September 2011 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-project] yield current Thread

by Nicolas Cellier

Did you type yield in a finder? Nicolas 2011/9/21 Camillo Bruni <camillo.bruni(a)inria.fr>: > Is it possible to manually yield the current (high priority) to leave the possibility for other processes to run? > > The closest solution I came up with is: > > Â Â Â Â Delay forMilliseconds: 0.001. > > IMO not very niceâ¦ > > cami > > >

Sept. 21, 2011

[Pharo-project] yield current Thread

by Camillo Bruni

Is it possible to manually yield the current (high priority) to leave the possibility for other processes to run? The closest solution I came up with is: Delay forMilliseconds: 0.001. IMO not very niceâ¦ cami

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] MethodWrappers

by Eliot Miranda

On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 3:48 AM, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: > Hi Eliot, > > at [1] you mentioned a port of MethodWrappers to Squeak 4.2. > Is there also a port for Pharo available or do you plan to > port it? > I was hoping someone with focus on Pharo would integrate the necessary compiler and kernel changes into Pharo. The Squeak trunk packages are Compiler-eem.214 & Compiler-eem.215, and Kernel-619 to Kernel-eem.623. I've attached the diffs. Notionally file in Compiler-213-214.st & Kernel-618-619.st, then file-in Compiler-214-215.st & Kernel-619-623.st. These are generally useful, a) restoring the ability to create subclasses of CompiledMethod, and b) fixing various subtle copying-related state-sharing bugs with AdditionalMethodState (the objects that add additional state to compiled methods, pragmas, properties and "extra inst vars"). The MethodWrappers4.2 package should then just load. It serves as a model for adding inst vars to CompiledMethod. > For those who dont know about MethodWrappers: look at [2] > Indeed. Yes, there's an alternative implementation above objects-as-methods, but that implementation is far from complete. It would be good to see he same kind of completeness. e.g. with MethodWrappers you can write | indent wrapper | indent := 0. wrapper := MwBlockMethodWrapper on: #benchFib inClass: Integer. wrapper beforeBlock: [:rcvr :args| Transcript crtab: indent; print: rcvr; space; nextPutAll: #benchFib; flush. indent := indent + 1]; afterBlock: [:rcvr :args| indent := indent - 1]. [wrapper install. 7 benchFib] ensure: [wrapper uninstall] whereas there are few if any examples with the objects-as-methods AFAICS. > > Thanks > Torsten > > > [1] > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/squeak-dev/2011-September/16156… > [2] http://www.refactory.com/Software/MethodWrappers/ > -- > NEU: FreePhone - 0ct/min Handyspartarif mit Geld-zurÃ¼ck-Garantie! > Jetzt informieren: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/freephone > -- best, Eliot

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world like codecity in Pharo

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

I prefer rez on PS2 This is a really cool game http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4EFNWe4mCc Stef On Sep 21, 2011, at 2:06 PM, Henrik Sperre Johansen wrote: > On 21.09.2011 13:50, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >>> I think that depending on your goals both approaches are good: >>> >>> - binding to OpenGL >>> it would be very cool to have a working/solid solution in this area. >>> As Henrik and Marcus said, native support would be great. >>> If I remember correctly, Lumiere is not very usable. >>> Perhaps with NativeBoost and its GL bindings could be a way to go. >> Would be cool, but frankly I do not think the Pharo community can provide a reliable, multi-platform and smooth integration of OpenGL in a near future. Many have tried before and there is not many success. >> >>> - software 3D (no hardware support) >>> As Alex said, for simple stuff it could be enough and it is easier to ensure portability. >>> But be carreful of the size of your scenes because I think that Moose graphs could be huge and it could be really really slow... >> I would not be that pessimistic. Visualizing software does not require animation, moving colored cameras and texture. > > Hey, it WOULD be cool way of visualizing a programs execution though ;) > Think squares as classes, height of buildings as amount of instances, and some sort of traffic being message sends, camera panning automatically to catch the activity. > For GC, you could have a tetris-effect, where some of the buildings height start blinking then disappears! > The possibilities are endless! > > Hmm, it kind of sounds strangely familiar when I think about it... > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3XzPhdBx9g#t=143s > Maybe that wasn't as ludicrous as I've always thought :) > > Cheers, > Henry >

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world like codecity in Pharo

by Levente Uzonyi

On Wed, 21 Sep 2011, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >> I think that depending on your goals both approaches are good: >> >> - binding to OpenGL >> it would be very cool to have a working/solid solution in this area. >> As Henrik and Marcus said, native support would be great. >> If I remember correctly, Lumiere is not very usable. >> Perhaps with NativeBoost and its GL bindings could be a way to go. > > Would be cool, but frankly I do not think the Pharo community can provide a reliable, multi-platform and smooth integration of OpenGL in a near future. Many have tried before and there is not many success. What are your problems with existing OpenGL bindings? Levente > >> - software 3D (no hardware support) >> As Alex said, for simple stuff it could be enough and it is easier to ensure portability. >> But be carreful of the size of your scenes because I think that Moose graphs could be huge and it could be really really slow... > > I would not be that pessimistic. Visualizing software does not require animation, moving colored cameras and texture. Mondrian handles 20 thousands nodes and it does not use quadtrees. > > @Stef: We studied it and we could not make lumiere work. > > Alexandre > >> >> >> >> 2011/9/20 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >> Ok what is your experience with lumiere? >> I would like to see if we can have Plotz or another solution to display metrics in Moose. >> >> Stef >> >> On Sep 20, 2011, at 1:53 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >> >>> I think that recoding a 3d engine is easier and much less frustrating that making Pharo talk to OpenGl. I am not aware of the last progresses made on that front, but I burnt 1 student on this. >>> >>> Codecity visualizations are not complex, it is just a matter of displaying triangles and multiplying matrixes. A student here learnt Smalltalk that way: >>> http://bergel.eu/download/papers/Jaca11a-Klotz.pdf >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Alexandre >>> >>> On 20 Sep 2011, at 08:45, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >>> >>>> Hi guys >>>> >>>> we would like to propose a fun project and the idea would be to build a little codecity. >>>> Now what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world in Pharo? >>>> >>>> - Lumiere? >>>> - opengl binding? >>>> >>>> Stef >>> >>> -- >>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > >

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world like codecity in Pharo

by Igor Stasenko

On 21 September 2011 15:22, Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote: >> why so pessimistic? >> many applications using opengl without problems. why pharo has to be >> any different? >> >> i doubt that its hard to make opengl up and running. what is hard is >> to make sure that you can be on having certain features (opengl >> version), supported across all platforms. >> But that's not our fault. If someone using 10 years old OS with 10 >> years old opengl driver and hardware, why he would expect that it can >> run things which are written for today's machines? > > There is nothing that prevent it from running. It just requires a lot of effort. > I am the first one who wants to see a nice integration of OpenGL in Pharo. no, you will be second one, after me :) > > Alexandre > > >> >> >>>> Â - software 3D (no hardware support) >>>> Â As Alex said, for simple stuff it could be enough and it is easier to ensure portability. >>>> Â But be carreful of the size of your scenes because I think that Moose graphs could be huge and it could be really really slow... >>> >>> I would not be that pessimistic. Visualizing software does not require animation, moving colored cameras and texture. Mondrian handles 20 thousands nodes and it does not use quadtrees. >>> >>> @Stef: We studied it and we could not make lumiere work. >>> >>> Alexandre >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> 2011/9/20 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >>>> Ok what is your experience with lumiere? >>>> I would like to see if we can have Plotz or another solution to display metrics in Moose. >>>> >>>> Stef >>>> >>>> On Sep 20, 2011, at 1:53 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >>>> >>>>> I think that recoding a 3d engine is easier and much less frustrating that making Pharo talk to OpenGl. I am not aware of the last progresses made on that front, but I burnt 1 student on this. >>>>> >>>>> Codecity visualizations are not complex, it is just a matter of displaying triangles and multiplying matrixes. A student here learnt Smalltalk that way: >>>>> http://bergel.eu/download/papers/Jaca11a-Klotz.pdf >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Alexandre >>>>> >>>>> On 20 Sep 2011, at 08:45, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi guys >>>>>> >>>>>> we would like to propose a fun project and the idea would be to build a little codecity. >>>>>> Now what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world in Pharo? >>>>>> >>>>>> Â Â Â - Lumiere? >>>>>> Â Â Â - opengl binding? >>>>>> >>>>>> Stef >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>>>> Alexandre Bergel Â http://www.bergel.eu >>>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>> Alexandre Bergel Â http://www.bergel.eu >>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. >> > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel Â http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world like codecity in Pharo

by Alexandre Bergel

> why so pessimistic? > many applications using opengl without problems. why pharo has to be > any different? > > i doubt that its hard to make opengl up and running. what is hard is > to make sure that you can be on having certain features (opengl > version), supported across all platforms. > But that's not our fault. If someone using 10 years old OS with 10 > years old opengl driver and hardware, why he would expect that it can > run things which are written for today's machines? There is nothing that prevent it from running. It just requires a lot of effort. I am the first one who wants to see a nice integration of OpenGL in Pharo. Alexandre > > >>> - software 3D (no hardware support) >>> As Alex said, for simple stuff it could be enough and it is easier to ensure portability. >>> But be carreful of the size of your scenes because I think that Moose graphs could be huge and it could be really really slow... >> >> I would not be that pessimistic. Visualizing software does not require animation, moving colored cameras and texture. Mondrian handles 20 thousands nodes and it does not use quadtrees. >> >> @Stef: We studied it and we could not make lumiere work. >> >> Alexandre >> >>> >>> >>> >>> 2011/9/20 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >>> Ok what is your experience with lumiere? >>> I would like to see if we can have Plotz or another solution to display metrics in Moose. >>> >>> Stef >>> >>> On Sep 20, 2011, at 1:53 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >>> >>>> I think that recoding a 3d engine is easier and much less frustrating that making Pharo talk to OpenGl. I am not aware of the last progresses made on that front, but I burnt 1 student on this. >>>> >>>> Codecity visualizations are not complex, it is just a matter of displaying triangles and multiplying matrixes. A student here learnt Smalltalk that way: >>>> http://bergel.eu/download/papers/Jaca11a-Klotz.pdf >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> Alexandre >>>> >>>> On 20 Sep 2011, at 08:45, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi guys >>>>> >>>>> we would like to propose a fun project and the idea would be to build a little codecity. >>>>> Now what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world in Pharo? >>>>> >>>>> - Lumiere? >>>>> - opengl binding? >>>>> >>>>> Stef >>>> >>>> -- >>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] MethodWrappers

by Nick Ager

Hi at [1] you mentioned a port of MethodWrappers to Squeak 4.2. > Is there also a port for Pharo available or do you plan to > port it? > I'm successfully using ObjectAsMethodWrapper class>>#installOn:selector: in a recent Pharo image, which if it isn't in your image you can load through ConfigurationOfObjectMetaTools Nick

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world like codecity in Pharo

by Igor Stasenko

On 21 September 2011 13:50, Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote: >> Â I think that depending on your goals both approaches are good: >> >> Â - binding to OpenGL >> Â it would be very cool to have a working/solid solution in this area. >> Â As Henrik and Marcus said, native support would be great. >> Â If I remember correctly, Â Lumiere is not very usable. >> Â Perhaps with NativeBoost and its GL bindings could be a way to go. > > Would be cool, but frankly I do not think the Pharo community can provide a reliable, multi-platform and smooth integration of OpenGL in a near future. Many have tried before and there is not many success. > why so pessimistic? many applications using opengl without problems. why pharo has to be any different? i doubt that its hard to make opengl up and running. what is hard is to make sure that you can be on having certain features (opengl version), supported across all platforms. But that's not our fault. If someone using 10 years old OS with 10 years old opengl driver and hardware, why he would expect that it can run things which are written for today's machines? >> Â - software 3D (no hardware support) >> Â As Alex said, for simple stuff it could be enough and it is easier to ensure portability. >> Â But be carreful of the size of your scenes because I think that Moose graphs could be huge and it could be really really slow... > > I would not be that pessimistic. Visualizing software does not require animation, moving colored cameras and texture. Mondrian handles 20 thousands nodes and it does not use quadtrees. > > @Stef: We studied it and we could not make lumiere work. > > Alexandre > >> >> >> >> 2011/9/20 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >> Ok what is your experience with lumiere? >> I would like to see if we can have Plotz or another solution to display metrics in Moose. >> >> Stef >> >> On Sep 20, 2011, at 1:53 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: >> >> > I think that recoding a 3d engine is easier and much less frustrating that making Pharo talk to OpenGl. I am not aware of the last progresses made on that front, but I burnt 1 student on this. >> > >> > Codecity visualizations are not complex, it is just a matter of displaying triangles and multiplying matrixes. A student here learnt Smalltalk that way: >> > http://bergel.eu/download/papers/Jaca11a-Klotz.pdf >> > >> > Cheers, >> > Alexandre >> > >> > On 20 Sep 2011, at 08:45, StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote: >> > >> >> Hi guys >> >> >> >> we would like to propose a fun project and the idea would be to build a little codecity. >> >> Now what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world in Pharo? >> >> >> >> Â Â Â - Lumiere? >> >> Â Â Â - opengl binding? >> >> >> >> Stef >> > >> > -- >> > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >> > Alexandre Bergel Â http://www.bergel.eu >> > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> >> > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel Â http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] parsing html....

by Camillo Bruni

seems to work :) thanks On 2011-09-21, at 13:49, Francois Stephany wrote: > I've no idea if it still works in Pharo 1.3/4 but Soup is quite nice: > > http://www.squeaksource.com/Soup.html > > On 21/09/11 13:44, Camillo Bruni wrote: >> Hi everyone. >> >> I want to parse an HTML document with Pharo, But the following example fails: >> >> XMLDOMParser parse: (ZnEasy get: 'http://www.google.com/') contents. >> >> fails on some javascript (&&window...) due to a lazily omitted<![CDATA[ in the<script> section. >> So Is there an easy way to get around this? >> >> cami >

Sept. 21, 2011