On 21 September 2011 15:22, Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel@me.com> wrote:
why so pessimistic? many applications using opengl without problems. why pharo has to be any different?
i doubt that its hard to make opengl up and running. what is hard is to make sure that you can be on having certain features (opengl version), supported across all platforms. But that's not our fault. If someone using 10 years old OS with 10 years old opengl driver and hardware, why he would expect that it can run things which are written for today's machines?
There is nothing that prevent it from running. It just requires a lot of effort. I am the first one who wants to see a nice integration of OpenGL in Pharo.
no, you will be second one, after me :)
Alexandre
 - software 3D (no hardware support)  As Alex said, for simple stuff it could be enough and it is easier to ensure portability.  But be carreful of the size of your scenes because I think that Moose graphs could be huge and it could be really really slow...
I would not be that pessimistic. Visualizing software does not require animation, moving colored cameras and texture. Mondrian handles 20 thousands nodes and it does not use quadtrees.
@Stef: We studied it and we could not make lumiere work.
Alexandre
2011/9/20 Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> Ok what is your experience with lumiere? I would like to see if we can have Plotz or another solution to display metrics in Moose.
Stef
On Sep 20, 2011, at 1:53 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
I think that recoding a 3d engine is easier and much less frustrating that making Pharo talk to OpenGl. I am not aware of the last progresses made on that front, but I burnt 1 student on this.
Codecity visualizations are not complex, it is just a matter of displaying triangles and multiplying matrixes. A student here learnt Smalltalk that way: http://bergel.eu/download/papers/Jaca11a-Klotz.pdf
Cheers, Alexandre
On 20 Sep 2011, at 08:45, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Hi guys
we would like to propose a fun project and the idea would be to build a little codecity. Now what are the frameworks to develop 3d interactive world in Pharo?
   - Lumiere?    - opengl binding?
Stef
-- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel  http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
-- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel  http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.
-- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel  http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.