Stef, Do you mean better than VW or Pharo? Dolphin is damn good; the problem there is Windows itself. On technical grounds, VW is excellent. Its feature set is bigger than Dolphin's, and so is its price tag. When I first started getting very concerned about Microsoft's whims knocking me out of business, I contacted Cincom (or perhaps it was a predecessor??) and asked for a price. They literally asked me "what's it worth to you?" Whether that is scary or innovative, I'm not sure. It was not something I was ready to take the accountant du jour. Perhaps VW would have a community grow around it were it not for the runtime fees?? Just asking. The pricing model certainly stopped me from even trying to adopt it on Linux several years ago. Smalltalk/X and MT both have their followers, or at least had strong ones when I last looked: I didn't get it. X was unstable, and MT wasn't finished, IMHO. Again, that is old news at this point and would need to be re-evaluated. Bill ________________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr [pharo-project-bounces@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Stéphane Ducasse [stephane.ducasse@inria.fr] Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2010 4:02 PM To: Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Dear Santa ... let's start to get more political here: - first did VW ever considered any community? - second does it make sense not to change? - third what is a better smalltalk? Yes of course been fragmented is bad but this is like that. Stef On Dec 18, 2010, at 8:38 PM, Andreas Wacknitz wrote: