April 2010 - Pharo-users - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-users] Install seaside with metacello. examples missing

by zekUs

Hi, i installed directly from ConfigurationOfSeaside30 and the examples are ok. Thanks to Lukas. i thought that ConfigurationOfSeaside is a something like general conf for seaside and related projects. and i used it to fetch seaside3.0. i think metacello is really useful and nice system. As a user of it i may critise a couple of things. first, i think metacello needs a GUI. on Monticello Browser we can see limited information about package. i do not exactly know if there is a place for application metadata on configuration classes but the conf class should carry the application name, application description etc. and some sort of GUI may let us to browse installation options of the package like versions and groups etc. for now in every configuration class there is different installation ways. actually i must say, with metacello i can install packages very problem-less as i had never before with other methods. so really i loved it. thanks for replies. 2010/4/9 Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com> > Hi. Maybe ConfigurationOfSeaside has a wrong name. Actually, it is like a > facade to install not only Seaside but also some other Seaside-related tools > like Magritte and Pier. > > Have you check ConfigurationOfSeaside >> workspace ? > > I cc Dale that will probably help you as I don't know if he is the mailing > list. > > Lukas: are there problems installing jQuery AND Scriptaculus ? > > Cheers > > Mariano > > > > On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 1:51 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> I am not sure if you use the right configuration, because here the >> class is called ConfigurationOfSeaside30. See >> http://www.seaside.st/download/pharo#113383063 for the complete script >> that works for me, e.g. it loads all jQuery and Scriptaculous >> examples. >> >> Cheers, >> Lukas >> >> On 9 April 2010 13:24, zekUs <zekzekus(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> > hello, >> > i installed seaside 3.0 into my pharo image with metacello. but >> > scriptacalous and jquery examples are not loaded. when i installed with >> the >> > script generated from seaside web site, there was examples of these >> > libraries. >> > i used the code below to install: >> > ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'ALL'. >> > is there way to install examples of scriptacalous and jquery? >> > regards. >> > >> > -- >> > Zekeriya "zekUs" KOÃ - http://zekzekus.com/blog >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Pharo-users mailing list >> > Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users >> > >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Lukas Renggli >> www.lukas-renggli.ch >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-users mailing list >> Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-users mailing list > Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users > > -- Zekeriya "zekUs" KOÃ - http://zekzekus.com/blog

April 9, 2010

Re: [Pharo-users] Install seaside with metacello. examples missing

by Lukas Renggli

> Lukas: are there problems installing jQuery AND Scriptaculus ? No. Lukas > > Cheers > > Mariano > > > On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 1:51 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> I am not sure if you use the right configuration, because here the >> class is called ConfigurationOfSeaside30. See >> http://www.seaside.st/download/pharo#113383063 for the complete script >> that works for me, e.g. it loads all jQuery and Scriptaculous >> examples. >> >> Cheers, >> Lukas >> >> On 9 April 2010 13:24, zekUs <zekzekus(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> > hello, >> > i installed seaside 3.0 into my pharo image with metacello. but >> > scriptacalous and jquery examples are not loaded. when i installed with >> > the >> > script generated from seaside web site, there was examples of these >> > libraries. >> > i used the code below to install: >> > ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'ALL'. >> > is there way to install examples of scriptacalous and jquery? >> > regards. >> > >> > -- >> > Zekeriya "zekUs" KOÃ - http://zekzekus.com/blog >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Pharo-users mailing list >> > Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users >> > >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Lukas Renggli >> www.lukas-renggli.ch >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-users mailing list >> Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users > > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-users mailing list > Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users > > -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

April 9, 2010

Re: [Pharo-users] Install seaside with metacello. examples missing

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Hi. Maybe ConfigurationOfSeaside has a wrong name. Actually, it is like a facade to install not only Seaside but also some other Seaside-related tools like Magritte and Pier. Have you check ConfigurationOfSeaside >> workspace ? I cc Dale that will probably help you as I don't know if he is the mailing list. Lukas: are there problems installing jQuery AND Scriptaculus ? Cheers Mariano On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 1:51 PM, Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I am not sure if you use the right configuration, because here the > class is called ConfigurationOfSeaside30. See > http://www.seaside.st/download/pharo#113383063 for the complete script > that works for me, e.g. it loads all jQuery and Scriptaculous > examples. > > Cheers, > Lukas > > On 9 April 2010 13:24, zekUs <zekzekus(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > hello, > > i installed seaside 3.0 into my pharo image with metacello. but > > scriptacalous and jquery examples are not loaded. when i installed with > the > > script generated from seaside web site, there was examples of these > > libraries. > > i used the code below to install: > > ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'ALL'. > > is there way to install examples of scriptacalous and jquery? > > regards. > > > > -- > > Zekeriya "zekUs" KOÃ - http://zekzekus.com/blog > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pharo-users mailing list > > Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users > > > > > > > > -- > Lukas Renggli > www.lukas-renggli.ch > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-users mailing list > Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users >

April 9, 2010

Re: [Pharo-users] Install seaside with metacello. examples missing

by Lukas Renggli

I am not sure if you use the right configuration, because here the class is called ConfigurationOfSeaside30. See http://www.seaside.st/download/pharo#113383063 for the complete script that works for me, e.g. it loads all jQuery and Scriptaculous examples. Cheers, Lukas On 9 April 2010 13:24, zekUs <zekzekus(a)gmail.com> wrote: > hello, > i installed seaside 3.0 into my pharo image with metacello. but > scriptacalous and jquery examples are not loaded. when i installed with the > script generated from seaside web site, there was examples of these > libraries. > i used the code below to install: > ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'ALL'. > is there way to install examples of scriptacalous and jquery? > regards. > > -- > Zekeriya "zekUs" KOÃ - http://zekzekus.com/blog > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-users mailing list > Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users > > -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

April 9, 2010

Install seaside with metacello. examples missing

by zekUs

hello, i installed seaside 3.0 into my pharo image with metacello. but scriptacalous and jquery examples are not loaded. when i installed with the script generated from seaside web site, there was examples of these libraries. i used the code below to install: ConfigurationOfSeaside project latestVersion load: 'ALL'. is there way to install examples of scriptacalous and jquery? regards. -- Zekeriya "zekUs" KOÃ - http://zekzekus.com/blog

April 9, 2010

Re: [Pharo-users] removing packages

by Yoandy RodrÃguez MartÃnez

Yep, works like a charm, Thanks for your help ( and Marcus's too) En Thu, 08 Apr 2010 05:48:04 -0300, Lukas Renggli <renggli(a)gmail.com> escribiÃ³: >> You can do it via code: >> >> remove package + code: >> >> (MCPackage named: 'ObjectMetaTools') unload. > > Gofer new > package: 'ObjectMetaTools'; > unload > > does not leave garbage behind. > > Lukas

April 8, 2010

Re: [Pharo-users] Experiences with non RDBs?

by Norbert Hartl

On 08.04.2010, at 12:35, Friedrich Dominicus wrote: > Norbert Hartl <norbert(a)hartl.name> writes: > >> - in OODBs this case is easy. The serialization contains everything >> from the key-values and the class that they belong to. Sometimes the >> data format on disk is the same as in memory so there is less to >> do. The difference between magma and gemstone is that magma is an >> addition to an image. That means you have your smalltalk image in >> memory and than you have magma. With magma you define a persisted root >> object, e.g. a Dictionary. Everything you attach to the Dictionary >> will be persisted if you do a commit. Well, you need to do your >> changes inside a transaction but there are always ways to make this >> look nearly transparent. In gemstone everything is already persisted >> including all the classes and objects. As soon as you attach a newly >> created object somewhere that is already persistent it will be >> persisted, too. The easiest way of handling your data is to keep an >> instance variable in your class that holds the instances. Et voila, >> that's all! All you objects are persisted. Speaking of seaside >> gemstone can be used doing autocommits on a request basis so you don't >> have to care at all about transactions. You just use your objects and >> that is it. Querying is like using collections. If you need special >> kind of querying either for your problem or performance you can >> provide a special type of collection that is optimized for the problem > Are there any examples around showing that? The special collections? I don't know much because most of the time you don't need something special. The only thing that comes to my mind are the reduced conflict collection classes in gemstone that could be considered special. But basically you subclass a collection class that deals with a special implementation and then you just create that one instead to other. >> >> - In SQL databases the instance variables are mapped to columns of a >> table or multiple tables and each row is an object. Relationships of >> objects are handled by keys in the tables. A 1:1 relationships >> contains a key of the relation source in the relation target table. A >> n:m relationship needs an intermediate table that maps relation source >> keys to relation target keys. Talking about inheritance this gets >> easily complicated. Basically there are two options. You can solve it >> like everyone would expect it, let's say more BNF like. You would have >> a table A for class A and a table B for class B. Now in all tables of >> objects that reference A or B you need an additional information which >> class is meant: A or B. The tables than could be joint correctly after >> evaluation the additional value. Another strategy is to do multiple >> lookups until you've found the right value. The other approach is to >> make one table that is a super set of all needed variables. The keys >> are unique among all the subclasses and can be lookuped up more >> easily. But you waste some space because a lot of the columns would be >> empty. In any case you need to change your database schema if you >> change your model. Joins and number of requests can grow easily so >> that your application will be slowed down. Glorp gives you all of >> these strategies if you want them. My personal advize would be to >> avoid inheritance in that scenario completely or do only the simplest >> cases possible. Relational databases and object oriented approaches >> just don't fit together. > Well that was what liked to get shown. I was thinking in the simples > possible cases of inheritance and how "bad/good" that works with RDBs. > > So I wanted to know if someone has done some work on ORM to handle that > with not too much pain on "my side". > Define pain! :) I used Glorp a lot and is good piece of software. It helps you a lot with these things. Well, it helps you as much as it is possible when dealing with RDBs. I could create most of the cases but then suddenly a login attempt to the website caused around 400 requests to the database just to show the first page. That's the point where it turns against you and you have trouble to look behind all that that was causing you less pain. > I expected something like that. Either you build you stuff that it fits > the RDB model or you better avoid RDBs. I have tried to figure > that out e.g in Rails but it all comes short if "even" simple > inheritance comes into play. You message just confirms this impression. > I think this is a more general rule. Things are made for a purpose. If you try to force them to fulfill a completely different purpose it probably won't work out. At least it will cause you pain. > Any way my question still persists, are there anywhere examples on > handling inheritance in ORMs? I scanned my old archives but didn't find a good example at first glance. Maybe it is not in my repository because all the attempts weren't satisfactory at all. So I probably never committed one of the trials. Norbert

April 8, 2010

Re: [Pharo-users] Experiences with non RDBs?

by Friedrich Dominicus

Norbert Hartl <norbert(a)hartl.name> writes: > - in OODBs this case is easy. The serialization contains everything > from the key-values and the class that they belong to. Sometimes the > data format on disk is the same as in memory so there is less to > do. The difference between magma and gemstone is that magma is an > addition to an image. That means you have your smalltalk image in > memory and than you have magma. With magma you define a persisted root > object, e.g. a Dictionary. Everything you attach to the Dictionary > will be persisted if you do a commit. Well, you need to do your > changes inside a transaction but there are always ways to make this > look nearly transparent. In gemstone everything is already persisted > including all the classes and objects. As soon as you attach a newly > created object somewhere that is already persistent it will be > persisted, too. The easiest way of handling your data is to keep an > instance variable in your class that holds the instances. Et voila, > that's all! All you objects are persisted. Speaking of seaside > gemstone can be used doing autocommits on a request basis so you don't > have to care at all about transactions. You just use your objects and > that is it. Querying is like using collections. If you need special > kind of querying either for your problem or performance you can > provide a special type of collection that is optimized for the problem Are there any examples around showing that? > > - In SQL databases the instance variables are mapped to columns of a > table or multiple tables and each row is an object. Relationships of > objects are handled by keys in the tables. A 1:1 relationships > contains a key of the relation source in the relation target table. A > n:m relationship needs an intermediate table that maps relation source > keys to relation target keys. Talking about inheritance this gets > easily complicated. Basically there are two options. You can solve it > like everyone would expect it, let's say more BNF like. You would have > a table A for class A and a table B for class B. Now in all tables of > objects that reference A or B you need an additional information which > class is meant: A or B. The tables than could be joint correctly after > evaluation the additional value. Another strategy is to do multiple > lookups until you've found the right value. The other approach is to > make one table that is a super set of all needed variables. The keys > are unique among all the subclasses and can be lookuped up more > easily. But you waste some space because a lot of the columns would be > empty. In any case you need to change your database schema if you > change your model. Joins and number of requests can grow easily so > that your application will be slowed down. Glorp gives you all of > these strategies if you want them. My personal advize would be to > avoid inheritance in that scenario completely or do only the simplest > cases possible. Relational databases and object oriented approaches > just don't fit together. Well that was what liked to get shown. I was thinking in the simples possible cases of inheritance and how "bad/good" that works with RDBs. So I wanted to know if someone has done some work on ORM to handle that with not too much pain on "my side". I expected something like that. Either you build you stuff that it fits the RDB model or you better avoid RDBs. I have tried to figure that out e.g in Rails but it all comes short if "even" simple inheritance comes into play. You message just confirms this impression. Any way my question still persists, are there anywhere examples on handling inheritance in ORMs? Regards Friedrich -- Q-Software Solutions GmbH; Sitz: Bruchsal; Registergericht: Mannheim Registriernummer: HRB232138; Geschaeftsfuehrer: Friedrich Dominicus

April 8, 2010

Re: [Pharo-users] removing packages

by Lukas Renggli

> You can do it via code: > > remove package + code: > > (MCPackage named: 'ObjectMetaTools') unload. Gofer new package: 'ObjectMetaTools'; unload does not leave garbage behind. Lukas -- Lukas Renggli www.lukas-renggli.ch

April 8, 2010

Re: [Pharo-users] Experiences with non RDBs?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

in SqueakSafe (developed at HPI) they use traits exactly to be able to plug persistency in an existing domain single inheritance. Stef On Apr 8, 2010, at 9:02 AM, Friedrich Dominicus wrote: > Friedrich Dominicus <frido(a)q-software-solutions.de> writes: > >> I just wonder about experiences with non relational databases like e.g >> - Magma >> - Gemstone >> - others > Ok to get a bit more concrete assume I have a simple inheritance as > in the example > > Object subclass: #ClosedFigure > instanceVariableNames: 'sideA sideB sideC alpha beta gamma' > classVariableNames: '' > poolDictionaries: '' > category: 'Pharo-Mailing-List-Example'! > > !ClosedFigure methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:21'! > area > ^0 ! ! > > !ClosedFigure methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:07'! > circumreference > ^ 0! ! > > > > Object subclass: #ModelLine > instanceVariableNames: 'length beginPoint endPoint' > classVariableNames: '' > poolDictionaries: '' > category: 'Pharo-Mailing-List-Example'! > > !ModelLine methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:09'! > beginPoint > ^ beginPoint! ! > > !ModelLine methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:09'! > beginPoint: anObject > beginPoint := anObject! ! > > !ModelLine methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:09'! > endPoint > ^ endPoint! ! > > !ModelLine methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:09'! > endPoint: anObject > endPoint := anObject! ! > > !ModelLine methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:09'! > length > ^ length! ! > > !ModelLine methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:09'! > length: anObject > length := anObject! ! > > > !ModelLine methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:19'! > initialize > super initialize. > length := 0.! ! > > "-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- "! > > ModelLine class > instanceVariableNames: ''! > > !ModelLine class methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 07:33'! > new: initialLength > ^ self new length: initialLength > ! ! > > > ClosedFigure subclass: #ModelRectangle > instanceVariableNames: 'lengthSideA lengthSideB' > classVariableNames: '' > poolDictionaries: '' > category: 'Pharo-Mailing-List-Example'! > > !ModelRectangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:31'! > lengthSideA > ^ lengthSideA! ! > > !ModelRectangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:31'! > lengthSideA: anObject > lengthSideA := anObject! ! > > !ModelRectangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:31'! > lengthSideB > ^ lengthSideB! ! > > !ModelRectangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:31'! > lengthSideB: anObject > lengthSideB := anObject! ! > > > !ModelRectangle methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:35'! > area > ^ lengthSideA * lengthSideB ! ! > > !ModelRectangle methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:32'! > lengthSideA: lenA lengthSideB: lenB > super initialize. > lengthSideA := lenA. > lengthSideB := lenB.! ! > > "-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- "! > > ModelRectangle class > instanceVariableNames: ''! > > !ModelRectangle class methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:39'! > lengthSideA: lenA lengthSideB: lenB > ^ self new lengthSideA: lenA lengthSideB: lenB.! ! > > > ClosedFigure subclass: #ModelTriangle > instanceVariableNames: 'height length' > classVariableNames: '' > poolDictionaries: '' > category: 'Pharo-Mailing-List-Example'! > > !ModelTriangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:51'! > area > ^ 1/2 * length * height ! ! > > !ModelTriangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:46'! > height > ^ height! ! > > !ModelTriangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:46'! > height: anObject > height := anObject! ! > > !ModelTriangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:46'! > length > ^ length! ! > > !ModelTriangle methodsFor: 'accessing' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:46'! > length: anObject > length := anObject! ! > > > !ModelTriangle methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:47'! > length: aLength height: aHeight > super initialize. > length := aLength. > height:= aHeight. ! ! > > "-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- "! > > ModelTriangle class > instanceVariableNames: ''! > > !ModelTriangle class methodsFor: 'as yet unclassified' stamp: 'FriedrichDominicus 4/8/2010 08:49'! > length: aLength height: aHeight > ^ self new length: aLength height: aHeight.! ! > > > > Now this is as simple as can be. I have a Parent and two derived > classes. How would I make this stuff persistent, and how would it look > in different persistence solutions. > > Let us assume. I would store the outline e.g in an OrderedCollection of > Lines or whatever. What about other "ClosedFigures" like e.g circles, > ellipses etc. How do I model inheritance in the diverse OR mappers. How > does that work in let's say > - Magma > - Glorp > - GemStone > - whatever you choose > > How would I query the database on let's side length of some lines of > the Closed Figure, or let's say I like to query a few closed figures on > their circumreference or area. > > Or asked anotherway. How is inheritance handled in the diverse > persistence tools.. > > Another question is how easy or difficult is it to have let's say > something like a person with addresses, phone numbers etc. > > How would I have to query let's say the street address of a certain > Person. e.g > > Regards > Friedrich > > -- > Q-Software Solutions GmbH; Sitz: Bruchsal; Registergericht: Mannheim > Registriernummer: HRB232138; Geschaeftsfuehrer: Friedrich Dominicus > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-users mailing list > Pharo-users(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-users

April 8, 2010