- Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] New address for the Spec jenkins

by Benjamin

Roadmap can be discussed here: https://github.com/spec-framework/spec/issues/16 Ben On 10 Aug 2014, at 20:58, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: > Hi ben > > do you have a roadmap that we can discuss for spec? > Because there are several points I would like to fixed. > > Stef > > On 10/8/14 17:19, Benjamin wrote: >> If people are interested having the latest >> Spec bleeding image, it can now be retrieved at: http://benjamin.is-a-geek.com:8080/job/Spec/ :) >> >> >> Ben >> >

Aug. 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo : the power hog.

by kilon alios

fair enough I wanted just to inform you. Oh and Sven I never jump to the latest version , don't want to have to deal with weird bugs and instabilities , I let you all be my guinea pigs , so go on and don't wait for me ;D. On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 9:50 PM, ClÃ©ment Bera <bera.clement(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hello, > > I believe the issue is that typically on idle an application does not > consume energy, it is in wait mode and restart when an I/O event is > triggered. > > For Pharo, I/O event does not restart the Process, on idle, the Process > waits for 1 ms, then checks if I/O event was triggered, and if nothing > happened, waits again a ms. > > We wants to fix that in the future but it is difficult it requires to > change the Process implementation which is implemented half in the VM half > in the image .... > > I am not sure it is related to Morphic. > > > 2014-08-10 20:10 GMT+02:00 kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com>: > > I have just upgraded my macbook air to Mavericks and I noticed now that >> Activity Monitor has an energy tab that shows which apps consume most >> energy and Pharo is on No1 spot for idle apps. >> >> 1) Pharo - > 50-60% >> >> 2) Chrome (7 tabs open) -> 10% >> >> 3) Blender (3d app) -> 15% >> >> emacs, itunes , maps etc close to 0% >> >> The only way to compete with pharo is playback a youtube video that >> spikes energy to 80 or play a 3d game. >> >> I assume Morphic is quite heavy on resources. >> > >

Aug. 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] New address for the Spec jenkins

by stepharo

Hi ben do you have a roadmap that we can discuss for spec? Because there are several points I would like to fixed. Stef On 10/8/14 17:19, Benjamin wrote: > If people are interested having the latest > Spec bleeding image, it can now be retrieved at: > http://benjamin.is-a-geek.com:8080/job/Spec/ :) > > > Ben >

Aug. 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo : the power hog.

by ClÃ©ment Bera

Hello, I believe the issue is that typically on idle an application does not consume energy, it is in wait mode and restart when an I/O event is triggered. For Pharo, I/O event does not restart the Process, on idle, the Process waits for 1 ms, then checks if I/O event was triggered, and if nothing happened, waits again a ms. We wants to fix that in the future but it is difficult it requires to change the Process implementation which is implemented half in the VM half in the image .... I am not sure it is related to Morphic. 2014-08-10 20:10 GMT+02:00 kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com>: > I have just upgraded my macbook air to Mavericks and I noticed now that > Activity Monitor has an energy tab that shows which apps consume most > energy and Pharo is on No1 spot for idle apps. > > 1) Pharo - > 50-60% > > 2) Chrome (7 tabs open) -> 10% > > 3) Blender (3d app) -> 15% > > emacs, itunes , maps etc close to 0% > > The only way to compete with pharo is playback a youtube video that spikes > energy to 80 or play a 3d game. > > I assume Morphic is quite heavy on resources. >

Aug. 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo : the power hog.

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

On 10 Aug 2014, at 20:26, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > It took you a long time to upgrade, next month you'll be behind again ;-) > > Anyway, this has been reported before: > > http://forum.world.st/Pharo-on-Mac-OS-X-10-9-Mavericks-td4716590.html > > And even long before that: > > http://forum.world.st/Hungry-Pharo-td4717636.html Euh, I meant: http://forum.world.st/Waste-of-CPU-Power-by-polling-events-td3054458.html 2010 ! > BTW, it is not UI related as it is visible on servers as well. > > On 10 Aug 2014, at 20:10, kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> I have just upgraded my macbook air to Mavericks and I noticed now that Activity Monitor has an energy tab that shows which apps consume most energy and Pharo is on No1 spot for idle apps. >> >> 1) Pharo - > 50-60% >> >> 2) Chrome (7 tabs open) -> 10% >> >> 3) Blender (3d app) -> 15% >> >> emacs, itunes , maps etc close to 0% >> >> The only way to compete with pharo is playback a youtube video that spikes energy to 80 or play a 3d game. >> >> I assume Morphic is quite heavy on resources. >

Aug. 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo : the power hog.

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

It took you a long time to upgrade, next month you'll be behind again ;-) Anyway, this has been reported before: http://forum.world.st/Pharo-on-Mac-OS-X-10-9-Mavericks-td4716590.html And even long before that: http://forum.world.st/Hungry-Pharo-td4717636.html BTW, it is not UI related as it is visible on servers as well. On 10 Aug 2014, at 20:10, kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I have just upgraded my macbook air to Mavericks and I noticed now that Activity Monitor has an energy tab that shows which apps consume most energy and Pharo is on No1 spot for idle apps. > > 1) Pharo - > 50-60% > > 2) Chrome (7 tabs open) -> 10% > > 3) Blender (3d app) -> 15% > > emacs, itunes , maps etc close to 0% > > The only way to compete with pharo is playback a youtube video that spikes energy to 80 or play a 3d game. > > I assume Morphic is quite heavy on resources.

Aug. 10, 2014

Pharo : the power hog.

by kilon alios

I have just upgraded my macbook air to Mavericks and I noticed now that Activity Monitor has an energy tab that shows which apps consume most energy and Pharo is on No1 spot for idle apps. 1) Pharo - > 50-60% 2) Chrome (7 tabs open) -> 10% 3) Blender (3d app) -> 15% emacs, itunes , maps etc close to 0% The only way to compete with pharo is playback a youtube video that spikes energy to 80 or play a 3d game. I assume Morphic is quite heavy on resources.

Aug. 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Vm-dev] Re: mustBeBooleanMagicIn can crash the vm

by Camille Teruel

On 10 aoÃ»t 2014, at 19:15, Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Nicolai, > > > On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 9:39 AM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: > > Hi Eliot, > > I am pretty sure this is not a vm issue :) > > The mustBeBooleanInMagic: creates a method on the fly and executes it with the > a context as argument. > The "ThisContext" is not the "thisContext", but the argument of the generated method. > > This is the bytecode of the generated method: > > 17 <00> pushRcvr: 0 > 18 <8F 00 00 02> closureNumCopied: 0 numArgs: 0 bytes 22 to 23 > 22 <76> pushConstant: 1 > 23 <7D> blockReturn > 24 <8F 00 00 02> closureNumCopied: 0 numArgs: 0 bytes 28 to 29 > 28 <75> pushConstant: 0 > 29 <7D> blockReturn > 30 <F0> send: ifTrue:ifFalse: > 31 <7C> returnTop > > The original method is > > foo > ^ notABool1 ifTrue:[1] ifFalse:[0] > > The generated method compiles this part > notABool1 ifTrue:[1] ifFalse:[0] > > to bytecode without the jumpFalse optimization. > The problem is that the receiver for the ifTrue:ifFalse send is accessed through > pushRcvr:0, whereas the thisContext is not the context of the original method anymore. > > Ah, now I know what's going on. Thanks. I like this experiment very much. > > How do you extract the blocks from the method? Do you decompile or simply recompile from source or...? We just recompile the ast message node that triggered the error without optimizations and some rewriting (temps and returns). Right now it works only for 'if' messages. For 'while' messages I'm thinking about sending #truthValue to the value of the receiver block. > Have (any of) you looked at implementing the mustBeBooleanMagic by interpreting the bytecodes that already exist in the method via some specialized interpreter instead of compiling a method on the fly? No but that would be interesting indeed :) Another solution is to cache the generated methods somewhere instead of recompiling each time. > > > Nicolai > > > 2014-08-10 17:34 GMT+02:00 Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com>: > > Hi Nicolai, > > please try and remember to invlude vm-dev when you see a VM issue... > > > On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 7:34 AM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: > There is a certain risk, that the mustBeBooleanMagicIn method rewrite can crash the > vm > Issue 13805 > > Since you're using the Opal compiler ca you add the description of the bytecode (aCompiledMethod symbolic) to the issue? I'll try and take a look soon but want to be sure I'm debugging the relevant code. > > The receiver of the rewritten method is the "nonboolean" value receiving the > ifTrue:ifFalse: message. But the rewritten method can include > instvar accessor and self sends of the original method. > > We can include more rewrite rules in mustBeBooleanMagicIn like > "rewrite instvar accessing" > context receiver class instVarNamesAndOffsetsDo: [ :n :o | > RBParseTreeRewriter new > replace: n with: ('ThisContext receiver instVarAt: ', o asString); > executeTree: methodNode. > ]. > "rewrite self sends" > RBParseTreeRewriter new > replace: 'self' with: 'ThisContext receiver'; > executeTree: methodNode. > > But I don't know if this works for all possible situations. Or if there are > better ways to do the rewriting. > > Remember the mirror methods: > thisContext object: o instVarAt: > which doesn't send to o, reaching directly into it. > > But what's the point of replacing "self" with "thisContext receiver"? The latter is potentially an extremely slow way of doing the former. The former won't create a context object in a method activation that doesn't need one (doesn't include a block), whereas the latter always will. But they will always yield the same result. > -- > curious, > Eliot > -- > best, > Eliot

Aug. 10, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Vm-dev] Re: mustBeBooleanMagicIn can crash the vm

by Eliot Miranda

Hi Nicolai, On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 9:39 AM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: > > Hi Eliot, > > I am pretty sure this is not a vm issue :) > > The mustBeBooleanInMagic: creates a method on the fly and executes it with > the > a context as argument. > The "ThisContext" is not the "thisContext", but the argument of the > generated method. > > This is the bytecode of the generated method: > > 17 <00> pushRcvr: 0 > 18 <8F 00 00 02> closureNumCopied: 0 numArgs: 0 bytes 22 to 23 > 22 <76> pushConstant: 1 > 23 <7D> blockReturn > 24 <8F 00 00 02> closureNumCopied: 0 numArgs: 0 bytes 28 to 29 > 28 <75> pushConstant: 0 > 29 <7D> blockReturn > 30 <F0> send: ifTrue:ifFalse: > 31 <7C> returnTop > > The original method is > > foo > ^ notABool1 ifTrue:[1] ifFalse:[0] > > The generated method compiles this part > notABool1 ifTrue:[1] ifFalse:[0] > > to bytecode without the jumpFalse optimization. > The problem is that the receiver for the ifTrue:ifFalse send is accessed > through > pushRcvr:0, whereas the thisContext is not the context of the original > method anymore. > Ah, now I know what's going on. Thanks. I like this experiment very much. How do you extract the blocks from the method? Do you decompile or simply recompile from source or...? Have (any of) you looked at implementing the mustBeBooleanMagic by interpreting the bytecodes that already exist in the method via some specialized interpreter instead of compiling a method on the fly? Nicolai > > > 2014-08-10 17:34 GMT+02:00 Eliot Miranda <eliot.miranda(a)gmail.com>: > >> >> Hi Nicolai, >> >> please try and remember to invlude vm-dev when you see a VM issue... >> >> >> On Sun, Aug 10, 2014 at 7:34 AM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: >> >>> There is a certain risk, that the mustBeBooleanMagicIn method rewrite >>> can crash the >>> vm >>> Issue 13805 <https://pharo.fogbugz.com/default.asp?13805> >>> >> >> Since you're using the Opal compiler ca you add the description of the >> bytecode (aCompiledMethod symbolic) to the issue? I'll try and take a look >> soon but want to be sure I'm debugging the relevant code. >> >> The receiver of the rewritten method is the "nonboolean" value receiving >>> the >>> ifTrue:ifFalse: message. But the rewritten method can include >>> instvar accessor and self sends of the original method. >>> >>> We can include more rewrite rules in mustBeBooleanMagicIn like >>> "rewrite instvar accessing" >>> context receiver class instVarNamesAndOffsetsDo: [ :n :o | >>> RBParseTreeRewriter new >>> replace: n with: ('ThisContext receiver instVarAt: ', o >>> asString); >>> executeTree: methodNode. >>> ]. >>> "rewrite self sends" >>> RBParseTreeRewriter new >>> replace: 'self' with: 'ThisContext receiver'; >>> executeTree: methodNode. >>> >>> But I don't know if this works for all possible situations. Or if there >>> are >>> better ways to do the rewriting. >>> >> >> Remember the mirror methods: >> thisContext object: o instVarAt: >> which doesn't send to o, reaching directly into it. >> >> But what's the point of replacing "self" with "thisContext receiver"? >> The latter is potentially an extremely slow way of doing the former. The >> former won't create a context object in a method activation that doesn't >> need one (doesn't include a block), whereas the latter always will. But >> they will always yield the same result. >> -- >> curious, >> Eliot >> > -- best, Eliot

Aug. 10, 2014

Updating the list of users

by Alexandre Bergel

Hi! We try to keep track of users of Roassal. It would be great to have your logo on http://objectprofile.com/Users.html So, if you are a Roassal (or Hapao, Roassal3d, Spy) user, let us know please! It helps building a strong community. Cheers, Alexandre -- _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.

Aug. 10, 2014