December 2014 - Pharo-users

Re: [Pharo-users] [Pharo-dev] [Moose-dev] [ann] gtspotter: a moldable interface for spotting objects

by Tudor Girba

Hi Sven, Exactly! :) To be relevant, we had to show how it solves existing use cases (plus a bit more :)). Next we will focus on objects that are less "code". The hard part of actually getting the interface smooth and performant was kind of done. It's play time now :). As I noted in the post, we already have some 30 extensions for handling these cases. This was actually easy. The menu is an example of how we used this concept to approach a problem that is classically dealt with in a completely different way. There are a couple of things we did not show yet. For example, we already have a simple implementation of how to make a Moose model completely browseable through this interface. But, as with the inspector, the coolest thing is that if someone has a specific need, it is even simpler than with the inspector to hook that need in the system and make it searchable. Your list is definitely exciting, and I am hoping that people will start playing a bit and discover things we otherwise would not consider. It should be easier than with the inspector (because there are less things to specify, hence less variation). And wait to see what happens when we start to combine this interface with others. For example, the interesting thing about being able to search a menu is that you can actually open any menu with a spotter, which essentially has the potential of changing the way we deal with contextual actions (all through keybindings without shortcuts). I am quite sure we are just scratching the surface of what is possible. So, let's play together :). Cheers, Doru On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 10:35 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > Doru, > > One of the things/aspects that I miss a bit is the 'objects' part. In your > overall description/presentation you talk about 'objects', but right now I > would say it are mainly 'code objects' like classes & methods and friends, > and some IDE artefacts, like menus. > > What about arbitrary (user) objects ? > > Literal constants, like 123, 'some string' ? > Globals like the Transcript ? > Singletons accessible by class side accessors, like announcers ? > An evaluation functionality, just type an expression ? > Examples ? > The clipboard (contents), open windows, processes, ... > > Anyway, I am sure you get the idea ;-) > > Sven > > > On 07 Dec 2014, at 19:07, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > > > Hi Sven, > > > > Thanks for the kind words. Indeed, having the current selection is one > of the things we should keep in mind. For that we need to go to the next > step and integrate the interface in the overall environment. This will > certainly come. > > > > Cheers, > > Doru > > > > > > > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 6:57 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> > wrote: > > > > > On 07 Dec 2014, at 14:14, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > > > > > Alex Syrel, Andrei Chis and I are happy to announce a new addition to > the Glamorous Toolkit: > > > GTSpotter, a novel interface for spotting objects. > > > > Excellent work, all around. Congratulations to the team. Thank you for > pushing things like this, for thinking differently. > > > > Yes, I want this in Pharo 4 too, ASAP (especially since the main > shortcut is different from the old one, cmd+Enter vs. shift+Enter). > > > > The presentation is again very well done too: excellent article, super > movie. You are putting the bar very high for the rest of us ;-) > > > > A suggestion/idea: would it be possible to take the current selection > anywhere and feed it into Spotter ? That way there would be very good way > to make it replace all the other shortcuts: you would get implementers, > senders, references almost for free. > > > > Sven > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > www.tudorgirba.com > > > > "Every thing has its own flow" > > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] [Pharo-dev] [Moose-dev] [ann] gtspotter: a moldable interface for spotting objects

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Doru, One of the things/aspects that I miss a bit is the 'objects' part. In your overall description/presentation you talk about 'objects', but right now I would say it are mainly 'code objects' like classes & methods and friends, and some IDE artefacts, like menus. What about arbitrary (user) objects ? Literal constants, like 123, 'some string' ? Globals like the Transcript ? Singletons accessible by class side accessors, like announcers ? An evaluation functionality, just type an expression ? Examples ? The clipboard (contents), open windows, processes, ... Anyway, I am sure you get the idea ;-) Sven > On 07 Dec 2014, at 19:07, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > Hi Sven, > > Thanks for the kind words. Indeed, having the current selection is one of the things we should keep in mind. For that we need to go to the next step and integrate the interface in the overall environment. This will certainly come. > > Cheers, > Doru > > > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 6:57 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > > On 07 Dec 2014, at 14:14, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > > > Alex Syrel, Andrei Chis and I are happy to announce a new addition to the Glamorous Toolkit: > > GTSpotter, a novel interface for spotting objects. > > Excellent work, all around. Congratulations to the team. Thank you for pushing things like this, for thinking differently. > > Yes, I want this in Pharo 4 too, ASAP (especially since the main shortcut is different from the old one, cmd+Enter vs. shift+Enter). > > The presentation is again very well done too: excellent article, super movie. You are putting the bar very high for the rest of us ;-) > > A suggestion/idea: would it be possible to take the current selection anywhere and feed it into Spotter ? That way there would be very good way to make it replace all the other shortcuts: you would get implementers, senders, references almost for free. > > Sven > > > > > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > > "Every thing has its own flow"

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Emergency evaluator and GTGenericStackDebugger

by Tudor Girba

You can actually do the same in Pharo 3 as well. Doru On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 9:31 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: > Hi, > > what image do you use? > If it is pharo4, you can open the settings (World menu>System>Settings) > and disable GT playground and inspector (Glamorous Toolkit settings) > > > > > 2014-12-07 6:08 GMT+01:00 Edward Povazan <empovazan(a)gmail.com>: > >> Hello, >> >> Iâve been using Pharo for a while as my playground for trying things out, >> itâs a very soothing place to code and figure out algorithms (except that >> when I return to my âreal worldâ, the friction with modern tools is >> amplified). Iâm still a newb when it comes to knowing how things work >> deeper down. >> >> Iâm a little stuck. I did something (canât remember) and not realizing >> that I had a problem, saved my image too. >> Now when I try open a Workspace, I get a *** System error handling failed >> *** with a huge amount of text. >> >> Iâve uploaded a screen grab here: http://imgur.com/4ZwsF6e >> >> Is this worth debugging? >> >> My plan is to install the origin tools, and remove GToolkit. And then >> reinstall GToolkit. >> Would this help? >> >> And, how? I realize I donât know what tools are in the default Pharo3 >> image! >> Can someone tell me what they are called? >> >> Thanks! Canât wait to get back to the happy place! >> -Ed >> > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] Emergency evaluator and GTGenericStackDebugger

by Nicolai Hess

Hi, what image do you use? If it is pharo4, you can open the settings (World menu>System>Settings) and disable GT playground and inspector (Glamorous Toolkit settings) 2014-12-07 6:08 GMT+01:00 Edward Povazan <empovazan(a)gmail.com>: > Hello, > > Iâve been using Pharo for a while as my playground for trying things out, > itâs a very soothing place to code and figure out algorithms (except that > when I return to my âreal worldâ, the friction with modern tools is > amplified). Iâm still a newb when it comes to knowing how things work > deeper down. > > Iâm a little stuck. I did something (canât remember) and not realizing > that I had a problem, saved my image too. > Now when I try open a Workspace, I get a *** System error handling failed > *** with a huge amount of text. > > Iâve uploaded a screen grab here: http://imgur.com/4ZwsF6e > > Is this worth debugging? > > My plan is to install the origin tools, and remove GToolkit. And then > reinstall GToolkit. > Would this help? > > And, how? I realize I donât know what tools are in the default Pharo3 > image! > Can someone tell me what they are called? > > Thanks! Canât wait to get back to the happy place! > -Ed >

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] [Esug-list] [ann] gtspotter: a moldable interface for spotting objects

by Tudor Girba

Hi Thierry, What I meant is that no IDE I know allows you to refine search through arbitrary levels of nesting. For example, looking for senders, filter, implementors, filter, senders, filter ... Is the AltBrowser able to do that? If so, I missed this one. Cheers, Doru On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 4:00 PM, Thierry Goubier <thierry.goubier(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > 2014-12-07 15:56 GMT+01:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>: > >> Thanks, Stef. >> >> On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 2:35 PM, stephane ducasse < >> stephane.ducasse(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Last time I found myself looking for the sender of x but only inside the >>> implementor of y. >>> and of course I wanted to refactored them. And the default message >>> browser is not parametrized via an environment :_ >>> >> >> Exactly. This problem exists in any IDE I know. >> > > AltBrowser has that type of search builtin. Not the refactoring step, > still. > > RBEnvironment allows that easily, it's just that the tools are not > designed for it. > > Thierry > > >> >> Doru >> >> >>> Stef >>> >>> On 07 Dec 2014, at 05:14, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Alex Syrel, Andrei Chis and I are happy to announce a new addition to >>> the Glamorous Toolkit: >>> GTSpotter, a novel interface for spotting objects. >>> >>> GTSpotter has two goals: >>> - Provide a uniform yet moldable interface that can work on any object, >>> and >>> - Handle searching through arbitrary levels of object nesting. >>> >>> We think this will have a significant impact on the development workflow >>> in Pharo. >>> >>> Here is a couple of screenshots: >>> <gtspotter-packages-classes.png> >>> <gtspotter-dive-class-method-sender.png> <gtspotter-playground.png> >>> >>> >>> A trailer is available here: >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhSmjR3NOlU >>> >>> A detailed description is available here: >>> http://www.humane-assessment.com/blog/introducing-gtspotter >>> >>> It works already in Pharo 3.0 and can be played with by following the >>> instructions from: >>> http://gt.moosetechnology.org >>> >>> Please let us know what you think. >>> >>> Enjoy, >>> The Glamorous Team >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Esug-list mailing list >>> Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org >>> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> >> "Every thing has its own flow" >> > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] [ann] gtspotter: a moldable interface for spotting objects

by Tudor Girba

Hi, On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 3:52 PM, Thierry Goubier <thierry.goubier(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Cool. > > Interesting. I recognize some of the patterns I use, but in a slightly > different form. > Could you detail? I am asking because I am interesting in search use cases to see if they can be expressed in terms of Spotter of if we need to extend the interface in some way. GTSpotter is supposed to be moldable thus, it is important for it to handle as many use cases as possible. > The widget look very nice and clean. I'd worry about having a very long > top-level list, and I know that some of the search patterns are a bit less > efficient than what I use today. > What do you mean by long top-level lists? Do you refer to categories for which a query can show many results? In this case, our interface always limits the amount per category to 5. After reaching 5 items, the rest is being computed in a process with lower priority so as not to mess too much with the responsiveness of the UI. If you want to see more than 5, you can always dive in the category and then you focus only on that category. It seems to work well enough. You should also take into account that most widgets you see are hand-made in a lighter Morphic (called Brick) created by Alex Syrel. The goal of this one is to be fast and scalable. Does that answer the question? I'm impressed by the amount of work going into that. > Thanks. Indeed, the work was quite intensive and we went through 3 major variations of the implementations. Cheers, Doru > > Thierry > > 2014-12-07 14:14 GMT+01:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>: > >> Hi, >> >> Alex Syrel, Andrei Chis and I are happy to announce a new addition to the >> Glamorous Toolkit: >> GTSpotter, a novel interface for spotting objects. >> >> GTSpotter has two goals: >> - Provide a uniform yet moldable interface that can work on any object, >> and >> - Handle searching through arbitrary levels of object nesting. >> >> We think this will have a significant impact on the development workflow >> in Pharo. >> >> Here is a couple of screenshots: >> [image: Inline image 2] [image: Inline image 1] [image: Inline image 3] >> >> >> A trailer is available here: >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhSmjR3NOlU >> >> A detailed description is available here: >> http://www.humane-assessment.com/blog/introducing-gtspotter >> >> It works already in Pharo 3.0 and can be played with by following the >> instructions from: >> http://gt.moosetechnology.org >> >> Please let us know what you think. >> >> Enjoy, >> The Glamorous Team >> > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] [Pharo-dev] [Moose-dev] [ann] gtspotter: a moldable interface for spotting objects

by Tudor Girba

Hi Sven, Thanks for the kind words. Indeed, having the current selection is one of the things we should keep in mind. For that we need to go to the next step and integrate the interface in the overall environment. This will certainly come. Cheers, Doru On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 6:57 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > > On 07 Dec 2014, at 14:14, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > > > Alex Syrel, Andrei Chis and I are happy to announce a new addition to > the Glamorous Toolkit: > > GTSpotter, a novel interface for spotting objects. > > Excellent work, all around. Congratulations to the team. Thank you for > pushing things like this, for thinking differently. > > Yes, I want this in Pharo 4 too, ASAP (especially since the main shortcut > is different from the old one, cmd+Enter vs. shift+Enter). > > The presentation is again very well done too: excellent article, super > movie. You are putting the bar very high for the rest of us ;-) > > A suggestion/idea: would it be possible to take the current selection > anywhere and feed it into Spotter ? That way there would be very good way > to make it replace all the other shortcuts: you would get implementers, > senders, references almost for free. > > Sven > > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] [Moose-dev] [ann] gtspotter: a moldable interface for spotting objects

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

> On 07 Dec 2014, at 14:14, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > Alex Syrel, Andrei Chis and I are happy to announce a new addition to the Glamorous Toolkit: > GTSpotter, a novel interface for spotting objects. Excellent work, all around. Congratulations to the team. Thank you for pushing things like this, for thinking differently. Yes, I want this in Pharo 4 too, ASAP (especially since the main shortcut is different from the old one, cmd+Enter vs. shift+Enter). The presentation is again very well done too: excellent article, super movie. You are putting the bar very high for the rest of us ;-) A suggestion/idea: would it be possible to take the current selection anywhere and feed it into Spotter ? That way there would be very good way to make it replace all the other shortcuts: you would get implementers, senders, references almost for free. Sven

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] [Esug-list] [ann] gtspotter: a moldable interface for spotting objects

by Tudor Girba

:) I know how this feels. On the other hand, with this one we target 15 minutes (= the coffee break) :) Doru On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 4:20 PM, stephane ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)gmail.com > wrote: > > Hi, > > This is indeed a significant challenge. Until that point we need a couple > of more features, of which the most important is the preview for the > selected object. This will come and then we can consider what we can do > with it. > > But, in the meantime, there are a lot of use cases nobody ever considered > exactly because there was no easy way to consider them. Like finding all > the methods from CodeHolder* that are annotated with <systemsettings>. Or > like searching a Person in a Agenda model that someone develops. > > The cool thing is that you can program this yourself :). > > > :) > Donât get me tempted :) > > I have boring tasks to do :) > > Stef > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Dec. 7, 2014

Re: [Pharo-users] [Esug-list] [ann] gtspotter: a moldable interface for spotting objects

by Tudor Girba

Hi, This is indeed a significant challenge. Until that point we need a couple of more features, of which the most important is the preview for the selected object. This will come and then we can consider what we can do with it. But, in the meantime, there are a lot of use cases nobody ever considered exactly because there was no easy way to consider them. Like finding all the methods from CodeHolder* that are annotated with <systemsettings>. Or like searching a Person in a Agenda model that someone develops. The cool thing is that you can program this yourself :). Cheers, Doru On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 4:05 PM, stephane ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)gmail.com > wrote: > > On 07 Dec 2014, at 06:56, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > Thanks, Stef. > > On Sun, Dec 7, 2014 at 2:35 PM, stephane ducasse < > stephane.ducasse(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> Truly excellent! >> I have to try :) >> I read the blog (I love the marketing efforts and the documentation >> effort) :) >> Now do you a shortcut for finding a >> - senders? >> > - a specific method of a class? >> > > This first incarnation of the interface is meant to replace the top level > search because that was easier. There is more to come, and we definitely > will get to replace the senders, and integrate it even deeper in the > workflow > > > > A challenge that I would like to propose to the GTteam is the following > one: > > Often when I change code (for example, change the API of menus and want to > make it clean) > I look at all the senders and sender of senders and implementors and > senders â¦. > What I do is that I stack the browser in the stack where the top are the > leaves that I should treat and the next elements are the user of the > leavesâ¦. > Then what I do I have a physical stack of senders/implementors and I start > fixing the top of the stack > and I pop. > > So the old Omnibrowser based senders/implementors nevers worked to me > because I could never understand > what I was browsing (senders or implementers and where I was in the stack > or search tree). > > So my challenge is > - how can we support mixing senders and implementors taxes (not mixing the > two) > - how can we support the navigation with the tree of such tasks. > > Iâm not sure that it should be in GTSpotter and many having a tree > structure could help. > Stef > > > > >> Last time I found myself looking for the sender of x but only inside the >> implementor of y. >> and of course I wanted to refactored them. And the default message >> browser is not parametrized via an environment :_ >> > > Exactly. This problem exists in any IDE I know. > > > Really? Iâm surprised because it seems so obvious (if we had a couple > million dollarsâ¦ but we have cool guys) > > Doru > > >> Stef >> >> On 07 Dec 2014, at 05:14, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Alex Syrel, Andrei Chis and I are happy to announce a new addition to the >> Glamorous Toolkit: >> GTSpotter, a novel interface for spotting objects. >> >> GTSpotter has two goals: >> - Provide a uniform yet moldable interface that can work on any object, >> and >> - Handle searching through arbitrary levels of object nesting. >> >> We think this will have a significant impact on the development workflow >> in Pharo. >> >> Here is a couple of screenshots: >> <gtspotter-packages-classes.png> <gtspotter-dive-class-method-sender.png> >> <gtspotter-playground.png> >> >> >> A trailer is available here: >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhSmjR3NOlU >> >> A detailed description is available here: >> http://www.humane-assessment.com/blog/introducing-gtspotter >> >> It works already in Pharo 3.0 and can be played with by following the >> instructions from: >> http://gt.moosetechnology.org >> >> Please let us know what you think. >> >> Enjoy, >> The Glamorous Team >> _______________________________________________ >> Esug-list mailing list >> Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org >> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org >> >> >> > > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > > "Every thing has its own flow" > > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Dec. 7, 2014