October 2017 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] Organisation and workflows

by Steven R. Baker

On 02/10/17 15:28, Esteban Lorenzano wrote: >> On 2 Oct 2017, at 15:12, Stephane Ducasse <stepharo.self(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> I discussed with esteban sooner this summer and we really want to have a process >> where people can deploy applications and not just code. >> Now we are not yet there. >> >> Stef >> >> On Sun, Oct 1, 2017 at 9:03 PM, Steven R. Baker <steven(a)stevenrbaker.com> wrote: >>> Heya folks, >>> >>> [Please jump on any of my statements that sound crazy: use of Spec, >>> other assumptions, etc.] >>> >>> I'm starting an application in Pharo, using Spec. Basically, a GTD >>> application in the spirit of nirvanahq, omnifocus, things, nozbe. The >>> code is working just fine, but I'm left with a lot of questions about >>> how to organize it. >>> >>> First, is there some trick to managing images? Are people using >>> one-per-project, or one-per-computer? All of the above? Anyone using >>> PharoLauncher these days? Other tools? > pharo users tend to prefer one-per-project approach :) > most people uses (or should use) pharo launcher. In fact, we want to make it the default download, is just that to get it right is complicated :) > > butâ¦ pharo launcher is to developers. A final app would require other stuff to be accomplished (like closing development tools, etc.). > >>> I'm assuming that the current state of the art is Iceberg; where can I >>> find a "This is how you should organize your project using Iceberg" >>> document, blog, book, tutorial, video, or otherwise. > beware: Iceberg is a cvs (like Monticello or git or svnâ¦): it is use to store code, not to organise your project. > To organise your project you have Metacello. > >>> Once the application is done, I assume I'll want to ship it in a minimal >>> Pharo image. Is there documentation or prior art on this? > this is what is hard :) > I imagine with the headless VMs we are about to finish it will be easier (to just initiate a window with your app, instead initiate a window with the full world as now). > but we still require some work. > >>> Finally, is there a way to run and capture keybindings globally? I have >>> one part of my application (a quick-entry window) which I want summoned >>> from a global (OS-wide) hotkey. Has this been done before? Or is it not >>> easy to break the fourth wall, so to speak, and register a global >>> keybinding from inside the VM? > there is a keybindings framework inside pharo, but since you have a lot of development tools, it becomes hard to use (again, something that can be solved in the near future, with same approach as before, but not yet). > now, to get the keybindings of the system you will need to install that *in* the system. > > for mac, for example, you can doit using the ObjC bridge (which does not works in 64bit images... Iâm working on a UFFI replacement, butâ¦ guess what? not yet :P) > and I guess using UFFI you can get that to work on windows and linux? Iâm really donât know. > > all you ask is *doable*â¦ but not all your requirements are *easily* doable right now, which is want I want to fix :) I don't mind contributing code and time on these things, as they present real barriers to me. I'm looking for ways to get involved in the community again. :) -Steven > Esteban > >>> Thanks! >>> >>> -Steven >>> >>> >>> >

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Equals and HashCode Builder

by Prof. Andrew P. Black

> On 2 Oct 2017, at 16:37 , Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com> wrote: > > 2. #hash > ^ var1 hash bitXor: (var2 hash bitXor: var3 hash) > Is this implementation always safe? It's what I usually hand roll based on > what I've seen, but Andres Valloud wrote a whole (large) book on hashing, so > I've always wondered if I was missing somethingâ¦ If you read Andres book (which is hard, because he wonât make it available online), you will learn that itâs better to take the order of the instance variables into account. #bitXor: is commutative, so it of course ignores order. In other words, if you have a Point with x and y fields, then 3@9 and 9@3 will have the same hash. For this reason, itâs better to multiply successive fields by a constant (e.g. shifting left by 2) before XORing them into the hash. But then, for objects with lots of fields, the later ones are lot completely, because they are multiplied by a number so large that they are out of the range of the hash. One can avoid this by using a circular shift to implement the multiply. All of this was, I thought, implemented in a #hashCombine: method, but I canât find it in my image. Maybe some other Smalltalk ...

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Equals and HashCode Builder

by Denis Kudriashov

2017-10-02 17:13 GMT+02:00 Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com>: > I am sorry, not species, but #isKindOf istead of #= to compare classes. > It is bad idea. #= should be transitive. How you will generate it with isKindOf: logic? You need to know common parent. Also I not remember cases where I was needed two instances of different classes to be equal. And I can imaging the problems which it will lead to. > > On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:57 AM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >> >> 2017-10-02 16:37 GMT+02:00 Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com>: >> >>> >>> Two questions/comments about the generated code: >>> 1. #= >>> ... >>> self class = anObject class "should compare #species instead?" >>> ifFalse: [ ^ false ]. >>> ... >>> Typically, I've seen #species instead of #class in the guard statement. >>> Should we change it to that? >>> >> >> I doubt that it is important for domain classes. Because I never saw the >> user of #species which is not a kind of Collection. And for collections >> this refactoring is not valid anyway. >> >> >>> >>> >>> 2. #hash >>> ^ var1 hash bitXor: (var2 hash bitXor: var3 hash) >>> Is this implementation always safe? It's what I usually hand roll based >>> on >>> what I've seen, but Andres Valloud wrote a whole (large) book on >>> hashing, so >>> I've always wondered if I was missing somethingâ¦ >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> Cheers, >>> Sean >>> -- >>> Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html >>> >>> >> >

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Equals and HashCode Builder

by Vitor Medina Cruz

I am sorry, not species, but #isKindOf istead of #= to compare classes. On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:57 AM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > 2017-10-02 16:37 GMT+02:00 Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com>: > >> >> Two questions/comments about the generated code: >> 1. #= >> ... >> self class = anObject class "should compare #species instead?" >> ifFalse: [ ^ false ]. >> ... >> Typically, I've seen #species instead of #class in the guard statement. >> Should we change it to that? >> > > I doubt that it is important for domain classes. Because I never saw the > user of #species which is not a kind of Collection. And for collections > this refactoring is not valid anyway. > > >> >> >> 2. #hash >> ^ var1 hash bitXor: (var2 hash bitXor: var3 hash) >> Is this implementation always safe? It's what I usually hand roll based on >> what I've seen, but Andres Valloud wrote a whole (large) book on hashing, >> so >> I've always wondered if I was missing somethingâ¦ >> >> >> >> ----- >> Cheers, >> Sean >> -- >> Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html >> >> >

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Organisation and workflows

by Sean P. DeNigris

Steven Baker wrote > using Spec It really depends on your aim. The *idea* of Spec was to write once and deploy "everywhere", but as yet there is only a Morphic backend that I know of, and you would be restricting yourself to standard desktop widgets. So, if that is not a problem, Spec might be an easy route to a working application. If you want to create a more imaginative UI, you'll probably have to hand roll on each target (e.g. Morphic for desktop, PharoJS or Amber for web). Steven Baker wrote > a GTD application in the spirit of nirvanahq, omnifocus, things, nozbe Cool! I'll be your first customer ;) Steven Baker wrote > Are people using one-per-project, or one-per-computer? Yes and yes. I prefer one per project for development projects I'm working on and one per computer for personal images (a la my own personal Dynabook). The former is also fine for personal tools, but the latter can get hairy e.g. if you're digging into the system and accidentally break an image with all your personal data in it (assuming I'm not the only one who is a little sloppy with persistence in personal contexts ha ha)[1]. Steven Baker wrote > Anyone using > PharoLauncher these days? Other tools? Yes! I now use it exclusively and love it. There are minor hiccups here and there as Pharo rapidly evolves in parallel, but Christophe and team are really responsive and helpful. I also made a project called SmallWorld [2] which is like my own personal SqueakMap/Project-catalog that keeps track of projects I care about. What makes it a little different that e.g. Pharo Catalog is that it lets me specify how *I* want to load a project (e.g. which repo/branch), which may not be the canonical way, especially if I am typical in a developer role and not a user. I built a tiny extension which hooks this into Launcher, providing a button to automatically load one of these projects into an image of my choice. Beware I am the only user (that I know of), so the UI is very primitive (a combination of GT and Magritte), but I'm happy to help anyone along if the idea seems helpful. <http://forum.world.st/file/t128965/Screenshot_2017-10-02_11.jpeg> Steven Baker wrote > I'm assuming that the current state of the art is Iceberg; where can I > find a "This is how you should organize your project using Iceberg" > document, blog, book, tutorial, video, or otherwise. As Esteban mentioned, Iceberg is a vcs, so if you mean how to organize *code*, Pharo handles this automatically under the hood. The only thing you have to decide is the root folder. Typically people choose a top level folder inside the git repo for this, named 'source' (or 'src', 'repository', or 'mc'), so that you can have other top level categories like wiki, scripts, etc. If you mean project in a wider context, as in including documentation, this seems to be an open field with many different possibilities. I can't help on the other parts of your question, but am eager to hear any answers! [1] Although the beauty of Smalltalk is that there's (almost) always a way forward (see http://forum.world.st/Fwd-Oops-I-put-a-halt-in-a-startup-method-tp3800729.h…) [2] https://github.com/seandenigris/Small-World ----- Cheers, Sean -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Equals and HashCode Builder

by Denis Kudriashov

2017-10-02 16:37 GMT+02:00 Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com>: > > Two questions/comments about the generated code: > 1. #= > ... > self class = anObject class "should compare #species instead?" > ifFalse: [ ^ false ]. > ... > Typically, I've seen #species instead of #class in the guard statement. > Should we change it to that? > I doubt that it is important for domain classes. Because I never saw the user of #species which is not a kind of Collection. And for collections this refactoring is not valid anyway. > > > 2. #hash > ^ var1 hash bitXor: (var2 hash bitXor: var3 hash) > Is this implementation always safe? It's what I usually hand roll based on > what I've seen, but Andres Valloud wrote a whole (large) book on hashing, > so > I've always wondered if I was missing somethingâ¦ > > > > ----- > Cheers, > Sean > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > >

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Equals and HashCode Builder

by Vitor Medina Cruz

I think it should have an option to generate with species (which I think should be the default). Also It would be nice if it could implement the solution for pitfall #4 described in http://www.artima.com/lejava/articles/equality.html On Mon, Oct 2, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk(a)gmail.com> wrote: > 2017-10-02 16:41 GMT+02:00 Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com>: > >> Denis Kudriashov wrote >> > I just use RBGenerateEqualHashRefactoring for this: >> >> I added your answer to the Pharo wiki. Is this available through the UI? >> If >> not, maybe it should be! >> >> > As I know it not exists > > >> >> >> ----- >> Cheers, >> Sean >> -- >> Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html >> >> >

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Equals and HashCode Builder

by Denis Kudriashov

2017-10-02 16:41 GMT+02:00 Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com>: > Denis Kudriashov wrote > > I just use RBGenerateEqualHashRefactoring for this: > > I added your answer to the Pharo wiki. Is this available through the UI? If > not, maybe it should be! > > As I know it not exists > > > ----- > Cheers, > Sean > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > >

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Equals and HashCode Builder

by Denis Kudriashov

Hi Sean. I did not know about quality of generated hash function. But if I remember correctly the same code is generated for java using Eclipse or Idea. So it should be good enough. 2017-10-02 16:37 GMT+02:00 Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com>: > Denis Kudriashov wrote > > I just use RBGenerateEqualHashRefactoring for this: > > > > r := RBGenerateEqualHashRefactoring className: MyClass variables: #(vars > > which should be used in equal and hash). > > r execute > > That is sooooo cool! I shudder to think how many times I implemented just > that by hand!! > > Two questions/comments about the generated code: > 1. #= > ... > self class = anObject class "should compare #species instead?" > ifFalse: [ ^ false ]. > ... > Typically, I've seen #species instead of #class in the guard statement. > Should we change it to that? > > > 2. #hash > ^ var1 hash bitXor: (var2 hash bitXor: var3 hash) > Is this implementation always safe? It's what I usually hand roll based on > what I've seen, but Andres Valloud wrote a whole (large) book on hashing, > so > I've always wondered if I was missing somethingâ¦ > > > > ----- > Cheers, > Sean > -- > Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html > >

Oct. 2, 2017

Re: [Pharo-users] Equals and HashCode Builder

by Sean P. DeNigris

Denis Kudriashov wrote > I just use RBGenerateEqualHashRefactoring for this: I added your answer to the Pharo wiki. Is this available through the UI? If not, maybe it should be! ----- Cheers, Sean -- Sent from: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-Smalltalk-Users-f1310670.html

Oct. 2, 2017