October 2016 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Spec: Layout Problems

by Brad Selfridge

Just about the time I think I have Spec layouts figured out, I stump myself all over again. I have a layout that I want to have two variable width columns and one fixed width column. I have created three columns in a row. When I put a single widget in each column, then the columns display as equal sizes and spread equally across the row. However, when I set the third column to a fixed width, then the first column takes up half of the width row and the other two widgets share the other half of the row. I have tried several ways to solve this to no avail. Here is my current layout. ^SpecLayout composed newRow: [ :r | r newColumn: [ :c | c add: #tblTxt ]. r newColumn: [ :c | c add: #colTxt ]. r newColumn: [ :c | c newRow: [ :row | row add: #editButton width: self toolbarHeight. row add: #deleteButton width: self toolbarHeight ]] width: 60 ] height: self toolbarHeight yourself What am I doing wrong. ----- Brad Selfridge -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Spec-Layout-Problems-tp4920329.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial

by Offray Vladimir Luna CÃ¡rdenas

You're welcomed. The English Grafoscopio page is here (with updated installation instructions): http://mutabit.com/grafoscopio/index.en.html Tutorial is mainly in Spanish, but the code is pretty readable :-). Cheers, Offray On 26/10/16 14:36, phil(a)highoctane.be wrote: > Interesting. > > I really need to get into that grafoscopio... > > Phil > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 9:13 PM, Offray Vladimir Luna CÃ¡rdenas > <offray.luna(a)mutabit.com <mailto:offray.luna@mutabit.com>> wrote: > > > Hi, > > On the issue of contributing to Free, Libre, Open Source Software > (FLOSS) projects, I have been reading recently Nadia Eghbal and > her analysis that confirm that most FLOSS projects are done by > individuals and small teams, which is contrary to the bazaar > narrative. This comic shows the point: > > and you can find more details here: > https://medium.com/@nayafia/what-success-really-looks-like-in-open-source-2… > <https://medium.com/@nayafia/what-success-really-looks-like-in-open-source-2…> > > In that sense Pharo and what we're doing here on small > communities, teams and individuals, is not the exception, is the > rule. We're fortunate that we have a friendly and dynamic > community around a powerful environment, so even being part of the > rule, we can be very creative and productive. > > On the issue of step 0, learning materials and approaches, and > Pharo for beginners, my findings are that Pharo is pretty well > suited for non-programmers (journalist, scientist, teachers, > philosophers) compared to IPython for example. I have tried both, > IPython notebooks and Pharo/Grafoscopio, and the uniformity and > self containment of the environment is very empowering, without > too much overhead and extra complications. So I think that we also > need to look towards the non-usual programmer and computer > scientist profiles for the "newbies" and interested in belonging > to the community. > > Our approach in our Data Week workshop is different: > > - We start with some panoramic view of computing comparing Unix > fathers versus dynabook children. This gives a point to see the > technology and the differences and why Pharo is more like OS + IDE > + Apps in a minimalist fashion, instead of the Unix legacy > approach to the same problem. > > - We go to the professor Stef tutorial, which is the first part of > a Grafoscopio notebook. Then we use some one liners taking from > Sven's Elegant Pharo code, then we use HernÃ¡n's Internet Movie > Data Base example to introduce JSON, queries and REST API, then we > use blocks to abstract the example (see below) and create our > first "Cinemania" package. > > - Then we learn how to extend the Dataviz package (made in > Roassal), with our Twitter exported data and we deal with an open > problem: Twitter Data Selfies. > > > So, there are several routes to learning for different populations > and contexts. Putting the new contextualized stuff we're doing in > dialogue with the material the community is creating (MOOC, UPBE, > Deep Into Pharo) and other communities like Open Knowledge (see > our recent for the upcomming Data Week 7 at [a]) is the key to let > learners traverse different paths according to their needs and > interests. > > [a] > https://discuss.okfn.org/t/data-week-7-our-critical-code-data-literacy-and-… > <https://discuss.okfn.org/t/data-week-7-our-critical-code-data-literacy-and-…> > > Cheers, > > Offray > > > On 25/10/16 22:19, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: >> Ruby On Rails was started by one developer , so no it's not users >> that bring contributors it's contributors that bring users. >> Smalltalk started by a small team. Almost all programming >> languages started with no users and mostly a sole developer. This >> is because a user will not use software that is not even alpha, >> on the other hand a contributor will be a user and a contributor >> regardless of the state of software provided he has the desire to >> do so. >> >> Spreading the word and helping people understand Pharo no longer >> makes you a user, it promotes you to contributor >> >> Same applies to Richard >> >> ;) >> On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 03:19, Vitor Medina Cruz >> <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> Yes it is an amazing thing what you all do, I admire that. >> But isn't contributors previous users? >> >> What I like about the Richard intent, from what I understand, >> is to make Smalltalk, and Pharo, more visible, more used, and >> that is the only way I know to bring more contributors. From >> what I know, Ruby got a lot of more contributors after Rails, >> which brought a lot of users to the platform. >> >> I really would like to contribute some day, in the mean time >> I will try to support initiatives like the one proposed by >> Richard, and spread the word as much as I can. >> >> >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 9:45 PM, Dimitris Chloupis >> <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com <mailto:kilon.alios@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> Do you know how many unique views had PBE last 5 months ? >> 1000 >> Do you know how many contributions PBE had last 5 months >> ? Zero. Not 100 . Not even 10. Not even 1... zero >> >> PBE would be still in Pharo version 1.4 if it was not for >> me , Stef and Damien. >> >> This is not a Pharo problem, all open source software has >> the same issue. >> >> We need more people helping, I ported the first 1/3rd of >> the book from 1.4 to Pharo 4 just by myself and the other >> two joined after I was burned out from the pain. I was >> disgusted working on PBE . I literally hated Pharo. >> Fortunately nothing that a bit of a small break could not >> fix. >> >> I was and still I am the most loud critic about the state >> of documentation. In the end however what makes open >> source projects exist is not users. Users are >> insignificant. Sorry to say that but is true. It's >> contributors that are the life of the project. >> >> People like Stef made Pharo and even Squeak possible. >> People like Stef keep Smalltalk alive. Personally I don't >> give a damn what users want , I rather attract only >> contributors and zero just users. That's enough to keep >> Pharo evolving for centuries. >> >> Stef says that "Pharo is yours" , apparently this easier >> said than done. I respect your opinion, I agree with your >> opinion because I said what you say years ago. In the end >> however if you and other users are not willing to help we >> will remain at zero commits at least as far as PBE is >> concerned . >> >> It's pretty much the same for the other areas of Pharo. >> On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 01:26, Vitor Medina Cruz >> <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> *Dimitris:* >> * >> * >> I agree with much of what you said, but I think it is >> still possible to make step 0 and follow the Pharo >> path with more easy. :) >> >> Also, >> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/UpdatedPharoByExample/lastSucces… >> <https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/UpdatedPharoByExample/lastSucces…> >> is nice too, I didn't know of it. It is the new >> version of PBE ongoing? I am going to take a look at it. >> >> Ben: >> >> Thanks for the links, two of them I didn't know of. I >> hadn't time to read them yet, but I think what I am >> looking for is something like >> https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53… >> <https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53…> >> >> "The things we see as important might be a >> paradigm step too far for newcomers." >> >> >> I think the problem for Step 0 it is exactly that. I >> myself have already tried to show the paradigm shift >> along with all that must be learn to use Pharo, and >> it didn't went well. It is too much to tackle at >> once. There is the language, the environment, the >> IDE, the paradigm shift, too much... >> >> Nicolai: >> >> The first example from the book provides the first >> experience you have on Pharo, and it uses stuff that >> is not on the default image (it happened to me a long >> time ago and with a friend more recently). It is >> frustrating and leave the person trying to learn >> suspicious. I see that the current site for the book >> has a link to the image that should be used while >> reading the book, but it is not very visible and I >> think the book don't mention it. From the Getting >> Started chapter I count five pages until some code is >> executed (Time now). The problem here is that people >> usually don't understand, yet, the power of the >> environment, and are eager to see code and execute >> it, and they often get confused with so many >> different things to learn even before the first >> "Hello World". I can say the first time I got PBE I >> gave up because of this, and I only come back later >> because I persist to learn Smalltalk, and I know some >> other people who tried to read it too and give up for >> exactly the same reason. >> >> I found the book an excellent reference and source to >> solidify the understanding of Pharo, but I don't like >> it as a tutorial. >> >> >> *-------* >> >> Look at the Go language site: https://golang.org/, >> the first thing it puts in your face is a way to >> execute code and a link to a Tour. I don't even have >> to think much before I have executed the Hello World, >> my hand just moved the mouse to the Run button, and >> even before I noticed I was doing the tour. >> >> In my opinion, a good Step 0 would be something like >> Profstef (http://amber-lang.net/learn.html >> <http://amber-lang.net/learn.html>) as a Tour, going >> slowly through the language aspects, messages types, >> comparing to other OO languages, showing that >> operator are just messages, then that control flow >> statements are also just messages, creating classes >> etc, always letting the user execute code as she goes >> on. >> >> After that, the Tour could tell its user to continue >> it using the image and showing the download link. >> When the user execute Pharo.exe and loads the default >> image the first thing that appears is the Profstef >> asking if it is the first time he is there and if he >> is continuing the tour from the web (if it is someone >> used to Pharo, he just closes the windows and starts >> to use his new fresh image). It could explains >> steadily the workspace, the transcript, the nautilus >> and how to make a very simple web application with >> tests. After that it could explain the image, that >> objects are stored (serialized) into it and the image >> itself consists of the running program while the >> Pharo.exe is the VM. In the end It could point to a >> tutorial like >> https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53… >> <https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53…>, >> the PBE and to the many others resources available. >> >> The order of things could change and maybe I had >> missed something, but that is what I can think now. >> Perhaps this approach is too slow, I don't know, but >> the fast one isn't working for me :( It don't need to >> be a tour also, but something in these lines, like >> the medium post above but with more parts, each >> describing a little more of Pharo. The idea, in >> general, is to easy the entrance barriers that Pharo >> has by it's quite different, yet powerful, >> programming model and environment. When I talk to >> people I know that have tried Pharo, that is the >> biggest problem. >> >> That is just my two cents. :) >> >> And thanks for all the new links :) >> >> Regards, >> Vitor >> > > >

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial

by stepharo

Le 26/10/16 Ã 19:27, Dimitris Chloupis a Ã©crit : > Probably then it's ready to get released for version 5. I will give it > a look the next few days, should be able to make the release by the > end of the week. Then after that onward for version 6 ;) PBE is doing > great with the help of you guys , porting it to 6 should be relative > easy. I know that I was thinking about the next iteration when I rewrote some parts. So I will print it and browse to see how it feels. > > On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 18:44, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr > <mailto:stepharo@free.fr>> wrote: > > Thanks this is cool to hear that. > > BTW do you know if we finished with UPBE or if there is something > else to do from a conversion stand point? > > I thought I did a final pass. > > > > Le 26/10/16 Ã 01:45, Dimitris Chloupis a Ã©crit : >> Do you know how many unique views had PBE last 5 months ? 1000 >> Do you know how many contributions PBE had last 5 months ? Zero. >> Not 100 . Not even 10. Not even 1... zero >> >> PBE would be still in Pharo version 1.4 if it was not for me , >> Stef and Damien. >> >> This is not a Pharo problem, all open source software has the >> same issue. >> >> We need more people helping, I ported the first 1/3rd of the book >> from 1.4 to Pharo 4 just by myself and the other two joined after >> I was burned out from the pain. I was disgusted working on PBE . >> I literally hated Pharo. Fortunately nothing that a bit of a >> small break could not fix. >> >> I was and still I am the most loud critic about the state of >> documentation. In the end however what makes open source projects >> exist is not users. Users are insignificant. Sorry to say that >> but is true. It's contributors that are the life of the project. >> >> People like Stef made Pharo and even Squeak possible. People like >> Stef keep Smalltalk alive. Personally I don't give a damn what >> users want , I rather attract only contributors and zero just >> users. That's enough to keep Pharo evolving for centuries. >> >> Stef says that "Pharo is yours" , apparently this easier said >> than done. I respect your opinion, I agree with your opinion >> because I said what you say years ago. In the end however if you >> and other users are not willing to help we will remain at zero >> commits at least as far as PBE is concerned . >> >> It's pretty much the same for the other areas of Pharo. >> On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 01:26, Vitor Medina Cruz >> <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> *Dimitris:* >> * >> * >> I agree with much of what you said, but I think it is still >> possible to make step 0 and follow the Pharo path with more >> easy. :) >> >> Also, >> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/UpdatedPharoByExample/lastSucces… >> is nice too, I didn't know of it. It is the new version of >> PBE ongoing? I am going to take a look at it. >> >> Ben: >> >> Thanks for the links, two of them I didn't know of. I hadn't >> time to read them yet, but I think what I am looking for is >> something like >> https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53… >> >> "The things we see as important might be a paradigm step >> too far for newcomers." >> >> >> I think the problem for Step 0 it is exactly that. I myself >> have already tried to show the paradigm shift along with all >> that must be learn to use Pharo, and it didn't went well. It >> is too much to tackle at once. There is the language, the >> environment, the IDE, the paradigm shift, too much... >> >> Nicolai: >> >> The first example from the book provides the first experience >> you have on Pharo, and it uses stuff that is not on the >> default image (it happened to me a long time ago and with a >> friend more recently). It is frustrating and leave the person >> trying to learn suspicious. I see that the current site for >> the book has a link to the image that should be used while >> reading the book, but it is not very visible and I think the >> book don't mention it. From the Getting Started chapter I >> count five pages until some code is executed (Time now). The >> problem here is that people usually don't understand, yet, >> the power of the environment, and are eager to see code and >> execute it, and they often get confused with so many >> different things to learn even before the first "Hello >> World". I can say the first time I got PBE I gave up because >> of this, and I only come back later because I persist to >> learn Smalltalk, and I know some other people who tried to >> read it too and give up for exactly the same reason. >> >> I found the book an excellent reference and source to >> solidify the understanding of Pharo, but I don't like it as a >> tutorial. >> >> >> *-------* >> >> Look at the Go language site: https://golang.org/, the first >> thing it puts in your face is a way to execute code and a >> link to a Tour. I don't even have to think much before I have >> executed the Hello World, my hand just moved the mouse to the >> Run button, and even before I noticed I was doing the tour. >> >> In my opinion, a good Step 0 would be something like Profstef >> (http://amber-lang.net/learn.html) as a Tour, going slowly >> through the language aspects, messages types, comparing to >> other OO languages, showing that operator are just messages, >> then that control flow statements are also just messages, >> creating classes etc, always letting the user execute code as >> she goes on. >> >> After that, the Tour could tell its user to continue it using >> the image and showing the download link. When the user >> execute Pharo.exe and loads the default image the first thing >> that appears is the Profstef asking if it is the first time >> he is there and if he is continuing the tour from the web (if >> it is someone used to Pharo, he just closes the windows and >> starts to use his new fresh image). It could explains >> steadily the workspace, the transcript, the nautilus and how >> to make a very simple web application with tests. After that >> it could explain the image, that objects are stored >> (serialized) into it and the image itself consists of the >> running program while the Pharo.exe is the VM. In the end It >> could point to a tutorial like >> https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53…, >> the PBE and to the many others resources available. >> >> The order of things could change and maybe I had missed >> something, but that is what I can think now. Perhaps this >> approach is too slow, I don't know, but the fast one isn't >> working for me :( It don't need to be a tour also, but >> something in these lines, like the medium post above but with >> more parts, each describing a little more of Pharo. The idea, >> in general, is to easy the entrance barriers that Pharo has >> by it's quite different, yet powerful, programming model and >> environment. When I talk to people I know that have tried >> Pharo, that is the biggest problem. >> >> That is just my two cents. :) >> >> And thanks for all the new links :) >> >> Regards, >> Vitor >> >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 8:05 PM, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr >> <mailto:stepharo@free.fr>> wrote: >> >> >> >> Le 25/10/16 Ã 15:05, Dimitris Chloupis a Ã©crit : >>> PBE is for Pharo version 5, I will give it another look >>> to start porting it to Pharo version 6. Will add a git >>> tag and make release for 5. >> >> Thanks. >> Yes it would be an immense help. >> >> Stef >> >> >>> >>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 10:19 AM phil(a)highoctane.be >>> <mailto:phil@highoctane.be> <phil(a)highoctane.be >>> <mailto:phil@highoctane.be>> wrote: >>> >>> There was this book (and some others of the same >>> ink) that was provided with my first computer: >>> >>> http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Getting… >>> <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Getting…> >>> >>> I actually had the french version. >>> http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Color%2… >>> <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Color%2…> >>> >>> This thing is still sitting near my desk today (I >>> guess it keeps me connected to my curious young self >>> or something like that). >>> >>> I keep on thinking that it would be great to have a >>> Pharo-based version of it. >>> >>> And something like this one for bytecode sets... >>> >>> http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Programming/EDTA… >>> <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Programming/EDTA…> >>> >>> Phil >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 7:22 AM, Matteo via >>> Pharo-users <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org >>> <mailto:pharo-users@lists.pharo.org>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >>> From: Matteo <matteob8(a)yahoo.it >>> <mailto:matteob8@yahoo.it>> >>> To: Any question about pharo is welcome >>> <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org >>> <mailto:pharo-users@lists.pharo.org>> >>> >>> Cc: >>> Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 07:08:21 +0200 >>> Subject: Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate >>> Smalltalk Tutorial >>> +1 for PBE >>> It has been my first smalltalk/Pharo tutorial. >>> I'm still using it, as a quick reference. >>> >>> On October 25, 2016 6:25:08 AM GMT+02:00, monty >>> <monty2(a)programmer.net >>> <mailto:monty2@programmer.net>> wrote: >>> >>> +1 for PBE. >>> >>> >>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 at 1:56 >>> AM From: "Nicolai Hess" >>> <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com >>> <mailto:nicolaihess@gmail.com>> To: "Any >>> question about pharo is welcome" >>> <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org >>> <mailto:pharo-users@lists.pharo.org>> >>> Subject: Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate >>> Smalltalk Tutorial Am 23.10.2016 3:16 >>> nachm. schrieb "Vitor Medina Cruz" >>> <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com >>> <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>[mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com >>> <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>]>: >>> >>> I think the MOOC is too much for a >>> tutorial. What I miss today is a >>> good written (no videos! Please!) >>> tutorial that teaches just a little >>> of the language and give a few >>> guidelines on how to do simple stuff >>> with the environment, such as a >>> "Hello World!", creating a class, >>> tests and run stuff. >>> >>> I thought "pharo by example" provides >>> exactly that. What is missing here, from >>> your perspective? I learned a lot from >>> it and it helped me to get started to >>> learn smalltalk, not only the syntax, >>> but also, doing something the smalltalk >>> way. >>> >>> On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 12:15 PM, >>> horrido <horrido.hobbies(a)gmail.com >>> <mailto:horrido.hobbies@gmail.com>[mailto:horrido.hobbies@gmail.com >>> <mailto:horrido.hobbies@gmail.com>]> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Excellent suggestion! I shall >>> look into it. Thanks. -- View >>> this message in context: >>> http://forum.world.st/The-Ultimate-Smalltalk-Tutorial-tp4918859p4918930.htm… >>> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk >>> Users mailing list archive at >>> Nabble.com <http://Nabble.com>. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. >>> Please excuse my brevity. >>> >> >> >

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial

by Dale Henrichs

On 10/26/16 12:13 PM, Offray Vladimir Luna CÃ¡rdenas wrote: > > > Hi, > > On the issue of contributing to Free, Libre, Open Source Software > (FLOSS) projects, I have been reading recently Nadia Eghbal and her > analysis that confirm that most FLOSS projects are done by individuals > and small teams, which is contrary to the bazaar narrative. This comic > shows the point: > > and you can find more details here: > https://medium.com/@nayafia/what-success-really-looks-like-in-open-source-2… > After skimming the actual article and finding that the points made in the article are valid I would have wished that the right panel in the cartoon had said "one more pull request before going to bed" since that is closer to what the article is about ... an active, community that contributes is also an important component and something that Pharo/Smalltalk community does indeed have. Dale

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial

by stepharo

Le 26/10/16 Ã 21:13, Offray Vladimir Luna CÃ¡rdenas a Ã©crit : > > > Hi, > > On the issue of contributing to Free, Libre, Open Source Software > (FLOSS) projects, I have been reading recently Nadia Eghbal and her > analysis that confirm that most FLOSS projects are done by individuals > and small teams, which is contrary to the bazaar narrative. This comic > shows the point: > > and you can find more details here: > https://medium.com/@nayafia/what-success-really-looks-like-in-open-source-2… > > In that sense Pharo and what we're doing here on small communities, > teams and individuals, is not the exception, is the rule. We're > fortunate that we have a friendly and dynamic community around a > powerful environment, so even being part of the rule, we can be very > creative and productive. > > On the issue of step 0, learning materials and approaches, and Pharo > for beginners, my findings are that Pharo is pretty well suited for > non-programmers (journalist, scientist, teachers, philosophers) > compared to IPython for example. I have tried both, IPython notebooks > and Pharo/Grafoscopio, and the uniformity and self containment of the > environment is very empowering, without too much overhead and extra > complications. So I think that we also need to look towards the > non-usual programmer and computer scientist profiles for the "newbies" > and interested in belonging to the community. > I agree. This is why I was pushing alex to describe stories (people can do data journalism and software vis. vs. we can do visualization) around roassal with your experience as an example > Our approach in our Data Week workshop is different: > > - We start with some panoramic view of computing comparing Unix > fathers versus dynabook children. This gives a point to see the > technology and the differences and why Pharo is more like OS + IDE + > Apps in a minimalist fashion, instead of the Unix legacy approach to > the same problem. > > - We go to the professor Stef tutorial, which is the first part of a > Grafoscopio notebook. Then we use some one liners taking from Sven's > Elegant Pharo code, then we use HernÃ¡n's Internet Movie Data Base > example to introduce JSON, queries and REST API, then we use blocks to > abstract the example (see below) and create our first "Cinemania" > package. > It could be nice to give steroids to Prof Stef by adding some pages with cool scripts :) > - Then we learn how to extend the Dataviz package (made in Roassal), > with our Twitter exported data and we deal with an open problem: > Twitter Data Selfies. > > > So, there are several routes to learning for different populations and > contexts. Putting the new contextualized stuff we're doing in dialogue > with the material the community is creating (MOOC, UPBE, Deep Into > Pharo) and other communities like Open Knowledge (see our recent for > the upcomming Data Week 7 at [a]) is the key to let learners traverse > different paths according to their needs and interests. > Yes and I think that your approach is really interesting because it brings a perspective that I cannot really give and this is a "super user" perspective and it is really nice. > [a] > https://discuss.okfn.org/t/data-week-7-our-critical-code-data-literacy-and-… > > Cheers, > > Offray > > > On 25/10/16 22:19, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: >> Ruby On Rails was started by one developer , so no it's not users >> that bring contributors it's contributors that bring users. Smalltalk >> started by a small team. Almost all programming languages started >> with no users and mostly a sole developer. This is because a user >> will not use software that is not even alpha, on the other hand a >> contributor will be a user and a contributor regardless of the state >> of software provided he has the desire to do so. >> >> Spreading the word and helping people understand Pharo no longer >> makes you a user, it promotes you to contributor >> >> Same applies to Richard >> >> ;) >> On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 03:19, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com >> <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> Yes it is an amazing thing what you all do, I admire that. But >> isn't contributors previous users? >> >> What I like about the Richard intent, from what I understand, is >> to make Smalltalk, and Pharo, more visible, more used, and that >> is the only way I know to bring more contributors. From what I >> know, Ruby got a lot of more contributors after Rails, which >> brought a lot of users to the platform. >> >> I really would like to contribute some day, in the mean time I >> will try to support initiatives like the one proposed by Richard, >> and spread the word as much as I can. >> >> >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 9:45 PM, Dimitris Chloupis >> <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com <mailto:kilon.alios@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> Do you know how many unique views had PBE last 5 months ? 1000 >> Do you know how many contributions PBE had last 5 months ? >> Zero. Not 100 . Not even 10. Not even 1... zero >> >> PBE would be still in Pharo version 1.4 if it was not for me >> , Stef and Damien. >> >> This is not a Pharo problem, all open source software has the >> same issue. >> >> We need more people helping, I ported the first 1/3rd of the >> book from 1.4 to Pharo 4 just by myself and the other two >> joined after I was burned out from the pain. I was disgusted >> working on PBE . I literally hated Pharo. Fortunately nothing >> that a bit of a small break could not fix. >> >> I was and still I am the most loud critic about the state of >> documentation. In the end however what makes open source >> projects exist is not users. Users are insignificant. Sorry >> to say that but is true. It's contributors that are the life >> of the project. >> >> People like Stef made Pharo and even Squeak possible. People >> like Stef keep Smalltalk alive. Personally I don't give a >> damn what users want , I rather attract only contributors and >> zero just users. That's enough to keep Pharo evolving for >> centuries. >> >> Stef says that "Pharo is yours" , apparently this easier said >> than done. I respect your opinion, I agree with your opinion >> because I said what you say years ago. In the end however if >> you and other users are not willing to help we will remain at >> zero commits at least as far as PBE is concerned . >> >> It's pretty much the same for the other areas of Pharo. >> On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 01:26, Vitor Medina Cruz >> <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> *Dimitris:* >> * >> * >> I agree with much of what you said, but I think it is >> still possible to make step 0 and follow the Pharo path >> with more easy. :) >> >> Also, >> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/UpdatedPharoByExample/lastSucces… >> is nice too, I didn't know of it. It is the new version >> of PBE ongoing? I am going to take a look at it. >> >> Ben: >> >> Thanks for the links, two of them I didn't know of. I >> hadn't time to read them yet, but I think what I am >> looking for is something like >> https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53… >> >> "The things we see as important might be a paradigm >> step too far for newcomers." >> >> >> I think the problem for Step 0 it is exactly that. I >> myself have already tried to show the paradigm shift >> along with all that must be learn to use Pharo, and it >> didn't went well. It is too much to tackle at once. There >> is the language, the environment, the IDE, the paradigm >> shift, too much... >> >> Nicolai: >> >> The first example from the book provides the first >> experience you have on Pharo, and it uses stuff that is >> not on the default image (it happened to me a long time >> ago and with a friend more recently). It is frustrating >> and leave the person trying to learn suspicious. I see >> that the current site for the book has a link to the >> image that should be used while reading the book, but it >> is not very visible and I think the book don't mention >> it. From the Getting Started chapter I count five pages >> until some code is executed (Time now). The problem here >> is that people usually don't understand, yet, the power >> of the environment, and are eager to see code and execute >> it, and they often get confused with so many different >> things to learn even before the first "Hello World". I >> can say the first time I got PBE I gave up because of >> this, and I only come back later because I persist to >> learn Smalltalk, and I know some other people who tried >> to read it too and give up for exactly the same reason. >> >> I found the book an excellent reference and source to >> solidify the understanding of Pharo, but I don't like it >> as a tutorial. >> >> >> *-------* >> >> Look at the Go language site: https://golang.org/, the >> first thing it puts in your face is a way to execute code >> and a link to a Tour. I don't even have to think much >> before I have executed the Hello World, my hand just >> moved the mouse to the Run button, and even before I >> noticed I was doing the tour. >> >> In my opinion, a good Step 0 would be something like >> Profstef (http://amber-lang.net/learn.html) as a Tour, >> going slowly through the language aspects, messages >> types, comparing to other OO languages, showing that >> operator are just messages, then that control flow >> statements are also just messages, creating classes etc, >> always letting the user execute code as she goes on. >> >> After that, the Tour could tell its user to continue it >> using the image and showing the download link. When the >> user execute Pharo.exe and loads the default image the >> first thing that appears is the Profstef asking if it is >> the first time he is there and if he is continuing the >> tour from the web (if it is someone used to Pharo, he >> just closes the windows and starts to use his new fresh >> image). It could explains steadily the workspace, the >> transcript, the nautilus and how to make a very simple >> web application with tests. After that it could explain >> the image, that objects are stored (serialized) into it >> and the image itself consists of the running program >> while the Pharo.exe is the VM. In the end It could point >> to a tutorial like >> https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53…, >> the PBE and to the many others resources available. >> >> The order of things could change and maybe I had missed >> something, but that is what I can think now. Perhaps this >> approach is too slow, I don't know, but the fast one >> isn't working for me :( It don't need to be a tour also, >> but something in these lines, like the medium post above >> but with more parts, each describing a little more of >> Pharo. The idea, in general, is to easy the entrance >> barriers that Pharo has by it's quite different, yet >> powerful, programming model and environment. When I talk >> to people I know that have tried Pharo, that is the >> biggest problem. >> >> That is just my two cents. :) >> >> And thanks for all the new links :) >> >> Regards, >> Vitor >> > >

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial

by phil＠highoctane.be

Interesting. I really need to get into that grafoscopio... Phil On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 9:13 PM, Offray Vladimir Luna CÃ¡rdenas < offray.luna(a)mutabit.com> wrote: > > Hi, > > On the issue of contributing to Free, Libre, Open Source Software (FLOSS) > projects, I have been reading recently Nadia Eghbal and her analysis that > confirm that most FLOSS projects are done by individuals and small teams, > which is contrary to the bazaar narrative. This comic shows the point: > > and you can find more details here: https://medium.com/@nayafia/ > what-success-really-looks-like-in-open-source-2dd1facaf91c#.e360z53sf > > In that sense Pharo and what we're doing here on small communities, teams > and individuals, is not the exception, is the rule. We're fortunate that we > have a friendly and dynamic community around a powerful environment, so > even being part of the rule, we can be very creative and productive. > > On the issue of step 0, learning materials and approaches, and Pharo for > beginners, my findings are that Pharo is pretty well suited for > non-programmers (journalist, scientist, teachers, philosophers) compared to > IPython for example. I have tried both, IPython notebooks and > Pharo/Grafoscopio, and the uniformity and self containment of the > environment is very empowering, without too much overhead and extra > complications. So I think that we also need to look towards the non-usual > programmer and computer scientist profiles for the "newbies" and interested > in belonging to the community. > > Our approach in our Data Week workshop is different: > > - We start with some panoramic view of computing comparing Unix fathers > versus dynabook children. This gives a point to see the technology and the > differences and why Pharo is more like OS + IDE + Apps in a minimalist > fashion, instead of the Unix legacy approach to the same problem. > > - We go to the professor Stef tutorial, which is the first part of a > Grafoscopio notebook. Then we use some one liners taking from Sven's > Elegant Pharo code, then we use HernÃ¡n's Internet Movie Data Base example > to introduce JSON, queries and REST API, then we use blocks to abstract the > example (see below) and create our first "Cinemania" package. > > - Then we learn how to extend the Dataviz package (made in Roassal), with > our Twitter exported data and we deal with an open problem: Twitter Data > Selfies. > > > So, there are several routes to learning for different populations and > contexts. Putting the new contextualized stuff we're doing in dialogue with > the material the community is creating (MOOC, UPBE, Deep Into Pharo) and > other communities like Open Knowledge (see our recent for the upcomming > Data Week 7 at [a]) is the key to let learners traverse different paths > according to their needs and interests. > > [a] https://discuss.okfn.org/t/data-week-7-our-critical-code- > data-literacy-and-visualization-hackathon-returns/3823 > > Cheers, > > Offray > > On 25/10/16 22:19, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: > > Ruby On Rails was started by one developer , so no it's not users that > bring contributors it's contributors that bring users. Smalltalk started by > a small team. Almost all programming languages started with no users and > mostly a sole developer. This is because a user will not use software that > is not even alpha, on the other hand a contributor will be a user and a > contributor regardless of the state of software provided he has the desire > to do so. > > Spreading the word and helping people understand Pharo no longer makes you > a user, it promotes you to contributor > > Same applies to Richard > > ;) > On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 03:19, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Yes it is an amazing thing what you all do, I admire that. But isn't >> contributors previous users? >> >> What I like about the Richard intent, from what I understand, is to make >> Smalltalk, and Pharo, more visible, more used, and that is the only way I >> know to bring more contributors. From what I know, Ruby got a lot of more >> contributors after Rails, which brought a lot of users to the platform. >> >> I really would like to contribute some day, in the mean time I will try >> to support initiatives like the one proposed by Richard, and spread the >> word as much as I can. >> >> >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 9:45 PM, Dimitris Chloupis <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com >> > wrote: >> >> Do you know how many unique views had PBE last 5 months ? 1000 >> Do you know how many contributions PBE had last 5 months ? Zero. Not 100 >> . Not even 10. Not even 1... zero >> >> PBE would be still in Pharo version 1.4 if it was not for me , Stef and >> Damien. >> >> This is not a Pharo problem, all open source software has the same issue. >> >> We need more people helping, I ported the first 1/3rd of the book from >> 1.4 to Pharo 4 just by myself and the other two joined after I was burned >> out from the pain. I was disgusted working on PBE . I literally hated >> Pharo. Fortunately nothing that a bit of a small break could not fix. >> >> I was and still I am the most loud critic about the state of >> documentation. In the end however what makes open source projects exist is >> not users. Users are insignificant. Sorry to say that but is true. It's >> contributors that are the life of the project. >> >> People like Stef made Pharo and even Squeak possible. People like Stef >> keep Smalltalk alive. Personally I don't give a damn what users want , I >> rather attract only contributors and zero just users. That's enough to keep >> Pharo evolving for centuries. >> >> Stef says that "Pharo is yours" , apparently this easier said than done. >> I respect your opinion, I agree with your opinion because I said what you >> say years ago. In the end however if you and other users are not willing to >> help we will remain at zero commits at least as far as PBE is concerned . >> >> It's pretty much the same for the other areas of Pharo. >> On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 01:26, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> *Dimitris:* >> >> I agree with much of what you said, but I think it is still possible to >> make step 0 and follow the Pharo path with more easy. :) >> >> Also, https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/UpdatedPharoByExample/ >> lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/book-result/PharoTour/PharoTour.html is >> nice too, I didn't know of it. It is the new version of PBE ongoing? I am >> going to take a look at it. >> >> Ben: >> >> Thanks for the links, two of them I didn't know of. I hadn't time to read >> them yet, but I think what I am looking for is something like >> https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes- >> 1b5327ca0740 >> >> "The things we see as important might be a paradigm step too far for >> newcomers." >> >> >> I think the problem for Step 0 it is exactly that. I myself have already >> tried to show the paradigm shift along with all that must be learn to use >> Pharo, and it didn't went well. It is too much to tackle at once. There is >> the language, the environment, the IDE, the paradigm shift, too much... >> >> Nicolai: >> >> The first example from the book provides the first experience you have on >> Pharo, and it uses stuff that is not on the default image (it happened to >> me a long time ago and with a friend more recently). It is frustrating and >> leave the person trying to learn suspicious. I see that the current site >> for the book has a link to the image that should be used while reading the >> book, but it is not very visible and I think the book don't mention >> it. From the Getting Started chapter I count five pages until some code is >> executed (Time now). The problem here is that people usually don't >> understand, yet, the power of the environment, and are eager to see code >> and execute it, and they often get confused with so many different things >> to learn even before the first "Hello World". I can say the first time I >> got PBE I gave up because of this, and I only come back later because I >> persist to learn Smalltalk, and I know some other people who tried to read >> it too and give up for exactly the same reason. >> >> I found the book an excellent reference and source to solidify the >> understanding of Pharo, but I don't like it as a tutorial. >> >> >> *-------* >> >> Look at the Go language site: https://golang.org/, the first thing it >> puts in your face is a way to execute code and a link to a Tour. I don't >> even have to think much before I have executed the Hello World, my hand >> just moved the mouse to the Run button, and even before I noticed I was >> doing the tour. >> >> In my opinion, a good Step 0 would be something like Profstef ( >> http://amber-lang.net/learn.html) as a Tour, going slowly through the >> language aspects, messages types, comparing to other OO languages, showing >> that operator are just messages, then that control flow statements are also >> just messages, creating classes etc, always letting the user execute code >> as she goes on. >> >> After that, the Tour could tell its user to continue it using the image >> and showing the download link. When the user execute Pharo.exe and loads >> the default image the first thing that appears is the Profstef asking if it >> is the first time he is there and if he is continuing the tour from the web >> (if it is someone used to Pharo, he just closes the windows and starts to >> use his new fresh image). It could explains steadily the workspace, the >> transcript, the nautilus and how to make a very simple web application with >> tests. After that it could explain the image, that objects are stored >> (serialized) into it and the image itself consists of the running program >> while the Pharo.exe is the VM. In the end It could point to a tutorial like >> https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes- >> 1b5327ca0740, the PBE and to the many others resources available. >> >> The order of things could change and maybe I had missed something, but >> that is what I can think now. Perhaps this approach is too slow, I don't >> know, but the fast one isn't working for me :( It don't need to be a tour >> also, but something in these lines, like the medium post above but with >> more parts, each describing a little more of Pharo. The idea, in general, >> is to easy the entrance barriers that Pharo has by it's quite different, >> yet powerful, programming model and environment. When I talk to people I >> know that have tried Pharo, that is the biggest problem. >> >> That is just my two cents. :) >> >> And thanks for all the new links :) >> >> Regards, >> Vitor >> >> > >

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial

by Offray Vladimir Luna CÃ¡rdenas

Hi, On the issue of contributing to Free, Libre, Open Source Software (FLOSS) projects, I have been reading recently Nadia Eghbal and her analysis that confirm that most FLOSS projects are done by individuals and small teams, which is contrary to the bazaar narrative. This comic shows the point: and you can find more details here: https://medium.com/@nayafia/what-success-really-looks-like-in-open-source-2… In that sense Pharo and what we're doing here on small communities, teams and individuals, is not the exception, is the rule. We're fortunate that we have a friendly and dynamic community around a powerful environment, so even being part of the rule, we can be very creative and productive. On the issue of step 0, learning materials and approaches, and Pharo for beginners, my findings are that Pharo is pretty well suited for non-programmers (journalist, scientist, teachers, philosophers) compared to IPython for example. I have tried both, IPython notebooks and Pharo/Grafoscopio, and the uniformity and self containment of the environment is very empowering, without too much overhead and extra complications. So I think that we also need to look towards the non-usual programmer and computer scientist profiles for the "newbies" and interested in belonging to the community. Our approach in our Data Week workshop is different: - We start with some panoramic view of computing comparing Unix fathers versus dynabook children. This gives a point to see the technology and the differences and why Pharo is more like OS + IDE + Apps in a minimalist fashion, instead of the Unix legacy approach to the same problem. - We go to the professor Stef tutorial, which is the first part of a Grafoscopio notebook. Then we use some one liners taking from Sven's Elegant Pharo code, then we use HernÃ¡n's Internet Movie Data Base example to introduce JSON, queries and REST API, then we use blocks to abstract the example (see below) and create our first "Cinemania" package. - Then we learn how to extend the Dataviz package (made in Roassal), with our Twitter exported data and we deal with an open problem: Twitter Data Selfies. So, there are several routes to learning for different populations and contexts. Putting the new contextualized stuff we're doing in dialogue with the material the community is creating (MOOC, UPBE, Deep Into Pharo) and other communities like Open Knowledge (see our recent for the upcomming Data Week 7 at [a]) is the key to let learners traverse different paths according to their needs and interests. [a] https://discuss.okfn.org/t/data-week-7-our-critical-code-data-literacy-and-… Cheers, Offray On 25/10/16 22:19, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: > Ruby On Rails was started by one developer , so no it's not users that > bring contributors it's contributors that bring users. Smalltalk > started by a small team. Almost all programming languages started with > no users and mostly a sole developer. This is because a user will not > use software that is not even alpha, on the other hand a contributor > will be a user and a contributor regardless of the state of software > provided he has the desire to do so. > > Spreading the word and helping people understand Pharo no longer makes > you a user, it promotes you to contributor > > Same applies to Richard > > ;) > On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 03:19, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com > <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: > > Yes it is an amazing thing what you all do, I admire that. But > isn't contributors previous users? > > What I like about the Richard intent, from what I understand, is > to make Smalltalk, and Pharo, more visible, more used, and that is > the only way I know to bring more contributors. From what I know, > Ruby got a lot of more contributors after Rails, which brought a > lot of users to the platform. > > I really would like to contribute some day, in the mean time I > will try to support initiatives like the one proposed by Richard, > and spread the word as much as I can. > > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 9:45 PM, Dimitris Chloupis > <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com <mailto:kilon.alios@gmail.com>> wrote: > > Do you know how many unique views had PBE last 5 months ? 1000 > Do you know how many contributions PBE had last 5 months ? > Zero. Not 100 . Not even 10. Not even 1... zero > > PBE would be still in Pharo version 1.4 if it was not for me , > Stef and Damien. > > This is not a Pharo problem, all open source software has the > same issue. > > We need more people helping, I ported the first 1/3rd of the > book from 1.4 to Pharo 4 just by myself and the other two > joined after I was burned out from the pain. I was disgusted > working on PBE . I literally hated Pharo. Fortunately nothing > that a bit of a small break could not fix. > > I was and still I am the most loud critic about the state of > documentation. In the end however what makes open source > projects exist is not users. Users are insignificant. Sorry to > say that but is true. It's contributors that are the life of > the project. > > People like Stef made Pharo and even Squeak possible. People > like Stef keep Smalltalk alive. Personally I don't give a damn > what users want , I rather attract only contributors and zero > just users. That's enough to keep Pharo evolving for centuries. > > Stef says that "Pharo is yours" , apparently this easier said > than done. I respect your opinion, I agree with your opinion > because I said what you say years ago. In the end however if > you and other users are not willing to help we will remain at > zero commits at least as far as PBE is concerned . > > It's pretty much the same for the other areas of Pharo. > On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 01:26, Vitor Medina Cruz > <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com <mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com>> wrote: > > *Dimitris:* > * > * > I agree with much of what you said, but I think it is > still possible to make step 0 and follow the Pharo path > with more easy. :) > > Also, > https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/UpdatedPharoByExample/lastSucces… > is nice too, I didn't know of it. It is the new version of > PBE ongoing? I am going to take a look at it. > > Ben: > > Thanks for the links, two of them I didn't know of. I > hadn't time to read them yet, but I think what I am > looking for is something like > https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53… > > "The things we see as important might be a paradigm > step too far for newcomers." > > > I think the problem for Step 0 it is exactly that. I > myself have already tried to show the paradigm shift along > with all that must be learn to use Pharo, and it didn't > went well. It is too much to tackle at once. There is the > language, the environment, the IDE, the paradigm shift, > too much... > > Nicolai: > > The first example from the book provides the first > experience you have on Pharo, and it uses stuff that is > not on the default image (it happened to me a long time > ago and with a friend more recently). It is frustrating > and leave the person trying to learn suspicious. I see > that the current site for the book has a link to the image > that should be used while reading the book, but it is not > very visible and I think the book don't mention it. From > the Getting Started chapter I count five pages until some > code is executed (Time now). The problem here is that > people usually don't understand, yet, the power of the > environment, and are eager to see code and execute it, and > they often get confused with so many different things to > learn even before the first "Hello World". I can say the > first time I got PBE I gave up because of this, and I only > come back later because I persist to learn Smalltalk, and > I know some other people who tried to read it too and give > up for exactly the same reason. > > I found the book an excellent reference and source to > solidify the understanding of Pharo, but I don't like it > as a tutorial. > > > *-------* > > Look at the Go language site: https://golang.org/, the > first thing it puts in your face is a way to execute code > and a link to a Tour. I don't even have to think much > before I have executed the Hello World, my hand just moved > the mouse to the Run button, and even before I noticed I > was doing the tour. > > In my opinion, a good Step 0 would be something like > Profstef (http://amber-lang.net/learn.html) as a Tour, > going slowly through the language aspects, messages types, > comparing to other OO languages, showing that operator are > just messages, then that control flow statements are also > just messages, creating classes etc, always letting the > user execute code as she goes on. > > After that, the Tour could tell its user to continue it > using the image and showing the download link. When the > user execute Pharo.exe and loads the default image the > first thing that appears is the Profstef asking if it is > the first time he is there and if he is continuing the > tour from the web (if it is someone used to Pharo, he just > closes the windows and starts to use his new fresh image). > It could explains steadily the workspace, the transcript, > the nautilus and how to make a very simple web application > with tests. After that it could explain the image, that > objects are stored (serialized) into it and the image > itself consists of the running program while the Pharo.exe > is the VM. In the end It could point to a tutorial like > https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53…, > the PBE and to the many others resources available. > > The order of things could change and maybe I had missed > something, but that is what I can think now. Perhaps this > approach is too slow, I don't know, but the fast one isn't > working for me :( It don't need to be a tour also, but > something in these lines, like the medium post above but > with more parts, each describing a little more of Pharo. > The idea, in general, is to easy the entrance > barriers that Pharo has by it's quite different, yet > powerful, programming model and environment. When I talk > to people I know that have tried Pharo, that is the > biggest problem. > > That is just my two cents. :) > > And thanks for all the new links :) > > Regards, > Vitor >

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] UFFI and ObjC

by Dimitris Chloupis

Well maybe it's time to give Spec another try , maybe this time I will like it But then I always had a weird taste I am also flirting with idea of QT maybe with the support of my Python bridge it will give even the ability to design the GUIs using QTCreator. Fun fun fun, I love experiments.... wish me luck ;) On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 18:34, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: Le 26/10/16 Ã 12:22, Dimitris Chloupis a Ã©crit : I always listen , and I did try it, same problem I am innocent your Honor Pharo Configuration worked great :) Do you think its worth taking a stab at Mars, is this how it works on macos ? Yes :) What would be super cool is a spec binding :) Stef

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial

by Dimitris Chloupis

Probably then it's ready to get released for version 5. I will give it a look the next few days, should be able to make the release by the end of the week. Then after that onward for version 6 ;) PBE is doing great with the help of you guys , porting it to 6 should be relative easy. On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 18:44, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: > Thanks this is cool to hear that. > > BTW do you know if we finished with UPBE or if there is something else to > do from a conversion stand point? > > I thought I did a final pass. > > > > Le 26/10/16 Ã 01:45, Dimitris Chloupis a Ã©crit : > > Do you know how many unique views had PBE last 5 months ? 1000 > Do you know how many contributions PBE had last 5 months ? Zero. Not 100 . > Not even 10. Not even 1... zero > > PBE would be still in Pharo version 1.4 if it was not for me , Stef and > Damien. > > This is not a Pharo problem, all open source software has the same issue. > > We need more people helping, I ported the first 1/3rd of the book from 1.4 > to Pharo 4 just by myself and the other two joined after I was burned out > from the pain. I was disgusted working on PBE . I literally hated Pharo. > Fortunately nothing that a bit of a small break could not fix. > > I was and still I am the most loud critic about the state of > documentation. In the end however what makes open source projects exist is > not users. Users are insignificant. Sorry to say that but is true. It's > contributors that are the life of the project. > > People like Stef made Pharo and even Squeak possible. People like Stef > keep Smalltalk alive. Personally I don't give a damn what users want , I > rather attract only contributors and zero just users. That's enough to keep > Pharo evolving for centuries. > > Stef says that "Pharo is yours" , apparently this easier said than done. I > respect your opinion, I agree with your opinion because I said what you say > years ago. In the end however if you and other users are not willing to > help we will remain at zero commits at least as far as PBE is concerned . > > It's pretty much the same for the other areas of Pharo. > On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 at 01:26, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > *Dimitris:* > > I agree with much of what you said, but I think it is still possible to > make step 0 and follow the Pharo path with more easy. :) > > Also, > https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/UpdatedPharoByExample/lastSucces… > is nice too, I didn't know of it. It is the new version of PBE ongoing? I > am going to take a look at it. > > Ben: > > Thanks for the links, two of them I didn't know of. I hadn't time to read > them yet, but I think what I am looking for is something like > https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53… > > "The things we see as important might be a paradigm step too far for > newcomers." > > > I think the problem for Step 0 it is exactly that. I myself have already > tried to show the paradigm shift along with all that must be learn to use > Pharo, and it didn't went well. It is too much to tackle at once. There is > the language, the environment, the IDE, the paradigm shift, too much... > > Nicolai: > > The first example from the book provides the first experience you have on > Pharo, and it uses stuff that is not on the default image (it happened to > me a long time ago and with a friend more recently). It is frustrating and > leave the person trying to learn suspicious. I see that the current site > for the book has a link to the image that should be used while reading the > book, but it is not very visible and I think the book don't mention > it. From the Getting Started chapter I count five pages until some code is > executed (Time now). The problem here is that people usually don't > understand, yet, the power of the environment, and are eager to see code > and execute it, and they often get confused with so many different things > to learn even before the first "Hello World". I can say the first time I > got PBE I gave up because of this, and I only come back later because I > persist to learn Smalltalk, and I know some other people who tried to read > it too and give up for exactly the same reason. > > I found the book an excellent reference and source to solidify the > understanding of Pharo, but I don't like it as a tutorial. > > > *-------* > > Look at the Go language site: https://golang.org/, the first thing it > puts in your face is a way to execute code and a link to a Tour. I don't > even have to think much before I have executed the Hello World, my hand > just moved the mouse to the Run button, and even before I noticed I was > doing the tour. > > In my opinion, a good Step 0 would be something like Profstef ( > http://amber-lang.net/learn.html) as a Tour, going slowly through the > language aspects, messages types, comparing to other OO languages, showing > that operator are just messages, then that control flow statements are also > just messages, creating classes etc, always letting the user execute code > as she goes on. > > After that, the Tour could tell its user to continue it using the image > and showing the download link. When the user execute Pharo.exe and loads > the default image the first thing that appears is the Profstef asking if it > is the first time he is there and if he is continuing the tour from the web > (if it is someone used to Pharo, he just closes the windows and starts to > use his new fresh image). It could explains steadily the workspace, the > transcript, the nautilus and how to make a very simple web application with > tests. After that it could explain the image, that objects are stored > (serialized) into it and the image itself consists of the running program > while the Pharo.exe is the VM. In the end It could point to a tutorial like > https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53…, > the PBE and to the many others resources available. > > The order of things could change and maybe I had missed something, but > that is what I can think now. Perhaps this approach is too slow, I don't > know, but the fast one isn't working for me :( It don't need to be a tour > also, but something in these lines, like the medium post above but with > more parts, each describing a little more of Pharo. The idea, in general, > is to easy the entrance barriers that Pharo has by it's quite different, > yet powerful, programming model and environment. When I talk to people I > know that have tried Pharo, that is the biggest problem. > > That is just my two cents. :) > > And thanks for all the new links :) > > Regards, > Vitor > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 8:05 PM, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: > > > > Le 25/10/16 Ã 15:05, Dimitris Chloupis a Ã©crit : > > PBE is for Pharo version 5, I will give it another look to start porting > it to Pharo version 6. Will add a git tag and make release for 5. > > > Thanks. > Yes it would be an immense help. > > Stef > > > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 10:19 AM phil(a)highoctane.be <phil(a)highoctane.be> > wrote: > > There was this book (and some others of the same ink) that was provided > with my first computer: > > > http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Getting… > <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Getting…> > > I actually had the french version. > http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Color%2… > <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Hardware/Color%2…> > > This thing is still sitting near my desk today (I guess it keeps me > connected to my curious young self or something like that). > > I keep on thinking that it would be great to have a Pharo-based version of > it. > > And something like this one for bytecode sets... > > > http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Programming/EDTA… > <http://www.colorcomputerarchive.com/coco/Documents/Manuals/Programming/EDTA…> > > Phil > > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 7:22 AM, Matteo via Pharo-users < > pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org> wrote: > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Matteo <matteob8(a)yahoo.it> > To: Any question about pharo is welcome <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org> > > Cc: > Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 07:08:21 +0200 > Subject: Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial > +1 for PBE > It has been my first smalltalk/Pharo tutorial. > I'm still using it, as a quick reference. > > On October 25, 2016 6:25:08 AM GMT+02:00, monty <monty2(a)programmer.net> > wrote: > > +1 for PBE. > > > > Sent: Monday, October 24, 2016 at 1:56 AM > From: "Nicolai Hess" <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com> > To: "Any question about pharo is welcome" <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org> > Subject: Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial > > Am 23.10.2016 3:16 nachm. schrieb "Vitor Medina Cruz" <vitormcruz@gmail.com[mailto:vitormcruz@gmail.com]>: > > > I think the MOOC is too much for a tutorial. What I miss today is a good written (no videos! Please!) tutorial that teaches just a little of the language and give a few guidelines on how to do simple stuff with the environment, such as a "Hello World!", creating a class, tests and run stuff. > > I thought "pharo by example" provides exactly that. > What is missing here, from your perspective? > I learned a lot from it and it helped me to get started to learn smalltalk, not only the syntax, but also, doing something the smalltalk way. > > > On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 12:15 PM, horrido <horrido.hobbies@gmail.com[mailto:horrido.hobbies@gmail.com]> wrote: > > > Excellent suggestion! I shall look into it. Thanks. > > > > > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/The-Ultimate-Smalltalk-Tutorial-tp4918859p4918930.htm… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > > > -- > Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. > > > > >

Oct. 26, 2016

Re: [Pharo-users] The Ultimate Smalltalk Tutorial

by Jimmie Houchin

I am a big fan of proper attribution, so here is my guess. It seems to be a paraphrase of an Alan Perlis quote https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Alan_Perlis " A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing." From his article Epigrams on Programming, 1982 ACM SIGPLAN Notices 17 (9), September 1982, pp. 7â13 Hope this helps someone. Jimmie Houchin On 10/23/2016 07:36 PM, Ben Coman wrote: > On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 8:11 AM, Dimitris Chloupis > <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> I was looking my entire life for something like Pharo , almost 30 years. >> When I found it took me another 5 to realize this is it and I had many close >> calls to abandoning it. But in the end I realized with its weakness and >> frustrated moments I love Pharo. >> >> To tell you truth even if I was to give up Pharo, today, it would not matter >> much. Mainly because I can take the Pharo ideology to any other programming >> language even the most ugly ones like Java, C++ and JavaScript. > I don't remember who said it, but I like the quote... > "The only languages worth learning are those that change the way you > think about programming" > >> On Mon, 24 Oct 2016 at 01:52, Vitor Medina Cruz <vitormcruz(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >>> I think what is missing is something before all that, something that spark >>> the "I am interested in Pharo", the STEP 0. What does that today? I think a >>> simple tutorial that catch the attention of people would do that. Right now >>> I think it is too hard for someone to get interested in Smalltalk in >>> general, and Pharo in particular, because something like that is missing, >>> and one must really understand and see the value of Smalltalk to persist and >>> keep going and learning, like happened to me. > Perhaps something like these? > * https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/reddit-st-in-10-cool-pharo-classes-1b53… > * https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/rediscovering-the-ux-of-the-legendary-h… > * https://medium.com/concerning-pharo/elegant-pharo-code-bb590f0856d0 > > If you do notice somewhere a suitable step 0, please let us know. For > those of us using Pharo a while, our perspective changes so maybe we > can't see what might hook newcomers. The things we see as important > might be a paradigm step too far for newcomers. Although those who > teach Pharo classes would have a better idea of a newcomer > perspective, may that is still different from someone voluntarily > choosing Pharo without a supportive environment like a university > course. > > cheers -ben >

Oct. 26, 2016