- Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] Experiment: New Download page based on Pharo Launcher

by Esteban Lorenzano

> On 15 Mar 2018, at 09:34, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > > >> On 15 Mar 2018, at 09:27, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm(a)gmail.com <mailto:estebanlm@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> >> >>> On 15 Mar 2018, at 00:08, Cyril Ferlicot <cyril.ferlicot(a)gmail.com <mailto:cyril.ferlicot@gmail.com>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> On mer. 14 mars 2018 at 18:18, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr <mailto:marcus.denker@inria.fr>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> > On 9 Mar 2018, at 23:34, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: >>> > >>> > Additional portable versions would be nice too (based on a simple ZIP) instead of only the installable apps >>> > >>> >>> Is there a deeper reason for this? If I look at âother systemsâ, they manage to have *one* download, *one* way of installing. >>> For me, offering *a lot* of possible different ways means that the user has to choose without knowing why there is even the option to chooseâ¦ >>> >>> The problem is that Pharo is different from other systems. When you install eclipse, you'll use the installed eclipse for all your projects for a long time. >>> >>> Pharo images are more like a "disposable". You'll not use the same Pharo image for multiple big projects and you'll more easily throw away an image to take a new one from time to time. >>> >>> Actually I think I download and delete around 5 images/day sometime. >> >> IMO this just strengthen Marcus argument :) >> >>> This complicate a little things because sometime you want to directly download one image. Sometime you want to have one application to manage your images (Pharo launcher) >> >> Why? You have launcher: you download all images you want (btwâ¦ I still believe launcher UI needs love, but one thing at a time ;) ) >> And if you need more complex stuff, you always have the âotherâ section. >> >> but I side with Marcus here: we need ONE blessed way of manage pharo, otherwise is an un-managable mess. >> >> cheers, >> Esteban >> >> ps: btw, weâll need also >> - OBS for the launcher (to have linux packaging) >> - signing the launcher on mac (we already did this for the VM, we can do the same for launcher). And distribute it as dmg, not zip (a dmg is just a zip renamed so no problem here). >> - a windows installer >> > and I would love support for this: https://sparkle-project.org <https://sparkle-project.org/> to keep the âPharoâ app always up-to-date dreams, dreamsâ¦ maybe next year I will have time to do some of this? who knowsâ¦ > . > > Marcus

March 15, 2018

Re: [Pharo-dev] Experiment: New Download page based on Pharo Launcher

by Marcus Denker

> On 15 Mar 2018, at 09:27, Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > >> On 15 Mar 2018, at 00:08, Cyril Ferlicot <cyril.ferlicot(a)gmail.com <mailto:cyril.ferlicot@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> >> On mer. 14 mars 2018 at 18:18, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr <mailto:marcus.denker@inria.fr>> wrote: >> >> >> > On 9 Mar 2018, at 23:34, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: >> > >> > Additional portable versions would be nice too (based on a simple ZIP) instead of only the installable apps >> > >> >> Is there a deeper reason for this? If I look at âother systemsâ, they manage to have *one* download, *one* way of installing. >> For me, offering *a lot* of possible different ways means that the user has to choose without knowing why there is even the option to chooseâ¦ >> >> The problem is that Pharo is different from other systems. When you install eclipse, you'll use the installed eclipse for all your projects for a long time. >> >> Pharo images are more like a "disposable". You'll not use the same Pharo image for multiple big projects and you'll more easily throw away an image to take a new one from time to time. >> >> Actually I think I download and delete around 5 images/day sometime. > > IMO this just strengthen Marcus argument :) > >> This complicate a little things because sometime you want to directly download one image. Sometime you want to have one application to manage your images (Pharo launcher) > > Why? You have launcher: you download all images you want (btwâ¦ I still believe launcher UI needs love, but one thing at a time ;) ) > And if you need more complex stuff, you always have the âotherâ section. > > but I side with Marcus here: we need ONE blessed way of manage pharo, otherwise is an un-managable mess. > > cheers, > Esteban > > ps: btw, weâll need also > - OBS for the launcher (to have linux packaging) > - signing the launcher on mac (we already did this for the VM, we can do the same for launcher). And distribute it as dmg, not zip (a dmg is just a zip renamed so no problem here). > - a windows installer > and I would love support for this: https://sparkle-project.org <https://sparkle-project.org/> to keep the âPharoâ app always up-to-date. Marcus

March 15, 2018

Re: [Pharo-dev] Experiment: New Download page based on Pharo Launcher

by Esteban Lorenzano

> On 15 Mar 2018, at 00:08, Cyril Ferlicot <cyril.ferlicot(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > On mer. 14 mars 2018 at 18:18, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr <mailto:marcus.denker@inria.fr>> wrote: > > > > On 9 Mar 2018, at 23:34, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: > > > > Additional portable versions would be nice too (based on a simple ZIP) instead of only the installable apps > > > > Is there a deeper reason for this? If I look at âother systemsâ, they manage to have *one* download, *one* way of installing. > For me, offering *a lot* of possible different ways means that the user has to choose without knowing why there is even the option to chooseâ¦ > > The problem is that Pharo is different from other systems. When you install eclipse, you'll use the installed eclipse for all your projects for a long time. > > Pharo images are more like a "disposable". You'll not use the same Pharo image for multiple big projects and you'll more easily throw away an image to take a new one from time to time. > > Actually I think I download and delete around 5 images/day sometime. IMO this just strengthen Marcus argument :) > This complicate a little things because sometime you want to directly download one image. Sometime you want to have one application to manage your images (Pharo launcher) Why? You have launcher: you download all images you want (btwâ¦ I still believe launcher UI needs love, but one thing at a time ;) ) And if you need more complex stuff, you always have the âotherâ section. but I side with Marcus here: we need ONE blessed way of manage pharo, otherwise is an un-managable mess. cheers, Esteban ps: btw, weâll need also - OBS for the launcher (to have linux packaging) - signing the launcher on mac (we already did this for the VM, we can do the same for launcher). And distribute it as dmg, not zip (a dmg is just a zip renamed so no problem here). - a windows installer pps: we are taking volunteers to tackle this stuff ;) > > > > Marcus > -- > Cyril Ferlicot > https://ferlicot.fr <https://ferlicot.fr/>

March 15, 2018

Re: [Pharo-dev] Experiment: New Download page based on Pharo Launcher

by Marcus Denker

> On 15 Mar 2018, at 00:08, Cyril Ferlicot <cyril.ferlicot(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > On mer. 14 mars 2018 at 18:18, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr <mailto:marcus.denker@inria.fr>> wrote: > > > > On 9 Mar 2018, at 23:34, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de <mailto:astares@gmx.de>> wrote: > > > > Additional portable versions would be nice too (based on a simple ZIP) instead of only the installable apps > > > > Is there a deeper reason for this? If I look at âother systemsâ, they manage to have *one* download, *one* way of installing. > For me, offering *a lot* of possible different ways means that the user has to choose without knowing why there is even the option to chooseâ¦ > > The problem is that Pharo is different from other systems. When you install eclipse, you'll use the installed eclipse for all your projects for a long time. > > Pharo images are more like a "disposable". You'll not use the same Pharo image for multiple big projects and you'll more easily throw away an image to take a new one from time to time. > > Actually I think I download and delete around 5 images/day sometime. > > This complicate a little things because sometime you want to directly download one image. Sometime you want to have one application to manage your images (Pharo launcher) > For me, the Launcher should be the âVM Downloadâ, that comes with a) a default template image of the release and b) the launcher too to discover images. *But* it should be done in a way that you can of course just download more images (and I would love to have images actually being âone fileâ) and, having Pharo installed, you can run them, using the âPharoâ that you have installed (the launcher). The âLauncherâ should feel more like âI have installed Pharo, now I can run imagesâ. As such, I think we should add back links that point to single image downloads on the download page. Marcus

March 15, 2018

Re: [Pharo-dev] Experiment: New Download page based on Pharo Launcher

by Stephan Eggermont

Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> On 9 Mar 2018, at 23:34, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: >> >> Additional portable versions would be nice too (based on a simple ZIP) >> instead of only the installable apps >> > > Is there a deeper reason for this? If I look at âother systemsâ, they > manage to have *one* download, *one* way of installing. > For me, offering *a lot* of possible different ways means that the user > has to choose without knowing why there is even the option to chooseâ¦ Yes. I want the live usb stick experience Stephan

March 15, 2018

Re: [Pharo-dev] Experiment: New Download page based on Pharo Launcher

by Cyril Ferlicot

On mer. 14 mars 2018 at 18:18, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > > > On 9 Mar 2018, at 23:34, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: > > > > Additional portable versions would be nice too (based on a simple ZIP) > instead of only the installable apps > > > > Is there a deeper reason for this? If I look at âother systemsâ, they > manage to have *one* download, *one* way of installing. > For me, offering *a lot* of possible different ways means that the user > has to choose without knowing why there is even the option to chooseâ¦ > The problem is that Pharo is different from other systems. When you install eclipse, you'll use the installed eclipse for all your projects for a long time. Pharo images are more like a "disposable". You'll not use the same Pharo image for multiple big projects and you'll more easily throw away an image to take a new one from time to time. Actually I think I download and delete around 5 images/day sometime. This complicate a little things because sometime you want to directly download one image. Sometime you want to have one application to manage your images (Pharo launcher) > Marcus > -- Cyril Ferlicot https://ferlicot.fr

March 14, 2018

New ConfigurationOfZincHTTPComponents

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Just a quick heads up: there is a new ConfigurationOfZincHTTPComponents with a version 2.9.1 (based on a new baseline 2.9), not yet declared stable. [ In the Zn MC repos ] This version contains the changes made recently by Guille to streams in Pharo 7. It should be possible to load this version in various Pharo versions without breaking anything fundamental. However, the CI is not yet happy and I don't yet know why, hence I hesitate to declare this a stable version. I will try to figure this out tomorrow. === Name: ConfigurationOfZincHTTPComponents-SvenVanCaekenberghe.113 Author: SvenVanCaekenberghe Time: 14 March 2018, 8:55:19.156462 pm UUID: ebb9d97d-c623-0d00-bd15-c17e09f900fd Ancestors: ConfigurationOfZincHTTPComponents-SvenVanCaekenberghe.112 new 2.9 baseline and 2.9.1 version, not yet declared stable incorporates pharo 7 stream changes by Guille ter === Sven

March 14, 2018

[Pharo 7.0-dev] Build #696: 21575-Method-classCommentBlank-should-not-return-actual-class-comment

by ci-pharo-ci-jenkins2＠inria.fr

There is a new Pharo build available! The status of the build #696 was: FAILURE. The Pull Request #1092 was integrated: "21575-Method-classCommentBlank-should-not-return-actual-class-comment" Pull request url: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/1092 Issue Url: https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21575 Build Url: https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-ci-jenkins2/job/Test%20pending%20pull%20request%2…

March 14, 2018

[Pharo 7.0-dev] Build #695: Fixed mc writing

by ci-pharo-ci-jenkins2＠inria.fr

There is a new Pharo build available! The status of the build #695 was: SUCCESS. The Pull Request #1091 was integrated: "Fixed mc writing" Pull request url: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/1091 Issue Url: https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/21574 Build Url: https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-ci-jenkins2/job/Test%20pending%20pull%20request%2…

March 14, 2018

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Pharo-users] Something is happening...

by Esteban A. Maringolo

Do we have any metrics on the number of visits we get on the pharo.org website, which parts are the most visited, etc? The same regarding web downloads, and so on. I understand that CI can distort download count if using only access logs, but certainly if we count a download through the webpage as a "conversion" (and track it somehow) we would have a better idea how big this is becoming. But back to your point and as a bystander these days, it is very hard to be aware of everything that's going on in the Pharo world, and not because of the associated noise, because there is actually a lot of things going on. :) Regards, Esteban A. Maringolo 2018-03-13 4:27 GMT-03:00 Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr>: > Hi, > > There is something odd happeningâ¦ or better: There is *a lot* happening. > > Just one example: for the Newsletter, the original idea was to send out once > a month a post with 3 things, some of them recycled (e.g. pointers to > existing projects, re-use âsuccess storiesâ, things like that. > > Now already some months ago I had to add âand here are some other > interesting announcements, blog posts, videosâ. > > But this month, the list of things for the newsletter TODO list contains > over 60 entries. With the exception of maybe 5, these are just things that > happened between sending the February newsletter and today. > > Newsletter March should be ready till this thursday, I hope, subscribe or > read the oder ones here: http://newsletter.pharo.org > > Marcus

March 14, 2018