philippeback wrote
Text is here to stay once we get into the sysadmin realm. People do not want to deal with code internals when they are doing the piping. Just my experience dealing with such admins working with a lot of different systems. We cannot ask them to become polyglot coders as their hands are full already.
I agree that people should deal with code internals, that was my entire point. We should try to find ways to make systems more *self-representative, self-explanatory and direct*. People who want to instrument a system should not have to resort to programming, and, borrowing the metaphor from electronics they don't have to (at least for the static parts of the system, see my previous post). As for text: Who says that text is here to say? Just because it always has been this way, does not mean it always will. Instead of using the traditional ways and metaphors of building systems, we should look for better alternatives - isn't that the whole point of the Pharo project? And looking at the past of computing, there are a lot of good ideas and metaphors that need to be incorporated into Pharo, instead of doing old things in a slightly different fashion and repeating all mistakes in different clothings. In other words: To me the need for logging facilities is a symptom of a larger architectural problem: self-representation. This problem needs to be tackled at its roots and there are many ways to do this. The problem that I see is that immediate needs have to be satisfied but that doesn't mean to cave in. I won't, I am done with code hacking. -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/What-Logging-framework-for-Pharo-tp4799073p4799263.htm... Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Developers mailing list archive at Nabble.com.