WXIAvRa…>) can get you through all you need to know. 2- Pharo open documentation is a much better place to be getting started with Pharo: https://github.com/pharo-open-documentation/pharo-wiki<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/github.com/pharo-open-documentation/phar…> 3- Then you can go and read Pharo by Example and Deep in Pharo books in order to get more information after you can get started, if you are interest, but by now you must be able to do most basic stuff with the system.. Hope that helps you getting by and fuel you interest in Smalltalk and Pharo. Regars, Vitor On Tue, May 19, 2020 at 7:38 PM G B via Pharo-users <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org<mailto:pharo-users@lists.pharo.org>> wrote: I am new to Pharo and liked that it is a cleaned up and modern Smalltalk, but I think I'm done before I ever started. My biggest interest was in Seaside, yet trying to install it from instructions on the Seaside GitHub fails: Metacello new baseline:'Seaside3'; repository: 'github://SeasideSt/Seaside:master/repository'; load Trying to load packages from the catalog browser like Magritte fails. Some packages aren't updated for 8.0 and are only available for 7.0. Some are only available for 4.0. Trying to follow the book for creating a blog has ha me spend time trying to get something going to no avail. I'm not an expert programmer, but I've been in IT for 25 years and can do some C, Racket, Pascal, shell languages, awk, Perl, but I am stymied at every turn with Pharo.

May 20, 2020