For the record, a friend told me about this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kivy Will it be cool to have something like that? Hilaire -- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
By "something like that" you mean what? More widgets? yaml-like DSL? Touch? Peter On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 3:36 PM, Hilaire <hilaire@drgeo.eu> wrote:
For the record, a friend told me about this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kivy
Will it be cool to have something like that?
Hilaire
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
All. Without forgetting multiplateform. I mean when you have such a framework, people get attracted, although Kivy was likely developed the other way: developed for Python because Python is well know and widely used. I am curious to know how Kivy was developed in the first place: a small community effort, a corporation in house developed tool, funding... Hilaire Le 04/07/2015 15:49, Peter Uhnák a écrit :
By "something like that" you mean what? More widgets? yaml-like DSL? Touch?
Peter
On Sat, Jul 4, 2015 at 3:36 PM, Hilaire <hilaire@drgeo.eu <mailto:hilaire@drgeo.eu>> wrote:
For the record, a friend told me about this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kivy
Will it be cool to have something like that?
Hilaire
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
For the information we are working on touch and OSWindow improvements. Alain is imporving Bloc the future graphic layer of Pharo, people from bern are working on new widgets. We are working on cleaning widgets. Now we also accept help. Stef Le 4/7/15 15:36, Hilaire a écrit :
For the record, a friend told me about this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kivy
Will it be cool to have something like that?
Hilaire
Kivy embed a Python interpreter in a native mobile app. All is developed in Python in association with their own declarative language : the kivy language. To do the same thing with Smalltalk, i think you have CogDroid or PharoDroid that embed a smalltalk vm in a native mobile app. When Bloc Widgets will be available, it should be easy to provide a "wonderful" mobile-specific widget layer. You can already do things like that with Bloc : <http://forum.world.st/file/n4835762/BwtMobile.png> (I'm using it as a simulator for mobile apps developed in Pharo) In another way, I'm working on a mobile development environment based on Pharo (part of my phd thesis). The goal is to use Pharo such as a modeling, development and validation environment in order to finally generate fully native mobile applications for several platforms. So, i hope that Pharo will become mobile soon ! ;) Regards, Glenn. ----- Glenn Cavarlé -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Kivy-tp4835739p4835762.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Kivy embed a Python interpreter in a native mobile app. All is developed in Python in association with their own declarative language : the kivy language.
This is cool because with the bootstrap and modularPharo then it can be really interesting. I think that we will see all our efforts paying in all kind of directions.
To do the same thing with Smalltalk, i think you have CogDroid or PharoDroid that embed a smalltalk vm in a native mobile app. When Bloc Widgets will be available, it should be easy to provide a "wonderful" mobile-specific widget layer.
You can already do things like that with Bloc :
<http://forum.world.st/file/n4835762/BwtMobile.png>
(I'm using it as a simulator for mobile apps developed in Pharo)
In another way, I'm working on a mobile development environment based on Pharo (part of my phd thesis). The goal is to use Pharo such as a modeling, development and validation environment in order to finally generate fully native mobile applications for several platforms.
So, i hope that Pharo will become mobile soon ! ;)
Me too.
Regards, Glenn.
----- Glenn Cavarlé -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Kivy-tp4835739p4835762.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On 7/4/15, Glenn Cavarlé <glenn@cavarle.fr> wrote:
Kivy embed a Python interpreter in a native mobile app. All is developed in Python in association with their own declarative language : the kivy language.
To do the same thing with Smalltalk, i think you have CogDroid or PharoDroid that embed a smalltalk vm in a native mobile app. When Bloc Widgets will be available, it should be easy to provide a "wonderful" mobile-specific widget layer.
You can already do things like that with Bloc :
<http://forum.world.st/file/n4835762/BwtMobile.png>
(I'm using it as a simulator for mobile apps developed in Pharo)
Is Bloc a user interface markup language? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_interface_markup_language Or a graphic framework like Morphic?
In another way, I'm working on a mobile development environment based on Pharo (part of my phd thesis). The goal is to use Pharo such as a modeling, development and validation environment in order to finally generate fully native mobile applications for several platforms.
I assume Android and iOS are part of them...
So, i hope that Pharo will become mobile soon ! ;)
3 months? Regards Hannes
----- Glenn Cavarlé -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Kivy-tp4835739p4835762.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Hannes Hirzel wrote
Is Bloc a user interface markup language?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_interface_markup_language
Or a graphic framework like Morphic?
Bloc is a graphical core framework, it provides the basics features to build UI/Animation frameworks on top of it. A markup language or a declarative syntaxe is not part of Bloc but can be a good idea to experiment when a first widget framework will be released. This is a point that particularly interests me, especially regarding declarative syntax. Hannes Hirzel wrote
I assume Android and iOS are part of them...
So, i hope that Pharo will become mobile soon ! ;)
3 months?
Yes, but unfortunately not in 3 month (for my part)... Regards, Glenn. ----- Glenn Cavarlé -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Kivy-tp4835739p4835775.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Le 4/7/15 19:04, Glenn Cavarlé a écrit :
Hannes Hirzel wrote
Is Bloc a user interface markup language?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_interface_markup_language
Or a graphic framework like Morphic? Bloc is a graphical core framework, it provides the basics features to build UI/Animation frameworks on top of it. A markup language or a declarative syntaxe is not part of Bloc but can be a good idea to experiment when a first widget framework will be released. I'm not sure that we need a DSL. This is a point that particularly interests me, especially regarding declarative syntax.
Hannes Hirzel wrote
I assume Android and iOS are part of them...
So, i hope that Pharo will become mobile soon ! ;) 3 months? Yes, but unfortunately not in 3 month (for my part)...
Not for Brick too :)
Regards, Glenn.
----- Glenn Cavarlé -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Kivy-tp4835739p4835775.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
I'm not sure that we need a DSL.
Iâm not sure that we donât need a DSL :) Spec is a kind of dsl and the idea is cool.
This is a point that particularly interests me, especially regarding declarative syntax. Yes, but unfortunately not in 3 month (for my part)...
Not for Brick too :)
give one full year to Aliaksel together with Glenn :)
Regards, Glenn.
----- Glenn Cavarlé -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Kivy-tp4835739p4835775.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Le 04/07/2015 15:58, stepharo a écrit :
For the information we are working on touch and OSWindow improvements. Alain is imporving Bloc the future graphic layer of Pharo, people from bern are working on new widgets. We are working on cleaning widgets. Now we also accept help.
Stef
Le 4/7/15 15:36, Hilaire a écrit :
For the record, a friend told me about this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kivy
Will it be cool to have something like that?
Hilaire
Sure I know. The constituting parts does not make the whole however. I mean a larger plan could help structuring the parts and give a focus. Hilaire -- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
For the information we are working on touch and OSWindow improvements. Alain is imporving Bloc the future graphic layer of Pharo, people from bern are working on new widgets. We are working on cleaning widgets. Now we also accept help.
Stef Sure I know. The constituting parts does not make the whole however. I mean a larger plan could help structuring the parts and give a focus.
Hilaire we have a plan a new graphics core with new widgets and event touch support and several windows. So I do not see why you say that we are not focused. Now you do not create a graphics core in 2 days. And if more people would help then we would go faster :) Alex is experimenting to port Roassal on Bloc and he is finding bugs that Alain is fixing. When I proposed topics to students this is also with this vision in mind. Stef
Le 04/07/2015 23:06, stepharo a écrit :
For the information we are working on touch and OSWindow improvements. Alain is imporving Bloc the future graphic layer of Pharo, people from bern are working on new widgets. We are working on cleaning widgets. Now we also accept help.
Stef Sure I know. The constituting parts does not make the whole however. I mean a larger plan could help structuring the parts and give a focus.
Hilaire we have a plan a new graphics core with new widgets and event touch support and several windows.
So I do not see why you say that we are not focused. Now you do not create a graphics core in 2 days. And if more people would help then we would go faster :) Alex is experimenting to port Roassal on Bloc and he is finding bugs that Alain is fixing.
When I proposed topics to students this is also with this vision in mind.
Stef
I didn't write Pharo is unfocused, I just think broader project like kivy can give structuring focus. When reading Pharo vision document, I see great parts/foci, but I am not sure about the whole vision. I agree it is easy to raise external opinion than working on that internally, but however it does not dismiss the opinion. Hilaire -- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
For the information we are working on touch and OSWindow improvements. Alain is imporving Bloc the future graphic layer of Pharo, people from bern are working on new widgets. We are working on cleaning widgets. Now we also accept help.
Stef Sure I know. The constituting parts does not make the whole however. I mean a larger plan could help structuring the parts and give a focus. Hilaire we have a plan a new graphics core with new widgets and event touch support and several windows.
So I do not see why you say that we are not focused. Now you do not create a graphics core in 2 days. And if more people would help then we would go faster :) Alex is experimenting to port Roassal on Bloc and he is finding bugs that Alain is fixing.
When I proposed topics to students this is also with this vision in mind.
Stef
I didn't write Pharo is unfocused, I just think broader project like kivy can give structuring focus.
Yes Now our project is: We also want Pharo to be a modern prototyping UI platform and this is why we did athens, cairo, now gesture, bloc, Morphic cleaning, brick,....
When reading Pharo vision document, I see great parts/foci, but I am not sure about the whole vision. I agree it is easy to raise external opinion than working on that internally, but however it does not dismiss the opinion.
Hilaire
Le 05/07/2015 18:55, stepharo a écrit :
Yes Now our project is: We also want Pharo to be a modern prototyping UI platform and this is why we did athens, cairo, now gesture, bloc, Morphic cleaning, brick,....
And Athens is a fantastic move forward... -- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
On 7/4/15, Hilaire <hilaire@drgeo.eu> wrote:
For the record, a friend told me about this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kivy
Will it be cool to have something like that?
Hilaire
Yes, and what about other options https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_interface_markup_language ? --Hannes
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
I asked my friend why Python and Kivy. He kindly answered with a lengthy response I transfer bellow. Hilaire -------- Message transféré -------- Sujet : Re: How are you? Date : Wed, 8 Jul 2015 11:39:32 +0800 De : æ´ªæè²´ <ckhung@cyut.edu.tw> Répondre à : ckhung@frdm.info Pour : Hilaire Fernandes <hilaire@drgeo.eu> Wow, a long discussion. Indeed you are right -- it does not really deserve endless discussion :-) I don't have much of a choice. Here are the constraints and supporting factors around me: 1. I am asked to teach the course "Mobile apps for the Cloud". 2. On android, the only viable alternative to java is python. There was sl4a that had the potential to support many scripting languages but it seems to be discontinued. 3. I preached cross-platform development long time ago, and now a colleague told me that kivy should be the choice for me. 4. I am personally interested in deep learning. deeplearning4j (java) and theano (python) seem to be the most popular choices. 5. At this age and with my job requirement, I'd prefer learning a new language so as to be able to slightly modify some existing projects, rather than to have a nice development framework/paradigm, etc. 6. FS users already being a minority, I cannot afford choosing a minority language in the minority FS population. Actually I never heard of pharo except from you. Even smalltalk in general shows up very very rarely in my usual searches and readings. (If I had an opportunity to teach math, choosing DrGeo over Geogebra would be fine since for the students only math matters. But choosing pharo over python as a development language wouldn't make sense for my CS students, who are ok but non-elite and not especially confident.) So you could say that my choice is more political, practical, and personal than technical. -- Oracle å¦ä½ç¨æè²´çãä¸è³è¹ç代å¹ãç¶æ¶ä½ åå ¬å¸? http://user.frdm.info/ckhung/ Chao-Kuei Hung æ´ªæè²´ 2015-07-08 1:34 GMT+08:00 Hilaire Fernandes <hilaire@drgeo.eu>:
Le 04/07/2015 21:51, Hilaire Fernandes a écrit :
Oh and I decide to teach python and kivy in one of my next semester's class, so I have to learn these.
Kivy looks very impressive. Too bad we don't have this within Pharo. It looks like an interesting framework to get students motivated.
CK, may I ask you why Python/Kirvi, and why not Pharo? Pharo is a pretty well equipped language with a powerful programming environment.
I am really curious to read your output as I am discussing the subject within the Pharo community[1]
Hilaire
http://forum.world.st/Kivy-td4835739.html
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
Le 04/07/2015 21:36, Hilaire a écrit :
For the record, a friend told me about this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kivy
Will it be cool to have something like that?
Hilaire
-- Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu http://google.com/+DrgeoEu
participants (6)
-
Alain Plantec -
Glenn Cavarlé -
H. Hirzel -
Hilaire -
Peter Uhnák -
stepharo