January 2013 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] Phaas - anyone interested in setting up Pharo as a Service?

by Andy Burnett

Thanks James, That would be really helpful. If you haven't sent the email already. I would be really interested to know if they could support Gemstone. That, combined with fuel+tanker could make a fantastic dev environment. Cheers Andy On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:13 PM, <pharo-users-request(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr>wrote: > I will contact them and ask what it would take for them to support a new > runtime/framework/database. I expect that the primary question will be > business opportunity followed by support requirements. > > James > > On Jan 28, 2013, at 3:58 AM, Janko Miv?ek <janko.mivsek(a)eranova.si> wrote: > > > What if we ask one of existing commercial PaaS providers to add > > Smalltalk among the languages of choice? This way we achieve one-click > > Smalltalk cloud apps the fastest way for sure. > > > > Right now I'm looking at AppFog http://www.appfog.com. This is > > CloudFoundry based PaaS provider over the Amazon, Rackspace and Azure > > IaaS providers. It supports also "unusual" languages like Erlang and Go > > [1], so maybe they are open for Smalltalk too. > > > > James, AppCloud is located in Portland, Gemstone as well, so you are > > neighbors :) Do you think it would be wise to make a contact with them > > to start discussing the possibilities? > > > > Best regards > > Janko >

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] world menu shortcut

by Peter H. Meadows

Shall I open an issue? On 29 January 2013 13:58, Guillermo Polito <guillermopolito(a)gmail.com>wrote: > > > On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 2:05 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck < > marianopeck(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 12:19 AM, Peter H. Meadows < >> peter.h.meadows(a)googlemail.com> wrote: >> >>> Is there a keyboard shortcut to open the world menu from anywhere? >>> >>> >> I remember I asked the same some time ago to Guille Polito. >> But as far as I remember there wasn't. >> Guille, now that we have KeyBindings in the image, could we add this? >> > > I played once with that and was easy... The worse part of assigning new > shortcuts is finding a good key combination :). > > >> >>> How about adding a button to the taskbar? >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Mariano >> http://marianopeck.wordpress.com >> > >

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Getting started with Gemstone for Pharo users

by Bernat Romagosa

Thanks a lot, I'll check it out too! :) 2013/1/29 Paul DeBruicker <pdebruic(a)gmail.com> > SIXX with the XML Pull Parser mentioned here should do what you want > > https://kentreis.wordpress.com/2009/06/01/deep-sixx-with-xml-pull-parser/ > > > Also asking this on the GLASS list might not hurt as the above may be > obsolete (or not working in Gemstone 3.1) at this time. I've cc'd it on > this email > > The GLASS list is here: > > http://seaside.gemstone.com/mailman/listinfo/beta > > > > On 01/29/2013 08:21 AM, Bernat Romagosa wrote: > > No, I don't think I'm storing anything specific to Pharo... just model > > objects. > > > > We're handling quite a lot of user of data right now, so migration is a > > must, any ideas? :P > > > > Thanks! > > > > Bernat. > > > > > > 2013/1/29 Martin Dias <tinchodias(a)gmail.com <mailto:tinchodias@gmail.com > >> > > > > I don't know of any port of Fuel to Gemstone. The difficulty depends > > on what objects you have serialized. You don't store too specific > > stuff, like block closures or classes, right? > > > > Cheers, > > Martin > > > > On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:14 PM, Bernat Romagosa > > <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com > > <mailto:tibabenfortlapalanca@gmail.com>> wrote: > > > I see, thanks for the answers! > > > > > > What about moving all the data to the new Gemstone configuration? > > Is it > > > possible to materialize Fuel graphs from within Gemstone? > > > > > > > > > 2013/1/29 Paul DeBruicker <pdebruic(a)gmail.com > > <mailto:pdebruic@gmail.com>> > > >> > > >> I'm sure the gemstone guys will chime in with more details. > > >> > > >> Iliad does not have to run in the GemTools image. No need to get > > 0.9.1.2 > > >> to run in older Pharo versions. You just use the GemTools image > > as the IDE > > >> for Gemstone. So start the GemTools image and connect to the > > stone and use > > >> it to load Iliad 0.9.1.2 into Gemstone by running the Gemstone > > specific > > >> Monticelo or workspace or browsers. > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> On Jan 29, 2013, at 5:22 AM, Bernat Romagosa > > >> <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com > > <mailto:tibabenfortlapalanca@gmail.com>> wrote: > > >> > > >> > Hi list, > > >> > > > >> > I've heard the "develop in Pharo, deploy in Gemstone" idea a > > million > > >> > times, and I'd like to understand how people proceed in > > real-world cases. > > >> > > > >> > I've done my homework and I've watched and read a lot of > beginner > > >> > tutorials, but I still have lots of pieces missing. Here's our > > scenario: > > >> > > > >> > We have a web app, built on Pharo 1.4 and Iliad 0.9.1.2. > > Currently, we > > >> > handle persistence on the image and we have a scheduler process > > doing > > >> > regular Fuel backups every 10 minutes, and we also keep daily > > backups in > > >> > case things go wrong. > > >> > > > >> > The app is starting to gain momentum, and it feels like things > > are going > > >> > to start being way too sluggish soon, so we need to scale. > > >> > > > >> > We've been trying many different persistence approaches, but > > we'd love > > >> > to stay inside Smalltalk. We hate having to flatten and pump > > back our > > >> > objects all the time. Also, REST apis to any kind of DB are not > > good enough > > >> > for us, every o(n) operation becomes unbearably slow, as n REST > > calls must > > >> > be sent out and n answers received. > > >> > > > >> > In short, we want to use Gemstone, as we've read it's best for > > complex, > > >> > intertwined Smalltalk models, and it scales like crazy. > > >> > > > >> > We'd be okay with Pharo being the "dealer" between clients and > > the DB, > > >> > but as I understand, GemTools can't be installed on Pharo 1.4, > > so we're kind > > >> > of stuck with an old Pharo 1.1.1 image, in which Iliad 0.9.1.2 > > can't be > > >> > installed. > > >> > > > >> > What's the solution here? How does one proceed to migrate an > > app of this > > >> > kind? We've developed in Pharo, now how does one accomplish the > > "deploy in > > >> > Gemstone" part? > > >> > > > >> > Any pointers to documentation, blog posts or whatever will be > > so much > > >> > appreciated. > > >> > > > >> > Thanks a lot in advance, > > >> > > > >> > Bernat. > > >> > > > >> > -- > > >> > Bernat Romagosa. > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Bernat Romagosa. > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Bernat Romagosa. > > > -- Bernat Romagosa.

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Getting started with Gemstone for Pharo users

by Paul DeBruicker

SIXX with the XML Pull Parser mentioned here should do what you want https://kentreis.wordpress.com/2009/06/01/deep-sixx-with-xml-pull-parser/ Also asking this on the GLASS list might not hurt as the above may be obsolete (or not working in Gemstone 3.1) at this time. I've cc'd it on this email The GLASS list is here: http://seaside.gemstone.com/mailman/listinfo/beta On 01/29/2013 08:21 AM, Bernat Romagosa wrote: > No, I don't think I'm storing anything specific to Pharo... just model > objects. > > We're handling quite a lot of user of data right now, so migration is a > must, any ideas? :P > > Thanks! > > Bernat. > > > 2013/1/29 Martin Dias <tinchodias(a)gmail.com <mailto:tinchodias@gmail.com>> > > I don't know of any port of Fuel to Gemstone. The difficulty depends > on what objects you have serialized. You don't store too specific > stuff, like block closures or classes, right? > > Cheers, > Martin > > On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:14 PM, Bernat Romagosa > <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com > <mailto:tibabenfortlapalanca@gmail.com>> wrote: > > I see, thanks for the answers! > > > > What about moving all the data to the new Gemstone configuration? > Is it > > possible to materialize Fuel graphs from within Gemstone? > > > > > > 2013/1/29 Paul DeBruicker <pdebruic(a)gmail.com > <mailto:pdebruic@gmail.com>> > >> > >> I'm sure the gemstone guys will chime in with more details. > >> > >> Iliad does not have to run in the GemTools image. No need to get > 0.9.1.2 > >> to run in older Pharo versions. You just use the GemTools image > as the IDE > >> for Gemstone. So start the GemTools image and connect to the > stone and use > >> it to load Iliad 0.9.1.2 into Gemstone by running the Gemstone > specific > >> Monticelo or workspace or browsers. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Jan 29, 2013, at 5:22 AM, Bernat Romagosa > >> <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com > <mailto:tibabenfortlapalanca@gmail.com>> wrote: > >> > >> > Hi list, > >> > > >> > I've heard the "develop in Pharo, deploy in Gemstone" idea a > million > >> > times, and I'd like to understand how people proceed in > real-world cases. > >> > > >> > I've done my homework and I've watched and read a lot of beginner > >> > tutorials, but I still have lots of pieces missing. Here's our > scenario: > >> > > >> > We have a web app, built on Pharo 1.4 and Iliad 0.9.1.2. > Currently, we > >> > handle persistence on the image and we have a scheduler process > doing > >> > regular Fuel backups every 10 minutes, and we also keep daily > backups in > >> > case things go wrong. > >> > > >> > The app is starting to gain momentum, and it feels like things > are going > >> > to start being way too sluggish soon, so we need to scale. > >> > > >> > We've been trying many different persistence approaches, but > we'd love > >> > to stay inside Smalltalk. We hate having to flatten and pump > back our > >> > objects all the time. Also, REST apis to any kind of DB are not > good enough > >> > for us, every o(n) operation becomes unbearably slow, as n REST > calls must > >> > be sent out and n answers received. > >> > > >> > In short, we want to use Gemstone, as we've read it's best for > complex, > >> > intertwined Smalltalk models, and it scales like crazy. > >> > > >> > We'd be okay with Pharo being the "dealer" between clients and > the DB, > >> > but as I understand, GemTools can't be installed on Pharo 1.4, > so we're kind > >> > of stuck with an old Pharo 1.1.1 image, in which Iliad 0.9.1.2 > can't be > >> > installed. > >> > > >> > What's the solution here? How does one proceed to migrate an > app of this > >> > kind? We've developed in Pharo, now how does one accomplish the > "deploy in > >> > Gemstone" part? > >> > > >> > Any pointers to documentation, blog posts or whatever will be > so much > >> > appreciated. > >> > > >> > Thanks a lot in advance, > >> > > >> > Bernat. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Bernat Romagosa. > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > Bernat Romagosa. > > > > > -- > Bernat Romagosa.

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Getting started with Gemstone for Pharo users

by Bernat Romagosa

No, I don't think I'm storing anything specific to Pharo... just model objects. We're handling quite a lot of user of data right now, so migration is a must, any ideas? :P Thanks! Bernat. 2013/1/29 Martin Dias <tinchodias(a)gmail.com> > I don't know of any port of Fuel to Gemstone. The difficulty depends > on what objects you have serialized. You don't store too specific > stuff, like block closures or classes, right? > > Cheers, > Martin > > On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:14 PM, Bernat Romagosa > <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > I see, thanks for the answers! > > > > What about moving all the data to the new Gemstone configuration? Is it > > possible to materialize Fuel graphs from within Gemstone? > > > > > > 2013/1/29 Paul DeBruicker <pdebruic(a)gmail.com> > >> > >> I'm sure the gemstone guys will chime in with more details. > >> > >> Iliad does not have to run in the GemTools image. No need to get > 0.9.1.2 > >> to run in older Pharo versions. You just use the GemTools image as the > IDE > >> for Gemstone. So start the GemTools image and connect to the stone and > use > >> it to load Iliad 0.9.1.2 into Gemstone by running the Gemstone specific > >> Monticelo or workspace or browsers. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Jan 29, 2013, at 5:22 AM, Bernat Romagosa > >> <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> > >> > Hi list, > >> > > >> > I've heard the "develop in Pharo, deploy in Gemstone" idea a million > >> > times, and I'd like to understand how people proceed in real-world > cases. > >> > > >> > I've done my homework and I've watched and read a lot of beginner > >> > tutorials, but I still have lots of pieces missing. Here's our > scenario: > >> > > >> > We have a web app, built on Pharo 1.4 and Iliad 0.9.1.2. Currently, we > >> > handle persistence on the image and we have a scheduler process doing > >> > regular Fuel backups every 10 minutes, and we also keep daily backups > in > >> > case things go wrong. > >> > > >> > The app is starting to gain momentum, and it feels like things are > going > >> > to start being way too sluggish soon, so we need to scale. > >> > > >> > We've been trying many different persistence approaches, but we'd love > >> > to stay inside Smalltalk. We hate having to flatten and pump back our > >> > objects all the time. Also, REST apis to any kind of DB are not good > enough > >> > for us, every o(n) operation becomes unbearably slow, as n REST calls > must > >> > be sent out and n answers received. > >> > > >> > In short, we want to use Gemstone, as we've read it's best for > complex, > >> > intertwined Smalltalk models, and it scales like crazy. > >> > > >> > We'd be okay with Pharo being the "dealer" between clients and the DB, > >> > but as I understand, GemTools can't be installed on Pharo 1.4, so > we're kind > >> > of stuck with an old Pharo 1.1.1 image, in which Iliad 0.9.1.2 can't > be > >> > installed. > >> > > >> > What's the solution here? How does one proceed to migrate an app of > this > >> > kind? We've developed in Pharo, now how does one accomplish the > "deploy in > >> > Gemstone" part? > >> > > >> > Any pointers to documentation, blog posts or whatever will be so much > >> > appreciated. > >> > > >> > Thanks a lot in advance, > >> > > >> > Bernat. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Bernat Romagosa. > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > Bernat Romagosa. > > -- Bernat Romagosa.

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] tuesday we will do a coding sprint here at Santiago

by Sean P. DeNigris

No problem... just was worried about you guys ;) just sent you a request on skype... On Jan 29, 2013, at 11:03 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse [via Smalltalk] <ml-node+s1294792n4666250h38(a)n4.nabble.com> wrote: > We were fighting a daemon - with a lot of dark implication. > The fact that we cannot load certain package two times in a row with gofer. > It looks stupid but it spotted several bugs. > > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7284 > > Stef > > > On Jan 29, 2013, at 9:40 AM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote: > > > Sean P. DeNigris wrote > >> > >> StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote > >>> I guess starting around 9h30 > >> Great, I want to play. I'll be online and available via > >> Skype/phone/IRC/smoke-signals/whatever bright and early (I think that's > >> 0730 in NY time)... > > > > Have you guys started yet? I'm on the pharo IRC channel and can Skype if > > necessary... > > > > > > > > -- > > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/tuesday-we-will-do-a-coding-sprint-here-at-Santiago-t… > > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > > > > > > If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below: > http://forum.world.st/tuesday-we-will-do-a-coding-sprint-here-at-Santiago-t… > To unsubscribe from tuesday we will do a coding sprint here at Santiago, click here. > NAML -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/tuesday-we-will-do-a-coding-sprint-here-at-Santiago-t… Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Phaas - anyone interested in setting up Pharo as a Service?

by James Foster

I will contact them and ask what it would take for them to support a new runtime/framework/database. I expect that the primary question will be business opportunity followed by support requirements. James On Jan 28, 2013, at 3:58 AM, Janko MivÅ¡ek <janko.mivsek(a)eranova.si> wrote: > What if we ask one of existing commercial PaaS providers to add > Smalltalk among the languages of choice? This way we achieve one-click > Smalltalk cloud apps the fastest way for sure. > > Right now I'm looking at AppFog http://www.appfog.com. This is > CloudFoundry based PaaS provider over the Amazon, Rackspace and Azure > IaaS providers. It supports also "unusual" languages like Erlang and Go > [1], so maybe they are open for Smalltalk too. > > James, AppCloud is located in Portland, Gemstone as well, so you are > neighbors :) Do you think it would be wise to make a contact with them > to start discussing the possibilities? > > Best regards > Janko > > [1] Languages and Runtimes > https://docs.appfog.com/roadmap#langs > > Dne 28. 01. 2013 09:17, piÅ¡e Geert Claes: >> While it is great that one can actually use Smalltalk in Cloud Foundry ... it >> does require a lot of steps to get it going. Having said that reckon it >> would be interresting to have an easy to use Pharo-as-a-Service. For >> persistence maybe rely on things like MongoLab or MongoHQ so you don't have >> to worry about that? >> >> >> fstephany wrote >>> http://programminggems.wordpress.com/2012/02/17/adding-smalltalk-to-cloud-f… >>> >>> http://programminggems.wordpress.com/2012/02/27/using-mysql-in-aida-on-phar… >>> >>> https://programminggems.wordpress.com/2012/02/28/using-mysql-from-smalltalk… >>> >>> Are the three articles describing it :) >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Phaas-anyone-interested-in-setting-up-Pharo-as-a-Serv… >> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >> >> > > -- > Janko MivÅ¡ek > Aida/Web > Smalltalk Web Application Server > http://www.aidaweb.si > >

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] tuesday we will do a coding sprint here at Santiago

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

We were fighting a daemon - with a lot of dark implication. The fact that we cannot load certain package two times in a row with gofer. It looks stupid but it spotted several bugs. http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7284 Stef On Jan 29, 2013, at 9:40 AM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote: > Sean P. DeNigris wrote >> >> StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote >>> I guess starting around 9h30 >> Great, I want to play. I'll be online and available via >> Skype/phone/IRC/smoke-signals/whatever bright and early (I think that's >> 0730 in NY time)... > > Have you guys started yet? I'm on the pharo IRC channel and can Skype if > necessary... > > > > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/tuesday-we-will-do-a-coding-sprint-here-at-Santiago-t… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] tuesday we will do a coding sprint here at Santiago

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

sean I'm online on skype stducasse I'm looking at your fixes. On Jan 29, 2013, at 1:18 AM, Sean P. DeNigris wrote: > StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote >> I guess starting around 9h30 > > Great, I want to play. I'll be online and available via > Skype/phone/IRC/smoke-signals/whatever bright and early (I think that's 0730 > in NY time)... > > > > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/tuesday-we-will-do-a-coding-sprint-here-at-Santiago-t… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >

Jan. 29, 2013

Re: [Pharo-users] Getting started with Gemstone for Pharo users

by Martin Dias

I don't know of any port of Fuel to Gemstone. The difficulty depends on what objects you have serialized. You don't store too specific stuff, like block closures or classes, right? Cheers, Martin On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:14 PM, Bernat Romagosa <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I see, thanks for the answers! > > What about moving all the data to the new Gemstone configuration? Is it > possible to materialize Fuel graphs from within Gemstone? > > > 2013/1/29 Paul DeBruicker <pdebruic(a)gmail.com> >> >> I'm sure the gemstone guys will chime in with more details. >> >> Iliad does not have to run in the GemTools image. No need to get 0.9.1.2 >> to run in older Pharo versions. You just use the GemTools image as the IDE >> for Gemstone. So start the GemTools image and connect to the stone and use >> it to load Iliad 0.9.1.2 into Gemstone by running the Gemstone specific >> Monticelo or workspace or browsers. >> >> >> >> >> >> On Jan 29, 2013, at 5:22 AM, Bernat Romagosa >> <tibabenfortlapalanca(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> > Hi list, >> > >> > I've heard the "develop in Pharo, deploy in Gemstone" idea a million >> > times, and I'd like to understand how people proceed in real-world cases. >> > >> > I've done my homework and I've watched and read a lot of beginner >> > tutorials, but I still have lots of pieces missing. Here's our scenario: >> > >> > We have a web app, built on Pharo 1.4 and Iliad 0.9.1.2. Currently, we >> > handle persistence on the image and we have a scheduler process doing >> > regular Fuel backups every 10 minutes, and we also keep daily backups in >> > case things go wrong. >> > >> > The app is starting to gain momentum, and it feels like things are going >> > to start being way too sluggish soon, so we need to scale. >> > >> > We've been trying many different persistence approaches, but we'd love >> > to stay inside Smalltalk. We hate having to flatten and pump back our >> > objects all the time. Also, REST apis to any kind of DB are not good enough >> > for us, every o(n) operation becomes unbearably slow, as n REST calls must >> > be sent out and n answers received. >> > >> > In short, we want to use Gemstone, as we've read it's best for complex, >> > intertwined Smalltalk models, and it scales like crazy. >> > >> > We'd be okay with Pharo being the "dealer" between clients and the DB, >> > but as I understand, GemTools can't be installed on Pharo 1.4, so we're kind >> > of stuck with an old Pharo 1.1.1 image, in which Iliad 0.9.1.2 can't be >> > installed. >> > >> > What's the solution here? How does one proceed to migrate an app of this >> > kind? We've developed in Pharo, now how does one accomplish the "deploy in >> > Gemstone" part? >> > >> > Any pointers to documentation, blog posts or whatever will be so much >> > appreciated. >> > >> > Thanks a lot in advance, >> > >> > Bernat. >> > >> > -- >> > Bernat Romagosa. >> > > > > -- > Bernat Romagosa.

Jan. 29, 2013