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Re: [Pharo-project] experience with large images?

by Stephan Eggermont

Igor Stasenko wrote: > I think you looking for solution in a wrong direction. > Just ask yourself, how much of that data you need to keep in operative > memory at single moment of time > to efficiently compute results. All of it. And then of course the annotations and resulting output model. I know practically nothing about the data at first (about 700 files, about 700 MB). When trying to understand the data, it is crucial that I can test hypotheses fast. Efficiency is about my time, not computer time. > If today you need to deal with >500Mb data sets, > tomorrow you may need to deal with multigigabyte datasets, which can > easily surpass > the amount of operative memory your computer has. 16 GB DIMMS are about 250 Euro. For a commercial project it is easy to justify half a terabyte of ram. > I know, it is easier to find cheap solution, without spending time > implementing own > data caching scheme, but you just delaying inevitable. Delaying is crucial. If I wait long enough, PC's will have enough memory. Stephan

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Building 32-bit Cairo library on Macs

by Igor Stasenko

On 23 November 2011 23:20, Schwab,Wilhelm K <bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu> wrote: > I'm going to have to run down that dynamic library quote - I vaguely recall seeing it, but obviously need a refresher course. this is a quote about object-oriented and C++ :) [ Actually I made up the term "object-oriented", and I can tell you I did not have C++ in mind. ] -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] object format of true, false, nil and others...

by Igor Stasenko

On 24 November 2011 23:29, Javier PimÃ¡s <elpochodelagente(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 4:58 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse > <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> >> >> > We do the same for our bootstrapper. First allocate space for the >> > objects used by the metamodel: Metaclass, Class, Behavior, Object, >> > UndefinedObject, True, False, their instances, metaclasses, etc. Each object >> > of its corresponding size. >> >> Â Â Â Â how do you compute the size? > > > Good question. For now we still don't have a design that convinces me in > this area. In some cases we calculate it manually, for example in objects > without fields. In other cases we take it from the current image, this is > the case of metaclass and class. > but you should be able to calculate size taken from object format descriptor, don't you? > In the end, it depends on which are the compact classes, and what fields you > assume that some objects will have, like class and metaclass. > > After this kernel is bootstraped, objects are created sending new so the > size is calculated from the class. > >> >> >> > After that, fill the header and fields of these objects. Finally, new >> > objects can be created by sending messages to objects in this kernel. >> >> I was planning to do the same so I would like to see your code. >> Tomorrow I want to read it. >> >> Stef >> >> > >> > Cheers, >> > Javier. >> > >> > On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 10:59 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse >> > <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> > Hi >> > >> > imagine that I want to bootstrap our nice kernel. >> > I will need to somehow create a new nil, true, false, instances of new >> > classes Undefined, True, False. >> > Such instances will then be put on the SpecialObjectArray somehow. >> > >> > Now I can create a dummy object playing such roles and then use >> > SystemTracer to substitute my placeholder with the true nil falseâ¦. >> > or another trick to swap them. Now anybody has other ideas? >> > >> > Stef >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Lic. Javier PimÃ¡s >> > Ciudad de Buenos Aires >> >> > > > > -- > Lic. Javier PimÃ¡s > Ciudad de Buenos Aires -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo 1.3 vs 1.2.1 some results for ConfigurationOfODBC

by Mariano Martinez Peck

Hi Bon. Are you using exactly the same VM for both, 1.3 and 1.2.1? from what I can see it looks like if FFI doesn't find the odbc library. cheers On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 4:57 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr > wrote: > did you check the plugins? > are they the same? > > Stef > > On Nov 24, 2011, at 3:31 PM, Ben Coman wrote: > > > I have a Microsoft Access database on Microsoft Windows that I want to > process using Pharo. ConfigurationOfODBC looked promising so followed > instructions at > http://www.pharocasts.com/2010/12/access-database-through-odbc.html, > > though using a blank MDB file rather than SQLLite, and 'TestMDB' as the > ODBC DSN, I executed... > > --8<--- > > Gofer new > > squeaksource: 'ODBC'; > > package: 'ConfigurationOfODBC'; load. > > (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfODBC) load. > > > > connection := ODBCConnection dsn: 'TestMDB' user: '' password: ''. > > connection execute: 'CREATE TABLE user(name varchar(10), age smallint)'. > > connection execute: 'INSERT INTO user VALUES(''Old Bob'', 100)'. > > contents := (connection query: 'select * from user;') execute: ''. > > contents asTable inspect. > > connection close. > > --8<--- > > which failed on Pharo 1.3 but worked on Pharo 1.2.1. To debug this I > compared each by single stepping 1.3 & 1.2.1 side-by-side. > > I executed... connection := ODBCConnection dsn: 'TestMDB' user: '' > password: ''. > > which seemed to worked the same on both platforms up to the inserted > 'self halt' shown here... > > --8<--- > > ODBCConnection>>connect > > "Connect to the database" > > self registerForFinalization. > > hEnv := self sqlAllocEnv. > > false ifTrue: > > [ self > > sqlSetEnvAttr: 200 > > value: 2 "SQL_ATTR_ODBC_VERSION" ]. > > self halt. > > hdbc := self sqlAllocConnect: hEnv. > > --8<--- > > ODBCConnection>>sqlAllocConnect: envHandle > > | h | > > h := SQLHDBC new. > > self checkSQLReturn: (ODBCLibrary default > > sqlAllocConnectEnvironment: hEnv connection: h > > ). > > ^h > > --8<--- > > ODBCLibrary(Object)>>sqlAllocConnectEnvironment: environmentHandle > connection: connectionHandle > > "SQLRETURN > > SQLAllocConnect( > > SQLHENV EnvironmentHandle, > > SQLHDBC *ConnectionHandle);" > > <cdecl: short 'SQLAllocConnect' (SQLHENV SQLHDBC*)> > > ^ self externalCallFailed > > --8<--- > > ODBCConnection>>checkSQLReturn: sqlReturn > > "private - check the sqlReturn and generates an exception if > corresponds" > > self > > checkSQLReturn: sqlReturn > > environment: hEnv > > connection: hdbc > > statement: nil > > --8<--- > > If you've followed the call chain down to here, then the result is... > > In Pharo 1.2.1 (WinXP & Win7) primitive SQLAllocConnect primitive > succeeds, with sqlReturn=0 > > In Pharo 1.3 (WinXP & Win7) primitive SQLAllocConnect primitive > succeeds, with sqlReturn=-2 > > I cannot find what -2 may mean on any of the Microsoft ODBC API pages, > nor a few header files I checked (though I may have missed some header file) > > ================= > > To investigate further, I thought to try running the bypassed code... > > --8<--- > > ODBCConnection>>connect > > "Connect to the database" > > self registerForFinalization. > > hEnv := self sqlAllocEnv. > > self halt. > > true ifTrue: > > [ self > > sqlSetEnvAttr: 200 > > value: 2 "SQL_ATTR_ODBC_VERSION" ]. > > --8<--- > > sqlSetEnvAttr: attr value: value > > self checkSQLReturn: (ODBCLibrary default > > sqlSetEnvAttr: hEnv attr: attr value: value length: 0 > > ) > > --8<--- > > sqlSetEnvAttrPtr: hEnv attr: attr value: value length: length > > "SQLRETURN SQLSetEnvAttr( > > SQLHENV EnvironmentHandle, > > SQLINTEGER Attribute, > > SQLPOINTER ValuePtr, > > SQLINTEGER StringLength);" > > <cdecl: short 'SQLSetEnvAttr' (SQLHENV long void* long)> > > ^ self externalCallFailed > > --8<--- > > For both 1.2.1 and 1.3 'self externalCallFailed' is executed > > for 1.2.1 errCode=12 'No module to load address from' > > for 1.3 errCode=13 'Unable to find function address' > > --8<--- > > Pointers anyone? > > btw, In parallel I am also trying out DBXTalk. > > > > > -- Mariano http://marianopeck.wordpress.com

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] object format of true, false, nil and others...

by Javier PimÃ¡s

On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 4:58 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr > wrote: > > > We do the same for our bootstrapper. First allocate space for the > objects used by the metamodel: Metaclass, Class, Behavior, Object, > UndefinedObject, True, False, their instances, metaclasses, etc. Each > object of its corresponding size. > > how do you compute the size? > Good question. For now we still don't have a design that convinces me in this area. In some cases we calculate it manually, for example in objects without fields. In other cases we take it from the current image, this is the case of metaclass and class. In the end, it depends on which are the compact classes, and what fields you assume that some objects will have, like class and metaclass. After this kernel is bootstraped, objects are created sending new so the size is calculated from the class. > > > After that, fill the header and fields of these objects. Finally, new > objects can be created by sending messages to objects in this kernel. > > I was planning to do the same so I would like to see your code. > Tomorrow I want to read it. > > Stef > > > > > Cheers, > > Javier. > > > > On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 10:59 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse < > stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > Hi > > > > imagine that I want to bootstrap our nice kernel. > > I will need to somehow create a new nil, true, false, instances of new > classes Undefined, True, False. > > Such instances will then be put on the SpecialObjectArray somehow. > > > > Now I can create a dummy object playing such roles and then use > SystemTracer to substitute my placeholder with the true nil falseâ¦. > > or another trick to swap them. Now anybody has other ideas? > > > > Stef > > > > > > > > -- > > Lic. Javier PimÃ¡s > > Ciudad de Buenos Aires > > > -- Lic. Javier PimÃ¡s Ciudad de Buenos Aires

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] experience with large images?

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Alex two remarks: - what is the level of reification because we reify a lot and it can be discarded. - did you check the orion model because with orion you only represent the delta and this is a big difference. Stef On Nov 24, 2011, at 2:05 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote: > Having a reification in Moose of 100 versions of Mondrian for example :-) > > Just answering the question 'Which classes and methods of Mondrian have changed more than 10 times since the day Mondrian was born?' cannot be easily done without a lot of memory > > Alexandre > > > On 24 Nov 2011, at 03:27, Francois Stephany wrote: > >> I'm wondering: how big is a dataset > 500MB ? I've no idea how big it is. >> Alex, what is your use case (in practice!) for more than 500MB? >> >> On 23/11/11 18:25, Igor Stasenko wrote: >>> It is problematic, and requires different memory management than we >>> currently have. >>> I think if you need really big data sets, then use gemstone, which is >>> developed to deal with that specifically. >> > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > > >

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] object format of true, false, nil and others...

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

> We do the same for our bootstrapper. First allocate space for the objects used by the metamodel: Metaclass, Class, Behavior, Object, UndefinedObject, True, False, their instances, metaclasses, etc. Each object of its corresponding size. how do you compute the size? > After that, fill the header and fields of these objects. Finally, new objects can be created by sending messages to objects in this kernel. I was planning to do the same so I would like to see your code. Tomorrow I want to read it. Stef > > Cheers, > Javier. > > On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 10:59 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > Hi > > imagine that I want to bootstrap our nice kernel. > I will need to somehow create a new nil, true, false, instances of new classes Undefined, True, False. > Such instances will then be put on the SpecialObjectArray somehow. > > Now I can create a dummy object playing such roles and then use SystemTracer to substitute my placeholder with the true nil falseâ¦. > or another trick to swap them. Now anybody has other ideas? > > Stef > > > > -- > Lic. Javier PimÃ¡s > Ciudad de Buenos Aires

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] Pharo 1.3 vs 1.2.1 some results for ConfigurationOfODBC

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

did you check the plugins? are they the same? Stef On Nov 24, 2011, at 3:31 PM, Ben Coman wrote: > I have a Microsoft Access database on Microsoft Windows that I want to process using Pharo. ConfigurationOfODBC looked promising so followed instructions at http://www.pharocasts.com/2010/12/access-database-through-odbc.html, > though using a blank MDB file rather than SQLLite, and 'TestMDB' as the ODBC DSN, I executed... > --8<--- > Gofer new > squeaksource: 'ODBC'; > package: 'ConfigurationOfODBC'; load. > (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfODBC) load. > > connection := ODBCConnection dsn: 'TestMDB' user: '' password: ''. > connection execute: 'CREATE TABLE user(name varchar(10), age smallint)'. > connection execute: 'INSERT INTO user VALUES(''Old Bob'', 100)'. > contents := (connection query: 'select * from user;') execute: ''. > contents asTable inspect. > connection close. > --8<--- > which failed on Pharo 1.3 but worked on Pharo 1.2.1. To debug this I compared each by single stepping 1.3 & 1.2.1 side-by-side. > I executed... connection := ODBCConnection dsn: 'TestMDB' user: '' password: ''. > which seemed to worked the same on both platforms up to the inserted 'self halt' shown here... > --8<--- > ODBCConnection>>connect > "Connect to the database" > self registerForFinalization. > hEnv := self sqlAllocEnv. > false ifTrue: > [ self > sqlSetEnvAttr: 200 > value: 2 "SQL_ATTR_ODBC_VERSION" ]. > self halt. > hdbc := self sqlAllocConnect: hEnv. > --8<--- > ODBCConnection>>sqlAllocConnect: envHandle > | h | > h := SQLHDBC new. > self checkSQLReturn: (ODBCLibrary default > sqlAllocConnectEnvironment: hEnv connection: h > ). > ^h > --8<--- > ODBCLibrary(Object)>>sqlAllocConnectEnvironment: environmentHandle connection: connectionHandle > "SQLRETURN > SQLAllocConnect( > SQLHENV EnvironmentHandle, > SQLHDBC *ConnectionHandle);" > <cdecl: short 'SQLAllocConnect' (SQLHENV SQLHDBC*)> > ^ self externalCallFailed > --8<--- > ODBCConnection>>checkSQLReturn: sqlReturn > "private - check the sqlReturn and generates an exception if corresponds" > self > checkSQLReturn: sqlReturn > environment: hEnv > connection: hdbc > statement: nil > --8<--- > If you've followed the call chain down to here, then the result is... > In Pharo 1.2.1 (WinXP & Win7) primitive SQLAllocConnect primitive succeeds, with sqlReturn=0 > In Pharo 1.3 (WinXP & Win7) primitive SQLAllocConnect primitive succeeds, with sqlReturn=-2 > I cannot find what -2 may mean on any of the Microsoft ODBC API pages, nor a few header files I checked (though I may have missed some header file) > ================= > To investigate further, I thought to try running the bypassed code... > --8<--- > ODBCConnection>>connect > "Connect to the database" > self registerForFinalization. > hEnv := self sqlAllocEnv. > self halt. > true ifTrue: > [ self > sqlSetEnvAttr: 200 > value: 2 "SQL_ATTR_ODBC_VERSION" ]. > --8<--- > sqlSetEnvAttr: attr value: value > self checkSQLReturn: (ODBCLibrary default > sqlSetEnvAttr: hEnv attr: attr value: value length: 0 > ) > --8<--- > sqlSetEnvAttrPtr: hEnv attr: attr value: value length: length > "SQLRETURN SQLSetEnvAttr( > SQLHENV EnvironmentHandle, > SQLINTEGER Attribute, > SQLPOINTER ValuePtr, > SQLINTEGER StringLength);" > <cdecl: short 'SQLSetEnvAttr' (SQLHENV long void* long)> > ^ self externalCallFailed > --8<--- > For both 1.2.1 and 1.3 'self externalCallFailed' is executed > for 1.2.1 errCode=12 'No module to load address from' > for 1.3 errCode=13 'Unable to find function address' > --8<--- > Pointers anyone? > btw, In parallel I am also trying out DBXTalk. >

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] How turn on Halo's?

by Sean P. DeNigris

Sven Van Caekenberghe wrote > > option-shift-click for show halos > Yes, that cycles from front to back. What was removed was back to front (option-click) -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/How-turn-on-Halo-s-tp2227309p4105053.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Nov. 24, 2011

Re: [Pharo-project] How turn on Halo's?

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

On 24 Nov 2011, at 16:42, Sean P. DeNigris wrote: > > StÃ©phane Ducasse wrote >> >> in pharo halos are there but only when you really want them. :) >> > > In Squeak, you can cycle through the halos either front to back or reverse. > I'd like to get that behavior back on my personal images as I use it all the > time. Does anyone know where the functionality lived? I checked the issue > tracker but didn't find the actual code that was integrated to remove it. > > Thanks. > Sean On my Mac it is option-shift-click for show halos ctrl-click for the menu HTH, Sven

Nov. 24, 2011