January 2011 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on Windows

by Tony Fleig

Just to add to what Andrew experienced: I am a relatively experienced Pharo user on Linux and OSX -- or at least I know about the VM and image and change files. I recently decided to test the TFLogin package on Windows so I installed Pharo on Windows using the One-Click image. I had an experience similar to Andrew's. It may have been easier for me to diagnose and fix the problems as I am more experienced with Pharo and have programmed on Windows for years, but... I think Pharo should install and run without problems the way any quality Windows does. I did nothing during the installation that I was not prompted to do (such as deciding where to place the zip file and where to unpack it) and yet Pharo would not start the first time I clicked on the shortcut. Pharo is great, but it should install and run without problems for newcomers on the most popular OS platform out there. Granted, programmers are more likely to be able to resolve the problems, but it doesn't inspire confidence when a product doesn't work immediately after installation. If I were at all uncertain about whether I wanted to try Pharo, failure on first startup might be enough to cause me to uninstall it without further investigation. I know resources are tight, but perhaps a little more attention should be given to the new user's first-time experience on Windows. Regards, TF On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 8:57 AM, Andrew Black <t-ablack(a)microsoft.com>wrote: > I just started using Pharo on windows for the first time. > > > > First, I should say that Iâm really impressed. Pharo seems much more solid > than when I last tried it. I programmed all day without getting a > walkback! All of the tools âjust workedâ. Well done! Itâs a lot of work > creating a solid user experience, but you have done it. > > > > Now I have some Windows-specific questions. Iâm a real windows newbi, so > please be patient. > > > > After I downloaded Pharo.app, I dragged the whole directory to a convenient > place, and tried to launch the Pharo.lnk file, just like the readme file > says. But there is no such file visible in windows explorer (even though I > have âdonât show extensions for known file typesâ box unchecked. The file > shows up as Pharo. Anyway, I figured that it was really Pharo.lnk (Cygwin > tells the truth) and double-clicked on it. > > > > This brings up an alert that says > C:\Users\<username>\Desktop\OneClick.app\Contents\Windows\Squeak.exe the > specified path does not exist. > > > > Is this because I moved the downloaded package? Shouldnât the symlink be > relative? > > > > Anyway, I looked in â¦\ Contents\Windows\, double-clicked on Squeak.exe, and > everything started up just fine. > > > > I worked all day, and saved my image a few times using the Save menu on the > desktop. Each time, I get the usual confirmatory dialog in the Transcript. > > > > Overnight, my machine shut down. > > > > Today, I relaunch Squeak.exe, and of course I get the virgin image! Where > is the image that Iâve been using? The Windows âsearch this computerâ tool > canât find it! What about my package cache? > > > > Eventually I find everything in Pharo.app\Contents\Resources, but not until > Iâve had a few moments of panic! > > > > Questions: Is this the appropriate behaviour on Windows, or was there a > user error on my part? Is it OK to move my image somewhere else? How can > I change the current directory for Pharo on Windows? > > > > OK, so now that Iâve found my image file, how to I re-launch it? I > double-clicked on the .image file, and I got a dialog saying that Windows > didnât know what program to use to open it. Fair enough. So I told it to > use Squeak.exe. Pharo launches, and I get: âError: invalid utf8 input > detectedâ. Itâs treating the image as if it were a source file: it has > opened a MultiByteFileSTream on it. Thatâs not right. > > > > How do I re-launch my Pharo image? > > > > Andrew > > > > > > >

Jan. 20, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on Windows

by Igor Stasenko

On 20 January 2011 17:57, Andrew Black <t-ablack(a)microsoft.com> wrote: > I just started using Pharo on windows for the first time. > > > > First, I should say that Iâm really impressed.Â Pharo seems much more solid > than when I last tried it.Â I programmed all day without getting a > walkback!Â All of the tools âjust workedâ.Â Well done!Â Â Itâs a lot of work > creating a solid user experience, but you have done it. > > > > Now I have some Windows-specific questions.Â Iâm a real windows newbi, so > please be patient. > > > > After I downloaded Pharo.app, I dragged the whole directory to a convenient > place, and tried to launch the Pharo.lnk file, just like the readme file > says.Â But there is no such file visible in windows explorer (even though I > have âdonât show extensions for known file typesâ box unchecked. Â Â The file > shows up as Pharo.Â Â Anyway, I figured that it was really Pharo.lnkÂ (Cygwin > tells the truth) and double-clicked on it. > > > > This brings up an alert that says > C:\Users\<username>\Desktop\OneClick.app\Contents\Windows\Squeak.exe the > specified path does not exist. > > > > Is this because I moved the downloaded package?Â Shouldnât the symlink be > relative? > > > > Anyway, I looked in â¦\ Contents\Windows\, double-clicked on Squeak.exe, and > everything started up just fine. > > > > I worked all day, and saved my image a few times using the Save menu on the > desktop. Â Each time, Â I get the usual confirmatory dialog in the Transcript. > > > > Overnight, my machine shut down. > > > > Today, I relaunch Squeak.exe, and of course I get the virgin image!Â Where > is the image that Iâve been using?Â The Windows âsearch this computerâ tool > canât find it!Â What about my package cache? > > > > Eventually I find everything in Pharo.app\Contents\Resources, but not until > Iâve had a few moments of panic! > > > > Questions: Is this the appropriate behaviour on Windows, or was there a user > error on my part?Â Is it OK to move my image somewhere else?Â Â How can I > change the current directory for Pharo on Windows? > > > > OK, so now that Iâve found my image file, how to I re-launch it?Â I > double-clicked on the .image file, and I got a dialog saying that Windows > didnât know what program to use to open it.Â Fair enough.Â So I told it to > use Squeak.exe.Â Pharo launches, and I get: âError: invalid utf8 input > detectedâ.Â Itâs treating the image as if it were a source file: it has > opened a MultiByteFileSTream on it.Â Thatâs not right. > > > > How do I re-launch my Pharo image? squeak.exe C:/pathToMyImage/myImage.image or just copy your image to whereever you see fit and then run squeak.exe and when it asks which image to open, choose the one you prefer. > > > > Â Â Â Andrew > > > > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

Jan. 20, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo on Windows

by Miguel CobÃ¡

Pharo experience is conformed of three things: VM Image sources file When you start the vm, it must run a image. When a image is ran, it searches for a sources file and as the development you do goes on, a changes files is generated. Now, if you downloaded the Pharo One-Click, this is a package of the several components that conforms Pharo, arranged in a given directory tree structure. Most surely, the paths and relative paths of the components is important. So isn't wise to get out the image out of this directory tree without the sources and the changes file. If the installation associated the .image files to the Squeak.exe vm, then double click on a image that is sitting along a source file should start the image without problems. But if you only have the image (associated with a VM) then on start the image will whine about the sources file. If you want to have the image everywhere in your machine the best is to download the vm separately and install it on your machine. Then download a Pharo Core image and populate it with the code you're interested or extract from the OneClick the image *and* the sources and put it on a folder (a changes will be created eventually). Cheers El jue, 20-01-2011 a las 16:57 +0000, Andrew Black escribiÃ³: > I just started using Pharo on windows for the first time. > > > > First, I should say that Iâm really impressed. Pharo seems much more > solid than when I last tried it. I programmed all day without getting > a walkback! All of the tools âjust workedâ. Well done! Itâs a lot > of work creating a solid user experience, but you have done it. > > > > Now I have some Windows-specific questions. Iâm a real windows newbi, > so please be patient. > > > > After I downloaded Pharo.app, I dragged the whole directory to a > convenient place, and tried to launch the Pharo.lnk file, just like > the readme file says. But there is no such file visible in windows > explorer (even though I have âdonât show extensions for known file > typesâ box unchecked. The file shows up as Pharo. Anyway, I > figured that it was really Pharo.lnk (Cygwin tells the truth) and > double-clicked on it. > > > > This brings up an alert that says C:\Users\<username>\Desktop > \OneClick.app\Contents\Windows\Squeak.exe the specified path does not > exist. > > > > Is this because I moved the downloaded package? Shouldnât the symlink > be relative? > > > > Anyway, I looked in â¦\ Contents\Windows\, double-clicked on > Squeak.exe, and everything started up just fine. > > > > I worked all day, and saved my image a few times using the Save menu > on the desktop. Each time, I get the usual confirmatory dialog in > the Transcript. > > > > Overnight, my machine shut down. > > > > Today, I relaunch Squeak.exe, and of course I get the virgin image! > Where is the image that Iâve been using? The Windows âsearch this > computerâ tool canât find it! What about my package cache? > > > > Eventually I find everything in Pharo.app\Contents\Resources, but not > until Iâve had a few moments of panic! > > > > Questions: Is this the appropriate behaviour on Windows, or was there > a user error on my part? Is it OK to move my image somewhere else? > How can I change the current directory for Pharo on Windows? > > > > OK, so now that Iâve found my image file, how to I re-launch it? I > double-clicked on the .image file, and I got a dialog saying that > Windows didnât know what program to use to open it. Fair enough. So > I told it to use Squeak.exe. Pharo launches, and I get: âError: > invalid utf8 input detectedâ. Itâs treating the image as if it were a > source file: it has opened a MultiByteFileSTream on it. Thatâs not > right. > > > > How do I re-launch my Pharo image? > > > > Andrew > > > > > > > > -- Miguel CobÃ¡ http://twitter.com/MiguelCobaMtz http://miguel.leugim.com.mx

Jan. 20, 2011

Pharo on Windows

by Andrew Black

I just started using Pharo on windows for the first time. First, I should say that I'm really impressed. Pharo seems much more solid than when I last tried it. I programmed all day without getting a walkback! All of the tools "just worked". Well done! It's a lot of work creating a solid user experience, but you have done it. Now I have some Windows-specific questions. I'm a real windows newbi, so please be patient. After I downloaded Pharo.app, I dragged the whole directory to a convenient place, and tried to launch the Pharo.lnk file, just like the readme file says. But there is no such file visible in windows explorer (even though I have "don't show extensions for known file types" box unchecked. The file shows up as Pharo. Anyway, I figured that it was really Pharo.lnk (Cygwin tells the truth) and double-clicked on it. This brings up an alert that says C:\Users\<username>\Desktop\OneClick.app\Contents\Windows\Squeak.exe the specified path does not exist. Is this because I moved the downloaded package? Shouldn't the symlink be relative? Anyway, I looked in ...\ Contents\Windows\, double-clicked on Squeak.exe, and everything started up just fine. I worked all day, and saved my image a few times using the Save menu on the desktop. Each time, I get the usual confirmatory dialog in the Transcript. Overnight, my machine shut down. Today, I relaunch Squeak.exe, and of course I get the virgin image! Where is the image that I've been using? The Windows "search this computer" tool can't find it! What about my package cache? Eventually I find everything in Pharo.app\Contents\Resources, but not until I've had a few moments of panic! Questions: Is this the appropriate behaviour on Windows, or was there a user error on my part? Is it OK to move my image somewhere else? How can I change the current directory for Pharo on Windows? OK, so now that I've found my image file, how to I re-launch it? I double-clicked on the .image file, and I got a dialog saying that Windows didn't know what program to use to open it. Fair enough. So I told it to use Squeak.exe. Pharo launches, and I get: "Error: invalid utf8 input detected". It's treating the image as if it were a source file: it has opened a MultiByteFileSTream on it. That's not right. How do I re-launch my Pharo image? Andrew

Jan. 20, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Infinite loop is not stopped by Cmd+.

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

probably the loop was too tight and the system did not get a chance to react. This is not the right behavior but not clear how to change it. Stef On Jan 19, 2011, at 12:19 PM, Alex Schenkman wrote: > Hi List, > > Recently I had a bug causing an infinite loop, which in turn hanged the image. > I thought that Cmd+. would allow me to stop this, but this is not the case. > > Adding and executing this method hangs my image and Cmd+. does not stop it. > > MyClass>>infinite > ^self infinite > > Is this the right behavior? > Thanks in advance! >

Jan. 19, 2011

Infinite loop is not stopped by Cmd+.

by Alex Schenkman

Hi List, Recently I had a bug causing an infinite loop, which in turn hanged the image. I thought that Cmd+. would allow me to stop this, but this is not the case. Adding and executing this method hangs my image and Cmd+. does not stop it. MyClass>>infinite ^self infinite Is this the right behavior? Thanks in advance!

Jan. 19, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo and network

by Adrien BARREAU

Hi, This was sent to me on the pharo-project mailing list, it answers my question. Thanks for your answers ;) Adrien. > Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 23:41:09 +0000 > From: mike(a)mjr104.co.uk > To: pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo and network > > yes... depending on your OS and version of Pharo, 127.0.0.1 does not > always work as the destination from your client to your server socket. > Did Olivier's code snippet work? try using netcat or lsof (unix) to > see and interact with the state of your sockets. > > There is also a SocketStream implementation (somewhere) that hides a > lot of this. > > cheers, > Mike > > On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:35 PM, Olivier Auverlot > <olivier.auverlot(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi Adrien, > > > > Could you try : > > > > | s | > > s := Socket new. > > s connectTo: (NetNameResolver addressForName: 'localhost') port: 12345. > > > > Best regards > > Olivier ;-) > > www.auverlot.fr > > > > Hello, > > > > I read these documents: > > http://book.pharo-project.org/book/networking/Socket > > http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/325 > > > > but I still don't get what I want with pharo. > > > > Here is the idea: I want a socket to listen a port while pharo is launched > > as a deamon. > > > > I tried to test the sockets with this idea: > > - creation of two sockets in two workspaces > > - server: > > > > | server st | > > st := String new. > > server := Socket newTCP. > > server listenOn: 12345 backlogSize: 4. > > server receiveDataInto: st > > > > - client: > > > > | s | > > s connectTo: ('127.0.0.1' asByteArray asSocketAddress) port: 12345. > > s sendData: 'Hello' > > > > - the connectTo:port: fails, and I don't understand why > > > > So I have no idea ... > > > > Adrien. > > > > >

Jan. 18, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Pharo and network

by Michael Roberts

yes... depending on your OS and version of Pharo, 127.0.0.1 does not always work as the destination from your client to your server socket. Did Olivier's code snippet work? try using netcat or lsof (unix) to see and interact with the state of your sockets. There is also a SocketStream implementation (somewhere) that hides a lot of this. cheers, Mike On Fri, Jan 14, 2011 at 11:35 PM, Olivier Auverlot <olivier.auverlot(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Adrien, > > Could you try : > > | s | > s := Socket new. > s connectTo: (NetNameResolver addressForName: 'localhost') port: 12345. > > Best regards > Olivier ;-) > www.auverlot.fr > > Hello, > > I read these documents: > http://book.pharo-project.org/book/networking/Socket > http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/325 > > but I still don't get what I want with pharo. > > Here is the idea: I want a socket to listen a port while pharo is launched > as a deamon. > > I tried to test the sockets with this idea: > - creation of two sockets in two workspaces > - server: > > | server st | > st := String new. > server := Socket newTCP. > server listenOn: 12345 backlogSize: 4. > server receiveDataInto: st > > - client: > > | s | > s connectTo: ('127.0.0.1' asByteArray asSocketAddress) port: 12345. > s sendData: 'Hello' > > - the connectTo:port: fails, and I don't understand why > > So I have no idea ... > > Adrien. > >

Jan. 17, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] [Pharo-project] Where do I find KeyedSet?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

On Jan 15, 2011, at 9:52 AM, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand wrote: > Hi Stef > > 2011/1/15 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr>: >> >> On Jan 14, 2011, at 6:24 PM, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand wrote: >> >>> Try PluggableSet >>> >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr/msg22890.ht… >>> >>> Is there a way for you guys to deprecate deleted classes or mantain a >>> record of deleted behaviors? (IIRC VW did this from 2.x versions) >> >> We try but we do not have the engineers of VW. >> Now find somebody that pay us just 3 engineers full time for two years and you will not >> recognized pharo and its process. > > I know we are very few, but what about this idea, instead of just > deleting a class we may adopt these simple rules: > > 1 - If deleting a class add the deleted class name somewhere (in a method?) > 2 - If renaming a class, make the class to know its previous names > like #previousNames > (Norberto Manzanos implemented this for his own package management and > I think is a great idea) > > doesn't require tools, just some consensus and maybe a modified > #deleteClass to enforce this "policy" yes this would be nice to have tool doing it for us. > > it sounds feasible for you? what do you think? > > HernÃ¡n >

Jan. 15, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] [Pharo-project] Where do I find KeyedSet?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Previous names is a good idea We should adopt it! Stef On Jan 15, 2011, at 9:52 AM, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand wrote: > Hi Stef > > 2011/1/15 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr>: >> >> On Jan 14, 2011, at 6:24 PM, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand wrote: >> >>> Try PluggableSet >>> >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr/msg22890.ht… >>> >>> Is there a way for you guys to deprecate deleted classes or mantain a >>> record of deleted behaviors? (IIRC VW did this from 2.x versions) >> >> We try but we do not have the engineers of VW. >> Now find somebody that pay us just 3 engineers full time for two years and you will not >> recognized pharo and its process. > > I know we are very few, but what about this idea, instead of just > deleting a class we may adopt these simple rules: > > 1 - If deleting a class add the deleted class name somewhere (in a method?) > 2 - If renaming a class, make the class to know its previous names > like #previousNames > (Norberto Manzanos implemented this for his own package management and > I think is a great idea) > > doesn't require tools, just some consensus and maybe a modified > #deleteClass to enforce this "policy" > > it sounds feasible for you? what do you think? > > HernÃ¡n >

Jan. 15, 2011