February 2020 - Pharo-users

Re: [Pharo-users] The results are in!

by Ben Coman

Hi Guille, Full disclosure, I've spent the past 6 months using my discretionary hobby time programming the infrastructure for this competition using Pharo, so my viewpoint may be biased. On Sun, 9 Feb 2020 at 03:25, Guillermo Polito <guillermopolito(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi Richard, > > Iâd like to invite you to refrain yourself from posting such off-topic messages in the future. > > This list is for people to *ask* questions about Pharo. Not to diffuse any kind of propaganda (pharo related or not). This list is not just for asking questions. There are plenty of [ANN] posts advertising new libraries and blogs articles. Following completion of the competition, the MIT licensed code repository will be announced here. Hopefully it may provide an engaging exercise for Pharo teachers to their with their students. > I have the feeling this list has been lately flooded with such off-topic messages. Unfortunately the original post was quite bare and failed to show how it was Pharo-topical. So I can understand how it triggered you. I hope the additional background info provided here alleviates some of your concern about it. > I know you donât agree, but I invite you to read here the **purpose** of this list, just for respect to people subscribed to it: > https://lists.pharo.org/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users_lists.pharo.org The purpose I see there seems fairly generic... "This is the general mailing list for users of Pharo." The competition is programmed in Pharo and Pharo is promoted later in the video with screens like... [image: image.png] [image: image.png] But that promotion is not the main thing. The main thing is simply that this is-A competition programmed using Pharo, and as such this list seems reasonable a reasonable place discuss it. Although the "smalltalk" title of the video is not ideal, that was the name of the competition when it was originally going to use VisualWorks, and so it carried over. A final thing to consider is how welcomed the dozens of competing students may feel if they are watching this list and see their Pharo based competition spurned by the community. So with this additional perspective, may one post a week be allowed to share the progress of the competition? cheers -ben > El 8 feb 2020, a las 19:12, Richard Kenneth Eng <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com> escribiÃ³: > > Round 1 â #1 Leading Team: https://youtu.be/QWHeN5WXfBQ > > I'm actually quite amazed by their effort. They surpassed my expectations. > > At the risk of sounding immodest, I think this is a terrific way to promote Smalltalk (Pharo). I think the video is an absolute blast. > > Richard > >

Feb. 9, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] P3 and concurrenty

by Petter Egesund

Yes, thanks for good feedback. I will try the pooled way, I think - not primarily because of speed, but due to that our library is built around prepared connections. Petter On Sun, Feb 9, 2020 at 6:01 PM Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > Hi Petter, > > > On 9 Feb 2020, at 17:27, Petter Egesund <petter.egesund(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > Hi Sven and thanks for answering! > > > > I use Teapot with one common sql-connecton, not one for each user > session. At startup I create several sql statements and these does not seem > to be usable from different Teapot request at the same time. > > It is useable, but not concurrently. > > > I could create one connection pr. session and then close the database > connection when the user leaves, but then I also would need to create all > the prepared sql-statements for each session, which does not sound right to > me? > > Yes and no, see further. > > > It seems I have will have to look into the other solution, and see if I > can use some mutex stuff to avoid several tasks acessessing the same > resources at the same time. > > Yes, follow the pointer that I gave you, it is not hard. > > > Creating a pool sounds like the right solution to me now - any meaning > about this? > > Yes, you could create a connection pool. But that is harder than it > sounds: what is the minimum size, the maximum size, what do you do when you > go over it, how do you make sure that a resource (connection) is clean when > returning it to the pool (given authentication, possible errors), ... > > I don't know what you are doing, but I think you focus too much on > performance issues. I would first try to get the code correct and worry > about performance later on. > > Running > > P3ClientTest new runBenchmark1Bench. > > on my machine gives me a BenchmarkResult(67 iterations in 5 seconds 57 > milliseconds. 13.249 per second). This is a query that returns 10.000 > records with 5 columns. It is reusing the same client/connection for all > iterations. > > If I modify this slightly to use a new client/connection each time, like > this > > [ > (P3Client url: 'psql://sven@localhost') > query: 'SELECT * FROM benchmark1'; > close > ] benchFor: 5 seconds > > I get a BenchmarkResult(65 iterations in 5 seconds 34 milliseconds. 12.912 > per second) which almost as fast. Of course, for smaller queries, the > connect/disconnect overhead will be more significant. > > And note that this is not using prepared statements. > > So I would start by opening/closing a connection each time you need it. > > HTH, > > Sven > > > Petter > > > > > > On Sun, Feb 9, 2020 at 4:52 PM Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> > wrote: > > Hi Petter, > > > > [ CC-ing the Pharo Users list ] > > > > P3Client is not built/designed to be used by multiple processes > concurrently. Each database connection is represented by an instance of > P3Client and holds some state both at the client as well as at the server > side. > > > > Typically, in a multi user server application, each connection should > have its own P3Client / psql connection. For example, in Seaside, a custom > WASession subclass gives each session/user its own p3 connection/client. > > > > Is that what you are doing ? > > > > If not, you could wrap your db accessing code so that mutual exclusion > is provided. For example, you can have a look at AbstractCache > #beThreadSafe and #critical: > > > > That will then serialise requests and possibly block one onto the other. > > > > HTH, > > > > Sven > > > > PS: another thing to take care of if closing your sql connections when > the session is no longer needed. > > > > PS: Zinc HTTP does also provide a session mechanism > (ZnServerSession[Manager]) but these work with cookies and typically won't > help with a REST access pattern. > > > > > On 9 Feb 2020, at 14:21, Petter Egesund <petter.egesund(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > > Hi Sven > > > > > > We are using Pharo as our backend in a project and we have run into a > problem with P3. > > > > > > The problem seems to be connected to compiled sql statements and > concurrency. > > > > > > We keep getting this error: Bindcomplete message expected > > > > > > Problem seems to be easy to reproduce: > > > > > > 1) Compile any sql statement > > > 2) Use this statement in a query twice (!) in a teapot endpoint > > > > > > The run some concurrent queries, like "curl > http://localhost:8080/endpoint & curl http://localhost:8080/endpoint.." > (add several curls after here). > > > > > > One could also use ex. siege ( > https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html) for easy > reproducing. > > > > > > If we chain the curls after each other, like "curl > http://localhost:8080/endpoint && > https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html && > https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html.." it seems > to work fine, so doing the request sequentially seem to work fine. > > > > > > My conclusion is that this must be connected to how teapot handles > concurrency in companion with the compiled statements? > > > > > > Any clues on this one? We are on Pharo 8.0 with latest version of P3, > PG 9.x) > > > > > > Best regards > > > > > > Petter Egesund (I wrote the heysql-package based on P3) > > > >

Feb. 9, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] [Browser] object is deprecated

by Denis Kudriashov

Hi Steve Smalltalk tools browser open Ð²Ñ, 9 ÑÐµÐ²Ñ. 2020 Ð³. Ð² 17:37, Steve Quezadas <steveeq1(a)gmail.com>: > Hello, > > I am porting a package into Pharo 8. One of the objects is referring to > object [Browser], but that does not seem to present in Pharo8 and > deprecated in Pharo5. What is the modern replacement for [Browser]? > > Also, is there a "smaltalk" way to find out recommended replacements for > deprecated objects? > > - Steve > > PS How do you open object [Browser] in Pharo5, so I can at least visually > see it? "Browser new open" and "Browser new openInWorld" both don't work. >

Feb. 9, 2020

[Browser] object is deprecated

by Steve Quezadas

Hello, I am porting a package into Pharo 8. One of the objects is referring to object [Browser], but that does not seem to present in Pharo8 and deprecated in Pharo5. What is the modern replacement for [Browser]? Also, is there a "smaltalk" way to find out recommended replacements for deprecated objects? - Steve PS How do you open object [Browser] in Pharo5, so I can at least visually see it? "Browser new open" and "Browser new openInWorld" both don't work.

Feb. 9, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] P3 and concurrenty

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Hi Petter, > On 9 Feb 2020, at 17:27, Petter Egesund <petter.egesund(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi Sven and thanks for answering! > > I use Teapot with one common sql-connecton, not one for each user session. At startup I create several sql statements and these does not seem to be usable from different Teapot request at the same time. It is useable, but not concurrently. > I could create one connection pr. session and then close the database connection when the user leaves, but then I also would need to create all the prepared sql-statements for each session, which does not sound right to me? Yes and no, see further. > It seems I have will have to look into the other solution, and see if I can use some mutex stuff to avoid several tasks acessessing the same resources at the same time. Yes, follow the pointer that I gave you, it is not hard. > Creating a pool sounds like the right solution to me now - any meaning about this? Yes, you could create a connection pool. But that is harder than it sounds: what is the minimum size, the maximum size, what do you do when you go over it, how do you make sure that a resource (connection) is clean when returning it to the pool (given authentication, possible errors), ... I don't know what you are doing, but I think you focus too much on performance issues. I would first try to get the code correct and worry about performance later on. Running P3ClientTest new runBenchmark1Bench. on my machine gives me a BenchmarkResult(67 iterations in 5 seconds 57 milliseconds. 13.249 per second). This is a query that returns 10.000 records with 5 columns. It is reusing the same client/connection for all iterations. If I modify this slightly to use a new client/connection each time, like this [ (P3Client url: 'psql://sven@localhost') query: 'SELECT * FROM benchmark1'; close ] benchFor: 5 seconds I get a BenchmarkResult(65 iterations in 5 seconds 34 milliseconds. 12.912 per second) which almost as fast. Of course, for smaller queries, the connect/disconnect overhead will be more significant. And note that this is not using prepared statements. So I would start by opening/closing a connection each time you need it. HTH, Sven > Petter > > > On Sun, Feb 9, 2020 at 4:52 PM Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > Hi Petter, > > [ CC-ing the Pharo Users list ] > > P3Client is not built/designed to be used by multiple processes concurrently. Each database connection is represented by an instance of P3Client and holds some state both at the client as well as at the server side. > > Typically, in a multi user server application, each connection should have its own P3Client / psql connection. For example, in Seaside, a custom WASession subclass gives each session/user its own p3 connection/client. > > Is that what you are doing ? > > If not, you could wrap your db accessing code so that mutual exclusion is provided. For example, you can have a look at AbstractCache #beThreadSafe and #critical: > > That will then serialise requests and possibly block one onto the other. > > HTH, > > Sven > > PS: another thing to take care of if closing your sql connections when the session is no longer needed. > > PS: Zinc HTTP does also provide a session mechanism (ZnServerSession[Manager]) but these work with cookies and typically won't help with a REST access pattern. > > > On 9 Feb 2020, at 14:21, Petter Egesund <petter.egesund(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Hi Sven > > > > We are using Pharo as our backend in a project and we have run into a problem with P3. > > > > The problem seems to be connected to compiled sql statements and concurrency. > > > > We keep getting this error: Bindcomplete message expected > > > > Problem seems to be easy to reproduce: > > > > 1) Compile any sql statement > > 2) Use this statement in a query twice (!) in a teapot endpoint > > > > The run some concurrent queries, like "curl http://localhost:8080/endpoint & curl http://localhost:8080/endpoint.." (add several curls after here). > > > > One could also use ex. siege (https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html) for easy reproducing. > > > > If we chain the curls after each other, like "curl http://localhost:8080/endpoint && https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html && https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html.." it seems to work fine, so doing the request sequentially seem to work fine. > > > > My conclusion is that this must be connected to how teapot handles concurrency in companion with the compiled statements? > > > > Any clues on this one? We are on Pharo 8.0 with latest version of P3, PG 9.x) > > > > Best regards > > > > Petter Egesund (I wrote the heysql-package based on P3) >

Feb. 9, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Dictionary removeKey: very low

by Richard O'Keefe

It's a problem with the traditional Smalltalk-80 implementation of Dictionaries. Using my compiler and library, 1311 usec to build 498 usec to delete (1..10000) 1318 usec to build 472 usec to delete (10000..1) (The time difference between building and deleting is mostly #printString.) There is no defect in the Pharo compiler here, it's the hash table design which is basically flawed if you want delete entries. My library uses separate chaining (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hash_table#Separate_chaining) which makes deletion simple and fast and allows 'null' keys. Pharo uses open addressing, which makes deletion much harder. It doesn't seem to improve retrieval performance either. On Mon, 3 Feb 2020 at 23:18, LABORDE Pierre <pierre.laborde(a)fr.thalesgroup.com> wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > I have a problem with Dictionaries : > > > > dic := Dictionary new: 10000. > > > > 1 to: 10000 do:[ :i | > > dic at: i put: i printString. > > ]. > > > > 1 to: 10000 do:[ :i | > > dic removeKey: i. > > ] > > > > Removing each keys is very slooow, time execution difference between add and remove is crazy. > > Any idea for fix that ? Can I use another Dictionary implementation or settings ? > > > > Thanks. > > > > Pierre > >

Feb. 9, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] P3 and concurrenty

by Petter Egesund

Hi Sven and thanks for answering! I use Teapot with one common sql-connecton, not one for each user session. At startup I create several sql statements and these does not seem to be usable from different Teapot request at the same time. I could create one connection pr. session and then close the database connection when the user leaves, but then I also would need to create all the prepared sql-statements for each session, which does not sound right to me? It seems I have will have to look into the other solution, and see if I can use some mutex stuff to avoid several tasks acessessing the same resources at the same time,. Creating a pool sounds like the right solution to me now - any meaning about this? Petter On Sun, Feb 9, 2020 at 4:52 PM Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > Hi Petter, > > [ CC-ing the Pharo Users list ] > > P3Client is not built/designed to be used by multiple processes > concurrently. Each database connection is represented by an instance of > P3Client and holds some state both at the client as well as at the server > side. > > Typically, in a multi user server application, each connection should have > its own P3Client / psql connection. For example, in Seaside, a custom > WASession subclass gives each session/user its own p3 connection/client. > > Is that what you are doing ? > > If not, you could wrap your db accessing code so that mutual exclusion is > provided. For example, you can have a look at AbstractCache #beThreadSafe > and #critical: > > That will then serialise requests and possibly block one onto the other. > > HTH, > > Sven > > PS: another thing to take care of if closing your sql connections when the > session is no longer needed. > > PS: Zinc HTTP does also provide a session mechanism > (ZnServerSession[Manager]) but these work with cookies and typically won't > help with a REST access pattern. > > > On 9 Feb 2020, at 14:21, Petter Egesund <petter.egesund(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > Hi Sven > > > > We are using Pharo as our backend in a project and we have run into a > problem with P3. > > > > The problem seems to be connected to compiled sql statements and > concurrency. > > > > We keep getting this error: Bindcomplete message expected > > > > Problem seems to be easy to reproduce: > > > > 1) Compile any sql statement > > 2) Use this statement in a query twice (!) in a teapot endpoint > > > > The run some concurrent queries, like "curl > http://localhost:8080/endpoint & curl http://localhost:8080/endpoint.." > (add several curls after here). > > > > One could also use ex. siege ( > https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html) for easy > reproducing. > > > > If we chain the curls after each other, like "curl > http://localhost:8080/endpoint && > https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html && > https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html.." it seems > to work fine, so doing the request sequentially seem to work fine. > > > > My conclusion is that this must be connected to how teapot handles > concurrency in companion with the compiled statements? > > > > Any clues on this one? We are on Pharo 8.0 with latest version of P3, PG > 9.x) > > > > Best regards > > > > Petter Egesund (I wrote the heysql-package based on P3) > >

Feb. 9, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] P3 and concurrenty

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Hi Petter, [ CC-ing the Pharo Users list ] P3Client is not built/designed to be used by multiple processes concurrently. Each database connection is represented by an instance of P3Client and holds some state both at the client as well as at the server side. Typically, in a multi user server application, each connection should have its own P3Client / psql connection. For example, in Seaside, a custom WASession subclass gives each session/user its own p3 connection/client. Is that what you are doing ? If not, you could wrap your db accessing code so that mutual exclusion is provided. For example, you can have a look at AbstractCache #beThreadSafe and #critical: That will then serialise requests and possibly block one onto the other. HTH, Sven PS: another thing to take care of if closing your sql connections when the session is no longer needed. PS: Zinc HTTP does also provide a session mechanism (ZnServerSession[Manager]) but these work with cookies and typically won't help with a REST access pattern. > On 9 Feb 2020, at 14:21, Petter Egesund <petter.egesund(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi Sven > > We are using Pharo as our backend in a project and we have run into a problem with P3. > > The problem seems to be connected to compiled sql statements and concurrency. > > We keep getting this error: Bindcomplete message expected > > Problem seems to be easy to reproduce: > > 1) Compile any sql statement > 2) Use this statement in a query twice (!) in a teapot endpoint > > The run some concurrent queries, like "curl http://localhost:8080/endpoint & curl http://localhost:8080/endpoint.." (add several curls after here). > > One could also use ex. siege (https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html) for easy reproducing. > > If we chain the curls after each other, like "curl http://localhost:8080/endpoint && https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html && https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man1/siege.1.html.." it seems to work fine, so doing the request sequentially seem to work fine. > > My conclusion is that this must be connected to how teapot handles concurrency in companion with the compiled statements? > > Any clues on this one? We are on Pharo 8.0 with latest version of P3, PG 9.x) > > Best regards > > Petter Egesund (I wrote the heysql-package based on P3)

Feb. 9, 2020

Voluntarily cancelling requests ("applying an expiration date")

by Holger Freyther

tl;dr: I am searching for a pattern (later code) to apply expiration to operations. Introduction: One nice aspect of Mongodb is that it has built-in data distribution[1] and configurable retention[2]. The upstream project has a document called "Server Discovery and Monitoring (SDAM)", defining how a client should behave. Martin Dias is currently implementing SDAM in MongoTalk/Voyage and I took it on a test drive. Behavior: My software stack is using Zinc, Zinc-REST, Voyage and Mongo. When a new REST requests arrives I am using Voyage (e.g. >>#selectOne:) which will use MongoTalk. The MongoTalk code needs to select the right server. It's currently done by waiting for a result. Next I started to simulate database outages. The rest clients retried when not receiving a result within two seconds (no back-off/jitter). What happened was roughly the following: [ 1.) ZnServer accepts a new connection 2.) MongoTalk waits for a server longer than 2s "nothing.. the above waits..." ] repeat. Problem: What happened next surprised me. I expected to have a bad time when the database recovers and all the stale (remember the REST clients already gave up and closed the socket) requests will be answered. Instead my image crashed early in my test as the ExternalSemaphoreTable was full. Let's focus on the timeout behavior and discuss the existence of the ExternalSemaphoreTable and the number of entries separately at a different time. To me the two main problems I see are: 1.) Lack of back-pressure for ZnManagingMultiThreadedServer 2.) Disconnect of time between the Application Layer handling REST is allowed to take and down the stack how long MongoTalk may sleep and wait for a server. The first item is difficult. Even answering HTTP 500 when we are out of space in the ExternalSemaphore is difficult... Let's ignore this for now as well. What I look for: 1.) Voluntarily Timeout Inside my Application code I would like to tag an operation with a timeout. This means everything that is done should complete within X seconds. It can be used on a voluntarily basis. >>#lookupPerson "We expect all database operations to complete within two seconds" person := ComputeContext current withTimeout: 2 seconds during: [ repository selectOne: Person where: [:each name | ...], ]. MongoTalk>>stuff "See if the outer context timeout has expired and signal. E.g. before writing something into the socket to keep consistency." ComputeContext current checkExpired. MongoTalk>>other "Sleep for up to the remaining time out (someSemaphore waitTimeoutContext: ComputeContext current) ifFalse: [ SomethingExpired signal. ] 2.) Cancellation More difficult to write in pseudo code (without TaskIt?). In my above case we are waiting for the database to be ready while the client already closed the file descriptor. Now we are not able to see this until much later. The idea is that in addition to the timeout we can pass a block that is called when an operation should be cancelled and the ComputeContext can be checked if something has been cancelled? The above takes inspiration from Go's context package[3]. In Go the context should be passed as parameter but we could make it a Process variable? Question: How do you handle this in your systems? Is this something we can consider for Pharo9? thanks holger [1] It has the concept of "replicationSet" and works by having a primary, secondary and arbiters running. [2] For every write one can configure if the write should succeed immediately (before it is even on disk) or when it has been written to multiple stores (e.g. majority, US and EMEA) [3] https://golang.org/pkg/context/

Feb. 9, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] The results are in!

by horrido

Now, who's telling lies? I have never "demanded" money for the competition. I've asked for donations through Kickstarter and GoFundMe. I didn't demand anything from LabWare; they were so impressed with my campaign, they offered to support it. Your characterization of me is inaccurate and unfair and downright insulting. I really don't understand where your vitriol is coming from. I have never "blamed" anybody for not donating. People are free to donate or not; I understand that and it's fine. Your characterization of my social media posts as "void articles" is also very insulting. As I said in another post, you don't seem to understand what marketing is all about. To you, anything that isn't technical information nor source code is void and vacuous. I don't "reject" feedback. I listen to it and if it makes sense, I act on it. Do all your feedback make sense? If I don't believe it makes sense, am I "rejecting" it? You seem to think that I should accept your feedback without question. Why should I? Who are you? You say I've been "spitting on every other programming language." It's fair game to compare Smalltalk with other languages. Am I "spitting" when I point out the weaknesses of other languages? Why are those languages off limits? Your use of loaded terms like "messianic" and "demand" and "blame" and "reject" shows that you are strongly biased against me. I don't know what I did to deserve your disdain, but I won't stand for it. I have my dignity and my grace. You, on the other hand, have no honour. And just for the record, many people appreciate my effort and support it. Does it please everybody? Of course not, nor should it. So if some of you are impatient with me, what am I supposed to do with that? Pavel Krivanek-3 wrote > so 8. 2. 2020 v 23:58 odesÃlatel Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-users < > pharo-users@.pharo >> napsal: > >> I guess I have to re-ask again since nobody answered my question from >> this week... >> >> Where can we post Pharo >> questions/remarks/thoughts/you-might-want-to-have-a-look-at-this-cool-idea/whatever >> >> (or anything that could be of any interest to Pharoers) ? >> >> MAYBE we need another list... >> >> This is getting ridiculous! The guy spends energy, time, effort and is >> able to gather 13K in prizes and puts Pharo to the forefront with this >> cool contest in schools, makes a lot of youngsters learn & use Pharo for >> their projects, puts up a website, makes videos, writes blog posts, >> PROMOTES Pharo and he gets slapped for posting here ?!?! WTF ??? >> > > You need to see the whole story. This guy with a messianic syndrome > started > his aggressive campaign by spitting on every other programming language > and > he is constantly spamming the social media by void articles that are often > full of lies while showing whole community in a very bad light of fanatic > fools. He (alone) came with the idea of the competition and started to > demand money for it. Then he started to blame anyone who didn't want to > provide money to him. He is constantly rejecting any critique and feedback > so do not be surprised that otherwise very friendly people are losing > their patience. > > -- Pavel > > >> >> Where should he post? Where should I post ? >> >> On 2020-02-08 17:35, Guillermo Polito wrote: >> > Hi Richard, >> > >> > Iâd like to invite you to refrain yourself from posting such off-topic >> > messages in the future. >> > >> -- >> ----------------- >> BenoÃ®t St-Jean >> Yahoo! Messenger: bstjean >> Twitter: @BenLeChialeux >> Pinterest: benoitstjean >> Instagram: Chef_Benito >> IRC: lamneth >> GitHub: bstjean >> Blogue: endormitoire.wordpress.com >> "A standpoint is an intellectual horizon of radius zero". (A. Einstein) >> >> >> -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Feb. 9, 2020