June 2014 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] Base64 encoding + UTF8 ?

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Bonsoir FranÃ§ois, >From the class comment of ZnBase64Encoder: [...] Note that to encode a String as Base64, you first have to encode the characters as bytes using a character encoder. [...] Sending #asByteArray to a String is the same as doing no encoding (or doing null encoding). Consider: ZnBase64Encoder new encode: (ZnUTF8Encoder new encodeString: 'tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre'). => 'dGFtw6hyZWVuc2xpcGRlZ3VlcnJl' ZnBase64Encoder new encode: (ZnByteEncoder iso88591 encodeString: 'tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre'). => 'dGFt6HJlZW5zbGlwZGVndWVycmU=' ZnBase64Encoder new encode: (ZnNullEncoder new encodeString: 'tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre'). => 'dGFt6HJlZW5zbGlwZGVndWVycmU=' The last two are often the same, and thus equivalent to #asByteArray, but not always. HTH, Sven On 11 Jun 2014, at 21:56, FranÃ§ois Stephany <tulipe.moutarde(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I might hit some problem with Base64 encoding in there. > It seems that Pharo does not use UTF8 for its Base64 encoding. > > I'm probably missing something related to Base64 encoding... > > In Pharo 3.0: > > ZnBase64Encoder new encode: 'tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre' asByteArray. > -> 'dGFt6HJlZW5zbGlwZGVndWVycmU=' > > 'tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre' base64Encoded. > -> 'dGFt6HJlZW5zbGlwZGVndWVycmU=' > > In Ruby 2.0: > > Base64.strict_encode64("tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre") > -> dGFtw6hyZWVuc2xpcGRlZ3VlcnJl > > http://www.motobit.com/util/base64-decoder-encoder.asp > (iso-8859-1) > tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre -> dGFt6HJlZW5zbGlwZGVndWVycmU= > > http://www.motobit.com/util/base64-decoder-encoder.asp > (utf8) > -tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre > dGFtw6hyZWVuc2xpcGRlZ3VlcnJl

June 11, 2014

Base64 encoding + UTF8 ?

by FranÃ§ois Stephany

I might hit some problem with Base64 encoding in there. It seems that Pharo does not use UTF8 for its Base64 encoding. I'm probably missing something related to Base64 encoding... In Pharo 3.0: ZnBase64Encoder new encode: 'tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre' asByteArray. -> 'dGFt6HJlZW5zbGlwZGVndWVycmU=' 'tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre' base64Encoded. -> 'dGFt6HJlZW5zbGlwZGVndWVycmU=' In Ruby 2.0: Base64.strict_encode64("tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre") -> dGFtw6hyZWVuc2xpcGRlZ3VlcnJl http://www.motobit.com/util/base64-decoder-encoder.asp (iso-8859-1) tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre -> dGFt6HJlZW5zbGlwZGVndWVycmU= http://www.motobit.com/util/base64-decoder-encoder.asp (utf8) -tamÃ¨reenslipdeguerre > dGFtw6hyZWVuc2xpcGRlZ3VlcnJl

June 11, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Another Pharo based solution released

by Tudor Girba

Congratulations! Doru On Mon, Jun 9, 2014 at 8:22 PM, Esteban A. Maringolo <emaringolo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Last Friday my company released a new software solution that involves > Pharo in the server side. > > It consists of a Android based app running on tablets, used for the > showcase and sales of products during expos (of retail companies), > backed by a Pharo server through a REST API, and with a Seaside based > admin/users web. > > The first expo was during the last weekend (fri-sun), and it involved > the sales of a large number of orders and products (I can't disclose > the numbers). > The scale of the solution/user base is small, far from being "cloud > scale", but it is for one of the largest consumer goods manufacturer > (and the one who sold the most during the expo). > Anyhow, the server handled all the request perfectly, without a single > glitch. > > We already have some future expos scheduled. So it will continue to > run along the already running Pharo based solution in the same > company. > > Best regards! > > Esteban A. Maringolo > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

June 11, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Gradualtalk

by Johan Fabry

Hi Bob, I think youâve got the wrong vm. We have not tried Gradualtalk on Windows, but itâs odd to me that your vm is Croquet.exe. Could you download the latest vm from the Pharo website and try with that? On Jun 11, 2014, at 10:16 AM, Bob Williams <rwilliams19(a)cox.net> wrote: > I am trying to look at the annotation typing used in Gradualtalk, but I am having no success. I download the gradualtalk. zip and what I think is the correct Cog VM, but when I run Croquet I do not see any window; I do see the application running in the Task Manager. I am trying to install it on a computer running Windows Vista. The files in the Gradualtalk directory are: > > Croquet.exe created 4 Oct 2010 > Croquet.ini > Croquet.map > Gradualtalk.changes created 3 12 2013 > Gradualtalk.image > PharoDebug.log > SqueadFFIPrims.dll > stderr > Win32OSProcessPlugin.dll > > Both stderr and PharoDebug.log were created when I attempted the run. The PharoDebug.log has the following: > > THERE_BE_DRAGONS_HERE > ==== Startup Error: MessageNotUnderstood: receiver of "do:" is nil > 11 June 2014 9:36:03.002 am > > VM: Win32 - IX86 - 6.0 - > > Any help would be appreciated. Would I have more success on a Mac? > > bw > > PS: Will the annotation typing be included in a future Pharo releases? ---> Save our in-boxes! http://emailcharter.org <--- Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry PLEIAD lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

June 11, 2014

Gradualtalk

by Bob Williams

I am trying to look at the annotation typing used in Gradualtalk, but I am having no success. I download the gradualtalk. zip and what I think is the correct Cog VM, but when I run Croquet I do not see any window; I do see the application running in the Task Manager. I am trying to install it on a computer running Windows Vista. The files in the Gradualtalk directory are: Croquet.exe created 4 Oct 2010 Croquet.ini Croquet.map Gradualtalk.changes created 3 12 2013 Gradualtalk.image PharoDebug.log SqueadFFIPrims.dll stderr Win32OSProcessPlugin.dll Both stderr and PharoDebug.log were created when I attempted the run. The PharoDebug.log has the following: THERE_BE_DRAGONS_HERE ==== Startup Error: MessageNotUnderstood: receiver of "do:" is nil 11 June 2014 9:36:03.002 am VM: Win32 - IX86 - 6.0 - Any help would be appreciated. Would I have more success on a Mac? bw PS: Will the annotation typing be included in a future Pharo releases?

June 11, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Coding by sending messages

by Andrew Glynn

The VisualAge series from IBM (Instantiations now owns the Smalltalk variant) used a very visual programming metaphor for Smalltalk, C++ and Java. C++ and Java programmers tended to not like the fact that ENVY was used for code, rather than the file system, and that kind of "if you don't act like it's 1978, you're not a real coder) is a big part of the problem in popularizing decent tools. The Java variant was replaced by Eclipse, which initially had about a quarter of the features and used 10x the memory. The C++ variant is I believe only still available on AIX. All of the versions were themselves written in Smalltalk. -- Andrew Glynn 512-818-3291 Hello, The problem is that in most cases non text editor based IDE are not user- friendly/hard to understand/hard to use. We are moving toward AST based tools software side but it will still be a textEditor for the user interface. I remember there may be something similar to what you are looking for here (Gaucho IDE): http://www.inf.usi.ch/phd/olivero/gaucho/home.html[1] In addition there is the Smart Browser that will be introduced at ESUG (http://vimeo.com/96091089[2]) tht may be related to what you want. People are working on it currently. But perhaps these 2 projects are quite different. 2014-06-11 11:31 GMT+02:00 Matthew Chadwick <post(a)celeriac.net[3]>: hello, It's interesting that in Smalltalk, coding is still done via a text editor, not by sending messages to objects (except in the background, parsing & compiling etc). I've been playing with coding by messaging nodes in the AST with a view to coding this way via Roassal graph visualizations of object dependencies combined with some nice graphical tools. Has any work on this way of coding been done before ? What I have in mind is a keyboard-centric, fast system designed as an alternative to the text editor, with a focus on top-down style coding. -------- [1] http://www.inf.usi.ch/phd/olivero/gaucho/home.html [2] http://vimeo.com/96091089 [3] mailto:post@celeriac.net

June 11, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Coding by sending messages

by ClÃ©ment Bera

Hello, The problem is that in most cases non text editor based IDE are not user-friendly/hard to understand/hard to use. We are moving toward AST based tools software side but it will still be a textEditor for the user interface. I remember there may be something similar to what you are looking for here (Gaucho IDE): http://www.inf.usi.ch/phd/olivero/gaucho/home.html In addition there is the Smart Browser that will be introduced at ESUG ( http://vimeo.com/96091089) tht may be related to what you want. People are working on it currently. But perhaps these 2 projects are quite different. 2014-06-11 11:31 GMT+02:00 Matthew Chadwick <post(a)celeriac.net>: > hello, > > It's interesting that in Smalltalk, coding is still done via a text > editor, not by sending messages to objects (except in the background, > parsing & compiling etc). I've been playing with coding by messaging nodes > in the AST with a view to coding this way via Roassal graph visualizations > of object dependencies combined with some nice graphical tools. Has any > work on this way of coding been done before ? What I have in mind is a > keyboard-centric, fast system designed as an alternative to the text > editor, with a focus on top-down style coding. >

June 11, 2014

Coding by sending messages

by Matthew Chadwick

hello, It's interesting that in Smalltalk, coding is still done via a text editor, not by sending messages to objects (except in the background, parsing & compiling etc). I've been playing with coding by messaging nodes in the AST with a view to coding this way via Roassal graph visualizations of object dependencies combined with some nice graphical tools. Has any work on this way of coding been done before ? What I have in mind is a keyboard-centric, fast system designed as an alternative to the text editor, with a focus on top-down style coding.

June 11, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Another Pharo based solution released

by Thushar G R

Congrats, Keep up the good work!! *G R Thushar* On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 1:39 AM, phil(a)highoctane.be <phil(a)highoctane.be> wrote: > Congratulations! > Le 9 juin 2014 20:35, "Sven Van Caekenberghe" <sven(a)stfx.eu> a Ã©crit : > > Nice to see that things are going well, keep it up ! >> >> On 09 Jun 2014, at 20:22, Esteban A. Maringolo <emaringolo(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> > Last Friday my company released a new software solution that involves >> > Pharo in the server side. >> > >> > It consists of a Android based app running on tablets, used for the >> > showcase and sales of products during expos (of retail companies), >> > backed by a Pharo server through a REST API, and with a Seaside based >> > admin/users web. >> > >> > The first expo was during the last weekend (fri-sun), and it involved >> > the sales of a large number of orders and products (I can't disclose >> > the numbers). >> > The scale of the solution/user base is small, far from being "cloud >> > scale", but it is for one of the largest consumer goods manufacturer >> > (and the one who sold the most during the expo). >> > Anyhow, the server handled all the request perfectly, without a single >> glitch. >> > >> > We already have some future expos scheduled. So it will continue to >> > run along the already running Pharo based solution in the same >> > company. >> > >> > Best regards! >> > >> > Esteban A. Maringolo >> > >> >> >> >>

June 11, 2014

CFP - IWST 2014 - Deadline Extension - June, 22

by jannik laval

Dear smalltalkers, we decided to extend the deadline for submitting contributions to IWST. The new deadline is set to *22nd June, 2014*. ************************************************************ ************************************************ [Please accept our apologies if you receive multiple copies of this call] [Please send to interested colleagues / mailing-lists] ************************************************************************************************************ CALL FOR PAPERS IWST14 â International Workshop on Smalltalk Technologies Cambridge, England; August 19, 2014 http://www.esug.org/Conferences/2014/IWST14 ************************************************************************************************************ ------------------- Goals and scopes ------------------- The goals of the workshop is to create a forum around advances or experience in Smalltalk and to trigger discussions and exchanges of ideas. The topics of your paper can be on all aspect of Smalltalk, theoretical as well as practical. Participants are invited to submit research articles or industrial papers. This year we want to open two different tracks: one research track and one industrial track with less scientific constraints. We expect papers of three kinds: Short position papers describing emerging ideas Long research papers with deeper description of experiments and of research results. Industrial papers with presentation of real and innovative Smalltalk applications; this kind of paper should enlighten why Smalltalk is really appropriate for your application. We will not enforce any length restriction. -------------------- Important Dates -------------------- Submission deadline: June 15, 2014 Notification deadline: July 15, 2014 Workshop : August 19, 2014 All accepted papers will be published in ACM DL (To be confirmed) ------------------- Topics ------------------- We welcome contributions on all aspects, theoretical as well as practical, of Smalltalk related topics such as: Aspect-oriented programming, Design patterns, Experience reports, Frameworks, Implementation, new dialects or languages implemented in Smalltalk, Interaction with other languages, Meta-programming and Meta-modeling, Tools ------------------- Best Paper Award ------------------- To encourage the submission of high-quality papers, the IWST organizing committee is very proud to announce a Best Paper Award for this edition of IWST. We thank Lam Research Corporation for its financial contribution that makes it possible a price for the three best papers: 1000 USD for first place, 600 USD for second place and 400 USD for third place. The ranking will be decided by the program committee during the review process. The awards will be given during the ESUG conference social event. The Best Paper Award will take place only with a minimum of six submissions. Notice also that to be illegible, a paper must be presented at the workshop by one of the author and that the presenting author must be registered at the ESUG conference. ------------------- Publication ------------------- Both submissions and final papers must be prepared using the ACM SIGPLAN 10 point format. Templates for Word and LaTeX are available at http://www.acm.org/sigs/sigplan/authorInformation.htm. This site also contains links to useful informations on how to write effective submissions. ------------------- Submission ------------------- All submissions must be sent via easychair: https://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=iwst2014 ------------------- Program chairs ------------------- Alain Plantec (UMR 6265 Lab-STICC, University of Brest, France) Jannik Laval (Ecole des Mines de Douai, France) -- ~~Jannik Laval~~ Ãcole des Mines de Douai Enseignant-chercheur http://www.jannik-laval.eu http://www.phratch.com http://car.mines-douai.fr/

June 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] How to encrypt a stream?

by Frank

Thanks Alejandro, I gonna try it Cheers Frank Alejandro Infante wrote > My bad, the configuration is called ApplicationSecurity, which includes > Nacl and Cryptography. > > Cheers > > On Jun 8, 2014, at 8:39 PM, Alejandro Infante < > alejandroinfante91@ > > wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Have you seen the Cryptography package, you can get it by downloading >> Nacl from Configuration Browser. It implements RC4 which is a Stream >> Cipher, but seems that a little bit of work is needed in order to use it >> on a Stream since it receives a ByteArray. >> >> Cheers, >> Alejandro >> >> On Jun 7, 2014, at 2:54 PM, Frank < > frank.martino.sm@ > > wrote: >> >>> Hi folks, >>> >>> I need to encrypt a stream. >>> >>> I want to write a file like: >>> StandardFileStream fileNamed: 'encryptedfile' do: [:str | str >>> nextPutAll: >>> 'string to be encrypted']. >>> >>> of course the file is in plain text :-) >>> >>> It would be wonderful if I can write something like: >>> EncrypedFileStream fileNamed: 'encryptedfile' do: [:str | str >>> nextPutAll: >>> 'string to be encrypted'] using: 'AES' andPassword: '12345' >>> >>> Can you help me, please? >>> >>> Cheers >>> Frank >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> View this message in context: >>> http://forum.world.st/How-to-encrypt-a-stream-tp4762022.html >>> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >>> >> -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/How-to-encrypt-a-stream-tp4762022p4762484.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

June 10, 2014

Typo in RenoirSt configuration

by Stephan Eggermont

Repo is not writable.

June 10, 2014

Grease 1.0.10 build on CI removed

by Stephan Eggermont

I have removed the 1.0.10 version of Grease build on https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/Grease/ Please let me know if it needs to be fixed to work on Pharo 4. Pharo 2, 3 and 4 builds are green. Stephan

June 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Another Pharo based solution released

by phil＠highoctane.be

Congratulations! Le 9 juin 2014 20:35, "Sven Van Caekenberghe" <sven(a)stfx.eu> a Ã©crit : > Nice to see that things are going well, keep it up ! > > On 09 Jun 2014, at 20:22, Esteban A. Maringolo <emaringolo(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Last Friday my company released a new software solution that involves > > Pharo in the server side. > > > > It consists of a Android based app running on tablets, used for the > > showcase and sales of products during expos (of retail companies), > > backed by a Pharo server through a REST API, and with a Seaside based > > admin/users web. > > > > The first expo was during the last weekend (fri-sun), and it involved > > the sales of a large number of orders and products (I can't disclose > > the numbers). > > The scale of the solution/user base is small, far from being "cloud > > scale", but it is for one of the largest consumer goods manufacturer > > (and the one who sold the most during the expo). > > Anyhow, the server handled all the request perfectly, without a single > glitch. > > > > We already have some future expos scheduled. So it will continue to > > run along the already running Pharo based solution in the same > > company. > > > > Best regards! > > > > Esteban A. Maringolo > > > > > >

June 9, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Another Pharo based solution released

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Nice to see that things are going well, keep it up ! On 09 Jun 2014, at 20:22, Esteban A. Maringolo <emaringolo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Last Friday my company released a new software solution that involves > Pharo in the server side. > > It consists of a Android based app running on tablets, used for the > showcase and sales of products during expos (of retail companies), > backed by a Pharo server through a REST API, and with a Seaside based > admin/users web. > > The first expo was during the last weekend (fri-sun), and it involved > the sales of a large number of orders and products (I can't disclose > the numbers). > The scale of the solution/user base is small, far from being "cloud > scale", but it is for one of the largest consumer goods manufacturer > (and the one who sold the most during the expo). > Anyhow, the server handled all the request perfectly, without a single glitch. > > We already have some future expos scheduled. So it will continue to > run along the already running Pharo based solution in the same > company. > > Best regards! > > Esteban A. Maringolo >

June 9, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Another Pharo based solution released

by Johan Fabry

Cool, congratulations! Time for a âsuccess storyâ on the website? On Jun 9, 2014, at 2:22 PM, Esteban A. Maringolo <emaringolo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Last Friday my company released a new software solution that involves > Pharo in the server side. > > It consists of a Android based app running on tablets, used for the > showcase and sales of products during expos (of retail companies), > backed by a Pharo server through a REST API, and with a Seaside based > admin/users web. > > The first expo was during the last weekend (fri-sun), and it involved > the sales of a large number of orders and products (I can't disclose > the numbers). > The scale of the solution/user base is small, far from being "cloud > scale", but it is for one of the largest consumer goods manufacturer > (and the one who sold the most during the expo). > Anyhow, the server handled all the request perfectly, without a single glitch. > > We already have some future expos scheduled. So it will continue to > run along the already running Pharo based solution in the same > company. > > Best regards! > > Esteban A. Maringolo > > ---> Save our in-boxes! http://emailcharter.org <--- Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry PLEIAD lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

June 9, 2014

Another Pharo based solution released

by Esteban A. Maringolo

Last Friday my company released a new software solution that involves Pharo in the server side. It consists of a Android based app running on tablets, used for the showcase and sales of products during expos (of retail companies), backed by a Pharo server through a REST API, and with a Seaside based admin/users web. The first expo was during the last weekend (fri-sun), and it involved the sales of a large number of orders and products (I can't disclose the numbers). The scale of the solution/user base is small, far from being "cloud scale", but it is for one of the largest consumer goods manufacturer (and the one who sold the most during the expo). Anyhow, the server handled all the request perfectly, without a single glitch. We already have some future expos scheduled. So it will continue to run along the already running Pharo based solution in the same company. Best regards! Esteban A. Maringolo

June 9, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Slots

by Johan Fabry

On Jun 9, 2014, at 8:28 AM, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: > In general, I do not think that we should make Pharo more static. To the extreme opposite, we should explore what a dynamic > (reflective, late bound) system can do that a static one can not doâ¦ and this means actually using the dynamic features > (in a controlled way) even in deployment. +1 on that. The dynamism of Smalltalk always and forever is a powerful too that we should not have to do without. > Of course this might mean that we can not be everything for everyone. But do we really want that? E.g. Is it the goal to be > a perfect development system for todayâs resource constrained mircro controllers? Or should we not better explore what the > new embedded world that already starts to show will get from a more dynamic point of view? In the super constrained micro controllers development is typically some C-like thingy (hacked together), we should not try to change those customs and that culture, thatâs not realistic. The new embedded world is indeed the place to go. For example, the raspberry pi running Pharo, that kind of hardware is becoming really wide-spread now. Other example is the Parrot AR Drone quadcopter, thatâs a FLYING embedded system that has a 32 bit ARM Cortex A8 processor @ 800MHz, 1GB DDR2 RAM, WIFI and runs Linux 2.6.x. â¦ while it is flying â¦ Now thatâs cool! :-) > The real challenge of embedded is the embedded nature, we now see a class of embedded systems that have *real* resources > and that are actually always network connected. > Here we can (we must!) take a complete different point of view to the standard âas static as possible, we have no resourcesâ view that > people focus on now. Even the parrot drone is always network connected â¦ its remote control is over wifi :-) ---> Save our in-boxes! http://emailcharter.org <--- Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry PLEIAD lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

June 9, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Emails

by Bernat Romagosa

Check out world.st, all smalltalk lists are accessible there in a forum-like fashion. On Jun 9, 2014 3:25 PM, "Bob Williams" <rwilliams19(a)cox.net> wrote: > This may sound stupid, but I want to answer a specific email and all I > have is the Pharo-user Digest. When I started following Pharo I had a link > to a Web page that showed the emails by subject and author; however, I seem > to have lost that link. All I have now is the digest and the archives. Can > anyone help me? >

June 9, 2014

Emails

by Bob Williams

This may sound stupid, but I want to answer a specific email and all I have is the Pharo-user Digest. When I started following Pharo I had a link to a Web page that showed the emails by subject and author; however, I seem to have lost that link. All I have now is the digest and the archives. Can anyone help me?

June 9, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Slots

by Marcus Denker

On 09 Jun 2014, at 14:20, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > On 09 Jun 2014, at 13:55, Bob Williams <rwilliams19(a)cox.net> wrote: > >> Camille and Marcus, thank you for your response. I thought something was missing, so the testing of Slots will be shelved for now; however, while it is in the planning stage, I would like to add some thoughts on targets and deliverable products (applications). >> >> I agree that most devices like the iPad and iPhone would not be suitable for development, they should be targets for application development and I would expand that list to include all devices, even micro-controllers. Look at the development process for the iPad and iPhone, the programming is done on a Mac using Xcode and testing is done first on the simulator running on the Mac and latter on the actual device. I find the Xcode environment inferior to Smalltalk's and by no stretch of the imagination is Objective-C a good substitute for Smalltalk. I think that development of application programs could be done far better with Smalltalk, provided that some tools were added to Smalltalk. Why not have the view, if it can be programmed in C then it can be programmed in Smalltalk. >> >> I think that the application process should be viewed as a series of steps culminating in the production of a product for sale or distribution: develop and test the program logic, test using constraints imposed by the target device, performance testing, test on the target device, and package for sale or distribution. A good examples of the second step where the constraints of the target is imposed are the word size and floating-point precision differences found in the target. If the development of the application is on a 64-bit computer then integer and floating-point calculated must be simulated for targets with smaller word size and for 32-bit floating-point or no floating-point processor. >> >> Implicit in those steps is the notion a gradual typing, the first uses the Smalltalk model to generically test the logic of the program, while the final step would require a fully compiled executable for some of the targets. I would argue that one reason that Smalltalk was not a commercial success was that you could not provide a fully compiled executable to the customer. The tools that the Smalltalk environment provides makes it a very productive application development environment, but of what use are they to the end user of the application, say a clerk or a business executive: why should any of the development tools be in the final product? >> >> It is clear that Slots will be used in the enforcement of typing at the instance variable level, but what about temporary variables? Can a compiler (machine not bytecode) be developed if temporary variables are not typed? Then there is the question of how to handle the elements of heterogeneous collections. >> >> I have more thoughts, but the above are related to Slots. Any comments? >> > > I donât think that the main power of Slots if typingâ¦ its more slots with behavioural changes or meta data. > Slots can be used for providing typed slots, but these would just do a runtime check, slowing down everything. > Itâs much more interesting for things like ProperySlots, BooleanSlots (which would be very memory efficient, typing > would be just a side effect). > > For typing, the actually annotations (of ivars, temps, and casting of expressions, return typesâ¦) is not that problemâ¦designing > a good type system is the real thing, e.g.: > > http://rmod.inria.fr/web/publications/bib?query=Alle13a&display=abstract > In general, I do not think that we should make Pharo more static. To the extreme opposite, we should explore what a dynamic (reflective, late bound) system can do that a static one can not doâ¦ and this means actually using the dynamic features (in a controlled way) even in deployment. Of course this might mean that we can not be everything for everyone. But do we really want that? E.g. Is it the goal to be a perfect development system for todayâs resource constrained mircro controllers? Or should we not better explore what the new embedded world that already starts to show will get from a more dynamic point of view? The real challenge of embedded is the embedded nature, we now see a class of embedded systems that have *real* resources and that are actually always network connected. Here we can (we must!) take a complete different point of view to the standard âas static as possible, we have no resourcesâ view that people focus on now. Marcus

June 9, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Slots

by Marcus Denker

On 09 Jun 2014, at 13:55, Bob Williams <rwilliams19(a)cox.net> wrote: > Camille and Marcus, thank you for your response. I thought something was missing, so the testing of Slots will be shelved for now; however, while it is in the planning stage, I would like to add some thoughts on targets and deliverable products (applications). > > I agree that most devices like the iPad and iPhone would not be suitable for development, they should be targets for application development and I would expand that list to include all devices, even micro-controllers. Look at the development process for the iPad and iPhone, the programming is done on a Mac using Xcode and testing is done first on the simulator running on the Mac and latter on the actual device. I find the Xcode environment inferior to Smalltalk's and by no stretch of the imagination is Objective-C a good substitute for Smalltalk. I think that development of application programs could be done far better with Smalltalk, provided that some tools were added to Smalltalk. Why not have the view, if it can be programmed in C then it can be programmed in Smalltalk. > > I think that the application process should be viewed as a series of steps culminating in the production of a product for sale or distribution: develop and test the program logic, test using constraints imposed by the target device, performance testing, test on the target device, and package for sale or distribution. A good examples of the second step where the constraints of the target is imposed are the word size and floating-point precision differences found in the target. If the development of the application is on a 64-bit computer then integer and floating-point calculated must be simulated for targets with smaller word size and for 32-bit floating-point or no floating-point processor. > > Implicit in those steps is the notion a gradual typing, the first uses the Smalltalk model to generically test the logic of the program, while the final step would require a fully compiled executable for some of the targets. I would argue that one reason that Smalltalk was not a commercial success was that you could not provide a fully compiled executable to the customer. The tools that the Smalltalk environment provides makes it a very productive application development environment, but of what use are they to the end user of the application, say a clerk or a business executive: why should any of the development tools be in the final product? > > It is clear that Slots will be used in the enforcement of typing at the instance variable level, but what about temporary variables? Can a compiler (machine not bytecode) be developed if temporary variables are not typed? Then there is the question of how to handle the elements of heterogeneous collections. > > I have more thoughts, but the above are related to Slots. Any comments? > I donât think that the main power of Slots if typingâ¦ its more slots with behavioural changes or meta data. Slots can be used for providing typed slots, but these would just do a runtime check, slowing down everything. Itâs much more interesting for things like ProperySlots, BooleanSlots (which would be very memory efficient, typing would be just a side effect). For typing, the actually annotations (of ivars, temps, and casting of expressions, return typesâ¦) is not that problemâ¦designing a good type system is the real thing, e.g.: http://rmod.inria.fr/web/publications/bib?query=Alle13a&display=abstract Marcus

June 9, 2014

Slots

by Bob Williams

Camille and Marcus, thank you for your response. I thought something was missing, so the testing of Slots will be shelved for now; however, while it is in the planning stage, I would like to add some thoughts on targets and deliverable products (applications). I agree that most devices like the iPad and iPhone would not be suitable for development, they should be targets for application development and I would expand that list to include all devices, even micro-controllers. Look at the development process for the iPad and iPhone, the programming is done on a Mac using Xcode and testing is done first on the simulator running on the Mac and latter on the actual device. I find the Xcode environment inferior to Smalltalk's and by no stretch of the imagination is Objective-C a good substitute for Smalltalk. I think that development of application programs could be done far better with Smalltalk, provided that some tools were added to Smalltalk. Why not have the view, if it can be programmed in C then it can be programmed in Smalltalk. I think that the application process should be viewed as a series of steps culminating in the production of a product for sale or distribution: develop and test the program logic, test using constraints imposed by the target device, performance testing, test on the target device, and package for sale or distribution. A good examples of the second step where the constraints of the target is imposed are the word size and floating-point precision differences found in the target. If the development of the application is on a 64-bit computer then integer and floating-point calculated must be simulated for targets with smaller word size and for 32-bit floating-point or no floating-point processor. Implicit in those steps is the notion a gradual typing, the first uses the Smalltalk model to generically test the logic of the program, while the final step would require a fully compiled executable for some of the targets. I would argue that one reason that Smalltalk was not a commercial success was that you could not provide a fully compiled executable to the customer. The tools that the Smalltalk environment provides makes it a very productive application development environment, but of what use are they to the end user of the application, say a clerk or a business executive: why should any of the development tools be in the final product? It is clear that Slots will be used in the enforcement of typing at the instance variable level, but what about temporary variables? Can a compiler (machine not bytecode) be developed if temporary variables are not typed? Then there is the question of how to handle the elements of heterogeneous collections. I have more thoughts, but the above are related to Slots. Any comments? bw

June 9, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Custom layout in Spec

by Benjamin

On 08 Jun 2014, at 15:21, webwarrior <reg(a)webwarrior.ws> wrote: > I want to make a layout based on TableLayout. Short answer: itâs not really supported yet. If you want to give it a try, itâs really welcome ;) > However, I noticed that SpecInterpreter has some hardcoded behaviour for > ContainerModel in computeSpecFrom:selector: method. Is this behaviour really > important, and if yes, how can I replicate it? Itâs really needed (even thought I do not remember why exactly now (but I think itâs to prevent some infinite loops)). The solution as I was thinking about it would be to have a different keyword per layout. Today, you start your layout with `SpecLayout composed`, where it could be `SpecLayout table`. Or it could be `SpecTableLayout composed`. The main issue you will have is that Spec does not directly rely on Morphic layouts. So you will have to implement some layouting algorithm by yourself. Hope it helps, Ben

June 9, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Custom layout in Spec

by Johan Fabry

I have been able to get size respecting behavior using rows and columns, by giving newColumn:width: and newRow:width. Combined with splitters (the addSplitter message) this has worked well for me (modulo some bugs). If you need more complex behavior than that Iâm afraid I cannot help you. On Jun 8, 2014, at 3:39 PM, webwarrior <reg(a)webwarrior.ws> wrote: > My main requirements are such that container respects sizes and resizing > behaviour (hResizing, vResizing) of its child elements. > > Proportional layout doesn't allow that. > > And yes, I've read Spec documentation and some Morphic documentation. > > > > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Custom-layout-in-Spec-tp4762142p4762213.html > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > ---> Save our in-boxes! http://emailcharter.org <--- Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry PLEIAD lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

June 8, 2014