January 2020 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] is this better regarding naming thigs

by Roelof Wobben

Thanks. I have missed that one. Thanks for pointing it to me. Roelof Op 6-1-2020 om 13:13 schreef xap: > Here's the permalink to Sven's response (in case it still isn't visible to > you): > http://forum.world.st/is-this-better-regarding-naming-thigs-tp5109389p51093… > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > >

Jan. 6, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] is this better regarding naming thigs

by xap

Here's the permalink to Sven's response (in case it still isn't visible to you): http://forum.world.st/is-this-better-regarding-naming-thigs-tp5109389p51093… -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Jan. 6, 2020

R: [ANN] Phoedown - Markdown to HTML

by Lorenzo

Ciao Giorgio, come stai? Mi fa piacere risentirti dopo tanto tempo. Forse (visto il successo della tua mail), sarebbe opportuno cominciare collaborazioni in Italia! Sentiamoci. Lorenzo Da: Pharo-users [mailto:pharo-users-bounces@lists.pharo.org] Per conto di giorgio ferraris Inviato: sabato 4 gennaio 2020 20:38 A: Any question about pharo is welcome <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org> Oggetto: Re: [Pharo-users] [ANN] Phoedown - Markdown to HTML Hello, first of all, have a wonderful 2020.. sorry for jumping in, I'm not a contributor to Pharo, and actually never a user of it ( when I work in Smalltalk, I use VW mostly, and still need to find the time to try Pharo seriously), but I do work in Smalltalk (and Pharo is a dialect of) from early 80'... and , as for many of you, Smalltalk is not the only language I use (I wish it was the most used, but not the only one, because one tool is not enough). Well, the idea that all should be done in Smalltalk seems to me something that us as a community have had as a goal from day one, but, are us sure it's not something that reduce the power of Smalltalk instead of allowing broader adoption? * First, there are lots of libraries and tools already well written, maintained and with full documentation. Why to reinvent the wheels if we can integrate them seamlessly? * Second: Smalltalk is not the fastest language out there, there are works that are not to be developed in Smalltalk. If we develop in Smalltalk something very CPU intensive we just made bad advertising for the language. Smalltalk is at is best for modelling difficult problems. Look at Python, it's very popular between Data Scientist, but it just expose in a nice way an interface to Macchine Learning libraries, For example TensorFlow has a lot of optimised c++ code inside. Python made easy to interface with C like languages, and it has good modelling capabilities, so it was chosen. But Smalltalk is better on the latter, this is a campground we should dominate, instead we are absent. And Pharo, being open source, could have been a good player in this field. If we spend our time to reinvent the wheel we can't get to far .. Look at Node.js, you can find libraries for connecting everything, people doesn't rewrote everything in JS/ So if you work in Node, you are fast at building stuff not because of the power of the language, but because to the libraries you can pick from the shelf and use. So I think a wonderful and easy integration framework is time better spent that redoing something already well done on other languages. Object are for reuse, but we try to rebuild... And on top of the framework, lot of smalltalk classes for an easy usage of the outside work already done. Obviously, all I said is not valid if Smalltalk is considered only an experimental language or a playground, but this was, and probably still is, the place for Squeak. If I remember well, Pharo was born for industrial grade application... Sorry for this rant, but I liked Smalltalk from day one, the day I read the famous Byte's article, and still try to understand why it's not the number one language, but I think we, as a community, did a lot on the wrong direction. BTW: I still like Smalltalk a lot and really appreciate the work done by all of the Smalltalk communities. again, have a wonderful year giorgio On Fri, Jan 3, 2020 at 4:55 PM Ramon Leon <ramon.leon(a)allresnet.com <mailto:ramon.leon@allresnet.com> > wrote: On 2020-01-02 10:56 a.m., Sean P. DeNigris wrote: > While I dream of a world where everything is in-image as pure Smalltalk, > given the reality of limited manpower, I think of outside library use as a > way to "cheat" and get a lot more from that limited engineering resource. Agree, I've used the original Markdown.pl implementation for years same as I would any other shell script, via OSProcess markdown: someContent ^UnixProcess pipeString: someContent throughCommand: (FileDirectory default fullPathFor: 'Markdown.pl') Never saw a need to rewrite what already works in its original form. -- RamÃ³n LeÃ³n VP of Technology Alliance Reservations Network

Jan. 6, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] is this better regarding naming thigs

by Roelof Wobben

Op 6-1-2020 om 09:34 schreef xap: > hi Roelof, i didn't mean to hijack your thread, sorry -- my question was > directed at you, then kinda took on a life of its own. > > That said, Sven had/has responded to your op (original post), no? > > One additional change I would make: rename "findAnagramsCandidates" --> > "findAnagrams" : it's shorter, and possibly more correct since what's > returned are true anagrams rather than candidates-that-may-be-anagrams ? > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > > NP, And if my question was answered , I miss it. That name was given by the challenge so if I would change it, Im afraid that I also have to change all tests included by the challenge. But thanks for answering. Roelof

Jan. 6, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] is this better regarding naming thigs

by xap

hi Roelof, i didn't mean to hijack your thread, sorry -- my question was directed at you, then kinda took on a life of its own. That said, Sven had/has responded to your op (original post), no? One additional change I would make: rename "findAnagramsCandidates" --> "findAnagrams" : it's shorter, and possibly more correct since what's returned are true anagrams rather than candidates-that-may-be-anagrams ? -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Jan. 6, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] How can we celebrate the 50th anniversary of Smalltalk?

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

> On 6 Jan 2020, at 06:11, Joachim Tuchel <jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de> wrote: > > I personally celebrate Smalltalk every (working) day. I enjoy the fun and productivity each time I find a way to solve a problem at hand. Well said.

Jan. 6, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] is this better regarding naming thigs

by Roelof Wobben

Hello, Nice to see that someone who ask another question on my question but do i get a answer on my question too. So if the naming is better now. Roelof Op 6-1-2020 om 02:18 schreef xap: > "but all objects respond to value..."; thx, Santiago -- that makes more > sense, that or: cares only about its receiver/argument evaluable as a > Boolean, no matter they started as blocks, expressions, or something else > (makes me wonder if a bare-value is a degenerate case of a block ... but > don't mind me, I'm just talking aloud). separately, point taken re > expressions being evaluated, and blocks possibly not. > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > >

Jan. 6, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] How can we celebrate the 50th anniversary of Smalltalk?

by Joachim Tuchel

That's also what my first thought was: .Isn't 2020 the 40th BIrthday of Smalltalk? Not sure anyone who wasn't there at Xerox can judge this. I guess the ignition for many of the concepts our favourite environment are built upon dat eback into the 60ies... I personally celebrate Smalltalk every (working) day. I enjoy the fun and productivity each time I find a way to solve a problem at hand. Joachim Am 05.01.2020 um 19:27 schrieb tbrunz: > Did Smalltalk start with Smalltalk-72 or Smalltalk-80? (Or 1969, when work > on it began..??) > > ST-72 was an internal release; ST-80 was its first public release, in 1980. > > I've always thought that 1980 was the birthday, so this year it turns 40... > Am I wrong? > > What's the consensus? Is it customary to go by the project start date, the > first stable version, the first release to the public, or what? > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > >

Jan. 6, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Prof Stef questions

by tbrunz

You're welcome, xap! One of the "thought exercises" that Stef likes to have Pharo students engage in is to come up with your own design for implementing something like 'or:' in Pharo code. And then, afterwards, to examine how the Boolean class and its two subclasses, True and False, are implemented. Most people are surprised by what they find! Smalltalk is often extremely elegant in its implementation. Sven wrote a nice Medium essay on just this: https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/tiny-yet-so-beautiful-1ef5149c910e (And as the source code you read points out, these are not actually implemented in Pharo source; they're implemented in the virtual machine, at a low level, so they can be highly optimized for good performance.) -t -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Jan. 6, 2020

Re: [Pharo-users] Prof Stef questions

by xap

many thx, tbrunz! i (and anybody who follows) much appreciate the thoughtful elucidation -- i did indeed assume that ifTrue: would return its argument as-is. Now that i go spellunking through source I see: ifTrue: alternativeBlock "If the receiver is false (i.e., the condition is false), then the value is the false alternative, which is nil. Otherwise answer the result of evaluating the argument, alternativeBlock. Create an error notification if the receiver is nonBoolean. Execution does not actually reach here because the expression is compiled in-line." -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Jan. 6, 2020