January 2011 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Smalltalk server pages

by Annick Fron

Hi, and in order to get a minimum of dynamic pages, (I think Seaside will be too large for my memory) what is best to get simple Smalltalk server pages, swazoo or Komhttpserver ? Annick Fron

Jan. 5, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Minimal pharo

by Annick Fron

Ok thanks Le 4 janv. 2011 Ã 22:48, Mariano Martinez Peck a Ã©crit : > > > On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 10:05 PM, Annick Fron <info(a)afceurope.com> wrote: > > Le 4 janv. 2011 Ã 21:51, StÃ©phane Ducasse a Ã©crit : > > > Annick > > > >> I have now tried the minimal images indicated by Torsten and Stephane, on Windows it amounts to 9.1 Mega in memory ... > >> Would it be smaller on Linux ? > Any idea on this ? > > I don't think so. It should be the same. > > >> Yet, I still need a shoe horn, having only 8 M ram from which 1.5 is already taken by the kernel... > > > > do you need the sources? > On Linux ? I had trouble installing Squeak on Linux. > > No, Stef wanted to said the .sources file of Pharo. Did you see that you need a Pharo1.0.sources file??? > Ok, that's not needed for a deployed app since it will decompile the methods in case you browse them (you wont have the tmp names thought), > > To get rid of sources, you need to evaluate Smalltalk abandonSources > > > > > The minikernel image is 2 mb > > Now you should also release the cache of MC and do several incantation and you can get to a more reasonable size. > > I am not too familiar with the environment, so it will me some time before I understand package loading and so on. > I don't understand why there are shell scripts together with Smalltalk scripts. > > The shell scripts are just to shrink down the PharoCore image and build a PharoKernel from it. > You can just download the PharoKernel image (no need to run the shell scripts, this is only if you want to build the PharoKernel by your own). But be aware that PharoKernel is REALLY kernel. There is no UI, and the way to interact with it is just passing a smalltalk script file at startup. > > > > > >> Any idea to downsize even more ? > > > > There are more to throw away and we are always trying to componentize it. > > Did you remove the tests? > Not yet > > As said in my previous email, #cleanUpForProduction does that. > > Cheers > > mariano > > > > > > >> Best regards > >> > >> Annick Fron > > > > > > > > >

Jan. 5, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Minimal pharo

by Luc Fabresse

Hi all, Yes, I agree with Adrian, all cleanings should be integrated. Perhaps in #cleanUpForProduction that already integrates some elements pointed by Mariano. #Luc 2011/1/5 Adrian Lienhard <adi(a)netstyle.ch> > > On Jan 4, 2011, at 22:42 , Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > > > ps: I wonder if any of those scripts should be added to ScriptLoader > > Yes, that would be good! Like this we can improve them and other people can > contribute. > > Esteban, could you share your experience with unloading packages? I assume > you had to also reorganize packages to make them cleanly unloadable? If yes > these changes should be integrated to improve the modularization. > > Cheers, > Adrian >

Jan. 5, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Minimal pharo

by Adrian Lienhard

On Jan 4, 2011, at 22:42 , Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: > ps: I wonder if any of those scripts should be added to ScriptLoader Yes, that would be good! Like this we can improve them and other people can contribute. Esteban, could you share your experience with unloading packages? I assume you had to also reorganize packages to make them cleanly unloadable? If yes these changes should be integrated to improve the modularization. Cheers, Adrian

Jan. 5, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Minimal pharo

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 10:05 PM, Annick Fron <info(a)afceurope.com> wrote: > > Le 4 janv. 2011 Ã 21:51, StÃ©phane Ducasse a Ã©crit : > > > Annick > > > >> I have now tried the minimal images indicated by Torsten and Stephane, > on Windows it amounts to 9.1 Mega in memory ... > >> Would it be smaller on Linux ? > Any idea on this ? > I don't think so. It should be the same. > >> Yet, I still need a shoe horn, having only 8 M ram from which 1.5 is > already taken by the kernel... > > > > do you need the sources? > On Linux ? I had trouble installing Squeak on Linux. > No, Stef wanted to said the .sources file of Pharo. Did you see that you need a Pharo1.0.sources file??? Ok, that's not needed for a deployed app since it will decompile the methods in case you browse them (you wont have the tmp names thought), To get rid of sources, you need to evaluate Smalltalk abandonSources > > The minikernel image is 2 mb > > Now you should also release the cache of MC and do several incantation > and you can get to a more reasonable size. > > I am not too familiar with the environment, so it will me some time before > I understand package loading and so on. > I don't understand why there are shell scripts together with Smalltalk > scripts. > The shell scripts are just to shrink down the PharoCore image and build a PharoKernel from it. You can just download the PharoKernel image (no need to run the shell scripts, this is only if you want to build the PharoKernel by your own). But be aware that PharoKernel is REALLY kernel. There is no UI, and the way to interact with it is just passing a smalltalk script file at startup. > > > >> Any idea to downsize even more ? > > > > There are more to throw away and we are always trying to componentize it. > > Did you remove the tests? > Not yet > As said in my previous email, #cleanUpForProduction does that. Cheers mariano > > > > >> Best regards > >> > >> Annick Fron > > > > > > > > >

Jan. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Minimal pharo

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Hi Annick. I don't know which image they told you, but if you take a PharoCore 1.1.1 from here: http://www.pharo-project.org/pharo-download/stable-core And you evaluate: ScriptLoader new cleanUpForRelease. And then save and quite, the image is 6.8 MB. Another hack I sometimes do is o put all all classes with the default category. You can still can browse and recompile the whole image. Most production enviroments don't care about categories...they make sense when developing. (not everybody agree). But anyway, if you then evaluate: Smalltalk allClassesAndTraitsDo: [:each | each zapOrganization ]. Symbol compactSymbolTable. Smalltalk garbageCollect Then the resulted image is 6.1 mb ;) If you then evaluate: "Compact all MethodDictionary instances" | oldInstances newInstances | oldInstances := MethodDictionary allInstances. newInstances := oldInstances collect: [ :md | (MethodDictionary new: md size) compactCopyFrom: md; yourself]. oldInstances elementsForwardIdentityTo: newInstances. "Different cleanUps" TextStyle allSubInstancesDo: [:ts | ts newFontArray: (ts fontArray copyFrom: 1 to: (2 min: ts fontArray size))]. "Clean all Monticello related stuff. You won't be able to browse packages for example" MCWorkingCopyBrowser allInstancesDo: [:each | each flushAllCaches ]. MCWorkingCopy allInstancesDo:[:wc| SystemChangeNotifier uniqueInstance noMoreNotificationsFor: wc. wc unregister]. SystemChangeNotifier uniqueInstance noMoreNotificationsFor: MCPackageManager. SystemChangeNotifier uniqueInstance noMoreNotificationsFor: MCWorkingCopy. "Most application don't need sound" SoundService default: nil. SoundService unregister: DummySoundSystem. SystemChangeNotifier uniqueInstance noMoreNotificationsFor: (Smalltalk at: #RecentMessageSet). TranscriptStream newTranscript: ThreadSafeTranscript new. ImageSegment classPool at: #RecentlyRenamedClasses put: Dictionary new. ExternalSettings classPool at: #RegisteredClients put: Set new. Locale classPool at: #LocaleChangeListeners put: nil. "Clean all the changes" ChangeSet resetCurrentToNewUnnamedChange Set. ChangeSet current initialize. ChangeSet classPool at: #AllChangeSets put: (OrderedCollection with: ChangeSet current). Symbol rehash. 3 timesRepeat: [ Smalltalk garbageCollect. Symbol compactSymbolTable ]. You will have a 5.9 MB image :) is that enought? If not, you can start unloading packages. Esteban did a lot of work with this of IPhone images. You can ask him. ps: I wonder if any of those scripts should be added to ScriptLoader Cheers Mariano On Tue, Jan 4, 2011 at 6:48 PM, Annick Fron <info(a)afceurope.com> wrote: > Hi all, > > I have now tried the minimal images indicated by Torsten and Stephane, on > Windows it amounts to 9.1 Mega in memory ... > Would it be smaller on Linux ? > Yet, I still need a shoe horn, having only 8 M ram from which 1.5 is > already taken by the kernel... > Any idea to downsize even more ? > Best regards > > Annick Fron >

Jan. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Minimal pharo

by Annick Fron

Le 4 janv. 2011 Ã 21:51, StÃ©phane Ducasse a Ã©crit : > Annick > >> I have now tried the minimal images indicated by Torsten and Stephane, on Windows it amounts to 9.1 Mega in memory ... >> Would it be smaller on Linux ? Any idea on this ? >> Yet, I still need a shoe horn, having only 8 M ram from which 1.5 is already taken by the kernel... > > do you need the sources? On Linux ? I had trouble installing Squeak on Linux. > The minikernel image is 2 mb > Now you should also release the cache of MC and do several incantation and you can get to a more reasonable size. I am not too familiar with the environment, so it will me some time before I understand package loading and so on. I don't understand why there are shell scripts together with Smalltalk scripts. > >> Any idea to downsize even more ? > > There are more to throw away and we are always trying to componentize it. > Did you remove the tests? Not yet > > >> Best regards >> >> Annick Fron > > >

Jan. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Minimal pharo

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Annick > I have now tried the minimal images indicated by Torsten and Stephane, on Windows it amounts to 9.1 Mega in memory ... > Would it be smaller on Linux ? > Yet, I still need a shoe horn, having only 8 M ram from which 1.5 is already taken by the kernel... do you need the sources? The minikernel image is 2 mb Now you should also release the cache of MC and do several incantation and you can get to a more reasonable size. > Any idea to downsize even more ? There are more to throw away and we are always trying to componentize it. Did you remove the tests? > Best regards > > Annick Fron

Jan. 4, 2011

Minimal pharo

by Annick Fron

Hi all, I have now tried the minimal images indicated by Torsten and Stephane, on Windows it amounts to 9.1 Mega in memory ... Would it be smaller on Linux ? Yet, I still need a shoe horn, having only 8 M ram from which 1.5 is already taken by the kernel... Any idea to downsize even more ? Best regards Annick Fron

Jan. 4, 2011

Re: [Pharo-users] Telnet client

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Hi Aidan, I have no idea, but I cc'ed pharo-dev mailing list just in case someone can help mariano On Mon, Jan 3, 2011 at 10:21 AM, Aidan Gauland <aidalgol(a)no8wireless.co.nz>wrote: > Hi, > > I want to create a MUD <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MUD> client (a > client for games played over Telnet) with Pharo, but I'm stuck on how > best to use Pharo as a Telnet client. I've heard of the cURL plugin, > but I'm not sure if that can be (easily) used for anything other than > file transfers. Even if I built and installed it, I'm not confident > I'd be able to tell for certain whether I can use it in the way I > want. I also found this > <http://map.squeak.org/package/14bcecc6-dbb8-4866-bb0c-25278ca882ba>, > but that's about eight years old and its homepage link is dead, so it > doesn't look too promising. I found TelnetProtocolClient in the Pharo > image, but that does not seem to be at all what I need. > > Can someone with experience with telnetting from within Pharo/Squeak > point me in the right direction? > > Thanks, > Aidan > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) > > iEYEARECAAYFAk0hlP4ACgkQjyzTRvYJmaV/3QCePcuRL3E1EX1OYjT6nVGSjnyl > VoQAoIF507GVLtaWENeKTOYbhSWGqrmh > =JWyt > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > >

Jan. 3, 2011