August 2013 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by Tim Hendriks

OK Thanks a lot. I won't call super initialize on de Class side.... Don't know why.... I just don't.... simpel.... Thanks for trying to explain why. Op 20-8-2013 12:00, Esteban Lorenzano schreef: > no, you do not call super initialize in class side initialize method. > > You do not do: > > MyClass class>>#initialize > super initialize. "THIS IS BAD" > ... rest of initialization. > > we should add a Lint rule with that, btw. > > > On Aug 20, 2013, at 11:52 AM, Tim Hendriks <th72(a)dds.nl> wrote: > >> Ok, I don't want to know :-) >> >> Just as a rule: don't call super initialize on the Class site ? But I can use (the message) initialize on the Class site (for initializing applications roots in seaside for example) but just do'nt use super in it. Correct? >> >> Thanks Tim >> >> Op 20-8-2013 11:45, jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de schreef: >>> Hi Tim, >>> >>> the problem is not the send of #super to a class, but the call of #initialize of #super on the class side. >>> >>> As long as you are not interested in very confusing details about the inheritence hierarchy of Class and Metaclasses and stuff, don't ask, just do as you're told ;-) >>> You can, however, have a look at chapter 13 Classes and Metaclasses of the "Pharo By Example" book (http://pharobyexample.org) if you want to know more. >>> >>> A very short and incomplete explanation is that the superclass of a class is never the superclass of the class of its instances, because all classes are instances of the same class ( I told you you prabably don't want to know right now ;-) ). >>> >>> Joachim >>> >>> >>> Am 20.08.13 11:34, schrieb Tim Hendriks: >>>> I'am just learning (a few weeks) .... so why not use super in Class? >>>> >>>> Thanks Tim >>>> >>>> Op 20-8-2013 11:29, Igor Stasenko schreef: >>>>> Thanks for your hard work! >>>>> >>>>> 1 important remark: >>>>> NBXLibTypes class>>initialize >>>>> super initialize. >>>>> Display := #NBXLibDisplay. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Never use 'super initialize' for class initializers. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 20 August 2013 09:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost >>>>> and Windows >>>>> you can use: >>>>> >>>>> NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId >>>>> >>>>> (requires the latest packages from >>>>> http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost >>>>> <http://smalltalkhub.com/#%21/%7EPharo/NativeBoost>) >>>>> >>>>> I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get >>>>> the PID, like >>>>> getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this >>>>> tutorial: >>>>> >>>>> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… >>>>> >>>>> Bye >>>>> T. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Best regards, >>>>> Igor Stasenko. >>> >> >

Aug. 20, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by jtuchel＠objektfabrik.de

Ok, here's the mess we made ;-). We've confused you. But don't worry, you've just touched an area of Smalltalk where the boundaries between computation and magic get very blurry. You can implement the method initialze (just like any other method) on the instance or class side. For instance side #initialize methods, it is completely okay to send "super initialize" if instances of this class need to do the same initialization as instances of its superclass. In some frameworks, it is a necessity to always send #initialize to super to make things work. For example, if you subclass WAComponent in a Seaside application and implement #initialize on this subclass' instance side, you MUST send super initialize, otherwise you get an exception when you try to render the component (UndefinedObject DNU #contents). But on the class side (class method #initialize) it is absolutely unlikely you ever want to send #initialize to the class' superclass. We've read a few explanations for this already. I hope things get a little clearer now. Joachim Am 20.08.13 11:52, schrieb Tim Hendriks: > Ok, I don't want to know :-) > > Just as a rule: don't call super initialize on the Class site ? But I > can use (the message) initialize on the Class site (for initializing > applications roots in seaside for example) but just do'nt use super in > it. Correct? > > Thanks Tim > > Op 20-8-2013 11:45, jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de schreef: >> Hi Tim, >> >> the problem is not the send of #super to a class, but the call of >> #initialize of #super on the class side. >> >> As long as you are not interested in very confusing details about the >> inheritence hierarchy of Class and Metaclasses and stuff, don't ask, >> just do as you're told ;-) >> You can, however, have a look at chapter 13 Classes and Metaclasses >> of the "Pharo By Example" book (http://pharobyexample.org) if you >> want to know more. >> >> A very short and incomplete explanation is that the superclass of a >> class is never the superclass of the class of its instances, because >> all classes are instances of the same class ( I told you you prabably >> don't want to know right now ;-) ). >> >> Joachim >> >> >> Am 20.08.13 11:34, schrieb Tim Hendriks: >>> I'am just learning (a few weeks) .... so why not use super in Class? >>> >>> Thanks Tim >>> >>> Op 20-8-2013 11:29, Igor Stasenko schreef: >>>> Thanks for your hard work! >>>> >>>> 1 important remark: >>>> NBXLibTypes class>>initialize >>>> super initialize. >>>> Display := #NBXLibDisplay. >>>> >>>> >>>> Never use 'super initialize' for class initializers. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 20 August 2013 09:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de >>>> <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: >>>> >>>> I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost >>>> and Windows >>>> you can use: >>>> >>>> NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId >>>> >>>> (requires the latest packages from >>>> http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost >>>> <http://smalltalkhub.com/#%21/%7EPharo/NativeBoost>) >>>> >>>> I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get >>>> the PID, like >>>> getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this >>>> tutorial: >>>> >>>> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… >>>> >>>> >>>> Bye >>>> T. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Best regards, >>>> Igor Stasenko. >>> >> >> > > > -- -- â¨----------------------------------------------------------------------- â¨Objektfabrik Joachim Tuchel mailto:jtuchel@objektfabrik.de â¨Fliederweg 1 http://www.objektfabrik.de D-71640 Ludwigsburg http://joachimtuchel.wordpress.com Telefon: +49 7141 56 10 86 0 Fax: +49 7141 56 10 86 1

Aug. 20, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by Esteban Lorenzano

no, you do not call super initialize in class side initialize method. You do not do: MyClass class>>#initialize super initialize. "THIS IS BAD" ... rest of initialization. we should add a Lint rule with that, btw. On Aug 20, 2013, at 11:52 AM, Tim Hendriks <th72(a)dds.nl> wrote: > Ok, I don't want to know :-) > > Just as a rule: don't call super initialize on the Class site ? But I can use (the message) initialize on the Class site (for initializing applications roots in seaside for example) but just do'nt use super in it. Correct? > > Thanks Tim > > Op 20-8-2013 11:45, jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de schreef: >> Hi Tim, >> >> the problem is not the send of #super to a class, but the call of #initialize of #super on the class side. >> >> As long as you are not interested in very confusing details about the inheritence hierarchy of Class and Metaclasses and stuff, don't ask, just do as you're told ;-) >> You can, however, have a look at chapter 13 Classes and Metaclasses of the "Pharo By Example" book (http://pharobyexample.org) if you want to know more. >> >> A very short and incomplete explanation is that the superclass of a class is never the superclass of the class of its instances, because all classes are instances of the same class ( I told you you prabably don't want to know right now ;-) ). >> >> Joachim >> >> >> Am 20.08.13 11:34, schrieb Tim Hendriks: >>> I'am just learning (a few weeks) .... so why not use super in Class? >>> >>> Thanks Tim >>> >>> Op 20-8-2013 11:29, Igor Stasenko schreef: >>>> Thanks for your hard work! >>>> >>>> 1 important remark: >>>> NBXLibTypes class>>initialize >>>> super initialize. >>>> Display := #NBXLibDisplay. >>>> >>>> >>>> Never use 'super initialize' for class initializers. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 20 August 2013 09:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: >>>> >>>> I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost >>>> and Windows >>>> you can use: >>>> >>>> NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId >>>> >>>> (requires the latest packages from >>>> http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost >>>> <http://smalltalkhub.com/#%21/%7EPharo/NativeBoost>) >>>> >>>> I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get >>>> the PID, like >>>> getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this >>>> tutorial: >>>> >>>> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… >>>> >>>> Bye >>>> T. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Best regards, >>>> Igor Stasenko. >>> >> >> > >

Aug. 20, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by Tim Hendriks

Ok, I don't want to know :-) Just as a rule: don't call super initialize on the Class site ? But I can use (the message) initialize on the Class site (for initializing applications roots in seaside for example) but just do'nt use super in it. Correct? Thanks Tim Op 20-8-2013 11:45, jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de schreef: > Hi Tim, > > the problem is not the send of #super to a class, but the call of > #initialize of #super on the class side. > > As long as you are not interested in very confusing details about the > inheritence hierarchy of Class and Metaclasses and stuff, don't ask, > just do as you're told ;-) > You can, however, have a look at chapter 13 Classes and Metaclasses of > the "Pharo By Example" book (http://pharobyexample.org) if you want to > know more. > > A very short and incomplete explanation is that the superclass of a > class is never the superclass of the class of its instances, because > all classes are instances of the same class ( I told you you prabably > don't want to know right now ;-) ). > > Joachim > > > Am 20.08.13 11:34, schrieb Tim Hendriks: >> I'am just learning (a few weeks) .... so why not use super in Class? >> >> Thanks Tim >> >> Op 20-8-2013 11:29, Igor Stasenko schreef: >>> Thanks for your hard work! >>> >>> 1 important remark: >>> NBXLibTypes class>>initialize >>> super initialize. >>> Display := #NBXLibDisplay. >>> >>> >>> Never use 'super initialize' for class initializers. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 20 August 2013 09:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de >>> <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: >>> >>> I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost >>> and Windows >>> you can use: >>> >>> NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId >>> >>> (requires the latest packages from >>> http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost >>> <http://smalltalkhub.com/#%21/%7EPharo/NativeBoost>) >>> >>> I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get >>> the PID, like >>> getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this >>> tutorial: >>> >>> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… >>> >>> Bye >>> T. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Best regards, >>> Igor Stasenko. >> > >

Aug. 20, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by jtuchel＠objektfabrik.de

Hi Tim, the problem is not the send of #super to a class, but the call of #initialize of #super on the class side. As long as you are not interested in very confusing details about the inheritence hierarchy of Class and Metaclasses and stuff, don't ask, just do as you're told ;-) You can, however, have a look at chapter 13 Classes and Metaclasses of the "Pharo By Example" book (http://pharobyexample.org) if you want to know more. A very short and incomplete explanation is that the superclass of a class is never the superclass of the class of its instances, because all classes are instances of the same class ( I told you you prabably don't want to know right now ;-) ). Joachim Am 20.08.13 11:34, schrieb Tim Hendriks: > I'am just learning (a few weeks) .... so why not use super in Class? > > Thanks Tim > > Op 20-8-2013 11:29, Igor Stasenko schreef: >> Thanks for your hard work! >> >> 1 important remark: >> NBXLibTypes class>>initialize >> super initialize. >> Display := #NBXLibDisplay. >> >> >> Never use 'super initialize' for class initializers. >> >> >> >> >> On 20 August 2013 09:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de >> <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: >> >> I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost >> and Windows >> you can use: >> >> NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId >> >> (requires the latest packages from >> http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost >> <http://smalltalkhub.com/#%21/%7EPharo/NativeBoost>) >> >> I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get >> the PID, like >> getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this >> tutorial: >> >> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… >> >> Bye >> T. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. > -- -- â¨----------------------------------------------------------------------- â¨Objektfabrik Joachim Tuchel mailto:jtuchel@objektfabrik.de â¨Fliederweg 1 http://www.objektfabrik.de D-71640 Ludwigsburg http://joachimtuchel.wordpress.com Telefon: +49 7141 56 10 86 0 Fax: +49 7141 56 10 86 1

Aug. 20, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by Igor Stasenko

Classes forming the tree structure (one class can have many subclasses). A class initialization usually done for initializing properties shared by class and all its subclasses, and sent automatically to tools like Monticello when it loads the code to each separate class. So, if we use 'super initialize' we will end up initializing superclass 100 times if it has 100 subclasses. Moreover, if we strictly follow that rule, the class initialization will endup in Behavior>>initialize (look at that method and guess what will happen if you run it) On 20 August 2013 11:34, Tim Hendriks <th72(a)dds.nl> wrote: > I'am just learning (a few weeks) .... so why not use super in Class? > > Thanks Tim > > Op 20-8-2013 11:29, Igor Stasenko schreef: > > Thanks for your hard work! > > 1 important remark: > > NBXLibTypes class>>initialize > super initialize. > Display := #NBXLibDisplay. > > > > Never use 'super initialize' for class initializers. > > > > > > On 20 August 2013 09:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: > >> I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost and >> Windows >> you can use: >> >> NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId >> >> (requires the latest packages from >> http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost) >> >> I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get the PID, >> like >> getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this tutorial: >> >> >> https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… >> >> Bye >> T. >> >> >> >> >> > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Aug. 20, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by Henrik Johansen

On Aug 20, 2013, at 11:34 , Tim Hendriks <th72(a)dds.nl> wrote: > I'am just learning (a few weeks) .... so why not use super in Class? > > Thanks Tim Nothing wrong with using super in Class, but using it in class initialize is a no-no. That method is treated specially and called once a Class is loaded into a system, usually to initialize class variables. So calling super from it will lead to re-initialization of existing class variables when you load code, which is generally not a kosher thing to do; if those have been changed since initialization, it's usually for a reason. Cheers, Henry

Aug. 20, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by Tim Hendriks

I'am just learning (a few weeks) .... so why not use super in Class? Thanks Tim Op 20-8-2013 11:29, Igor Stasenko schreef: > Thanks for your hard work! > > 1 important remark: > NBXLibTypes class>>initialize > super initialize. > Display := #NBXLibDisplay. > > > Never use 'super initialize' for class initializers. > > > > > On 20 August 2013 09:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de > <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: > > I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost > and Windows > you can use: > > NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId > > (requires the latest packages from > http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost > <http://smalltalkhub.com/#%21/%7EPharo/NativeBoost>) > > I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get the > PID, like > getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this > tutorial: > > https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… > > Bye > T. > > > > > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko.

Aug. 20, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Process ID of VM

by Igor Stasenko

Thanks for your hard work! 1 important remark: NBXLibTypes class>>initialize super initialize. Display := #NBXLibDisplay. Never use 'super initialize' for class initializers. On 20 August 2013 09:42, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: > I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost and Windows > you can use: > > NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId > > (requires the latest packages from > http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost) > > I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get the PID, > like > getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this tutorial: > > > https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… > > Bye > T. > > > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Aug. 20, 2013

Process ID of VM

by Torsten Bergmann

I just wrapped this in NB last week, so if you have NativeBoost and Windows you can use: NBWin32Process getCurrentProcessId (requires the latest packages from http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~Pharo/NativeBoost) I'm sure on any other platforms there are API's as well to get the PID, like getpid on Unix. Should be easy to wrap in NB if you follow this tutorial: https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/PharoForTheEnterprise/lastSucces… Bye T.

Aug. 20, 2013