Nobody said we were against such a mailing list! But, just as you, there are topics I skip on the mailing list. No harm done, quick & easy to do! But one should never refrain from talking about other Smalltalk environments on a Smalltalk/Pharo list : if VisualAge, or VisualWorks, or Dolphin, or Squeak, or ObjectStudio, or VSE or any other Smalltalk can inspire us to make Pharo better, I don't think that saying "Dolphin really has a great look & feel for Windows app" is equivalent to saying "VisualWorks sucks" or "Pharo is crap" ! I could talk for hours at what those Smalltalk products rock. I could also talk for hours at what those Smalltalk products suck. I could talk for hours about why product X is better that product Y for job Z. That doesn't mean one product is crap and the other one is perfect! Every Smalltalk product has strengths and weaknesses. Why shouldn't we be inspired by great features of other products that Pharo doesn't yet have? Criticism of Pharo (or praise of other products) doesn't mean we hate or despise Pharo! It just means that we care. And that we can make it better! Also, inevitably you'll have non-Pharo & non-Smalltalk related topics sometimes popping up on the mailing list. Am I interested by digital image formats? Nope. So if I see a thread about someone who wants to develop a library to read the FITS format (Flexible Image Transport System, used in astronomy mainly), chances are we'll see posts about astronomy & FITS for 2-3 days. I don't mind since, in the end, it still is Smalltalk-related! On the topic of "Why is [insert your favorite non-Smalltalk programming language here] better than Smalltalk/Pharo?", I gave up that kind of discussion years ago... And on the rare occasions when I have it, I have it in private. You'll always find a moron who thinks GW-BASIC + DOS 4.1 + dBase is the way to go. I don't waste time with those people anymore! lol On 2020-01-30 07:40, ducasse wrote:
You see this is several times that I gently ask if we can move on. And regularly we get the same.
So I can also live pharo-dev. At the end of the day we cannot have the cake and eat it too.
So you can consider that Iâm an asshole. Iâm probably that. Now Iâm super super fedup to have to jump over some thread. I quit newsgroups in the past because of that. I quit Pharo-users because of that.
When I want to read about X Z Y and this is not related to Pharo then I google the Web.
S.
On 30 Jan 2020, at 12:05, Benoit St-Jean <bstjean@yahoo.com <mailto:bstjean@yahoo.com>> wrote:
*From: *Benoit St-Jean <bstjean@yahoo.com <mailto:bstjean@yahoo.com>> *Subject: **Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo4pharo mailing-list announce* *Date: *30 January 2020 at 12:05:38 CET *To: *pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org <mailto:pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org>
Wow!
That post on Pharo Weekly ( https://pharoweekly.wordpress.com/2020/01/30/ann-pharo-4-pharo-mailing-list/ ) really sets a great welcoming ambiance for any newcomer interested by Pharo who'll read that or who'll stumble on it by accident while googling "Pharo+mailing+list" !
#Not #Fail #WorstAdvertisingEver
Please, take 30 seconds to remove that crap before too many people read it...
P.S. it's one thing to express yourself like that on a mailing list, it's another one to put it upfront on a blog...
On 2020-01-30 02:33, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
Hi
Tired of boring and dull discussions about the past? Tired and bored about the fact that the discussions are not about Pharo but about X, Z, K? Want to get in touch with other real pharo users? Want to have positive and nice discussions about Pharo?
This mailing-list is for you
https://lists.gforge.inria.fr/mailman/listinfo/lse-pharo4pharo
I created a new mailing-list for Pharo 4 Pharo. The idea of this new mailing-list is to exchange between Pharo users on Pharo.
If you want to talk about the weather and other cool fishing practices or how other languages are super cool, then you should use another mailing-list.
You can consider that Iâm [ ]Â Â an asshole [ ] Â an arrogant idiot [ ] Â other This is not my concern.
My concern is: can we respect Pharo and users of Pharo that want to share what they are doing and ask questions about their language?
If you join this mailing-list be warned that I (yes me the benevolent dictator of Pharo) will remove you from the mailing-list when you get on my nerves.
If you do not like it, do not like me, do not appreciate it, do not join!
S.
BTW they are plenty of newsgroups about Smalltalk and you can join there.
-------------------------------------------- Stéphane Ducasse http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr <http://stephane.ducasse.free.fr/> / http://www.pharo.org <http://www.pharo.org/> 03 59 35 87 52 Assistant: Julie Jonas FAX 03 59 57 78 50 TEL 03 59 35 86 16 S. Ducasse - Inria 40, avenue Halley, Parc Scientifique de la Haute Borne, Bât.A, Park Plaza Villeneuve d'Ascq 59650 France
-- ----------------- Benoît St-Jean Yahoo! Messenger: bstjean Twitter: @BenLeChialeux Pinterest: benoitstjean Instagram: Chef_Benito IRC: lamneth GitHub: bstjean Blogue:endormitoire.wordpress.com <http://endormitoire.wordpress.com> "A standpoint is an intellectual horizon of radius zero". (A. Einstein)
-- ----------------- Benoît St-Jean Yahoo! Messenger: bstjean Twitter: @BenLeChialeux Pinterest: benoitstjean Instagram: Chef_Benito IRC: lamneth GitHub: bstjean Blogue: endormitoire.wordpress.com "A standpoint is an intellectual horizon of radius zero". (A. Einstein)