February 2012 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] Nautilus Refactorings

by Tudor Girba

Hi Ben, He means that ConfigurationOfNautilus should specify all dependencies. For example, it should specify RPackage as dependency. Cheers, Doru On Tue, Feb 21, 2012 at 10:06 AM, Benjamin <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Something like ConfigurationOfNautilus ? > > > I do not get it > > > Ben > > On Feb 21, 2012, at 9:53 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: > >> >> On Feb 21, 2012, at 9:46 AM, Benjamin wrote: >> >>> A configuration for ? >> >> nautilus so that it loads automatically everything it needs in a core 1.4 >> >>> >>> >>> Ben >>> >>> On Feb 21, 2012, at 8:21 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> On Feb 20, 2012, at 11:33 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: >>>> >>>>> One last thing: when you type the name of a class somewhere and you do a cmd+b I think it would be much better if Nautilus open the "normal" browser and not "hierarchy" one. >>>> >>>> having cmd+h for hierarchy would be great :) >>>> >>>> Ben we should produce a configuration because this is important. >>>> What you can do is at least load the baseline and snapshot only when you will release on version for 1.4 and 1.5 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 8:38 PM, Benjamin <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> To be honest, if it works, I do not want to lose my time on Configuration >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> It shouldn't be done by hand, but generated by a tool :) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Ben >>>>> >>>>> On Feb 20, 2012, at 8:06 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 6:39 PM, Benjamin <benjamin.vanryseghem.pharo(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> Hello guys, >>>>>> >>>>>> I know a some of you are waiting for the integration of the RB engine into Nautilus. >>>>>> >>>>>> Some of them are already implemented, so if you wanna test them, here is the gofer script >>>>>> >>>>>> Gofer new >>>>>> Â Â url: 'http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Nautilus'; >>>>>> Â Â package: 'ConfigurationOfNautilus'; >>>>>> Â Â load. >>>>>> >>>>>> (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfNautilusRefactoring) perform: #loadDefault >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> So...that's the way of loading Nautilus with refactorings? Â Â Wouldn't it be better to include RB dependencis in ConfigurationOfNautilus and have a specific group there. So you can do for example >>>>>> >>>>>> ConfigurationOfNautilus project stableVersion load: 'WithRefactorings'. >>>>>> >>>>>> ? >>>>>> >>>>>> BTW, I checked the ConfigurationOfNautilusRefactoring and it looks you miss a critical feature of Metacello: project references :) Â From ConfigurationOfNautilusRefactoring you can directly depend on ConfigurationOfRB or ConfigurationOfNautilus rather than duplicating everything in there. Don't tell Stef you didn't read the chapter hahahaha >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> It loads everything. >>>>>> >>>>>> For now I have only done some refactorings for classes, so if you popup the menu on a class, a new item named Refactoring should appear :) >>>>>> >>>>>> Moreover, the 'rename class' method is replaced by the RB one :) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks in advance for your feedback, and if you want to participate, you are more than welcome :) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Ben >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Mariano >>>>>> http://marianopeck.wordpress.com >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Mariano >>>>> http://marianopeck.wordpress.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> >> > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

Feb. 21, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo VM

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

And when do we begin to "live long and prosper" with Spock's help? Sorry, had to ask, it's a wonderful idea. ________________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] on behalf of Pavel Krivanek [pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2012 7:10 AM To: Pharo Development Subject: [Pharo-project] Pharo VM Hi Stef, last year you mentioned that in January you want to brand our own VM. Is there any progress in this area? Will there be still two VMs (Cog and Stack)? Will we have own git repository? Cheers, -- Pavel

Feb. 21, 2012

[Pharo-project] [update 1.4] #14343

by Marcus Denker

14343 ----- Issue 5340: Deprecate SparseXTable http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=5340 Issue 5339: Finder find pragmas http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=5339 -- Marcus Denker -- http://marcusdenker.de

Feb. 21, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] "Do not feed the trolls"

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Hi Chris, On 21 Feb 2012, at 12:12, wysseier wrote: > It is not up to me whether our CMSBOX is an important project in a general > context. But to answer your question: almost 500 customers in Switzerland > are using this Pharo-based application until now and for them, this > application and the underlying very stable technology with ongoing > development IS important. Besides, we at netstyle.ch created several > business critical web-based applications, from automatic inventory > management to a large CRM for a Swiss insurance broker. Although you > probably never heard of these applications I guess we are nevertheless an > important component of the Pharo eco system and we use it because we believe > it to be the right way of the ongoing development. > > Although there is always room for improvement, the migration to Pharo was > and is an important step within our company strategy. On this basis, we > built a company from scratch with more than 10 employees whereof five > software engineers are doing nothing else than working with the Pharo IDE. > It is due to the ongoing development of a small community that our personal > "success" became possible. Could not be more thankful for that! Keep the > work going! > > To now improve whatever needs to improved in your opinion, one should not > issue orders to or offend the community but to collaborate constructively on > suggestions. Honestly, this was not our strength within the past months too, > but we are willing to support this lively community as much as we can in the > future although we are not Wikipedia or similar. I am convinced that a > constructive and appreciative collaboration is the only way to improve > Pharo so please consider my words when writing your next message. > > Cheers, > > Chris Wysseier > Founder and CEO of netstyle.ch and cmsbox > > P.S: Also wanted to say hi to everybody as I am new on the list. Be aware > that I am not an *experienced* software engineer (let's say "anymore" ;) ) > and therefore will not be able to discuss on technical strategies or tasks. > But I would like to know what is going on and to show support and presence > to all of you. Thanks for sharing this information! This is good to hear. We hope to hear more from you and the netstyle Smaltalkers in the future. Sven

Feb. 21, 2012

[Pharo-project] Pharo VM

by Pavel Krivanek

Hi Stef, last year you mentioned that in January you want to brand our own VM. Is there any progress in this area? Will there be still two VMs (Cog and Stack)? Will we have own git repository? Cheers, -- Pavel

Feb. 21, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] syntax error in StartupLoader script

by Camillo Bruni

thanks, I will have a look at it On 2012-02-21, at 06:10, Ben Coman wrote: > > I loaded SLICE-Issue-5290 onto a freshly unzipped Pharo-1.4-14341 + cogwin_r2522.zip > This caused a problem with the debugger as follows. In workspace I execute... > self halt. > x := 1. > y := 2. > z := x+y. > > I click the second line of the stack "UndefinedObject>>DoIt" which now shows "halt" highlighted. > I click <Into> and " := 1" is now highlighted. > I click <Into> again and nothing happens. There is no further response from any of the debugger buttons, although <Full Stack> causes the window to flash once. > > I can temporarily fix this misbehaviour by forcing #isPostMortem to always return false. > > > Camillo Bruni wrote: >> you can try to load >> SLICE-Issue-5290-Cleanup-Startup-Error-Handling-CamilloBruni.2 >> >> from the pharoInbox which will significantly improve the error responses during startup. >> >> best >> cami >> >> >> On 2012-02-18, at 00:19, Ben Coman wrote: >> >> >>> When using the following StartupLoader script >>> >>> StartupLoader default executeAtomicItems: { >>> StartupAction name: 'Shared Package Cache' code: [ MCCacheRepository default directory setPathName: 'C:\Apps\Smalltalk\!Shared-Package-Cache'.]. >>> }. >>> >>> I was getting a "syntax error in startup" that I could not identify (is it obvious to others?) >>> This was due to the debugger not opening at the point of error since SmalltalkImage>>executeDeferredStartupActions catches the errors. So I hacked this as follows... >>> deferredStartupActions do: [:each | >>> [ each cull: resuming ] value. >>> "btcdebug >>> on: Halt >>> do: [ :err| >>> Smalltalk >>> logError: '==== Startup Error: ', err description >>> inContext: err signalerContext. >>> errors add: err]"]. >>> >>> and then after a quit and restart the dialog "Syntax error: Unmatched string quote" appeared with... >>> StartupLoader default executeAtomicItems: { >>> StartupAction name: 'Shared Package Cache' code: [ MCCacheRepository default directory setPathName: _Unmatched string quote_ -> 'C:\Apps\Smalltalk\ >>> >>> So after removing "!" from the folder name the syntax error went away. >>> >>> So now a few questions... >>> >>> 1. Is there a simpler way to debug the startup scripts that I have missed? >>> If not, can a StartupLoader>>test or similar be implemented which runs the same as at image start time but without the error catching in executeDeferredStartupActions, rather than needing to hack executeDeferredStartupActions as I did. >>> >>> 2. Is it reasonable to set a shared package cache in the startup like I have? Or are there some obvious problems with this that I don't see? >>> I would like to avoid downloading all packages every time unzip a fresh image for testing. >>> >>> 3. Is the invalid "!" fixable (though of course I've worked around it)? >>> >>> I'll open any required bug entries. This was with Pharo-14333 / cogwin_r2522.zip / Windows 7. >>> >>> cheers, -ben >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > >

Feb. 21, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Why do we use Pharo? a.k.a. rethinking Pharo marketing

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

On 21 Feb 2012, at 09:52, GÃ¶ran Krampe wrote: > Pharo (or Smalltalk in general) is for me about *speed* of development. > > Yes, one can make a huge list of other attributes - but it all boils down to that *for me*. For example, one could say "no, it is also about quality of code through good OO design" - but if you think about it, quality of design gives *speed*. The quality in itself doesn't give me "value" (well, I am being black-and-white here), but the speed that a good quality codebase gives me (in adapting to change etc) is true hard value. That speed makes programming fun. That speed impresses people. That speed is a true distinguishing feature. > > And of course, the speed comes as a product of many factors of which some are unique (but not all of them are): > > language-brevity * language-modeling-capability * tools * dynamic-typing * instant-compilation * app-always-running = awesome speed! > > ...and if we break out tools from the above equation: > > tools = full-reflection * written-all-in-itself * everyone-can-contribute-no-need-for-plugin-system-like-eclipse * crossplatform-so-everyone-can-contribute-regardless-of-OS > > > So if I would "pitch" Pharo to other developers, it would be about the extravagant speed of development. Sure, cross platform and good performance through Cog is nice, but for me and many other web devs (which perhaps contitutes 90% of the audience) it would be Linux anyway and the VM speed is not a real problem. But as I said, cross-platform is important for us to be able to work together on "common ground" improving the environment. Yes, well written and so true (for me in any case). Once you are used to Smalltalk it is so hard to go back, it is hard to describe. Thx, Sven

Feb. 21, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Netstyle experience (was Do not feed the trolls)

by Janko MivÅ¡ek

Hi Chris, Thank you very much for your experience report and I think I'm not alone to like to hear from your more about what are your wishes as a manager from the Pharo in the future. Because you are an "enterprise" (in a positive meaning of that word) Pharo user. Maybe let me start asking you an opinion of what I'd like to see from Pharo as a priority: - more stability, - better user experience (UX), - better version control and packaging tools - better integration of tools - tabbed browsing, back button etc More polishing and boring bug hunting tasks therefore and just a bit less fundamental rewritings like compiler etc. Later are more academic and more interesting, yes, but IMHO for us the "enterprise" users the above priorities are much more important. Best regards Janko S, wysseier piÅ¡e: > Guido Stepken wrote >> >> Much advanced code. Yes. But - what for? Any *important* app outside >> there? >> Dr.Geo ... any parametric CAD can do this! CMSBOX - pfffft! How many > I guess I need now to thank you too for your flowers... > > It is not up to me whether our CMSBOX is an important project in a general > context. But to answer your question: almost 500 customers in Switzerland > are using this Pharo-based application until now and for them, this > application and the underlying very stable technology with ongoing > development IS important. Besides, we at netstyle.ch created several > business critical web-based applications, from automatic inventory > management to a large CRM for a Swiss insurance broker. Although you > probably never heard of these applications I guess we are nevertheless an > important component of the Pharo eco system and we use it because we believe > it to be the right way of the ongoing development. > > Although there is always room for improvement, the migration to Pharo was > and is an important step within our company strategy. On this basis, we > built a company from scratch with more than 10 employees whereof five > software engineers are doing nothing else than working with the Pharo IDE. > It is due to the ongoing development of a small community that our personal > "success" became possible. Could not be more thankful for that! Keep the > work going! > > To now improve whatever needs to improved in your opinion, one should not > issue orders to or offend the community but to collaborate constructively on > suggestions. Honestly, this was not our strength within the past months too, > but we are willing to support this lively community as much as we can in the > future although we are not Wikipedia or similar. I am convinced that a > constructive and appreciative collaboration is the only way to improve > Pharo so please consider my words when writing your next message. > > Cheers, > > Chris Wysseier > Founder and CEO of netstyle.ch and cmsbox > > P.S: Also wanted to say hi to everybody as I am new on the list. Be aware > that I am not an *experienced* software engineer (let's say "anymore" ;) ) > and therefore will not be able to discuss on technical strategies or tasks. > But I would like to know what is going on and to show support and presence > to all of you. > > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Do-not-feed-the-trolls-tp4405636p4406708.html > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > -- Janko MivÅ¡ek Aida/Web Smalltalk Web Application Server http://www.aidaweb.si

Feb. 21, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] "Do not feed the trolls"

by Nicolas Petton

Guido, I'd rather focus on positive energy. Please understand that you're not helping, at all. I'm kindly asking you to stop, you're attitude is polluting this mailing list. Cheers, Nico On 21/02/12 02:40, Guido Stepken wrote: > Much simpler calling s.b. a troll than changing own behaviour!!! :-) > > You get old and unflexible, when you rather start to defend, refusing to > see facts: > > "Its not me, who is responsible for the failing of the product in the > market, i am working hard!!!!!" > > Always the same .... I hate it, this attitude. > > tnx 4 understanding, > > Guido Stepken > > Am 21.02.2012 02:29 schrieb "Peter Hugosson-Miller" > <oldmanlink(a)gmail.com <mailto:oldmanlink@gmail.com>>: > > Nice try, Dale, but this troll will apparently eat anything - even > Wikipedia articles :-p > > -- > Cheers, > Peter. > -- Nicolas Petton http://nicolas-petton.fr

Feb. 21, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] "Do not feed the trolls"

by wysseier

Guido Stepken wrote > > Much advanced code. Yes. But - what for? Any *important* app outside > there? > Dr.Geo ... any parametric CAD can do this! CMSBOX - pfffft! How many > customers? > > Pharo - still unstable, unusable, no sponsors. > > Jitter? Hmmm... e.g. LUAJit *has* sponsors, *very* mighty sponsors, WoW, > Wikipedia ... and it *ins* rock stable, portable to 32bit, 64bit Intel, > PPC > *and* ARM!!! > > One man show, b.t.w.!! Like Elliot Miranda with COGVM! > > Develop the development process! > > tnx for seeing reality, > > Guido Stepken > I guess I need now to thank you too for your flowers... It is not up to me whether our CMSBOX is an important project in a general context. But to answer your question: almost 500 customers in Switzerland are using this Pharo-based application until now and for them, this application and the underlying very stable technology with ongoing development IS important. Besides, we at netstyle.ch created several business critical web-based applications, from automatic inventory management to a large CRM for a Swiss insurance broker. Although you probably never heard of these applications I guess we are nevertheless an important component of the Pharo eco system and we use it because we believe it to be the right way of the ongoing development. Although there is always room for improvement, the migration to Pharo was and is an important step within our company strategy. On this basis, we built a company from scratch with more than 10 employees whereof five software engineers are doing nothing else than working with the Pharo IDE. It is due to the ongoing development of a small community that our personal "success" became possible. Could not be more thankful for that! Keep the work going! To now improve whatever needs to improved in your opinion, one should not issue orders to or offend the community but to collaborate constructively on suggestions. Honestly, this was not our strength within the past months too, but we are willing to support this lively community as much as we can in the future although we are not Wikipedia or similar. I am convinced that a constructive and appreciative collaboration is the only way to improve Pharo so please consider my words when writing your next message. Cheers, Chris Wysseier Founder and CEO of netstyle.ch and cmsbox P.S: Also wanted to say hi to everybody as I am new on the list. Be aware that I am not an *experienced* software engineer (let's say "anymore" ;) ) and therefore will not be able to discuss on technical strategies or tasks. But I would like to know what is going on and to show support and presence to all of you. -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Do-not-feed-the-trolls-tp4405636p4406708.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Feb. 21, 2012