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[Pharo-project] Providing a Cog debug [WAS] Fwd: [Vm-dev] Debugging Cog crash

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Hi...I was reading this thread, and even before his last answer, I was thinking more or less the same. Is it worth it to create one more target in Hudson so that to create cogs but with debug flags? It is not necessary to create for stack vm, cog and mt. Maybe just cog is enough. And one for each OS. So, it is only 3 targets, using: CogDebugMacOSConfig, CogDebugUnixConfig, and ... (sorry, I didn't find in windows..). What do you think? is it worth it ? or we can say "ehhh ehh compile it by your own " ? cheers Mariano ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu> Date: Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 2:19 PM Subject: RE: [Pharo-project] [Vm-dev] Debugging Cog crash To: "Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr" < Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr>, Squeak Virtual Machine Development Discussion <vm-dev(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Is there a debug version of Cog that I can run on the box? I have casually avoided learning how to build Cog in part because that means I can't hack the FFI plugin, which forces me to play by the rules on library paths/ldconfig, etc. It also means that I don't have a build environment ready to go, so I can't readily add syslog() calls to bracket where it quits. gdb isn't helping as described below. If there is something you want me to try, let me know. We have a reproducible Cog crash. ________________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [ pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Schwab,Wilhelm K [ bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu] Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:03 PM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr; Squeak Virtual Machine Development Discussion Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] [Vm-dev] FW: Debugging Cog crash Levente, I follow on why my shell script did not work. Your instructions got me going, but we still don't have an answer. The vm is running, but I cannot attach: http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/vm-dev/2008-March/001840.html >From what I read, one answer is the get the image loaded and then attach - my problem is that the vm never gets far enough to actually load the image. Any ideas? Bill -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

April 9, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Help (perfect for newcomers) migrating a technical FAQ

by Mariano Martinez Peck

One year after..... anyone interested ? On Thu, May 13, 2010 at 10:37 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck < marianopeck(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi folks. I had a good idea and and it perfect for someone that wants to > help and don't know how. It is not the most entertained task, but I promise > you will learn a lot. Mostly, if you are newcomer. > > The idea is basically to migrate the FAQ that is here: > > http://scg.unibe.ch/wiki/faq/pharofaq > > to a new section in the collaborative Pharo book: > > http://book.pharo-project.org/ > > So....any takers ? Let us know so that we generate a new user in the Book > > The idea is also to check whether what is says is still correct for pharo > or if it needs an update. Or even how to improve it (from the view of a > newcomer). > > Thanks > > Mariano > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

April 9, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] thx to Code Snippets

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Ineed, there is something much better. But no one take time to update it or moved to pharo book: http://forum.world.st/Help-perfect-for-newcomers-migrating-a-technical-FAQ-… Cheers Mariano On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 2:30 PM, Mariano Martinez Peck <marianopeck(a)gmail.com > wrote: > > > On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 2:27 PM, HwaJong Oh <daliot.oh(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> To me, learning Smalltalk is not as easy as knowing how cool Smalltalk is. >> >> I found a page very useful most of people here already know: >> >> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/wiki/CodeSnippets >> >> >> Although some examples are out dated. it is still fun. It almost feels >> like >> a web version of ProfStef. >> >> Thank you everyone who contributed there. >> >> > hehehe you can contribute too :) > Just update those out dated > > cheers > > mariano > > >> Best Regards >> >> -- >> View this message in context: >> http://forum.world.st/thx-to-Code-Snippets-tp3438383p3438383.html >> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >> >> > > > -- > Mariano > http://marianopeck.wordpress.com > > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

April 9, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] thx to Code Snippets

by Mariano Martinez Peck

On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 2:27 PM, HwaJong Oh <daliot.oh(a)gmail.com> wrote: > To me, learning Smalltalk is not as easy as knowing how cool Smalltalk is. > > I found a page very useful most of people here already know: > > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/wiki/CodeSnippets > > > Although some examples are out dated. it is still fun. It almost feels like > a web version of ProfStef. > > Thank you everyone who contributed there. > > hehehe you can contribute too :) Just update those out dated cheers mariano > Best Regards > > -- > View this message in context: > http://forum.world.st/thx-to-Code-Snippets-tp3438383p3438383.html > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. > > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

April 9, 2011

[Pharo-project] thx to Code Snippets

by HwaJong Oh

To me, learning Smalltalk is not as easy as knowing how cool Smalltalk is. I found a page very useful most of people here already know: http://code.google.com/p/pharo/wiki/CodeSnippets Although some examples are out dated. it is still fun. It almost feels like a web version of ProfStef. Thank you everyone who contributed there. Best Regards -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/thx-to-Code-Snippets-tp3438383p3438383.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

April 9, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] relational database and id field

by Alexandre Bergel

Ok Alexandre On 8 Apr 2011, at 14:50, Guillermo Polito wrote: > And one more remark about ids. I prefer not to use domain related ids like ISBN, because some day those rules will change and become obsolet, and your whole schema will need to be changed :/. > > Using autogenerated ids are more confortable if you take that into account. > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 3:43 PM, Richard Durr <richard.durr(a)googlemail.com> wrote: > I recommend ids because without them, objects that are equal but not identicall do not really fit into the db. ^^ > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 3:43 PM, Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu> wrote: > That sounds like a one-to-many relationship. In those cases, I create two tables, one for the singleton side and one for the many side. The many side includes the key field(s) from the one side, and setting it/them establishes the relationship. A unique ID field for the singleton side is helpful, especially if things get edited. For many to many, I create a third table that does nothing but associate keys between the two tables - I'm not even sure if there is another way to do it?? > > > > ________________________________________ > From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Benoit St-Jean [bstjean(a)yahoo.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 8:57 AM > To: Alexandre Bergel > Cc: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] relational database and id field > > One more remark, > > Since you're storing objects into a RDBMS, I guess what you're trying to express into "the relational world" is a notion of pointer (such as an object contains a collection of something in one of its instance variable, or a child has a mother kinda relationship, link). In that case, to save you headaches and lots of "weird object-oriented modeling", an oid (object id) is what is used normally. Any sequence (the shorter the better, don't use GUID for instance!) would do... > > ----------------- > Benoit St-Jean > Yahoo! Messenger: bstjean > A standpoint is an intellectual horizon of radius zero. > (Albert Einstein) > > > ________________________________ > From: Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> > To: Benoit St-Jean <bstjean(a)yahoo.com> > Cc: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr > Sent: Thu, April 7, 2011 9:49:11 AM > Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] relational database and id field > > > Normally, you should always have a primary key to uniquely identify a record in a database table. If you have an attribute (or a set of attributes) that can uniquely identify your ComicBook, you don't need an id field. BUT, if you tell me you're going to store lots and lots and lots of those ComicBook instances, having an id (integer) as the primary key has potential non-negligeable advantages over, say, something like a name. Mainly because an id (let's suppose it's an INT) takes way less storage than say a name (VARCHAR(30) for instance) and thus more index records can fit into the key buffer in memory. > > Ok, I understand. > > > 1) yes, always provide a primary key > > 2) if you have already A primary key (even a composite one) > > 2a) if you need performance and are gonna store LOTS of those objects, the smaller the key the better so you could create a surrogate key (the id key) instead of using the "real" primary key > > 2b) if performance is not an issue, you can use what is already available that uniquely identifies your object (row) in the database table > > Thanks! > > > P.S. Are you using a particular OO-RDBMS framework? > > No, I am correcting a student thesis :-) > I would probably not use SQL if I had to :-) > > Cheers, > Alexandre > > > > > > ----------------- > > Benoit St-Jean > > Yahoo! Messenger: bstjean > > A standpoint is an intellectual horizon of radius zero. > > (Albert Einstein) > > > > > > From: Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com<mailto:alexandre.bergel@me.com>> > > To: Pharo Development <Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr<mailto:Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr>> > > Sent: Thu, April 7, 2011 9:19:03 AM > > Subject: [Pharo-project] relational database and id field > > > > Hi! > > > > Since there are some experts in databases here, I ask a general question about it. > > Assume that I have to use a relational database to store, let's stay instances of Stef's ComicBook class. > > Should the class ComicBook have a field id to uniquely identify a book? > > > > Cheers, > > Alexandre > > -- > > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > > > > -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

April 9, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] [Vm-dev] Debugging Cog crash

by Schwab,Wilhelm K

Is there a debug version of Cog that I can run on the box? I have casually avoided learning how to build Cog in part because that means I can't hack the FFI plugin, which forces me to play by the rules on library paths/ldconfig, etc. It also means that I don't have a build environment ready to go, so I can't readily add syslog() calls to bracket where it quits. gdb isn't helping as described below. If there is something you want me to try, let me know. We have a reproducible Cog crash. ________________________________________ From: pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr [pharo-project-bounces(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Schwab,Wilhelm K [bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu] Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:03 PM To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr; Squeak Virtual Machine Development Discussion Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] [Vm-dev] FW: Debugging Cog crash Levente, I follow on why my shell script did not work. Your instructions got me going, but we still don't have an answer. The vm is running, but I cannot attach: http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/vm-dev/2008-March/001840.html >From what I read, one answer is the get the image loaded and then attach - my problem is that the vm never gets far enough to actually load the image. Any ideas? Bill

April 9, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Have started an independent developer activity - Thank you

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Congrats Laurent. I hope you can succeed! Remember that business is also part of the community. There are a lot of several companies held by guys in our community (also using Smalltalk). You, companies, should talk and do business together :) Cheers Mariano On Sat, Apr 9, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)beta9.be>wrote: > > On 09 Apr 2011, at 09:34, laurent laffont wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > I discovered Smalltalk and Pharo almost three years ago and just after > read Chad Fowler book "Passionate Programmer" (1st edition title was "My job > went to India"). These have changed my developer life, how I perceive > software and that great technology is fun, people doing it more. You're a > cool community and I'm proud to be there. > > > > Now I've started an aside (paid :) independent developer activity thanks > to a cool guy. That would not be possible without all the stuff I learn > every day from the community and the urge to continue you give me. > > Great for you Laurent, you absolutely deserve, I wish you success. > > > Each time I've made a step forward (open a blog, write ProfStef, fix > bugs, create PharoCasts) I've been amazed that the generated effects were > those described in Passionate Programmer (go read it !) The last chapter is > "Go independent" so now I need the sequel ;) > > > > Special big thank you to StÃ©phane Ducasse - you're crazy :) Long live > Pharo ! > > > > > > PS: nice piece of Passionate Programmer: > > > > When I was in India weeding through hundreds of candidates for only > > tens of jobs, the interview team was exhausting itself and running out > > of time because of a poor interview-to-hire hit rate. Heads hurting and > > eyes red, we held a late-night meeting to discuss a strategic change in > the > > way we would go through the candidates. We had to either optimize the > > process so we could interview more people or somehow interview better > > people (or both). With what little was left of my voice after twelve > straight > > hours of trying to drag answers out of dumbstruck programmers, I argued > > for adding Smalltalk to the list of keywords our headhunters were using > > to search their rÃ©sumÃ© database. But, nobody knows Smalltalk in India, > cried > > the human resources director. That was my point. Nobody knew it, and > > programming in Smalltalk was a fundamentally different experience than > > programming in Java. The varying experience would give candidates a > > different level of expectations, and the dynamic nature of the Smalltalk > > environment would reshape the way a Java programmer would approach > > a problem. My hope was that these factors would encourage a level of > > technical maturity that I hadnât been seeing from the candidates Iâd met > so > > far. > > The addition of Smalltalk to the requirements list yielded a candidate > pool > > that was tiny in contrast to our previous list. These people were > diamonds > > in the rough. They really understood object-oriented programming. They > > were aware that Java isnât the idealistic panacea itâs sometimes made out > > to be. Many of them loved to program! Where have you been for the past > two > > weeks? we thought. > > Unfortunately, our ability to attract these developers for the salaries > we > > were able to pay was limited. They were calling the shots, and most of > > them chose to stay where they were or to keep looking for a new job. > > Though we failed to recruit many of them, we learned a valuable recruit- > > ing lesson: we were more likely to extend offers to candidates with > diverse > > (and even unorthodox) experience than to those whose experiences were > > homogenous. My explanation is that either the good people seek out > > diversity, because they love to learn new things, or being forced into > alien > > experiences and environments created more mature, well-rounded soft- > > ware developers. I suspect itâs a little of both, but regardless of why > it > > works, we learned that it works. I still use this technique when looking > > for developers. > > Nice story, very true here as well, developers with broad interests are > better, but there are not many of them. > > > Laurent Laffont - @lolgzs > > > > Pharo Smalltalk Screencasts: http://www.pharocasts.com/ > > Blog: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/ > > Developer group: http://cara74.seasidehosting.st > > > > > > > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

April 9, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Have started an independent developer activity - Thank you

by Alexandre Bergel

This equally applies to research, thanks to all of you. Alexandre On 9 Apr 2011, at 03:34, laurent laffont wrote: > Hi, > > I discovered Smalltalk and Pharo almost three years ago and just after read Chad Fowler book "Passionate Programmer" (1st edition title was "My job went to India"). These have changed my developer life, how I perceive software and that great technology is fun, people doing it more. You're a cool community and I'm proud to be there. > > Now I've started an aside (paid :) independent developer activity thanks to a cool guy. That would not be possible without all the stuff I learn every day from the community and the urge to continue you give me. > > Each time I've made a step forward (open a blog, write ProfStef, fix bugs, create PharoCasts) I've been amazed that the generated effects were those described in Passionate Programmer (go read it !) The last chapter is "Go independent" so now I need the sequel ;) > > Special big thank you to StÃ©phane Ducasse - you're crazy :) Long live Pharo ! > > > PS: nice piece of Passionate Programmer: > > When I was in India weeding through hundreds of candidates for only > tens of jobs, the interview team was exhausting itself and running out > of time because of a poor interview-to-hire hit rate. Heads hurting and > eyes red, we held a late-night meeting to discuss a strategic change in the > way we would go through the candidates. We had to either optimize the > process so we could interview more people or somehow interview better > people (or both). With what little was left of my voice after twelve straight > hours of trying to drag answers out of dumbstruck programmers, I argued > for adding Smalltalk to the list of keywords our headhunters were using > to search their rÃ©sumÃ© database. But, nobody knows Smalltalk in India, cried > the human resources director. That was my point. Nobody knew it, and > programming in Smalltalk was a fundamentally different experience than > programming in Java. The varying experience would give candidates a > different level of expectations, and the dynamic nature of the Smalltalk > environment would reshape the way a Java programmer would approach > a problem. My hope was that these factors would encourage a level of > technical maturity that I hadnât been seeing from the candidates Iâd met so > far. > The addition of Smalltalk to the requirements list yielded a candidate pool > that was tiny in contrast to our previous list. These people were diamonds > in the rough. They really understood object-oriented programming. They > were aware that Java isnât the idealistic panacea itâs sometimes made out > to be. Many of them loved to program! Where have you been for the past two > weeks? we thought. > Unfortunately, our ability to attract these developers for the salaries we > were able to pay was limited. They were calling the shots, and most of > them chose to stay where they were or to keep looking for a new job. > Though we failed to recruit many of them, we learned a valuable recruit- > ing lesson: we were more likely to extend offers to candidates with diverse > (and even unorthodox) experience than to those whose experiences were > homogenous. My explanation is that either the good people seek out > diversity, because they love to learn new things, or being forced into alien > experiences and environments created more mature, well-rounded soft- > ware developers. I suspect itâs a little of both, but regardless of why it > works, we learned that it works. I still use this technique when looking > for developers. > > > Laurent Laffont - @lolgzs > > Pharo Smalltalk Screencasts: http://www.pharocasts.com/ > Blog: http://magaloma.blogspot.com/ > Developer group: http://cara74.seasidehosting.st > > -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

April 9, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Issue 3849 in pharo: ExternalSettings should be cleaned

by pharo＠googlecode.com

Updates: Status: FixProposed Labels: Milestone-1.3 Comment #2 on issue 3849 by marcus.d...(a)gmail.com: ExternalSettings should be cleaned http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=3849 1) do in the preamble Smalltalk removeFromShutDownList: ExternalSettings. Smalltalk removeFromStartUpList: ExternalSettings. Then file in the attached changeset Attachments: remExternalSettings.1.cs 518 bytes

April 9, 2011