September 2012 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] instVarNames vs instVarNamed:

by Camillo Bruni

On 2012-09-23, at 23:33, Peter Hugosson-Miller <oldmanlink(a)gmail.com> wrote: > This is weird, I'm not seeing the problem at all! > > I've always thought of *#instVarNamed:* as a sibling method to > *#instVarAt:*(which maybe is more obviously an instance method). So > *anAddress instVarNamed: 'street'* would return a Street, just as *anAddress > instVarAt: 2* could. But anAddress, being just an instance, doesn't need to > know about its class definition directly, since it can always ask its class > if it needs to, so for example *anAddress class instVarNames* would return > the names of all the instance variables defined in the Address class. > > Now can someone please explain why that is confusing? I don't see the problem either :P...

Sept. 23, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] instVarNames vs instVarNamed:

by Peter Hugosson-Miller

This is weird, I'm not seeing the problem at all! I've always thought of *#instVarNamed:* as a sibling method to *#instVarAt:*(which maybe is more obviously an instance method). So *anAddress instVarNamed: 'street'* would return a Street, just as *anAddress instVarAt: 2* could. But anAddress, being just an instance, doesn't need to know about its class definition directly, since it can always ask its class if it needs to, so for example *anAddress class instVarNames* would return the names of all the instance variables defined in the Address class. Now can someone please explain why that is confusing? -- Cheers, Peter On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 10:59 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck < marianopeck(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 6:55 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse < > stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > >> since groups is an instance variable on the class side >> >> >> Nautilus class instVarNames >> -> #('maxSize' 'cachedLastClasses' 'groups') >> >> ok we get the instance variables >> >> so it was strange that the class could not find the instance variable >> using instVarNamed: >> >> Nautilus class instVarNamed: 'groups' >> -> error >> >> I was confused. >> >> > Looks strange to me as well. I would like that it actually works :) > > >> >> Stef >> >> >> On Sep 23, 2012, at 5:42 PM, Camillo Bruni wrote: >> >> > >> > On 2012-09-23, at 17:38, Benjamin <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> >> On a class, should answer the inst of the corresponding metaclass >> >> >> >> Like when you ask the inst var of an instance, you get the inst var of >> the corresponding class >> >> >> >> Ben >> > >> > but that works...., I don't get it :D >> > >> > >> > >> > Nautilus instVarNamed: #maxSize >> > Nautilus new instVarNamed: #announcer >> > >> > and: >> > >> > Nautilus class instVarNames includes: #maxSize. >> > Nautilus instVarNames includes: #announcer. >> > >> > >> > everything fine and symmetrical here... >> >> >> > > > -- > Mariano > http://marianopeck.wordpress.com > >

Sept. 23, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] instVarNames vs instVarNamed:

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 6:55 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr > wrote: > since groups is an instance variable on the class side > > > Nautilus class instVarNames > -> #('maxSize' 'cachedLastClasses' 'groups') > > ok we get the instance variables > > so it was strange that the class could not find the instance variable > using instVarNamed: > > Nautilus class instVarNamed: 'groups' > -> error > > I was confused. > > Looks strange to me as well. I would like that it actually works :) > > Stef > > > On Sep 23, 2012, at 5:42 PM, Camillo Bruni wrote: > > > > > On 2012-09-23, at 17:38, Benjamin <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > >> On a class, should answer the inst of the corresponding metaclass > >> > >> Like when you ask the inst var of an instance, you get the inst var of > the corresponding class > >> > >> Ben > > > > but that works...., I don't get it :D > > > > > > > > Nautilus instVarNamed: #maxSize > > Nautilus new instVarNamed: #announcer > > > > and: > > > > Nautilus class instVarNames includes: #maxSize. > > Nautilus instVarNames includes: #announcer. > > > > > > everything fine and symmetrical here... > > > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Sept. 23, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] instVarNames vs instVarNamed:

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

since groups is an instance variable on the class side Nautilus class instVarNames -> #('maxSize' 'cachedLastClasses' 'groups') ok we get the instance variables so it was strange that the class could not find the instance variable using instVarNamed: Nautilus class instVarNamed: 'groups' -> error I was confused. Stef On Sep 23, 2012, at 5:42 PM, Camillo Bruni wrote: > > On 2012-09-23, at 17:38, Benjamin <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> On a class, should answer the inst of the corresponding metaclass >> >> Like when you ask the inst var of an instance, you get the inst var of the corresponding class >> >> Ben > > but that works...., I don't get it :D > > > > Nautilus instVarNamed: #maxSize > Nautilus new instVarNamed: #announcer > > and: > > Nautilus class instVarNames includes: #maxSize. > Nautilus instVarNames includes: #announcer. > > > everything fine and symmetrical here...

Sept. 23, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] I found this highly relevant to Pharo :)

by Benjamin

" It's COBOL so we can say it's automatically ugly " Told ya ;) Ben On Sep 23, 2012, at 6:38 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: > http://www.infoq.com/presentations/Ugly-Code > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. >

Sept. 23, 2012

[Pharo-project] I found this highly relevant to Pharo :)

by Igor Stasenko

http://www.infoq.com/presentations/Ugly-Code -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Sept. 23, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] instVarNames vs instVarNamed:

by Camillo Bruni

On 2012-09-23, at 17:38, Benjamin <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On a class, should answer the inst of the corresponding metaclass > > Like when you ask the inst var of an instance, you get the inst var of the corresponding class > > Ben but that works...., I don't get it :D Nautilus instVarNamed: #maxSize Nautilus new instVarNamed: #announcer and: Nautilus class instVarNames includes: #maxSize. Nautilus instVarNames includes: #announcer. everything fine and symmetrical here...

Sept. 23, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] instVarNames vs instVarNamed:

by Benjamin

On a class, should answer the inst of the corresponding metaclass Like when you ask the inst var of an instance, you get the inst var of the corresponding class Ben On Sep 23, 2012, at 5:15 PM, Camillo Bruni wrote: >> instVarNamed: is implemented on Object this is why it looks into the object class. >> but reimplementing on Class would make sense. > > I don't see any problem here, besides the maybe confusing names... > > #instVarNamed: works on class-side as well, used to read the values in the living > instance. > > What would your #instVarNamed: do?

Sept. 23, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] instVarNames vs instVarNamed:

by Camillo Bruni

> instVarNamed: is implemented on Object this is why it looks into the object class. > but reimplementing on Class would make sense. I don't see any problem here, besides the maybe confusing names... #instVarNamed: works on class-side as well, used to read the values in the living instance. What would your #instVarNamed: do?

Sept. 23, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] instVarNames vs instVarNamed:

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

yes I know. instVarNamed: is implemented on Object this is why it looks into the object class. but reimplementing on Class would make sense. Stef On Sep 23, 2012, at 2:06 PM, Benjamin wrote: > It's not a class var, it's an inst var of the meta class > > > Ben > On Sep 23, 2012, at 1:27 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: > >> On 23 September 2012 12:16, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >>> may be this is too early but I wanted to change the value of a class instance variable >>> >>> Nautilus class instVarNames >>> -> #('maxSize' 'cachedLastClasses' 'groups') >>> >>> Nautilus class instVarNamed: 'groups' >>> -> error >>> >>> Nautilus instVarNamed: 'groups' >>> worked >>> >>> I found that strange and inconsistent. >>> I'am wrong? >>> >> >> nope. i never tried to access class instance vars using this.. >> but it is strange, it should work. >> >>> Stef >> >> >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. >> > >

Sept. 23, 2012