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Re: [Pharo-project] Browsing hierarchy in 2.0

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

The best one is the groups :) > 2012/12/9 Nicolas Cellier <nicolas.cellier.aka.nice(a)gmail.com>: >> How do I browse hierarchy: for example that of Array? >> I know I can type Array browseHierarchy, select it and doIt, but I >> mean efficiently... >> >> Nicolas >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Helping the noobs help out - i.e. fixing the debugger

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Hi adrian this is not that we do not want to fix issues. This is that some are killing us while others are letting us to breath. Now we can argue for hours about priority. The best things to do is to try. And I can tell you that the debugger is important for us - this is our best friend. But it gets a bit old. To me having the UI defined in another class was strange for years. We fixed it. And as marcus said we are working :) and quite busy. Stef > Hi, > > I'm a Smalltalk newbie and I would like to help fix some simpler issues. For > example, I've recently logged some issues surrounding smart character use. I > set a breakpoint in NECController>>#smartCharacterWithEvent: and proceeded > to debug. > > Now, I understand that for the old-timers stepping through a selector is > straightforward, no matter what help the debugger gives you. For myself, and > likely many other Smalltalk noobs who'd like to help, I need all the help I > can get. One such support is an accurate indication of where the PC is as > you step through a body of code. Currently, in the 2.0 one-click image > (build 20431), things seem quite broken wrt getting accurate visual feedback > of where you are. > > First, as you step over message sends, the highlighted selection is shown in > a totally incorrect spot. Sometimes, just a bit off from where you expect to > be, but sometimes quite a bit off, for example in a block that should not > even be entered. In the selector I mentioned above, the highlighted location > enters the "editor hasSelection ifTrue: []" block when "editor hasSelection" > returns false. > > Second, the PC location highlight is removed when you click somewhere inside > the code. This should never turn off - it's as if you switch the lights off, > for people not familiar with some particular code. I know you can use the > "Where" button to re-establish the highlight, but other than the fact that > you shouldn't have to do this, the highlighted selection is sometimes shown > in the wrong place. > > Third, as you step through code, you would expect that the values of > variables as shown in the bottom right panel of the debugger are accurately > updated as state changes. I've seen cases, relatively frequent, where this > is not so. Current values are shown only after some further advancement > through code. > > There is an old issue tracking debugger selection, > http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=709 > <http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=709> , but fixing the > problem seems to have stalled. Additionally, I'm not sure that this > particular issue addresses the third point I made about stale variable > values being shown. > > Could I ask that making the debugger work be made a priority? Of course one > can muddle through some code even with visually broken indicators, but it > should not be so, IMO. The old timers can make the case that there are other > more pressing issues to be addressed, but IMO it makes sense to make the > actual tool used to fix problems as helpful as possible for everyone so that > even non-experts can be productive and lend a helping hand. > > > Cheers, > Adrian > > > > -- > View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Helping-the-noobs-help-out-i-e-fixing-the-debugger-tp… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] NativeBoost and Pharo Kernel

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Igor metacello can handle this situation and there is a doc. We can give a try together. but this is not like we do not have the tool at hand. Stef On Dec 11, 2012, at 3:30 PM, Igor Stasenko wrote: > On 11 December 2012 09:51, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> Hi, >> >> I would like to ask: should NativeBoost be part of the Pharo Kernel? >> Currently there are some minor issues like that AsmJit-Extension package >> takes ownership of Integer>>#&, False>>#asBit and so on. > > This is because 1.4 don't have those methods, while 2.0. has (added by > Camillo).. > and so, currently , NB can either work on both, by making 2.0 image dirty > or work only in 2.0, and fail to work in 1.4 because of "missing" methods. > > I am not very good in metacello-fu to write a confing, which will > select various set of stuff to load > depending on image version. > So, if someone can help, i would appreciate that. > I can move those methods into NB-pharo-1.4 package.. > > >> Will NativeBoost be >> more closely integrated with the kernel in the near future? >> > depends on what you putting into "kernel". > if it is "a basic functionality, which is absolutely required to do > anything else", > then no, it will be never part of a kernel. > > if it is " a set of functionality, ready to use for most common/daily > tasks" , then yes > it should be part of such kernel.. > > >> BTW, we need to integrate >> http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7062 before any update that >> will move methods between packages. >> >> Cheers, >> -- Pavel > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] another kid born: NBExternalEnumerationType

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

Ciprian this is really cool to see how pushing and enhancing NativeBoost. Really a cool nd warm feeling. Tx for your energy and time. Stef On Dec 11, 2012, at 8:33 PM, Ciprian Teodorov wrote: > Hi guys, > > today I have commited to the NativeBoost repository a new core class, the NBExternalEnumerationType, > which reifies the enum declarations in C and offers a nice interface (especially in terms of debug/inspect). > > To use it just subclass the NBExternalEnumeration and add an #enumDecl method to the class side such as: > Did you add this cool class comment :) > NBExternalEnumeration subclass: #NBTestEnumeration > instanceVariableNames: '' > classVariableNames: '' > poolDictionaries: '' > category: 'NativeBoost-Tests' > > NBTestEnumeration class>>enumDecl > ^ {(#AAA -> 1). > (#BBB -> 2). > (#CCC -> 3). > (#DDD -> 2400)} asDictionary > > DO NOT FORGET to call the #initialize method on your class. The rest is automatically done ;) > > You can use your new enum in two ways: > â¢ add it to a client class poolDictionaries list (see #NBExternalEnumTests for an example), and then just write CCC in your code -- CCC here is an item of your enum > â¢ or you can send the name of an item to your class --- NBTestEnumeration DDD > The NBExternalEnumeration implements (instance and class) some more API methods like: > â¢ #itemAt: retrieves the item having a specific value --- NBTestEnumeration itemAt: 2 > â¢ #includes: checks the existence of a specific item in the enum --- NBTestEnumeration includes: #AAA > Having this already gives us a nice interface to working with enums. Now I plan to improve a little bit on performance and usage scenarios: > â¢ the possibility to accept smalltalk integers as valid input/output for functions(or callbacks) that use enums as arguments/return. > â¢ support the different representation types for the enum values (int/uint) > So that will be for now. Feel free to try it out and send me any comments and/or improvement ideas, It will be my pleasure to improve it. > Cheers, > -- > Dr. Ciprian TEODOROV > IngÃ©nieur DÃ©veloppement CAO > > tÃ©l : 06 08 54 73 48 > mail : ciprian.teodorov(a)gmail.com > www.teodorov.ro

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Protecting against stack overflow ?

by Eliot Miranda

On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 9:26 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > On 12 December 2012 00:43, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 3:35 PM, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> > > wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 10:26 AM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> hehe.. > >>> it looks like we can do it: > >>> > >>> - when memory hits the waterline mark, VM should do the following: > >>> - for every currently scheduled process , push an artificial stack > >>> frame on top , which is > >>> StackOverflow signal. > >> > >> > >> If the VM supports the LowSpaceSignal mechanism as it used to be then > this > >> can be done in the image with a high-priority process. And tehrefore > it can > >> e.g. be avoided for processes such as the Delay process, where IMO it is > >> inappropriate. > > > > > > And if it is done in the image it is easy to e.g. avoid pushing two such > > frames on the same process because the process has made no progress since > > the last occurrence, etc. > > > indeed.. i did not realized that this can be done inside an image :) > > i was thinking more about stack limit, not space limit. > because scanning the stack will trigger putting all contexts on heap > (which in own turn will put even more pressure on memory).. while in > VM, to determine stack depth, it can walk the stack frames without > marrying them with heap contexts to count stack depth. > or it is not the case? is accessing the context state triggers > "marrying" it with heap object, i.e. > > [ count := count + 1. context := context sender. ] whileNotNil > > ? > exactly. The VM can provide a primitive to walk the stack without creating objects (which worsens the space situation). Even better the VM could maintain stack depth in Process, but that's for the future, because it needs a) a slot in Process and b) the support writing in both VMs. -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. > > -- best, Eliot

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: Lua scripting with nativeboost?

by Esteban Lorenzano

and is still a bad reason :) are you going to use a dynamic language (lua), to script a dynamic language (pharo)? if you launch a lua interpreter to run a script, you are in practice doing exactly the same as launching a new image to run your script. So you are doing exactly the same as Igor suggested, but replacing one dynamic language with another. and of course, you are "buying" the extra problem of: 1) interact with another language and define the input and output and conversions between one and the other. 2) downgrade the power of pharo into a language who is more limitated. IMO, that's non-sense. Esteban On Dec 12, 2012, at 4:35 PM, Marten Feldtmann <marten(a)schrievkrom.de> wrote: > And this is the biggest reason to use Lua as a scripting language. > > Marten > > On 12.12.2012 10:47, Igor Stasenko wrote: > >> i think the easiest solution is to run a separate image. >> if you want to run in same image, then you have to modify compiler/environment >> for sandboxed code, where nothing can sneak through and access private data. >> >> > <marten.vcf>

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Fwd: Lua scripting with nativeboost?

by Marten Feldtmann

And this is the biggest reason to use Lua as a scripting language. Marten On 12.12.2012 10:47, Igor Stasenko wrote: > i think the easiest solution is to run a separate image. > if you want to run in same image, then you have to modify compiler/environment > for sandboxed code, where nothing can sneak through and access private data. > >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] Nautilus and grey out text

by Peter Hugosson-Miller

On 12 dec 2012, at 11:52, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > On 12 Dec 2012, at 11:20, dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > >> ok I understand now thank you all for the clarifications. > >> Very exciting and powerful stuff, the more I learn about pharo and smalltalk the more I love it. > > Yes, Dimitris, that is the idea. But you have been warned: once you get infected it is hard to go back ;-) That was the understatement of the year: I went from using Smalltalk in my daily job for 15 years, to Java. Two years later and not a day goes by that I don't wish I could have carried on using Smalltalk! How long does it take for the infection to be cured, anyone know? -- Cheers, Peter. > One other thing: there is a Pharo-Users mailing list as well, it has less traffic, but the idea is that conversations like the one in this thread (how do I do this or that ? what does this or that mean ?) are better held there. > > http://www.pharo-project.org/community > > Keep on asking questions ! > >> From: Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm(a)gmail.com> >> To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr; dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> >> Sent: Wednesday, 12 December 2012, 12:15 >> Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Nautilus and grey out text >> >> No, just a method added to a class, and categorized with a special name: *NameOfThePackageWhereItBelongs >> >> Esteban >> >> On Dec 12, 2012, at 11:11 AM, dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: >> >>> Oh I see, very clever, are those methods traits ? >>> >>> From: Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> >>> To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr; dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> >>> Sent: Wednesday, 12 December 2012, 11:48 >>> Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Nautilus and grey out text >>> >>> If you have got a package named MyPackage then if some class that is not part of this package has got some methods in categories named like *MyPackage(-Something) (star, package name, optional category) then this methods are bundled together with MyPackage. >>> >>> -- Pavel >>> >>> On Wed, Dec 12, 2012 at 10:38 AM, dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: >>> thanks added to my list of things to study :) >>> >>> From: Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> >>> To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr; dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> >>> Sent: Wednesday, 12 December 2012, 11:33 >>> >>> Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Nautilus and grey out text >>> >>> >>> On 12 Dec 2012, at 10:25, dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: >>> >>>> Thanks for the reply , by "extension" you mean inheritance ? Package A class subclasses package B class ? >>> >>> No, it is extension with respect to Monticello/RPackage packaging. >>> >>>> From: Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> >>>> To: Pharo-project(a)lists.gforge.inria.fr; dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, 12 December 2012, 11:19 >>>> Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] Nautilus and grey out text >>>> >>>> If a package A adds an exteinson to a class from different package B then the extended class from package B is grayed out and all methods that are not part of the package A too. >>>> >>>> -- Pavel >>>> >>>> On Wed, Dec 12, 2012 at 10:03 AM, dimitris chloupis <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: >>>> I went through the Nautilus pdf and it seems to explains most of the thing but the grey out text. Any idea why some classess and methods are grey out ? >>>> >>>> By the way congratulation to Nautilus author and all people contributing to it , it certainly looks like a big improvement over the classic system browser. >>> >>> -- >>> Sven Van Caekenberghe >>> http://stfx.eu >>> Smalltalk is the Red Pill >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> > > -- > Sven Van Caekenberghe > http://stfx.eu > Smalltalk is the Red Pill > > > >

Dec. 12, 2012

Re: [Pharo-project] [Pharo-consortium] VMWare golden pharo consortium :)

by Norbert Hartl

Am 11.12.2012 um 10:09 schrieb StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr>: > Hi guys > > we are happy to announce that VMWare is a golden consortium member of the pharo consortium. > A good member indeed. Thanks to our friends at Geâ¦.VMWare! Norbert

Dec. 12, 2012

[Pharo-project] [update 2.0] #20434

by Esteban Lorenzano

20434 ----- Issue 7062: Package extensions not present in the package http://code.google.com/p/pharo/issues/detail?id=7062 Diff information: http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Pharo20/System-Support-EstebanLorenzano.758.diff http://ss3.gemstone.com/ss/Pharo20/Monticello-EstebanLorenzano.734.diff now yes :)

Dec. 12, 2012