November 2013 - Pharo-users

Re: [Pharo-users] i18n - Where to start?

by Stephan Eggermont

With the QCMagritte image (from the pharo contributions ci). That has build-in support for translations. Just start it and open the web demo Stephan

Nov. 14, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] i18n - Where to start?

by ClÃ©ment Bera

Hello, So there is 2 frameworks to do multi language UI in Pharo (but I don't know if one of them is i18n). One framework is in the image, does not work very well and no one use it seemingly. So I don't recommend it. The other one is the one everyone use, so I recommend it, I'm not sure but I think it is named getText and you can find here: http://smalltalkhub.com/#!/~PharoExtras/Gettext Seemingly it has been ported to Pharo 2.0 recently. Therefore it should work *nearly* out of the box. Regards, 2013/11/14 Bahman Movaqar <Bahman(a)bahmanm.com> > Hi all, > > Would anyone share a pionter to how to do i18n in Pharo for translating > the messages used in a Pharo application (web or desktop)? > > TIA, > > -- > Bahman Movaqar (http://BahmanM.com) > > ERP Evaluation, Implementation & Deployment Consultant > PGP Key ID: 0x6AB5BD68 (keyserver2.pgp.com) > >

Nov. 14, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Current 3.0 download is broken

by Johan Fabry

I guess this one fell through the cracks, so https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/12164/One-Click-on-Mac-is-broken-due-to-n… On Nov 10, 2013, at 12:48 PM, Johan Fabry <jfabry(a)dcc.uchile.cl> wrote: > > On principle, a big +1 on going forward on the PhD! :-) > > But, the one-click download Pharo3.0-mac.zip being broken is an important issue that should be addressed fairly quickly in my opinion. As I said, the sources file should be moved out of Contents/Resources and moved into Contents/MacOS. Then the one-click also runs. > > On Nov 10, 2013, at 10:29 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > >> >> On Nov 10, 2013, at 2:05 PM, Camillo Bruni <camillobruni(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> It did not solve the issue yet :/, I will have to look into it next week. >> >> Don't ;) >> You should not touch Pharo related things and start use pomodoroes to blast your phd >> >> Stef >>> In any case, I think it would be unrelated to a bootstrap since FileLocator >>> is already lazily initialized. There is just the typical problem on how and >>> when to update a singletonâ¦ >> Ok so this is good then. >> >>> >>> I should reopen the issue since the problem persists. > > > > ---> Save our in-boxes! http://emailcharter.org <--- > > Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry > PLEIAD lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile > ---> Save our in-boxes! http://emailcharter.org <--- Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry PLEIAD lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

Nov. 14, 2013

i18n - Where to start?

by Bahman Movaqar

Hi all, Would anyone share a pionter to how to do i18n in Pharo for translating the messages used in a Pharo application (web or desktop)? TIA, -- Bahman Movaqar (http://BahmanM.com) ERP Evaluation, Implementation & Deployment Consultant PGP Key ID: 0x6AB5BD68 (keyserver2.pgp.com)

Nov. 14, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Lock free structures in Pharo

by Igor Stasenko

On 14 November 2013 10:15, Stephan Eggermont <stephan(a)stack.nl> wrote: > Reading this code, made me wonder what operations are actually atomic. > Anyone having a good explanation? > > Stephan > > AtomicQueueItem>makeCircular > "Make a receiver circular, i.e. point to itself, > answer the old value of next variable. > Note, this operation should be atomic" > > | temp | > > " atomic swap here" > temp := next. > next := self. > > ^ temp > > imagine that i rewrite it with following: temp := self. temp <=> next. ^ temp here the <=> is a special 'atomic swap' operation which atomically swaps values of two variables. The best way to do that is to introduce a special bytecode in VM, which either swaps values of two temps or swaps values of temp and instance variable. If we could have such bytecode, then we would have a strong guarantee from VM about atomicity of certain operations, but since we don't have it yet, right now it is just (ab)uses the intrinsic behavior of VM, knowing that it never interrupts between two simple assignments. -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Nov. 14, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] NBOpenGL on Pharo 3.0

by Igor Stasenko

On 14 November 2013 14:25, Jean Baptiste Arnaud <jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com>wrote: > Yes the fix is not integrated yet. > NBWndClassEx should not be a variable subclass anymore. This part should > be checked with Igor. > > NBWndClassEx>>#initialize > self cbSize: (self class instanceSize). > and not self basicSize. > > ah, yes, of couse since before NBWndClassEx was var-byte and its basicSize was always == instanceSize, but now it is no longer like that and you need to use longer expression e.g. (self class instanceSize) > You can rebuildField accessor too (class side on every > NBExternalStructure). > > Do this change and your image should work. (with the last openGL-Win) > I can take you a picture of my computer. > > For more accurate answer I need the crash.dump > > > On Nov 14, 2013, at 1:47 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > Hi, > > As I understand there are still some things to be integrated in > NativeBoost. Indeed, I just tried now with Ricky, and version 3.0 of > NBOpenGL crashes the VM (on Win 7) when doing: > GLTTRenderingDemo new openInWorld. > > Could you point us to the NativeBoost fix to see if it works? > > Doru > > > On Thu, Nov 14, 2013 at 1:21 PM, Jean Baptiste Arnaud < > jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> Should work after integration. >> Configuration updated. >> Need fix review for integration in nativeBoost, will do that with igor >> this afternoon. >> >> >> On Nov 14, 2013, at 12:58 PM, Jean Baptiste Arnaud < >> jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> ok I have openGL work on my windows 7 machine. >> I will update the configuration. But I need to publish also a fix in >> NativeBoost win. >> This bug is the same related to the VM crash in Pharo dev : [Pharo-dev] >> NBOpenGL VM crash. >> >> I open a bug entry. When It will be integrated. >> Window should work well. But if you have any trouble, give me feedback. >> >> >> On Nov 14, 2013, at 12:01 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >> wrote: >> >> so richie >> >> have a look at the repository and load the latest version to see if they >> work (not using the configuration). >> This is what we will try here (chile). >> >> Stef >> >> On Nov 14, 2013, at 9:58 AM, Richard Wettel <wettel(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Thanks everyone! That would be great. >> Looking forward to having NBOpenGL up and running again. >> >> Cheers >> Ricky >> >> >> On Thu, Nov 14, 2013 at 2:29 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse < >> stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> >>> >>>> Right now it cannot even be loaded into 3.0. >>> But update is simple (i think JB did that already, just not published?). >>> >>> Grrr, all my code are published ^^. >>> >>> >>> Where? When did you announce it? >>> Sorry but how can you expect guys from the other part of the planet to >>> know it. >>> Communication in open-source is important because people do not know >>> what others >>> are doing. >>> You know richie asked and ronie too and they are smart guys. But they >>> cannot guess. >>> >>> For mac: >>> I do the change for mac last month because I needed it, it is >>> integrated. >>> >>> >>> ah ok this is why it is working on mac. >>> >>> For linux: >>> I fix, published, tested and updated the configuration for linux 2 days >>> ago, because Alex ask me. >>> On my roommate computer that work (ubuntu ). >>> But I need feedback. >>> >>> >>> oki we will check that tomorrow I hope. >>> >>> For windows: >>> I publish a fix for window yesterday:NBOpenGL-Win-jeanbaptistearnaud.9 >>> but I do not update configuration because I cannot test it. >>> I was planned to go test and debug on my home computer (window 7, 64), >>> tomorrow. >>> >>> >>> Ok we can say it to ronie to have a look. >>> >>> So, you can expect a fix integrated soon. >>> >>> And having a working OpenGL, exactly as it work in pharo 2.0. >>> >>> >>> Excellent. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> I have already looked at Roassal 3d, but it was not easy to separate >>>> the API from the code. >>>> >>>> >>>> Strange because even me I could see that the shadder code should not be >>>> in Roassal 3D but in NBOpenGL :). >>>> Because Roassal 3d should not be about shadder but about 3D. >>>> >>> >>>> And it is something completely different than what I have been using >>>> (and SourceCity, too), because Roassal 3d is using the modern OpenGL >>>> methodology (with FBOs and stuff). >>>> >>>> >>>> Yes they changed the API and deprecated the old way of doing it. >>>> >>> >>> I will also publish some example (using shadder) that I wrote but it is >>> still not yet user friendly. >>> >>> >>> So, I would really appreciate if that API would find its way from >>>> Roassal to NBOpenGL and I could use it for CodeCity. >>>> >>>> >>>> See below >>>> >>> >>>> Unfortunately I am able to help a lot with that, because I know very >>>> little about this and I also don't have enough time (I am doing CodeCity in >>>> my spare time). But, if you have concrete things that I can do, I'd be >>>> happy to help. >>>> >>>> >>>> Three remarks: >>>> - I know that jean-baptiste worked on moving part of roassal3d to >>>> NBOpenGL >>>> >>> >>> Shader part are done for now. >>> >>> - I'm not sure that doing 3d without investing a bit in the underlying >>>> technology is wise. Because you will be always relying >>>> on other people and probably frustrated when things are not working. >>>> >>> + 1 >>> >>> - Since JB does not know how to communicate here is what he did for >>>> fun instead of pushing MoosePython :) >>>> >>> a renderer to video to videos stream for openGL -> MKV, mp4 based >>>> one ffmpeg). The code is openGL extra. As an example you >>>> can get >>>> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uyli3tx3drendvj/qzA_Hy0jnk \ >>>> >>> >>>> >>> yes, my bad. >>> >>> Now again if nobody builds a jun like library in Pharo it will not >>>> exist. >>>> >>> >>>> Stef >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Cheers >>>> Ricky >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 9:44 AM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> I guess that what Ricky is asking is what changed between NBOpenGL 2.0 >>>>> and 3.0 such that this does not work anymore on Windows. The fact that he >>>>> mentioned 64 bits is not relevant for this discussion :). >>>>> >>>>> I also guess he wants to put some effort into understanding this as >>>>> well but he needs a bit of guidance. Right Ricky? >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Doru >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 2:12 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse < >>>>> stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Richard >>>>>> >>>>>> you should have a look at ROASSAL 3d because ronie improved the >>>>>> shadder part (no more assembler) >>>>>> and his code should be split in two and one part should go to >>>>>> NBOpenGL. >>>>>> Now he is experiencing some problem with NBOpenGL on windows as you. >>>>>> >>>>>> NativeBoost does not work on 64 bits. Yet but igor is really busy >>>>>> finishing the texteditor (and I can tell you that >>>>>> he does not have fun there). >>>>>> >>>>>> So it is important that you help because we are FULL >>>>>> and sorry about that but really FULL. >>>>>> >>>>>> Ronie will visit us in January and share an office with igor. >>>>>> >>>>>> Stef >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> > Hi >>>>>> > >>>>>> > CodeCity, the project I am working on is based on NBOpenGL. >>>>>> > I'd like to start working on it using Pharo 3, but it seems that >>>>>> NBOpenGL does not work yet with Pharo 3.0. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > I downloaded from jenkins the latest image with Pharo 3 and tried >>>>>> to execute the following code on Windows 7, 64 bits: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > GLTTRenderingDemo new openInWorld. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > but I get a 'No suitable implementation found for initializing >>>>>> OpenGL context for your platform'. >>>>>> > It seems that NBGLContextDriver does not have a subclass for >>>>>> Windows 64bits. Did I omit something? >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Cheers >>>>>> > Ricky >>>>>> > >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>>> >>>>> "Every thing has its own flow" >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Best regards, >>> Igor Stasenko. >>> >>> >>> Best Regards >>> Jean Baptiste Arnaud >>> jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> Best Regards >> Jean Baptiste Arnaud >> jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Best Regards >> Jean Baptiste Arnaud >> jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > > "Every thing has its own flow" > > > Best Regards > Jean Baptiste Arnaud > jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com > > > > > > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Nov. 14, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Who uses poolDictionaries? New class template cleanup

by Johan Fabry

On Nov 14, 2013, at 7:29 AM, jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de wrote: >> Unless my understanding of the proposal is way off, you would just add "poolDictionaries: 'whatever'" before "category:". No horrible breaking of anything would happen. >> >> Cheers, >> Sergi > I disagree ;-) > I find it hard to remember the ordering of these parameters. I sometimes have this problem with classInstVars in VAST. > > But you are right in that using a simpler template as the default won't remove the whole feature. And if you don't remember the ordering, just browse the implementer of the message in the template, you will find other variants right next to it :-) ---> Save our in-boxes! http://emailcharter.org <--- Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry PLEIAD lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

Nov. 14, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] NBOpenGL on Pharo 3.0

by Jean Baptiste Arnaud

Yes the fix is not integrated yet. NBWndClassEx should not be a variable subclass anymore. This part should be checked with Igor. NBWndClassEx>>#initialize self cbSize: (self class instanceSize). and not self basicSize. You can rebuildField accessor too (class side on every NBExternalStructure). Do this change and your image should work. (with the last openGL-Win) I can take you a picture of my computer. For more accurate answer I need the crash.dump On Nov 14, 2013, at 1:47 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > Hi, > > As I understand there are still some things to be integrated in NativeBoost. Indeed, I just tried now with Ricky, and version 3.0 of NBOpenGL crashes the VM (on Win 7) when doing: > GLTTRenderingDemo new openInWorld. > > Could you point us to the NativeBoost fix to see if it works? > > Doru > > > On Thu, Nov 14, 2013 at 1:21 PM, Jean Baptiste Arnaud <jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Should work after integration. > Configuration updated. > Need fix review for integration in nativeBoost, will do that with igor this afternoon. > > > On Nov 14, 2013, at 12:58 PM, Jean Baptiste Arnaud <jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> ok I have openGL work on my windows 7 machine. >> I will update the configuration. But I need to publish also a fix in NativeBoost win. >> This bug is the same related to the VM crash in Pharo dev : [Pharo-dev] NBOpenGL VM crash. >> >> I open a bug entry. When It will be integrated. >> Window should work well. But if you have any trouble, give me feedback. >> >> >> On Nov 14, 2013, at 12:01 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> >>> so richie >>> >>> have a look at the repository and load the latest version to see if they work (not using the configuration). >>> This is what we will try here (chile). >>> >>> Stef >>> >>> On Nov 14, 2013, at 9:58 AM, Richard Wettel <wettel(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Thanks everyone! That would be great. >>>> Looking forward to having NBOpenGL up and running again. >>>> >>>> Cheers >>>> Ricky >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Nov 14, 2013 at 2:29 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Right now it cannot even be loaded into 3.0. >>>>>> But update is simple (i think JB did that already, just not published?). >>>>> Grrr, all my code are published ^^. >>>> >>>> Where? When did you announce it? >>>> Sorry but how can you expect guys from the other part of the planet to know it. >>>> Communication in open-source is important because people do not know what others >>>> are doing. >>>> You know richie asked and ronie too and they are smart guys. But they cannot guess. >>>> >>>>> For mac: >>>>> I do the change for mac last month because I needed it, it is integrated. >>>> >>>> ah ok this is why it is working on mac. >>>> >>>>> For linux: >>>>> I fix, published, tested and updated the configuration for linux 2 days ago, because Alex ask me. >>>>> On my roommate computer that work (ubuntu ). >>>>> But I need feedback. >>>> >>>> oki we will check that tomorrow I hope. >>>> >>>>> For windows: >>>>> I publish a fix for window yesterday:NBOpenGL-Win-jeanbaptistearnaud.9 but I do not update configuration because I cannot test it. >>>>> I was planned to go test and debug on my home computer (window 7, 64), tomorrow. >>>> >>>> Ok we can say it to ronie to have a look. >>>> >>>>> So, you can expect a fix integrated soon. >>>>> >>>>> And having a working OpenGL, exactly as it work in pharo 2.0. >>>> >>>> Excellent. >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> I have already looked at Roassal 3d, but it was not easy to separate the API from the code. >>>>>> >>>>>> Strange because even me I could see that the shadder code should not be in Roassal 3D but in NBOpenGL :). >>>>>> Because Roassal 3d should not be about shadder but about 3D. >>>>>> >>>>>>> And it is something completely different than what I have been using (and SourceCity, too), because Roassal 3d is using the modern OpenGL methodology (with FBOs and stuff). >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes they changed the API and deprecated the old way of doing it. >>>>> >>>>> I will also publish some example (using shadder) that I wrote but it is still not yet user friendly. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> So, I would really appreciate if that API would find its way from Roassal to NBOpenGL and I could use it for CodeCity. >>>>>> >>>>>> See below >>>>>> >>>>>>> Unfortunately I am able to help a lot with that, because I know very little about this and I also don't have enough time (I am doing CodeCity in my spare time). But, if you have concrete things that I can do, I'd be happy to help. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Three remarks: >>>>>> - I know that jean-baptiste worked on moving part of roassal3d to NBOpenGL >>>>> >>>>> Shader part are done for now. >>>>> >>>>>> - I'm not sure that doing 3d without investing a bit in the underlying technology is wise. Because you will be always relying >>>>>> on other people and probably frustrated when things are not working. >>>>> + 1 >>>>> >>>>>> - Since JB does not know how to communicate here is what he did for fun instead of pushing MoosePython :) >>>>>> a renderer to video to videos stream for openGL -> MKV, mp4 based one ffmpeg). The code is openGL extra. As an example you >>>>>> can get >>>>>> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uyli3tx3drendvj/qzA_Hy0jnk \ >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> yes, my bad. >>>>> >>>>>> Now again if nobody builds a jun like library in Pharo it will not exist. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Stef >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers >>>>>>> Ricky >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 9:44 AM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I guess that what Ricky is asking is what changed between NBOpenGL 2.0 and 3.0 such that this does not work anymore on Windows. The fact that he mentioned 64 bits is not relevant for this discussion :). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I also guess he wants to put some effort into understanding this as well but he needs a bit of guidance. Right Ricky? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>> Doru >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 2:12 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >>>>>>> Richard >>>>>>> >>>>>>> you should have a look at ROASSAL 3d because ronie improved the shadder part (no more assembler) >>>>>>> and his code should be split in two and one part should go to NBOpenGL. >>>>>>> Now he is experiencing some problem with NBOpenGL on windows as you. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> NativeBoost does not work on 64 bits. Yet but igor is really busy finishing the texteditor (and I can tell you that >>>>>>> he does not have fun there). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> So it is important that you help because we are FULL >>>>>>> and sorry about that but really FULL. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Ronie will visit us in January and share an office with igor. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Stef >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> > Hi >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > CodeCity, the project I am working on is based on NBOpenGL. >>>>>>> > I'd like to start working on it using Pharo 3, but it seems that NBOpenGL does not work yet with Pharo 3.0. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > I downloaded from jenkins the latest image with Pharo 3 and tried to execute the following code on Windows 7, 64 bits: >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > GLTTRenderingDemo new openInWorld. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > but I get a 'No suitable implementation found for initializing OpenGL context for your platform'. >>>>>>> > It seems that NBGLContextDriver does not have a subclass for Windows 64bits. Did I omit something? >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Cheers >>>>>>> > Ricky >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "Every thing has its own flow" >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>> Igor Stasenko. >>>>> >>>>> Best Regards >>>>> Jean Baptiste Arnaud >>>>> jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> Best Regards >> Jean Baptiste Arnaud >> jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > Best Regards > Jean Baptiste Arnaud > jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com > > > > > > > > > > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > > "Every thing has its own flow" Best Regards Jean Baptiste Arnaud jbaptiste.arnaud(a)gmail.com

Nov. 14, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Who uses poolDictionaries? New class template cleanup

by Johan Fabry

Note that I'm not advocating removing PoolDictionaries. Just to have the subclassing template not mention them. I would leave the subclassing message with the poolDictionaries: argument in the system for people to use it if they want to. On Nov 14, 2013, at 7:02 AM, jtuchel(a)objektfabrik.de wrote: > Hi, > > I'd like to draw your attention to something else: consistency. > > I remember the days when Cincom added Namespaces to classes and the class definition template changed drastically. It took me quite a while to get used to that. > And there is this other aspect in the consistency field: most Smalltalk literature will include and address that line. If you learn Smalltalk, such small differences can cause trouble. > > And what if I need PoolDictionaries? How hard will it be to find the place to add my reference to them? > A fair amount of Pharo code may not make much use of PoolDictionaries, but other dialects do. I know Pharo has the concept of "never look back" and it is good to be prepared to cut off old strings. But there is a price to it. > > Seaside, apart from being a great web framework, has achieved something that was excellent and helped the whole Smalltalk universe make a leap forward: all Smalltalk dialects moved closer together and honestly worked on being more compatible. Suggestions like this may not break much of this per se, but many such cracks make a wide canyon. I find the argument that a certain line of code may irritate students a bit weak. It may make their life harder once they read code from other dialects. Should we remove class browsers because students are used to use text editors? > > Just my 2 cents > > Joachim ---> Save our in-boxes! http://emailcharter.org <--- Johan Fabry - http://pleiad.cl/~jfabry PLEIAD lab - Computer Science Department (DCC) - University of Chile

Nov. 14, 2013

Settings > Network > Blab email

by btc＠openinworld.com

In Settings I just noticed Network > Blab email. The description is not very description-able. What is it? cheers -ben

Nov. 14, 2013