March 2016 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] Starting to add class comment and test on BlElements

by Sean P. DeNigris

IMHO if we keep the asserts, we should at least remove the duplication of repeating them in the comments. This will be a maintenance headache with little to no value added. ----- Cheers, Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Starting-to-add-class-comment-and-test-on-BlElements-… Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Developers mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

March 5, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Call about Numerical Methods in Pharo :)

by Eliot Miranda

Stef, > On Mar 5, 2016, at 12:10 AM, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: > > You probably leave in a protected environment but I do not live in the same. > Did you check numPy recently or R? momemtum? > Do you think that people do not know how to count? > In 1980 my students were not even born, so how can it be better than > python, java, c#, lua, ... > > Do you think that it makes me happy to see my old friends leaving our language and do node.js. > Seriously. > Why do you blame me? Frankly tell to leave Pharo and I will leave. I can tell you. > I think that I need a break in my life in this moment so it would be a good opportunity. > Because if each time I do something to improve the wealth and visibility of our system > I get such kind of feedback then may be this is the time to do something. > Afterall I may be wrong. > Seriously if you think that I'm not doing a good job and you want to stay with old friends > just let me know. but if I stay then do not tell me that I'm an asshole that does not want to > promote smalltalk. I do not blame you. I am offended by Pharo disavowing the Smalltalk name. I am offended when people state Pharo is not Smalltalk. I want to refute false assumptions about the name Smalltalk, such as the equating it with cobol. Instead of taking it personally why don't you address my points about older programming languages whose names (AFAICT) are not perceived negatively? I support this community and am excited to participate in it. I admire and respect your efforts, StÃ©phane, in developing, organizing and supporting this community. But that does not mean I will keep quiet about something I profoundly disagree with and think is wrong. And that thing is to deny Pharo is Smalltalk. And I do this not because I am a zealot, but because words meaning are important, because to understand each other we should call a spade a spade, and because I am grateful for and delighted by this thing called Smalltalk, and I will not support taking credit away from it. Ruby is inspired by Smalltalk. Pharo is the real thing. > Stef > > Le 5/3/16 02:18, Eliot Miranda a Ã©crit : >> >> >>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 12:08 PM, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: >>> >>>> SciPharo? Not so great news from my POV. >>>> What is so much pharo specific in this library? >>>> Is Smalltalk scientific community large enough for yet another split? >>> Split of what? Let us be tagged with a name of 1980 and die in peace. Yes this looks like a >>> smart move. >>> There are just Python and R and Javascript around (not talking about ruby and swift) >>> so this is a great move. We are not the cobol of object-oriented programming!! >> >> When I read sentiments like this it makes me want to leave the community. I find it so offensive that the Pharo community uses Smalltalk but wants to distance itself. It feels like theft or massive disrespect for the inventors of the language, or a complete lack of gratitude. >> >> C is older than Smalltalk and no one says "C is the cobol of low-level imperative languages". List is much older than C but no one wants to rename Lisp because it is perceived as old. >> >> Smalltalk is a beautiful name, carefully chosen to differentiate and identify the system as different, not arrogant, not hieroglyphic. Further, Smalltalkl /is/ different and distinctive materially. Why anyone would be ashamed of that incredible heritage and pervasive influence is beyond me. >> >> Offended, >> Eliot >

March 5, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Call about Numerical Methods in Pharo :)

by Ben Coman

On Sun, Mar 6, 2016 at 12:59 AM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: > On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 11:32 PM, Serge Stinckwich > <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >>> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Serge Stinckwich >>> <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 8:44 PM, Nicolas Cellier >>>> <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> 2016-03-04 19:51 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >>>>>> >>>>>> I personally never liked the name âSciSmalltalkâ. âSciPharoâ is much >>>>>> better in my opinion >>>>>> PhaNum is also okay to me. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> SciSmalltalk is ugly. >>>> >>>> I don't like the name either. We will find a better sexy name ! >>> >>> Just a random line of thought... >>> PhaNum --> NumPha --> numcha --> numchi >>> --> numqi "An energy around numbers" >>> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi >> >> Nice ! >> >> Any other ideas ? > > Well, since you asked... Another approach is to consider who the > biggest competitor is - the one you'd like to be compared to and would > like to beat. Maybe its Julia(?), which currently got some buzz. From > a cursory skim, its multiple dispatch, dynamic typing and Scheme & > Common Lisp influences [1] somewhat echoes Smalltalk. We have > similar facility as [2] to already inspect method bytecode and I > reckon we might(?) be able to provide a view of the JITed machine code > and might(?) be possible someday be able to hand-tune that machine > code, which would be good to promote our system as a similar > one-stop-shop as described in [2]. > > So... along the philosophy that when a fight is starting, you should > *first* punch the *biggest* guy on the nose... you could be > provocative and name it Gaston or Fatou [3], except then I discover > the Julia name apparently has nothing to do with Julia Sets [4]. > So.... maybe Julia --> Juliet --> Romeo --> { Romiio, Romiea, Romiia, > Rhomia } -- these being a selection of variations with high > goognique**. However, on the one hand, we'd need to gain the > credibility to back this up, but on the other hand, its not just about > punching some on the nose... such naming can be aspirational. The > research presented by Jim Collins in"Good To Great" advises its quite > beneficial to have an adversary you can compete against in a > *friendly* way. > > [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_(programming_language) > [2] http://www.evanmiller.org/why-im-betting-on-julia.html > [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_set > [4] http://stackoverflow.com/questions/29290780/what-does-the-name-of-julia-the… > > ** My this instant newly contrived portmanteau for "google unique". And btw, it might be good to pick the eyes out of this discussion on Julia for points where do (or will) align and use similar language to promote our Numqi/Abacii system. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7109982 cheers -ben

March 5, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Call about Numerical Methods in Pharo :)

by Ben Coman

On Sun, Mar 6, 2016 at 12:57 AM, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > >> On Mar 5, 2016, at 7:34 AM, Serge Stinckwich <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> I was thinking as this name : Abacus >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abacus >> A calculating tool ! > > Good! But "abacus" --> 18,000,000 results, is not goognique. Maybe a variation "abacii" --> 2,800 results, as in "more than one calculating tool". cheers -ben >> >> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >>> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Serge Stinckwich >>> <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 8:44 PM, Nicolas Cellier >>>> <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> 2016-03-04 19:51 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >>>>>> >>>>>> I personally never liked the name âSciSmalltalkâ. âSciPharoâ is much >>>>>> better in my opinion >>>>>> PhaNum is also okay to me. >>>>> >>>>> SciSmalltalk is ugly. >>>> >>>> I don't like the name either. We will find a better sexy name ! >>> >>> Just a random line of thought... >>> PhaNum --> NumPha --> numcha --> numchi >>> --> numqi "An energy around numbers" >>> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi >>> >>> cheers -ben >>> >>>>> Currently, there is no package named SciSmalltalk. >>>>> SciSmalltalk is just: >>>>> - an aggregate of packages (a metacello configuration) >>>>> - a repository (github + Smalltalkhub) >>>> >>>> SciSmalltalk is a bit more than just a few packages ... >>>> We have tests, we have a CI job, we have a book. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Serge Stinckwich >>>> UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) >>>> Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk >>>> http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >> >> >> >> -- >> Serge Stinckwich >> UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) >> Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk >> http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >> >

March 5, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Call about Numerical Methods in Pharo :)

by Ben Coman

On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 11:32 PM, Serge Stinckwich <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Serge Stinckwich >> <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 8:44 PM, Nicolas Cellier >>> <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> 2016-03-04 19:51 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >>>>> >>>>> I personally never liked the name âSciSmalltalkâ. âSciPharoâ is much >>>>> better in my opinion >>>>> PhaNum is also okay to me. >>>>> >>>> >>>> SciSmalltalk is ugly. >>> >>> I don't like the name either. We will find a better sexy name ! >> >> Just a random line of thought... >> PhaNum --> NumPha --> numcha --> numchi >> --> numqi "An energy around numbers" >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi > > Nice ! > > Any other ideas ? Well, since you asked... Another approach is to consider who the biggest competitor is - the one you'd like to be compared to and would like to beat. Maybe its Julia(?), which currently got some buzz. From a cursory skim, its multiple dispatch, dynamic typing and Scheme & Common Lisp influences [1] somewhat echoes Smalltalk. We have similar facility as [2] to already inspect method bytecode and I reckon we might(?) be able to provide a view of the JITed machine code and might(?) be possible someday be able to hand-tune that machine code, which would be good to promote our system as a similar one-stop-shop as described in [2]. So... along the philosophy that when a fight is starting, you should *first* punch the *biggest* guy on the nose... you could be provocative and name it Gaston or Fatou [3], except then I discover the Julia name apparently has nothing to do with Julia Sets [4]. So.... maybe Julia --> Juliet --> Romeo --> { Romiio, Romiea, Romiia, Rhomia } -- these being a selection of variations with high goognique**. However, on the one hand, we'd need to gain the credibility to back this up, but on the other hand, its not just about punching some on the nose... such naming can be aspirational. The research presented by Jim Collins in"Good To Great" advises its quite beneficial to have an adversary you can compete against in a *friendly* way. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_(programming_language) [2] http://www.evanmiller.org/why-im-betting-on-julia.html [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_set [4] http://stackoverflow.com/questions/29290780/what-does-the-name-of-julia-the… ** My this instant newly contrived portmanteau for "google unique".

March 5, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Call about Numerical Methods in Pharo :)

by Eliot Miranda

> On Mar 5, 2016, at 7:34 AM, Serge Stinckwich <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > I was thinking as this name : Abacus > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abacus > A calculating tool ! Good! > > On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Serge Stinckwich >> <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 8:44 PM, Nicolas Cellier >>> <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> 2016-03-04 19:51 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >>>>> >>>>> I personally never liked the name âSciSmalltalkâ. âSciPharoâ is much >>>>> better in my opinion >>>>> PhaNum is also okay to me. >>>> >>>> SciSmalltalk is ugly. >>> >>> I don't like the name either. We will find a better sexy name ! >> >> Just a random line of thought... >> PhaNum --> NumPha --> numcha --> numchi >> --> numqi "An energy around numbers" >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi >> >> cheers -ben >> >>>> Currently, there is no package named SciSmalltalk. >>>> SciSmalltalk is just: >>>> - an aggregate of packages (a metacello configuration) >>>> - a repository (github + Smalltalkhub) >>> >>> SciSmalltalk is a bit more than just a few packages ... >>> We have tests, we have a CI job, we have a book. >>> >>> -- >>> Serge Stinckwich >>> UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) >>> Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk >>> http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ > > > > -- > Serge Stinckwich > UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) > Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk > http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >

March 5, 2016

accepting in the GTPanel does not save the modified code

by stepharo

Hi I was fixing all the return: Point and other in bloc using GTSpotter but it does not work since accepting in the code panel does not recompile the code. Stef

March 5, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Call about Numerical Methods in Pharo :)

by Serge Stinckwich

On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:48 PM, Yuriy Tymchuk <yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com> wrote: > Or we can use the name from other languages like LiczydÅo in Polish :) I have some Polish ancestors, but I'm not sure people will remember the name of the project ;-) > >> On 05 Mar 2016, at 16:34, Serge Stinckwich <Serge.Stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> I was thinking as this name : Abacus >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abacus >> A calculating tool ! >> >> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >>> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Serge Stinckwich >>> <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 8:44 PM, Nicolas Cellier >>>> <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> 2016-03-04 19:51 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >>>>>> >>>>>> I personally never liked the name âSciSmalltalkâ. âSciPharoâ is much >>>>>> better in my opinion >>>>>> PhaNum is also okay to me. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> SciSmalltalk is ugly. >>>> >>>> I don't like the name either. We will find a better sexy name ! >>> >>> Just a random line of thought... >>> PhaNum --> NumPha --> numcha --> numchi >>> --> numqi "An energy around numbers" >>> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi >>> >>> cheers -ben >>> >>>>> Currently, there is no package named SciSmalltalk. >>>>> SciSmalltalk is just: >>>>> - an aggregate of packages (a metacello configuration) >>>>> - a repository (github + Smalltalkhub) >>>> >>>> SciSmalltalk is a bit more than just a few packages ... >>>> We have tests, we have a CI job, we have a book. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Serge Stinckwich >>>> UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) >>>> Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk >>>> http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >>>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Serge Stinckwich >> UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) >> Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk >> http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >> > > -- Serge Stinckwich UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/

March 5, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Call about Numerical Methods in Pharo :)

by Yuriy Tymchuk

Or we can use the name from other languages like LiczydÅo in Polish :) > On 05 Mar 2016, at 16:34, Serge Stinckwich <Serge.Stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > I was thinking as this name : Abacus > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abacus > A calculating tool ! > > On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Serge Stinckwich >> <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 8:44 PM, Nicolas Cellier >>> <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> 2016-03-04 19:51 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >>>>> >>>>> I personally never liked the name âSciSmalltalkâ. âSciPharoâ is much >>>>> better in my opinion >>>>> PhaNum is also okay to me. >>>>> >>>> >>>> SciSmalltalk is ugly. >>> >>> I don't like the name either. We will find a better sexy name ! >> >> Just a random line of thought... >> PhaNum --> NumPha --> numcha --> numchi >> --> numqi "An energy around numbers" >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi >> >> cheers -ben >> >>>> Currently, there is no package named SciSmalltalk. >>>> SciSmalltalk is just: >>>> - an aggregate of packages (a metacello configuration) >>>> - a repository (github + Smalltalkhub) >>> >>> SciSmalltalk is a bit more than just a few packages ... >>> We have tests, we have a CI job, we have a book. >>> >>> -- >>> Serge Stinckwich >>> UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) >>> Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk >>> http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >>> >> > > > > -- > Serge Stinckwich > UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) > Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk > http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >

March 5, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Call about Numerical Methods in Pharo :)

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

> On 05 Mar 2016, at 16:34, Serge Stinckwich <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > I was thinking as this name : Abacus > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abacus > A calculating tool ! I like that one (BTW, thanks for doing this project, Serge & Co, these higher level, domain specific projects are really very important) > On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >> On Sat, Mar 5, 2016 at 4:14 AM, Serge Stinckwich >> <serge.stinckwich(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> On Fri, Mar 4, 2016 at 8:44 PM, Nicolas Cellier >>> <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> 2016-03-04 19:51 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >>>>> >>>>> I personally never liked the name âSciSmalltalkâ. âSciPharoâ is much >>>>> better in my opinion >>>>> PhaNum is also okay to me. >>>>> >>>> >>>> SciSmalltalk is ugly. >>> >>> I don't like the name either. We will find a better sexy name ! >> >> Just a random line of thought... >> PhaNum --> NumPha --> numcha --> numchi >> --> numqi "An energy around numbers" >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qi >> >> cheers -ben >> >>>> Currently, there is no package named SciSmalltalk. >>>> SciSmalltalk is just: >>>> - an aggregate of packages (a metacello configuration) >>>> - a repository (github + Smalltalkhub) >>> >>> SciSmalltalk is a bit more than just a few packages ... >>> We have tests, we have a CI job, we have a book. >>> >>> -- >>> Serge Stinckwich >>> UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) >>> Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk >>> http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >>> >> > > > > -- > Serge Stinckwich > UCBN & UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC) > Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk > http://www.doesnotunderstand.org/ >

March 5, 2016