Thinking again about this idea of voting system for features we would like to see in Pharo. I won't pay 10 euros / month for someone to develop full time on Pharo on what I do not control (may not be the best words to explain my feelings :) But I'm ready to give 30 to 50 euros to raise money to develop the most wanted feature from a voting system. This give more visibility. It's easier to make a one shot donation than give XXeuros/month. So one way to achieve this is to set up a voting system AND associated raising money system to develop the most wanted feature for one month. Another way is to pick the most wanted feature for Google Summer of code. With enough money one can stop his work for one month and develop exclusively for Pharo. If it's too hard to raise money for one month, we can try 15 days. I've seen that some great developers can do fantastic stuff in 15 days when he loves it :) Laurent Laffont On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote:
On 10 December 2010 13:32, Davorin Rusevljan <davorin.rusevljan@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Alan Rodas <alanrodas@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm relatively new to Pharo, maybe this has been tried before, but what about a forum where the ideas are published. Each idea could be a thread in the forum, and the people that would like to contribute may comment there. What it may be interesting is that the whole discussion about an idea could live in the thread, and you can keep track of old discussions and the state of a feature. If you keep your ideas for yourself, and you cannot implement something by your own, that idea will die there. If you allow people to comment on ideas, maybe two or more people have the same, and they can start working on it together. A forum allows for contacting people, and sharing, and, in that way, maybe the community will grow (Some developers feel they can do something because they don't have the time to do it by their own, or they don't have the skills, but they can help to a dev team that share the same goals.)
Is just a thought. If you did it before and didn't work, my apologies.
Well, those are all nice thoughts. I am also relatively new to Pharo though, I am with Smalltalk for quite a long time. In my humble opinion, while both are always nice to have, at this stage Pharo, much needs more hands willing to do the work, than hands filling the wish lists and voting about them.
Abso-freakin-lutely! :)
The Pharo team did marvelous job, I assume with a lot of investment of their personal time and energy. They also did quite good job at setting their targets since they already managed at transforming huge but sometimes hectic Squeak core into consistent development product.
The way things currently work nicely reflect this, you can freely float your ideas on the mailing list, but do not expect that someone else should do it just because of that. But the better the idea is, and the larger your contribution to Pharo is, chances of it being implemented will rise. Otherwise, roll up your sleeves, and do it for yourself. If that is too complicated, consider doing something else simpler but usefull.
I am always discussing ideas before going to implement them. And for things i do, if i not sure if i doing the best way, or there are multiple 'nice' ways to solve the problem, i asking people, what they prefer. In that way people staying in course of what i do, and sometimes could give an advice or help by other means. But i don't expecting much, because we all busy with own agendas.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:00 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
Thinking again about this idea of voting system for features we would like to see in Pharo.
I won't pay 10 euros / month for someone to develop full time on Pharo on what I do not control (may not be the best words to explain my feelings :)
But I'm ready to give 30 to 50 euros to raise money to develop the most wanted feature from a voting system. This give more visibility.
It's easier to make a one shot donation than give XXeuros/month.
Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
So one way to achieve this is to set up a voting system AND associated raising money system to develop the most wanted feature for one month.
Another way is to pick the most wanted feature for Google Summer of code.
Don't expect anything from it
With enough money one can stop his work for one month and develop exclusively for Pharo. If it's too hard to raise money for one month, we can try 15 days. I've seen that some great developers can do fantastic stuff in 15 days when he loves it :)
Laurent Laffont
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote: On 10 December 2010 13:32, Davorin Rusevljan <davorin.rusevljan@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Alan Rodas <alanrodas@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm relatively new to Pharo, maybe this has been tried before, but what about a forum where the ideas are published. Each idea could be a thread in the forum, and the people that would like to contribute may comment there. What it may be interesting is that the whole discussion about an idea could live in the thread, and you can keep track of old discussions and the state of a feature. If you keep your ideas for yourself, and you cannot implement something by your own, that idea will die there. If you allow people to comment on ideas, maybe two or more people have the same, and they can start working on it together. A forum allows for contacting people, and sharing, and, in that way, maybe the community will grow (Some developers feel they can do something because they don't have the time to do it by their own, or they don't have the skills, but they can help to a dev team that share the same goals.)
Is just a thought. If you did it before and didn't work, my apologies.
Well, those are all nice thoughts. I am also relatively new to Pharo though, I am with Smalltalk for quite a long time. In my humble opinion, while both are always nice to have, at this stage Pharo, much needs more hands willing to do the work, than hands filling the wish lists and voting about them.
Abso-freakin-lutely! :)
The Pharo team did marvelous job, I assume with a lot of investment of their personal time and energy. They also did quite good job at setting their targets since they already managed at transforming huge but sometimes hectic Squeak core into consistent development product.
The way things currently work nicely reflect this, you can freely float your ideas on the mailing list, but do not expect that someone else should do it just because of that. But the better the idea is, and the larger your contribution to Pharo is, chances of it being implemented will rise. Otherwise, roll up your sleeves, and do it for yourself. If that is too complicated, consider doing something else simpler but usefull.
I am always discussing ideas before going to implement them. And for things i do, if i not sure if i doing the best way, or there are multiple 'nice' ways to solve the problem, i asking people, what they prefer. In that way people staying in course of what i do, and sometimes could give an advice or help by other means. But i don't expecting much, because we all busy with own agendas.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.
Hello, On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:20 AM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:00 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
Thinking again about this idea of voting system for features we would like to see in Pharo.
I won't pay 10 euros / month for someone to develop full time on Pharo on what I do not control (may not be the best words to explain my feelings :)
But I'm ready to give 30 to 50 euros to raise money to develop the most wanted feature from a voting system. This give more visibility.
It's easier to make a one shot donation than give XXeuros/month.
Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
You should take a look at Flattr for donations. Also, in case some want to donate for specific feature, there are crowdfunding solutions like kickstarter.
So one way to achieve this is to set up a voting system AND associated raising money system to develop the most wanted feature for one month.
Another way is to pick the most wanted feature for Google Summer of code.
Don't expect anything from it
With enough money one can stop his work for one month and develop exclusively for Pharo. If it's too hard to raise money for one month, we can try 15 days. I've seen that some great developers can do fantastic stuff in 15 days when he loves it :)
Laurent Laffont
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote: On 10 December 2010 13:32, Davorin Rusevljan <davorin.rusevljan@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Alan Rodas <alanrodas@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm relatively new to Pharo, maybe this has been tried before, but what about a forum where the ideas are published. Each idea could be a thread in the forum, and the people that would like to contribute may comment there. What it may be interesting is that the whole discussion about an idea could live in the thread, and you can keep track of old discussions and the state of a feature. If you keep your ideas for yourself, and you cannot implement something by your own, that idea will die there. If you allow people to comment on ideas, maybe two or more people have the same, and they can start working on it together. A forum allows for contacting people, and sharing, and, in that way, maybe the community will grow (Some developers feel they can do something because they don't have the time to do it by their own, or they don't have the skills, but they can help to a dev team that share the same goals.)
Is just a thought. If you did it before and didn't work, my apologies.
Well, those are all nice thoughts. I am also relatively new to Pharo though, I am with Smalltalk for quite a long time. In my humble opinion, while both are always nice to have, at this stage Pharo, much needs more hands willing to do the work, than hands filling the wish lists and voting about them.
Abso-freakin-lutely! :)
The Pharo team did marvelous job, I assume with a lot of investment of their personal time and energy. They also did quite good job at setting their targets since they already managed at transforming huge but sometimes hectic Squeak core into consistent development product.
The way things currently work nicely reflect this, you can freely float your ideas on the mailing list, but do not expect that someone else should do it just because of that. But the better the idea is, and the larger your contribution to Pharo is, chances of it being implemented will rise. Otherwise, roll up your sleeves, and do it for yourself. If that is too complicated, consider doing something else simpler but usefull.
I am always discussing ideas before going to implement them. And for things i do, if i not sure if i doing the best way, or there are multiple 'nice' ways to solve the problem, i asking people, what they prefer. In that way people staying in course of what i do, and sometimes could give an advice or help by other means. But i don't expecting much, because we all busy with own agendas.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 7:16 AM, Geoffroy Couprie <geo.couprie@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello,
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:20 AM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
You should take a look at Flattr for donations.
I think the basics might be a good idea, but flattr just doesn't seem like a useful/viable choice to me. They're way too vague about how much of the money they keep, and it's really set up as a subscription service (last time I checked, anyway). It's just that you get to decide how you distribute your $x per month (as long as you stay on top of things and make that decision every month).
Also, in case some want to donate for specific feature, there are crowdfunding solutions like kickstarter.
Kickstarter sounds like it might be a *much* better choice for this sort of thing. I'm not sure how good it would be for on-going projects, though. e.g. "You paid $50 last month to have Geoffrey spend a month working on feature x. He estimates that he's 75% done. Will you spend $12.50 to let him spend another week on it?" Just my $0.02. -- James
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 5:21 PM, James Ashley <james.ashley@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 7:16 AM, Geoffroy Couprie <geo.couprie@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello,
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:20 AM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
You should take a look at Flattr for donations.
I think the basics might be a good idea, but flattr just doesn't seem like a useful/viable choice to me. They're way too vague about how much of the money they keep, and it's really set up as a subscription service (last time I checked, anyway). It's just that you get to decide how you distribute your $x per month (as long as you stay on top of things and make that decision every month).
Also, in case some want to donate for specific feature, there are crowdfunding solutions like kickstarter.
Kickstarter sounds like it might be a *much* better choice for this sort of thing.
I'm not sure how good it would be for on-going projects, though.
e.g. "You paid $50 last month to have Geoffrey spend a month working on feature x. He estimates that he's 75% done. Will you spend $12.50 to let him spend another week on it?"
Kickstarter is based on "all or nothing". If you don't finish, you don't receive the money. It's like contracting work, if you don't deliver, you're not paid, and many people have no problem with that :)
Yes I think it's good to have a real Pharo entity / status / association loi 1901. For architecture, as Andrés said he/we can set a UserVoice. For raising money http://pledgie.com/. As for Flattr the idea is good but it seems to raise only little money actually (feedback from pharobyexample and pharocasts. But we haven't tried to encourage people to donate). Laurent. On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:20 AM, Stéphane Ducasse < stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:00 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
Thinking again about this idea of voting system for features we would like to see in Pharo.
I won't pay 10 euros / month for someone to develop full time on Pharo on what I do not control (may not be the best words to explain my feelings :)
But I'm ready to give 30 to 50 euros to raise money to develop the most wanted feature from a voting system. This give more visibility.
It's easier to make a one shot donation than give XXeuros/month.
Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
So one way to achieve this is to set up a voting system AND associated
raising money system to develop the most wanted feature for one month.
Another way is to pick the most wanted feature for Google Summer of code.
Don't expect anything from it
With enough money one can stop his work for one month and develop exclusively for Pharo. If it's too hard to raise money for one month, we can try 15 days. I've seen that some great developers can do fantastic stuff in 15 days when he loves it :)
Laurent Laffont
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote: On 10 December 2010 13:32, Davorin Rusevljan <davorin.rusevljan@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Alan Rodas <alanrodas@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm relatively new to Pharo, maybe this has been tried before, but what about a forum where the ideas are published. Each idea could be a thread in the forum, and the people that would like to contribute may comment there. What it may be interesting is that the whole discussion about an idea could live in the thread, and you can keep track of old discussions and the state of a feature. If you keep your ideas for yourself, and you cannot implement something by your own, that idea will die there. If you allow people to comment on ideas, maybe two or more people have the same, and they can start working on it together. A forum allows for contacting people, and sharing, and, in that way, maybe the community will grow (Some developers feel they can do something because they don't have the time to do it by their own, or they don't have the skills, but they can help to a dev team that share the same goals.)
Is just a thought. If you did it before and didn't work, my apologies.
Well, those are all nice thoughts. I am also relatively new to Pharo though, I am with Smalltalk for quite a long time. In my humble opinion, while both are always nice to have, at this stage Pharo, much needs more hands willing to do the work, than hands filling the wish lists and voting about them.
Abso-freakin-lutely! :)
The Pharo team did marvelous job, I assume with a lot of investment of their personal time and energy. They also did quite good job at setting their targets since they already managed at transforming huge but sometimes hectic Squeak core into consistent development product.
The way things currently work nicely reflect this, you can freely float your ideas on the mailing list, but do not expect that someone else should do it just because of that. But the better the idea is, and the larger your contribution to Pharo is, chances of it being implemented will rise. Otherwise, roll up your sleeves, and do it for yourself. If that is too complicated, consider doing something else simpler but usefull.
I am always discussing ideas before going to implement them. And for things i do, if i not sure if i doing the best way, or there are multiple 'nice' ways to solve the problem, i asking people, what they prefer. In that way people staying in course of what i do, and sometimes could give an advice or help by other means. But i don't expecting much, because we all busy with own agendas.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.
Hi, sorry for being disconnected for a couple of days. I think the idea of raising money for supporting feature requests is really cool. And sure, I volunteer to setup a UserVoirce account. So, if we are all ok with it I'll be setting it up at some point between today and tomorrow. Regarding the founding process both kickstarter and pledgie looks nice. From the FAQ it seems that kickstarter needs an US bank account, don't know if that may be an issue. Cheers, Andrés laurent laffont escribió:
Yes I think it's good to have a real Pharo entity / status / association loi 1901.
For architecture, as Andrés said he/we can set a UserVoice. For raising money http://pledgie.com/.
As for Flattr the idea is good but it seems to raise only little money actually (feedback from pharobyexample and pharocasts. But we haven't tried to encourage people to donate).
Laurent.
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:20 AM, Stéphane Ducasse < stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:00 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
Thinking again about this idea of voting system for features we would like to see in Pharo. I won't pay 10 euros / month for someone to develop full time on Pharo on what I do not control (may not be the best words to explain my feelings :) But I'm ready to give 30 to 50 euros to raise money to develop the most wanted feature from a voting system. This give more visibility. It's easier to make a one shot donation than give XXeuros/month. Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
So one way to achieve this is to set up a voting system AND associated raising money system to develop the most wanted feature for one month. Another way is to pick the most wanted feature for Google Summer of code. Don't expect anything from it
With enough money one can stop his work for one month and develop exclusively for Pharo. If it's too hard to raise money for one month, we can try 15 days. I've seen that some great developers can do fantastic stuff in 15 days when he loves it :) Laurent Laffont
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote: On 10 December 2010 13:32, Davorin Rusevljan <davorin.rusevljan@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Alan Rodas <alanrodas@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm relatively new to Pharo, maybe this has been tried before, but what about a forum where the ideas are published. Each idea could be a thread in the forum, and the people that would like to contribute may comment there. What it may be interesting is that the whole discussion about an idea could live in the thread, and you can keep track of old discussions and the state of a feature. If you keep your ideas for yourself, and you cannot implement something by your own, that idea will die there. If you allow people to comment on ideas, maybe two or more people have the same, and they can start working on it together. A forum allows for contacting people, and sharing, and, in that way, maybe the community will grow (Some developers feel they can do something because they don't have the time to do it by their own, or they don't have the skills, but they can help to a dev team that share the same goals.)
Is just a thought. If you did it before and didn't work, my apologies. Well, those are all nice thoughts. I am also relatively new to Pharo though, I am with Smalltalk for quite a long time. In my humble opinion, while both are always nice to have, at this stage Pharo, much needs more hands willing to do the work, than hands filling the wish lists and voting about them. Abso-freakin-lutely! :)
The Pharo team did marvelous job, I assume with a lot of investment of their personal time and energy. They also did quite good job at setting their targets since they already managed at transforming huge but sometimes hectic Squeak core into consistent development product.
The way things currently work nicely reflect this, you can freely float your ideas on the mailing list, but do not expect that someone else should do it just because of that. But the better the idea is, and the larger your contribution to Pharo is, chances of it being implemented will rise. Otherwise, roll up your sleeves, and do it for yourself. If that is too complicated, consider doing something else simpler but usefull.
I am always discussing ideas before going to implement them. And for things i do, if i not sure if i doing the best way, or there are multiple 'nice' ways to solve the problem, i asking people, what they prefer. In that way people staying in course of what i do, and sometimes could give an advice or help by other means. But i don't expecting much, because we all busy with own agendas.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.
It seems the bank account is the only obstacle to go forward ? Laurent On Mon, Dec 13, 2010 at 1:21 PM, andres <andres@lifia.info.unlp.edu.ar>wrote:
Hi, sorry for being disconnected for a couple of days.
I think the idea of raising money for supporting feature requests is really cool. And sure, I volunteer to setup a UserVoirce account. So, if we are all ok with it I'll be setting it up at some point between today and tomorrow.
Regarding the founding process both kickstarter and pledgie looks nice. From the FAQ it seems that kickstarter needs an US bank account, don't know if that may be an issue.
Cheers, Andrés
laurent laffont escribió:
Yes I think it's good to have a real Pharo entity / status / association
loi 1901.
For architecture, as Andrés said he/we can set a UserVoice. For raising money http://pledgie.com/.
As for Flattr the idea is good but it seems to raise only little money actually (feedback from pharobyexample and pharocasts. But we haven't tried to encourage people to donate).
Laurent.
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:20 AM, Stéphane Ducasse < stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:00 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
Thinking again about this idea of voting system for features we would
like to see in Pharo.
I won't pay 10 euros / month for someone to develop full time on Pharo on
what I do not control (may not be the best words to explain my feelings :)
But I'm ready to give 30 to 50 euros to raise money to develop the most
wanted feature from a voting system. This give more visibility.
It's easier to make a one shot donation than give XXeuros/month.
Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
So one way to achieve this is to set up a voting system AND associated
raising money system to develop the most wanted feature for one month.
Another way is to pick the most wanted feature for Google Summer of code.
Don't expect anything from it
With enough money one can stop his work for one month and develop
exclusively for Pharo. If it's too hard to raise money for one month, we can try 15 days. I've seen that some great developers can do fantastic stuff in 15 days when he loves it :)
Laurent Laffont
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com>
wrote:
On 10 December 2010 13:32, Davorin Rusevljan <davorin.rusevljan@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Alan Rodas <alanrodas@gmail.com>
wrote:
I'm relatively new to Pharo, maybe this has been tried before, but
what
about a forum where the ideas are published.
Each idea could be a thread in the forum, and the people that would
like to
contribute may comment there. What it may be interesting is that the
whole
discussion about an idea could live in the thread, and you can keep
track of
old discussions and the state of a feature.
If you keep your ideas for yourself, and you cannot implement
something by
your own, that idea will die there. If you allow people to comment on
ideas,
maybe two or more people have the same, and they can start working on
it together. A forum allows for contacting people, and sharing, and,
in that
way, maybe the community will grow (Some developers feel they can do
something because they don't have the time to do it by their own, or
they
don't have the skills, but they can help to a dev team that share the
same
goals.)
Is just a thought. If you did it before and didn't work, my apologies.
Well, those are all nice thoughts. I am also relatively new to Pharo though, I am with Smalltalk for quite a long time. In my humble opinion, while both are always nice to have, at this stage Pharo, much needs more hands willing to do the work, than hands filling the wish lists and voting about them.
Abso-freakin-lutely! :)
The Pharo team did marvelous job, I assume with a lot of investment of
their personal time and energy. They also did quite good job at setting their targets since they already managed at transforming huge but sometimes hectic Squeak core into consistent development product.
The way things currently work nicely reflect this, you can freely float your ideas on the mailing list, but do not expect that someone else should do it just because of that. But the better the idea is, and the larger your contribution to Pharo is, chances of it being implemented will rise. Otherwise, roll up your sleeves, and do it for yourself. If that is too complicated, consider doing something else simpler but usefull.
I am always discussing ideas before going to implement them. And for things i do, if i not sure if i doing the best way, or there are multiple 'nice' ways to solve the problem, i asking people, what they prefer. In that way people staying in course of what i do, and sometimes could give an advice or help by other means. But i don't expecting much, because we all busy with own agendas.
rush
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.
yes and for that you need an association... On Dec 14, 2010, at 8:50 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
It seems the bank account is the only obstacle to go forward ?
Laurent
On Mon, Dec 13, 2010 at 1:21 PM, andres <andres@lifia.info.unlp.edu.ar> wrote: Hi, sorry for being disconnected for a couple of days.
I think the idea of raising money for supporting feature requests is really cool. And sure, I volunteer to setup a UserVoirce account. So, if we are all ok with it I'll be setting it up at some point between today and tomorrow.
Regarding the founding process both kickstarter and pledgie looks nice. From the FAQ it seems that kickstarter needs an US bank account, don't know if that may be an issue.
Cheers, Andrés
laurent laffont escribió:
Yes I think it's good to have a real Pharo entity / status / association loi 1901.
For architecture, as Andrés said he/we can set a UserVoice. For raising money http://pledgie.com/.
As for Flattr the idea is good but it seems to raise only little money actually (feedback from pharobyexample and pharocasts. But we haven't tried to encourage people to donate).
Laurent.
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:20 AM, Stéphane Ducasse < stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:00 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
Thinking again about this idea of voting system for features we would like to see in Pharo. I won't pay 10 euros / month for someone to develop full time on Pharo on what I do not control (may not be the best words to explain my feelings :) But I'm ready to give 30 to 50 euros to raise money to develop the most wanted feature from a voting system. This give more visibility. It's easier to make a one shot donation than give XXeuros/month. Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
So one way to achieve this is to set up a voting system AND associated raising money system to develop the most wanted feature for one month. Another way is to pick the most wanted feature for Google Summer of code. Don't expect anything from it
With enough money one can stop his work for one month and develop exclusively for Pharo. If it's too hard to raise money for one month, we can try 15 days. I've seen that some great developers can do fantastic stuff in 15 days when he loves it :) Laurent Laffont
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote: On 10 December 2010 13:32, Davorin Rusevljan <davorin.rusevljan@gmail.com> wrote: On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Alan Rodas <alanrodas@gmail.com> wrote: I'm relatively new to Pharo, maybe this has been tried before, but what about a forum where the ideas are published. Each idea could be a thread in the forum, and the people that would like to contribute may comment there. What it may be interesting is that the whole discussion about an idea could live in the thread, and you can keep track of old discussions and the state of a feature. If you keep your ideas for yourself, and you cannot implement something by your own, that idea will die there. If you allow people to comment on ideas, maybe two or more people have the same, and they can start working on it together. A forum allows for contacting people, and sharing, and, in that way, maybe the community will grow (Some developers feel they can do something because they don't have the time to do it by their own, or they don't have the skills, but they can help to a dev team that share the same goals.)
Is just a thought. If you did it before and didn't work, my apologies. Well, those are all nice thoughts. I am also relatively new to Pharo though, I am with Smalltalk for quite a long time. In my humble opinion, while both are always nice to have, at this stage Pharo, much needs more hands willing to do the work, than hands filling the wish lists and voting about them. Abso-freakin-lutely! :)
The Pharo team did marvelous job, I assume with a lot of investment of their personal time and energy. They also did quite good job at setting their targets since they already managed at transforming huge but sometimes hectic Squeak core into consistent development product.
The way things currently work nicely reflect this, you can freely float your ideas on the mailing list, but do not expect that someone else should do it just because of that. But the better the idea is, and the larger your contribution to Pharo is, chances of it being implemented will rise. Otherwise, roll up your sleeves, and do it for yourself. If that is too complicated, consider doing something else simpler but usefull.
I am always discussing ideas before going to implement them. And for things i do, if i not sure if i doing the best way, or there are multiple 'nice' ways to solve the problem, i asking people, what they prefer. In that way people staying in course of what i do, and sometimes could give an advice or help by other means. But i don't expecting much, because we all busy with own agendas.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.
Hi, sorry again for the delay. The user voice account is ready to run; I created it with a new mail account (pharo.feature.requests) so that it is not bounded to a particular person. Regarding the money rising issue, do you think that an association such as ESUG of FAST could help here? I have zero experience on accounting but maybe it is possible to channel the contributions through them? Cheers, Andrés Stéphane Ducasse escribió:
yes and for that you need an association...
On Dec 14, 2010, at 8:50 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
It seems the bank account is the only obstacle to go forward ?
Laurent
On Mon, Dec 13, 2010 at 1:21 PM, andres <andres@lifia.info.unlp.edu.ar> wrote: Hi, sorry for being disconnected for a couple of days.
I think the idea of raising money for supporting feature requests is really cool. And sure, I volunteer to setup a UserVoirce account. So, if we are all ok with it I'll be setting it up at some point between today and tomorrow.
Regarding the founding process both kickstarter and pledgie looks nice. From the FAQ it seems that kickstarter needs an US bank account, don't know if that may be an issue.
Cheers, Andrés
laurent laffont escribió:
Yes I think it's good to have a real Pharo entity / status / association loi 1901.
For architecture, as Andrés said he/we can set a UserVoice. For raising money http://pledgie.com/.
As for Flattr the idea is good but it seems to raise only little money actually (feedback from pharobyexample and pharocasts. But we haven't tried to encourage people to donate).
Laurent.
On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:20 AM, Stéphane Ducasse < stephane.ducasse@inria.fr> wrote:
On Dec 10, 2010, at 11:00 PM, laurent laffont wrote:
Thinking again about this idea of voting system for features we would like to see in Pharo. I won't pay 10 euros / month for someone to develop full time on Pharo on what I do not control (may not be the best words to explain my feelings :) But I'm ready to give 30 to 50 euros to raise money to develop the most wanted feature from a voting system. This give more visibility. It's easier to make a one shot donation than give XXeuros/month. Good! Tell us what architecture we can use for that. I should find some time to build a association of loi 1901 and get a paypal account for pharo.
So one way to achieve this is to set up a voting system AND associated raising money system to develop the most wanted feature for one month. Another way is to pick the most wanted feature for Google Summer of code. Don't expect anything from it
With enough money one can stop his work for one month and develop exclusively for Pharo. If it's too hard to raise money for one month, we can try 15 days. I've seen that some great developers can do fantastic stuff in 15 days when he loves it :) Laurent Laffont
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua@gmail.com> wrote: On 10 December 2010 13:32, Davorin Rusevljan <davorin.rusevljan@gmail.com> wrote: On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Alan Rodas <alanrodas@gmail.com> wrote: I'm relatively new to Pharo, maybe this has been tried before, but what about a forum where the ideas are published. Each idea could be a thread in the forum, and the people that would like to contribute may comment there. What it may be interesting is that the whole discussion about an idea could live in the thread, and you can keep track of old discussions and the state of a feature. If you keep your ideas for yourself, and you cannot implement something by your own, that idea will die there. If you allow people to comment on ideas, maybe two or more people have the same, and they can start working on it together. A forum allows for contacting people, and sharing, and, in that way, maybe the community will grow (Some developers feel they can do something because they don't have the time to do it by their own, or they don't have the skills, but they can help to a dev team that share the same goals.)
Is just a thought. If you did it before and didn't work, my apologies. Well, those are all nice thoughts. I am also relatively new to Pharo though, I am with Smalltalk for quite a long time. In my humble opinion, while both are always nice to have, at this stage Pharo, much needs more hands willing to do the work, than hands filling the wish lists and voting about them. Abso-freakin-lutely! :)
The Pharo team did marvelous job, I assume with a lot of investment of their personal time and energy. They also did quite good job at setting their targets since they already managed at transforming huge but sometimes hectic Squeak core into consistent development product.
The way things currently work nicely reflect this, you can freely float your ideas on the mailing list, but do not expect that someone else should do it just because of that. But the better the idea is, and the larger your contribution to Pharo is, chances of it being implemented will rise. Otherwise, roll up your sleeves, and do it for yourself. If that is too complicated, consider doing something else simpler but usefull.
I am always discussing ideas before going to implement them. And for things i do, if i not sure if i doing the best way, or there are multiple 'nice' ways to solve the problem, i asking people, what they prefer. In that way people staying in course of what i do, and sometimes could give an advice or help by other means. But i don't expecting much, because we all busy with own agendas.
-- Best regards, Igor Stasenko AKA sig.
On Dec 21, 2010, at 2:43 PM, andres wrote:
Hi, sorry again for the delay. The user voice account is ready to run; I created it with a new mail account (pharo.feature.requests) so that it is not bounded to a particular person.
Regarding the money rising issue, do you think that an association such as ESUG of FAST could help here? I have zero experience on accounting but maybe it is possible to channel the contributions through them?
we wanted to avoid to bother esug because else nasty people could say that it is helping too much pharo (even if esug manage the money for squeak over some long years). So not ESUG. This is why I should create a non profit association but it takes time. stef
participants (6)
-
andres -
Geoffroy Couprie -
Hilaire Fernandes -
James Ashley -
laurent laffont -
Stéphane Ducasse