April 2015 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] Ways to do 32-bit arithmetics?

by Stefan Marr

Hi Eliot: > On 03 Apr 2015, at 16:47, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > if seed is Andes with 16rffffffff when it is initialized then the Java code can be used to generate the next value and the sign conversion only applied once to yield the next value. That would eliminate lots of conversions and make the code readable, right? Sorry, I donât understand you. In the Java code the `0xffffffff` is redundant/superfluous. Itâs there because I ported the code from JavaScript. The important part is that Java has signed 32bit integers. So, it works as expected out of the box. The SOM version shows the explicit operations you need if you donât have any knowledge about the underlying integer representation. In most SOM implementations, integers happen to be represented as 64bit values, that overflow into some form of big/large integer representations. The sign-related operations are necessary to get the correct shift and overflow semantics. I guess I could implement it easily on a 64-bit Spur image, but I havenât looked into that yet. Marcusâ comment looks also useful, but it is going to be very slowâ¦ Best regards Stefan -- Stefan Marr INRIA Lille - Nord Europe http://stefan-marr.de/research/

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Ways to do 32-bit arithmetics?

by Eliot Miranda

Ah, you also need the sign conversion applied to the uses of seed in right shifts, but that's still a simplification. Eliot (phone) On Apr 3, 2015, at 7:15 AM, Stefan Marr <smalltalk(a)stefan-marr.de> wrote: > Hi: > > I am porting some benchmarks to Pharo, which rely on a deterministic random number generator that uses 32 bit values. > > In order to have properly comparable results across platforms, it needs to generated the same sequence of numbers. > > So, I am looking for efficient ways to implement it, any ideas? > I am a little at a loss, with SmallInts and Long Ints, how to get the proper 32-bit values, and how to apply the correct shifts, especially the right shift can be problematic. > > Code examples below. > > Thanks > Stefan > > In Java it looks like this: > > private static int seed; > > // Robert Jenkins' 32 bit integer hash function. > public static int random() { > seed = ((seed + 0x7ed55d16) + (seed << 12)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed ^ 0xc761c23c) ^ (seed >>> 19)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0x165667b1) + (seed << 5)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0xd3a2646c) ^ (seed << 9)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0xfd7046c5) + (seed << 3)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed ^ 0xb55a4f09) ^ (seed >>> 16)) & 0xffffffff; > return seed; > } > > > In SOM Smalltalk, it looks like this: > > > JenkinsRandom = ( > ---- > | seed | > > seed: val = ( seed := val ) > > "Robert Jenkins' 32 bit integer hash function." > random = ( > seed := ((seed + 2127912214 "0x7ed55d16") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 12) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed bitXor: 3345072700 "0xc761c23c") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue >>> 19)) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 374761393 "0x165667B1") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 5) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 3550635116 "0xd3a2646c") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 9) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 4251993797 "0xfd7046c5") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 3) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed bitXor: 3042594569 "0xb55a4f09") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue >>> 16)) as32BitSignedValue. > ^ seed > ) > ) > > -- > Stefan Marr > INRIA Lille - Nord Europe > http://stefan-marr.de/research/ > > > >

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Ways to do 32-bit arithmetics?

by Eliot Miranda

Hi Stefan, if seed is Andes with 16rffffffff when it is initialized then the Java code can be used to generate the next value and the sign conversion only applied once to yield the next value. That would eliminate lots of conversions and make the code readable, right? Eliot (phone) On Apr 3, 2015, at 7:15 AM, Stefan Marr <smalltalk(a)stefan-marr.de> wrote: > Hi: > > I am porting some benchmarks to Pharo, which rely on a deterministic random number generator that uses 32 bit values. > > In order to have properly comparable results across platforms, it needs to generated the same sequence of numbers. > > So, I am looking for efficient ways to implement it, any ideas? > I am a little at a loss, with SmallInts and Long Ints, how to get the proper 32-bit values, and how to apply the correct shifts, especially the right shift can be problematic. > > Code examples below. > > Thanks > Stefan > > In Java it looks like this: > > private static int seed; > > // Robert Jenkins' 32 bit integer hash function. > public static int random() { > seed = ((seed + 0x7ed55d16) + (seed << 12)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed ^ 0xc761c23c) ^ (seed >>> 19)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0x165667b1) + (seed << 5)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0xd3a2646c) ^ (seed << 9)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0xfd7046c5) + (seed << 3)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed ^ 0xb55a4f09) ^ (seed >>> 16)) & 0xffffffff; > return seed; > } > > > In SOM Smalltalk, it looks like this: > > > JenkinsRandom = ( > ---- > | seed | > > seed: val = ( seed := val ) > > "Robert Jenkins' 32 bit integer hash function." > random = ( > seed := ((seed + 2127912214 "0x7ed55d16") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 12) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed bitXor: 3345072700 "0xc761c23c") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue >>> 19)) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 374761393 "0x165667B1") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 5) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 3550635116 "0xd3a2646c") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 9) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 4251993797 "0xfd7046c5") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 3) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed bitXor: 3042594569 "0xb55a4f09") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue >>> 16)) as32BitSignedValue. > ^ seed > ) > ) > > -- > Stefan Marr > INRIA Lille - Nord Europe > http://stefan-marr.de/research/ > > > >

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions

by kilon alios

" It's not as if someone would ask for an OS/2 or a Motif UI theme! There are *LOTS* of people on Windows still !" That is irrelevant really . Thats not how open source works. In open source something maintained or goes in or stays in because someone bothers to code for it. You may get 1 billion users to complain about this and still it wont change a thing. You still need a developer to do the work. Most open source devs like to work on things that they really care about. And is not as if things are better for MacOS user, the watery theme looks very dated , ugly and it is not even compatible with the new dark theme. So in the end it makes sense to use one of the recent themes, either white or dark. Also you are the first to complain about this.If you want to get this fixed the easiest way is to fix it yourself as third party library and add it to the configuration browser for others to use. If you expect for someone else to fix it, you may have to wait for decades and no it wont matter if you get a billion users to agree with you and sign a petition. How many people you think asked for a blue theme in this mailing list ? none . Pharo now has a blue theme because of me, and has no windows theme with so many windows users. How many people use the blue them ? most likely only me. Thats how open source works I am afraid, dont blame Pharo, blame life and the reality we live in :)

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions

by Marcus Denker

> On 03 Apr 2015, at 16:19, Hilaire <hilaire(a)drgeo.eu> wrote: > > Oh, but wait a minute: W2K was not present in Pharo3, only Vistary was > there, but removed. > right, we removed W2K already for Pharo3. Itâs 2015... > Hilaire > > Le 03/04/2015 16:16, Hilaire a Ã©crit : >> Le 03/04/2015 15:56, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-dev a Ã©crit : >>> I can perfectly understand that "not everything has to be in the >>> image" and that, ultimately, someone has to maintain that code. The >>> only problem I have with the removal of that theme is that more than >>> 55% of users are running some flavor of Windows. It's not as if >>> someone would ask for an OS/2 or a Motif UI theme! There are *LOTS* >>> of people on Windows still ! >>> >> Hi Benoit, >> >> I agree with you this window theme may have its usefulness in >> professional desktop application for Pharo[1]. But Desktop application >> is not really the priority and I am afraid you are own your own. In the >> other hand it should be doable to maintain it as a separate package. >> >> Hilaire >> >> [1] You can even still see in operation kind of DOS like operated >> application, mainly because it is handy for users. I guess Windows theme >> can serve the same purpose, may be this is what Benoit is explaining about. >> > > > -- > Dr. Geo - http://drgeo.eu > iStoa - http://istoa.drgeo.eu > > >

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions

by Esteban Lorenzano

lot of time ago we decided *not* to pretend imitate any OS L&F, because is first a lot of work, and second a lose of time: they do not fit, and if you want to make them fit for real you need to spend *really* much time there (and you probably will fail anyway). Themes remained there without being maintained and they started to break. As no one uses it, no one noticed :) So we started to remove them. Nowâ¦ I would like to not just remove anything, but to move them to a graveyard, where it can be revived by any necromancer who wants to give them a try. We need to improve there. w2k theme wasâ¦ old. Didnât fit with any current L&F, not windows either. So, if you used the w2k theme just because of the icons (and alsoâ¦ I have to say it: windows and mac *is not* the same: windows is plenty of home-made L&F that does not respect any design ruleâ¦ mac is not like that). But well, coming back: if you want that old theme just for the icons, I just recommend you to take current theme and modify it to have the icons where you want (should not be so difficult). In the long term, it will be a lot more maintainable :) cheers, Esteban > On 03 Apr 2015, at 16:07, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > >> On 03 Apr 2015, at 15:57, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-dev <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> wrote: >> >> >> Date: 3 Apr 2015 15:53:56 CEST >> From: Benoit St-Jean <bstjean(a)yahoo.com> >> Reply-To: Benoit St-Jean <bstjean(a)yahoo.com> >> To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> >> Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions >> >> >> Kilon, >> >> I can perfectly understand that "not everything has to be in the image" and that, ultimately, someone has to maintain that code. The only problem I have with the removal of that theme is that more than 55% of users are running some flavor of Windows. It's not as if someone would ask for an OS/2 or a Motif UI theme! There are *LOTS* of people on Windows still ! > > There is no such thing as *one* Windows look (or version), there are many: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Windows#Usage_share > > We simply cannot maintain them, nor do we want to. > > Note that we do not maintain any other platform specific look&feels. > >> ----------------- >> Benoit St-Jean >> Yahoo! Messenger: bstjean >> Twitter: @BenLeChialeux >> Pinterest: benoitstjean >> IRC: lamneth >> Blogue: endormitoire.wordpress.com >> "A standpoint is an intellectual horizon of radius zero". (A. Einstein) >> >> From: kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> >> To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> >> Sent: Friday, April 3, 2015 9:25 AM >> Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions >> >> >> >> >> "The point is, every piece of code needs to be written and maintained which takes time and energy from other activities." >> >> >> I completely agree with you. I have zero issues of main pharo developers kicking out libraries that are not so much used by pharo users. Those libraries are perfectly capable of existing as third party. >> >> I also love the plan to make pharo modular, remove libraries from inside and make it easy to install. This way each one of us can easily make an image tailor made for his/her needs. Each pharo user is an individual with individual needs. >> >> Installing libraries is dead easy with the Configuration Browser , including their dependencies , just one click away. >> >> Of course that leaves whos going to maintain that stuff. I agree with Marcus here, "you want it in pharo , code it".The theme support in Pharo is very powerful , I know because I created my own custom blue theme and a tool to allow easy customization of theme colors with zero coding (Nireas). I expected that by now Nireas would be replaced by another way more powerful theme manager but it has not. Why ? Not because my theme manager is very good, but because the community is just too small. I love using my blue theme and fits perfect to my taste and needs ;) >> >> In the end no code can be more personal than the code you create. >> >> There is no need for everything to exist inside the image , great things can exist outside too. All it needs people who really care about pharo by coding for it. >> >> >> >> >> > >

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Ways to do 32-bit arithmetics?

by Marcus Denker

There is ThirtyTwoBitRegister â I represent a 32-bit register. An instance of me can hold any non-negative integer in the range [0..(2^32 - 1)]. Operations are performed on my contents in place, like a hardware register, and results are always modulo 2^32. This class is primarily meant for use by the SecureHashAlgorithm class. " > On 03 Apr 2015, at 16:15, Stefan Marr <smalltalk(a)stefan-marr.de> wrote: > > Hi: > > I am porting some benchmarks to Pharo, which rely on a deterministic random number generator that uses 32 bit values. > > In order to have properly comparable results across platforms, it needs to generated the same sequence of numbers. > > So, I am looking for efficient ways to implement it, any ideas? > I am a little at a loss, with SmallInts and Long Ints, how to get the proper 32-bit values, and how to apply the correct shifts, especially the right shift can be problematic. > > Code examples below. > > Thanks > Stefan > > In Java it looks like this: > > private static int seed; > > // Robert Jenkins' 32 bit integer hash function. > public static int random() { > seed = ((seed + 0x7ed55d16) + (seed << 12)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed ^ 0xc761c23c) ^ (seed >>> 19)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0x165667b1) + (seed << 5)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0xd3a2646c) ^ (seed << 9)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed + 0xfd7046c5) + (seed << 3)) & 0xffffffff; > seed = ((seed ^ 0xb55a4f09) ^ (seed >>> 16)) & 0xffffffff; > return seed; > } > > > In SOM Smalltalk, it looks like this: > > > JenkinsRandom = ( > ---- > | seed | > > seed: val = ( seed := val ) > > "Robert Jenkins' 32 bit integer hash function." > random = ( > seed := ((seed + 2127912214 "0x7ed55d16") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 12) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed bitXor: 3345072700 "0xc761c23c") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue >>> 19)) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 374761393 "0x165667B1") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 5) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 3550635116 "0xd3a2646c") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 9) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed + 4251993797 "0xfd7046c5") + (seed as32BitUnsignedValue << 3) as32BitSignedValue) as32BitSignedValue. > seed := ((seed bitXor: 3042594569 "0xb55a4f09") bitXor: (seed as32BitUnsignedValue >>> 16)) as32BitSignedValue. > ^ seed > ) > ) > > -- > Stefan Marr > INRIA Lille - Nord Europe > http://stefan-marr.de/research/ > > > >

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions

by Hilaire

Oh, but wait a minute: W2K was not present in Pharo3, only Vistary was there, but removed. Hilaire Le 03/04/2015 16:16, Hilaire a Ã©crit : > Le 03/04/2015 15:56, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-dev a Ã©crit : >> I can perfectly understand that "not everything has to be in the >> image" and that, ultimately, someone has to maintain that code. The >> only problem I have with the removal of that theme is that more than >> 55% of users are running some flavor of Windows. It's not as if >> someone would ask for an OS/2 or a Motif UI theme! There are *LOTS* >> of people on Windows still ! >> > Hi Benoit, > > I agree with you this window theme may have its usefulness in > professional desktop application for Pharo[1]. But Desktop application > is not really the priority and I am afraid you are own your own. In the > other hand it should be doable to maintain it as a separate package. > > Hilaire > > [1] You can even still see in operation kind of DOS like operated > application, mainly because it is handy for users. I guess Windows theme > can serve the same purpose, may be this is what Benoit is explaining about. > -- Dr. Geo - http://drgeo.eu iStoa - http://istoa.drgeo.eu

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions

by Hilaire

Le 03/04/2015 15:56, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-dev a Ã©crit : > > I can perfectly understand that "not everything has to be in the > image" and that, ultimately, someone has to maintain that code. The > only problem I have with the removal of that theme is that more than > 55% of users are running some flavor of Windows. It's not as if > someone would ask for an OS/2 or a Motif UI theme! There are *LOTS* > of people on Windows still ! > Hi Benoit, I agree with you this window theme may have its usefulness in professional desktop application for Pharo[1]. But Desktop application is not really the priority and I am afraid you are own your own. In the other hand it should be doable to maintain it as a separate package. Hilaire [1] You can even still see in operation kind of DOS like operated application, mainly because it is handy for users. I guess Windows theme can serve the same purpose, may be this is what Benoit is explaining about. -- Dr. Geo - http://drgeo.eu iStoa - http://istoa.drgeo.eu

April 3, 2015

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions

by Peter UhnÃ¡k

If you want to argue about usage, this is probably more appropriate http://strawpoll.me/4001583/r (though Linux numbers are in reallity somewhat lower due to desktop+server) The bottom line is: nobody (from ~third of Pharo users) really cared until now so the options I see: 1. open an issue in Pharo issue tracker 2. a) write it yourself, or 2. b) ask someone who is interested in themes to write it If nothing fundamental changed in theming in Pharo 4, than moving the buttons around should take an evening with bottle of beer at most. If you want it in the default theme but customizable, that may take more, but it would be interesting. If you want the whole Windows theme than that may be a bit more. Peter On Fri, Apr 3, 2015 at 4:07 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > > On 03 Apr 2015, at 15:57, Benoit St-Jean via Pharo-dev < > pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> wrote: > > > > > > Date: 3 Apr 2015 15:53:56 CEST > > From: Benoit St-Jean <bstjean(a)yahoo.com> > > Reply-To: Benoit St-Jean <bstjean(a)yahoo.com> > > To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> > > Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions > > > > > > Kilon, > > > > I can perfectly understand that "not everything has to be in the image" > and that, ultimately, someone has to maintain that code. The only problem > I have with the removal of that theme is that more than 55% of users are > running some flavor of Windows. It's not as if someone would ask for an > OS/2 or a Motif UI theme! There are *LOTS* of people on Windows still ! > > There is no such thing as *one* Windows look (or version), there are many: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Windows#Usage_share > > We simply cannot maintain them, nor do we want to. > > Note that we do not maintain any other platform specific look&feels. > > > ----------------- > > Benoit St-Jean > > Yahoo! Messenger: bstjean > > Twitter: @BenLeChialeux > > Pinterest: benoitstjean > > IRC: lamneth > > Blogue: endormitoire.wordpress.com > > "A standpoint is an intellectual horizon of radius zero". (A. Einstein) > > > > From: kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> > > To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> > > Sent: Friday, April 3, 2015 9:25 AM > > Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 4 Beta, first impressions > > > > > > > > > > "The point is, every piece of code needs to be written and maintained > which takes time and energy from other activities." > > > > > > I completely agree with you. I have zero issues of main pharo developers > kicking out libraries that are not so much used by pharo users. Those > libraries are perfectly capable of existing as third party. > > > > I also love the plan to make pharo modular, remove libraries from inside > and make it easy to install. This way each one of us can easily make an > image tailor made for his/her needs. Each pharo user is an individual with > individual needs. > > > > Installing libraries is dead easy with the Configuration Browser , > including their dependencies , just one click away. > > > > Of course that leaves whos going to maintain that stuff. I agree with > Marcus here, "you want it in pharo , code it".The theme support in Pharo is > very powerful , I know because I created my own custom blue theme and a > tool to allow easy customization of theme colors with zero coding (Nireas). > I expected that by now Nireas would be replaced by another way more > powerful theme manager but it has not. Why ? Not because my theme manager > is very good, but because the community is just too small. I love using my > blue theme and fits perfect to my taste and needs ;) > > > > In the end no code can be more personal than the code you create. > > > > There is no need for everything to exist inside the image , great things > can exist outside too. All it needs people who really care about pharo by > coding for it. > > > > > > > > > > > > >

April 3, 2015