August 2019 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Hi Torsten, how are you? Please find my answers below. On Tue, Aug 6, 2019 at 12:37 PM Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: > >Yes. And I think it's even more sad than the containers example doesn't > work anymore... AFAIK they replaced the system. > > Many things seem to be possible in times where talks like "How to get rid > of Smalltalk" [1] will be presented on > a Smalltalk conference (here ESUG 2019). > > Yes, I saw it too and caught my attention. Here is more details about the talk: https://github.com/ESUG/esug.github.io/blob/source/2019-Conference/talks/20… I think it's a nice gesture from ESUG to not ban it and let him speak. Whether we agree or not, that's a different discussion. But we can't ban. > Did commercial / traditional Smalltalk world really change over the years? > I'm not following them too closely in recent months > but I see some commercial vendors still try to attract people with old > success stories and videos from ancient times. > You know I am working for Instantiations. I have seen what you mean too in other vendors but I cannot speak in public about that. Feel free to send me a private email. Where is the "coolness factor" combined with fancy marketing to attract new > generations and audience... > > That's exactly the kind of marketing that we are doing at Instantiations. We are doing a lot of R&D in many areas such as IoT, ARM (we have ARM 32 and ARM 64), Raspberry Pi, AI/ML TensorFlow, Docker and many many other aspects. We have also moved forward on improving dialect compatibility such as writing a Tonel reader AND WRITER. Just take a look to my or or Instantiations twitter/linkedin activity and you will see it. You can also see our recent newsletter: https://mailchi.mp/instantiations/va-smalltalk-news-august-1-3037649 https://mailchi.mp/instantiations/va-smalltalk-news-april-17 Instantiations sponsored Camp St NC on March https://twitter.com/CampSmalltalkNA , its sponsoring ESUG and will sponsor Smalltalks. If you check everything I sent, you will notice there is not a single reference to success stories (except one that partner with us to build the new LLVM JIT). > And this although Smalltalk seems to be often mentioned as favourite > language like in [2] > > Pharo is in fact the main innovation driver these days. Another reason to > move on, to improve it or even change Pharo more radical > into a world beyond traditional Smalltalk. We all know that many new cool > and interesting things could be done on top > of the powerful base of a lively and dynamic object oriented system which > we still share with the historic roots.... > > Well, I don't fully agree there. See my response here: http://forum.world.st/Re-Pharo-users-OT-slightly-What-makes-other-dialects-… I don't mind Pharo moving forward in innovation and with more radical changes beyond traditional Smalltalk etc etc. But then don't call it "business friendly". It's not that you have 100 paid engineers to work on it. IMHO you cannot correctly target both. Best regards, -- Mariano Martinez Peck Email: marianopeck(a)gmail.com Twitter: @MartinezPeck LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/mariano-martinez-peck <https://www.linkedin.com/in/mariano-mart%C3%ADnez-peck/> Blog: https://marianopeck.wordpress.com/

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by horrido

I've read a number of LinkedIn posts from Mariano MartÃnez Peck about recent innovations to VA Smalltalk, IIRC. Seems to me that Instantiations are doing a good job of innovating, too. Torsten Bergmann wrote >>Yes. And I think it's even more sad than the containers example doesn't work anymore... AFAIK they replaced the system.Â > > Many things seem to be possible in times where talks like "How to get rid > of Smalltalk" [1] will be presented on > a Smalltalk conference (here ESUG 2019). > > Did commercial / traditional Smalltalk world really change over the years? > I'm not following them too closely in recent months > but I see some commercial vendors still try to attract people with old > success stories and videos from ancient times. > Where is the "coolness factor" combined with fancy marketing to attract > new generations and audience... > > And this although Smalltalk seems to be often mentioned as favourite > language like in [2] > > Pharo is in fact the main innovation driver these days. Another reason to > move on, to improve it or even change Pharo more radical > into a world beyond traditional Smalltalk. We all know that many new cool > and interesting things could be done on top > of the powerful base of a lively and dynamic object oriented system which > we still share with the historic roots.... > > Bye > T. > > [1] https://esug.github.io/2019-Conference/conf2019.html > [2] https://twitter.com/Grady_Booch/status/1157049284870602752 -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by Mariano Martinez Peck

The last place was a few days ago: https://twitter.com/MartinClausen8/status/1157051595999404033 But... a whole longer discussion took place a few months ago...but I cannot find it now. On Tue, Aug 6, 2019 at 5:19 PM BrunoBB <smalltalk(a)adinet.com.uy> wrote: > Sorry, > > The main phrase: > > Today, we continue to reap the rewards of this remarkable system. > > regards, > bruno > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > > -- Mariano Martinez Peck Email: marianopeck(a)gmail.com Twitter: @MartinezPeck LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/mariano-martinez-peck <https://www.linkedin.com/in/mariano-mart%C3%ADnez-peck/> Blog: https://marianopeck.wordpress.com/

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by BrunoBB

Sorry, The main phrase: Today, we continue to reap the rewards of this remarkable system. regards, bruno -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by BrunoBB

/Yes. And I think it's even more sad than the containers example doesn't work anymore... AFAIK they replaced the system. / How accurate is this ? From: https://www.oocl.com/eng/aboutoocl/companyprofile/informationtechnology/Pag… OOCL's Integrated Regional Information System, known as IRIS-2, was launched in 1999. IRIS-2 became more than just a software; it helped facilitate a new company culture. * IRIS-2 has changed the way we think and the way we do business.* regards, bruno -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] Following Git(Hub) History

by Sean P. DeNigris

Guillermo Polito wrote > $git log âfollow Didn't know about that one. Thanks! I'll try and report back... ----- Cheers, Sean -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by Torsten Bergmann

>Yes. And I think it's even more sad than the containers example doesn't work anymore... AFAIK they replaced the system.Â Many things seem to be possible in times where talks like "How to get rid of Smalltalk" [1] will be presented on a Smalltalk conference (here ESUG 2019). Did commercial / traditional Smalltalk world really change over the years? I'm not following them too closely in recent months but I see some commercial vendors still try to attract people with old success stories and videos from ancient times. Where is the "coolness factor" combined with fancy marketing to attract new generations and audience... And this although Smalltalk seems to be often mentioned as favourite language like in [2] Pharo is in fact the main innovation driver these days. Another reason to move on, to improve it or even change Pharo more radical into a world beyond traditional Smalltalk. We all know that many new cool and interesting things could be done on top of the powerful base of a lively and dynamic object oriented system which we still share with the historic roots.... Bye T. [1] https://esug.github.io/2019-Conference/conf2019.html [2] https://twitter.com/Grady_Booch/status/1157049284870602752

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by Esteban Maringolo

I'm not a native speaker but grammatically speaking "used" (simple past) means you did use it in the past but there is no information about whether you use it now, and "have been using" (present perfect) means you did use it in the past and continue to do so in the present. Esteban A. Maringolo On Tue, Aug 6, 2019 at 11:37 AM Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: > > I didn't get the sense that "used" means its no longer being used. > Yesterday I used a keyboard to write an email, and I'm doing the same thing today. > cheers -ben > > On Tue, 6 Aug 2019 at 16:06, Tim Mackinnon <tim(a)testit.works> wrote: >> >> Itâs very entertaining but it seems a bit sad - itâs a shame it refers to JP-Morgan as âused Smalltalk â as actually they are âstill using Smalltalkâ (so itâs not in the past) >> >> Tim >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On 5 Aug 2019, at 16:19, Richard Kenneth Eng <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> A big fan of my work created this rogue video: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1opveHaukFK8WbQ8wg8b14wuKJsjoOZfO/view >> >> I appreciate the homage, but I can't take credit for it. >> >> It's really quite beautiful, though. I'm using it as part of my evangelism. >>

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by Ben Coman

I didn't get the sense that "used" means its no longer being used. Yesterday I used a keyboard to write an email, and I'm doing the same thing today. cheers -ben On Tue, 6 Aug 2019 at 16:06, Tim Mackinnon <tim(a)testit.works> wrote: > Itâs very entertaining but it seems a bit sad - itâs a shame it refers to > JP-Morgan as âused Smalltalk â as actually they are âstill using Smalltalkâ > (so itâs not in the past) > > Tim > > Sent from my iPhone > > On 5 Aug 2019, at 16:19, Richard Kenneth Eng <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > A big fan of my work created this rogue video: > https://drive.google.com/file/d/1opveHaukFK8WbQ8wg8b14wuKJsjoOZfO/view > > I appreciate the homage, but I can't take credit for it. > > It's really quite beautiful, though. I'm using it as part of my evangelism. > >

Aug. 6, 2019

Re: [Pharo-users] A Canticle for Smalltalk

by Tim Mackinnon

Kapital is still operational - some of the guys on that team come to the UK Smalltalk Meetup and they are often talking about improvements and things they are doing (in a general sense, as obviously they canât share specific details) - so its still very active and an amazing system. I had a chance to work on it a bit myself for 6 months, and was amazed how productive I could be with very little on boarding (particularly when shown their equivalent of the halo click command to understand where the code in the ui comes from). Tim > On 6 Aug 2019, at 12:33, horrido <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > "Used Smalltalk" doesn't imply that they stopped using Smalltalk, esp. if > Kapital is still operational. > > > Tim Mackinnon wrote >> Itâs very entertaining but it seems a bit sad - itâs a shame it refers to >> JP-Morgan as âused Smalltalk â as actually they are âstill using >> Smalltalkâ (so itâs not in the past) >> >> Tim >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On 5 Aug 2019, at 16:19, Richard Kenneth Eng < > >> horrido.hobbies@ > >> > wrote: >>> >>> A big fan of my work created this rogue video: >>> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1opveHaukFK8WbQ8wg8b14wuKJsjoOZfO/view >>> >>> I appreciate the homage, but I can't take credit for it. >>> >>> It's really quite beautiful, though. I'm using it as part of my >>> evangelism. >>> > > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html >

Aug. 6, 2019