[Pharo-project] Fuel and Tanker in older Pharo images [WAS] Re: How to try Shapes and Gaucho?
On Fri, Sep 28, 2012 at 11:31 PM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello
ss3 repo for Shapes and Gaucho closed for reading or maybe empty. So is it possible to get it somewhere? maybe there is prepared image?
Actually I gather migrate our applications to last Pharo and use latest achievemens like fuel and tanker.
Hi. I don't want to go offtopic in the original thread so I opened this one. Of course it is usually a good idea to migrate to latest stable Pharo release so that you don't stay with a very old image. Anyway, what I wanted to say is that Fuel DOES WORK in previous images. In fact, it works from Pharo 1.1 to 2.0. And Tanker right now works in 2.0 only by just because by default we use the new ClassBuilder. But this can be easily changed for those who want to use it in older versions. Anyway, Tanker is still a little bit green ;) For more details read my answer to this comment: http://marianopeck.wordpress.com/2012/09/28/new-tanker-current-status/#comme...
And of course I want vector graphics for user interface by athens. And I very very excited about shapes which gives clean and powerfull morphic replacement (Am I right?)
But to understand amount of work for such big changes I should see shapes livelly. I need code.
Best regards, Denis
-- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com
2012/9/29 Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck@gmail.com>
On Fri, Sep 28, 2012 at 11:31 PM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello
ss3 repo for Shapes and Gaucho closed for reading or maybe empty. So is it possible to get it somewhere? maybe there is prepared image?
Actually I gather migrate our applications to last Pharo and use latest achievemens like fuel and tanker.
Hi. I don't want to go offtopic in the original thread so I opened this one. Of course it is usually a good idea to migrate to latest stable Pharo release so that you don't stay with a very old image. Anyway, what I wanted to say is that Fuel DOES WORK in previous images. In fact, it works from Pharo 1.1 to 2.0. And Tanker right now works in 2.0 only by just because by default we use the new ClassBuilder. But this can be easily changed for those who want to use it in older versions. Anyway, Tanker is still a little bit green ;) For more details read my answer to this comment: http://marianopeck.wordpress.com/2012/09/28/new-tanker-current-status/#comme...
Hello and thank's for response. Actually I want use Tanker to deploy my applications with "bootstrap way" where only kernel minimal image existed and all application loaded at startup. It will simplify delivering application updates to slow remote targets. I can just upload small tanker files and load it seamlessly because its really fast. And without image saves no corrupt images due to something bad at middle of image save. Best regards, Denis
On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 12:59 PM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk@gmail.com>wrote:
2012/9/29 Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck@gmail.com>
On Fri, Sep 28, 2012 at 11:31 PM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello
ss3 repo for Shapes and Gaucho closed for reading or maybe empty. So is it possible to get it somewhere? maybe there is prepared image?
Actually I gather migrate our applications to last Pharo and use latest achievemens like fuel and tanker.
Hi. I don't want to go offtopic in the original thread so I opened this one. Of course it is usually a good idea to migrate to latest stable Pharo release so that you don't stay with a very old image. Anyway, what I wanted to say is that Fuel DOES WORK in previous images. In fact, it works from Pharo 1.1 to 2.0. And Tanker right now works in 2.0 only by just because by default we use the new ClassBuilder. But this can be easily changed for those who want to use it in older versions. Anyway, Tanker is still a little bit green ;) For more details read my answer to this comment: http://marianopeck.wordpress.com/2012/09/28/new-tanker-current-status/#comme...
Hello and thank's for response.
Actually I want use Tanker to deploy my applications with "bootstrap way" where only kernel minimal image existed and all application loaded at startup. It will simplify delivering application updates to slow remote targets. I can just upload small tanker files and load it seamlessly because its really fast. And without image saves no corrupt images due to something bad at middle of image save.
Hi Denis. I want to say a couple of things about this. First, you are not the only one wanting this. In fact, that scenario is one of the reasons we are investing a lot of time in the infrastructure: 1) Pavel Krivanek has been working a lot in making the image more modular, being able to cleanly unload and reload packages. This was the first step. 2) Jannik Laval continue that effort trying to remove lots of cyclic dependencies between packages. 3) Guillermo Polito started to work in the bootstrap. He is now able to bootstrap images from scratch (contrary to Pavel's PharoKernel where he was unloading packages). 4) Esteban Lorenzano is working on a new ConfigurationOfPharo that will let you take a kernel/bootstraped/minimal image and load just the packages you want. 5) Camilo Bruni, Martin Dias, Guillermo Polito, and Toon Verwaest have been working in a new class builder based on layouts. The "old ClassBuilder" is really difficult to maintain, understand, fix, etc. When you load packages, the class builder takes an important role. Therefore, they were working in a new class builder, which, from my point of view, is way better, object-oriented, tested, etc. 6) Martin Dias and Me were working in Tanker, a tool to export/import packages of code using Fuel without Compiler. So.....as you can see there is/was a lot of work going on related to what you need :) It is not 100% ready, but we are getting there. Cheers,
Best regards, Denis
-- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com
On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 2:20 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck < marianopeck@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 12:59 PM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk@gmail.com>wrote:
2012/9/29 Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck@gmail.com>
On Fri, Sep 28, 2012 at 11:31 PM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk@gmail.com
wrote:
Hello
ss3 repo for Shapes and Gaucho closed for reading or maybe empty. So is it possible to get it somewhere? maybe there is prepared image?
Actually I gather migrate our applications to last Pharo and use latest achievemens like fuel and tanker.
Hi. I don't want to go offtopic in the original thread so I opened this one. Of course it is usually a good idea to migrate to latest stable Pharo release so that you don't stay with a very old image. Anyway, what I wanted to say is that Fuel DOES WORK in previous images. In fact, it works from Pharo 1.1 to 2.0. And Tanker right now works in 2.0 only by just because by default we use the new ClassBuilder. But this can be easily changed for those who want to use it in older versions. Anyway, Tanker is still a little bit green ;) For more details read my answer to this comment: http://marianopeck.wordpress.com/2012/09/28/new-tanker-current-status/#comme...
Hello and thank's for response.
Actually I want use Tanker to deploy my applications with "bootstrap way" where only kernel minimal image existed and all application loaded at startup. It will simplify delivering application updates to slow remote targets. I can just upload small tanker files and load it seamlessly because its really fast. And without image saves no corrupt images due to something bad at middle of image save.
Hi Denis. I want to say a couple of things about this. First, you are not the only one wanting this. In fact, that scenario is one of the reasons we are investing a lot of time in the infrastructure:
1) Pavel Krivanek has been working a lot in making the image more modular, being able to cleanly unload and reload packages. This was the first step. 2) Jannik Laval continue that effort trying to remove lots of cyclic dependencies between packages. 3) Guillermo Polito started to work in the bootstrap. He is now able to bootstrap images from scratch (contrary to Pavel's PharoKernel where he was unloading packages). 4) Esteban Lorenzano is working on a new ConfigurationOfPharo that will let you take a kernel/bootstraped/minimal image and load just the packages you want. 5) Camilo Bruni, Martin Dias, Guillermo Polito, and Toon Verwaest have been working in a new class builder based on layouts. The "old ClassBuilder" is really difficult to maintain, understand, fix, etc. When you load packages, the class builder takes an important role. Therefore, they were working in a new class builder, which, from my point of view, is way better, object-oriented, tested, etc. 6) Martin Dias and Me were working in Tanker, a tool to export/import packages of code using Fuel without Compiler.
And the list can of course continue: 7) Dale did Metacello, which is a great package management system (needed by 4) and for all the rest of the projects) 8) Fuel, as it is needed by 6) ..... and so on...
So.....as you can see there is/was a lot of work going on related to what you need :) It is not 100% ready, but we are getting there.
Cheers,
Best regards, Denis
-- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com
-- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com
On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 3:42 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck < marianopeck@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 2:20 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck < marianopeck@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Sep 29, 2012 at 12:59 PM, Denis Kudriashov <dionisiydk@gmail.com>wrote:
2012/9/29 Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck@gmail.com>
On Fri, Sep 28, 2012 at 11:31 PM, Denis Kudriashov < dionisiydk@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello
ss3 repo for Shapes and Gaucho closed for reading or maybe empty. So is it possible to get it somewhere? maybe there is prepared image?
Actually I gather migrate our applications to last Pharo and use latest achievemens like fuel and tanker.
Hi. I don't want to go offtopic in the original thread so I opened this one. Of course it is usually a good idea to migrate to latest stable Pharo release so that you don't stay with a very old image. Anyway, what I wanted to say is that Fuel DOES WORK in previous images. In fact, it works from Pharo 1.1 to 2.0. And Tanker right now works in 2.0 only by just because by default we use the new ClassBuilder. But this can be easily changed for those who want to use it in older versions. Anyway, Tanker is still a little bit green ;) For more details read my answer to this comment: http://marianopeck.wordpress.com/2012/09/28/new-tanker-current-status/#comme...
Hello and thank's for response.
Actually I want use Tanker to deploy my applications with "bootstrap way" where only kernel minimal image existed and all application loaded at startup. It will simplify delivering application updates to slow remote targets. I can just upload small tanker files and load it seamlessly because its really fast. And without image saves no corrupt images due to something bad at middle of image save.
Hi Denis. I want to say a couple of things about this. First, you are not the only one wanting this. In fact, that scenario is one of the reasons we are investing a lot of time in the infrastructure:
1) Pavel Krivanek has been working a lot in making the image more modular, being able to cleanly unload and reload packages. This was the first step. 2) Jannik Laval continue that effort trying to remove lots of cyclic dependencies between packages. 3) Guillermo Polito started to work in the bootstrap. He is now able to bootstrap images from scratch (contrary to Pavel's PharoKernel where he was unloading packages). 4) Esteban Lorenzano is working on a new ConfigurationOfPharo that will let you take a kernel/bootstraped/minimal image and load just the packages you want. 5) Camilo Bruni, Martin Dias, Guillermo Polito, and Toon Verwaest have been working in a new class builder based on layouts. The "old ClassBuilder" is really difficult to maintain, understand, fix, etc. When you load packages, the class builder takes an important role. Therefore, they were working in a new class builder, which, from my point of view, is way better, object-oriented, tested, etc. 6) Martin Dias and Me were working in Tanker, a tool to export/import packages of code using Fuel without Compiler.
And the list can of course continue:
7) Dale did Metacello, which is a great package management system (needed by 4) and for all the rest of the projects) 8) Fuel, as it is needed by 6)
9) RPackage also improves a lot the loading time (because it avoids the PackageInfo calculation...)
..... and so on...
So.....as you can see there is/was a lot of work going on related to what you need :) It is not 100% ready, but we are getting there.
Cheers,
Best regards, Denis
-- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com
-- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com
-- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com
Thanks mariano for the history :) This is the vision we have and that is presented in the vision file available in the consortium web page on the pharo-project.org :)
Hi Denis. I want to say a couple of things about this. First, you are not the only one wanting this. In fact, that scenario is one of the reasons we are investing a lot of time in the infrastructure:
1) Pavel Krivanek has been working a lot in making the image more modular, being able to cleanly unload and reload packages. This was the first step. 2) Jannik Laval continue that effort trying to remove lots of cyclic dependencies between packages. 3) Guillermo Polito started to work in the bootstrap. He is now able to bootstrap images from scratch (contrary to Pavel's PharoKernel where he was unloading packages). 4) Esteban Lorenzano is working on a new ConfigurationOfPharo that will let you take a kernel/bootstraped/minimal image and load just the packages you want. 5) Camilo Bruni, Martin Dias, Guillermo Polito, and Toon Verwaest have been working in a new class builder based on layouts. The "old ClassBuilder" is really difficult to maintain, understand, fix, etc. When you load packages, the class builder takes an important role. Therefore, they were working in a new class builder, which, from my point of view, is way better, object-oriented, tested, etc. 6) Martin Dias and Me were working in Tanker, a tool to export/import packages of code using Fuel without Compiler.
So.....as you can see there is/was a lot of work going on related to what you need :) It is not 100% ready, but we are getting there.
Cheers,
participants (3)
-
Denis Kudriashov -
Mariano Martinez Peck -
Stéphane Ducasse