- Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] SmalltalkHub bugs & hangs :-(

by Esteban Lorenzano

> On 27 Nov 2014, at 14:43, phil(a)highoctane.be wrote: > > At times, mczs still come handy for some merges... > > And Smalltalkhub is good as a safe heaven for collecting packages that are otherwise scattered all around. nothing that a real catalog/centralised package manager alla npm/apt-get/etc cannot do it. using a package manager as a catalog feels to me like hammering a screw. > > Is there a reason why Smalltalkhub would not stay working nicely? because we do not have the strength/willing to maintain it. and each day we are: farther from âstate of the artâ source management, and farther from state of the art javascript, etc. (which is the reason why sthub > Are we talking about using bigger boxes here? Or is it a deeper issue? keeping up-to-date a system like sthub is a lot of work, and takes a lot of time. personally, I prefer way more to spend my time in things that will have a real impact in the community (like having a modern vm) than lose it trying constantly to catch up with what others (with a lot more resources) already did. each time I start a sub-project, my first question is: âthis stuff will have a multiplier effect in the community?â and second question is âdo we have to doit from scratch, or can we take advantage of other projects?â. As a maintainer, and being conscious of our limitations, this are the driving forces I find positive to work. (and of course, most times I do not start sub-projects at all, I just jump into a burning place and try to do my best to fix itâ¦ not always very successfully :P) so, coming back to less âphilosophicalâ question: 1) do we need a state-of-the-art source code management? YES. 2) do we want to spend the few manpower we have on running into a worst solution of what is already around? I think no. Esteban > > Phil > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 1:52 PM, kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com <mailto:kilon.alios@gmail.com>> wrote: > I forgot to add that git comes with excellent gui clients that are far more powerful and elegant that what Pharo offers currently . > > If you are user of emacs there is magit , really powerful gui client and very popular among emacs users. > > For gui client I have used quite a lot SmartGit > > http://www.syntevo.com/smartgit/ <http://www.syntevo.com/smartgit/> > > and recently a fellow python developer introduced me to Sourcetree > > http://www.sourcetreeapp.com/ <http://www.sourcetreeapp.com/> > > Both are free for non commercial projects. They require a license for commercial use but they are relative cheap. They come with diff tools, easy commit access , branching, merging and tons of stuff to make life easier for complex scenarios and they integrate well with bitbucket and other online repositories besides github. > > But even from command line there is a lot of room for automation by creating bash scripts to make commits one step process. >

Nov. 27, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] SmalltalkHub bugs & hangs :-(

by phil＠highoctane.be

At times, mczs still come handy for some merges... And Smalltalkhub is good as a safe heaven for collecting packages that are otherwise scattered all around. Is there a reason why Smalltalkhub would not stay working nicely? Are we talking about using bigger boxes here? Or is it a deeper issue? Phil On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 1:52 PM, kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I forgot to add that git comes with excellent gui clients that are far > more powerful and elegant that what Pharo offers currently . > > If you are user of emacs there is magit , really powerful gui client and > very popular among emacs users. > > For gui client I have used quite a lot SmartGit > > http://www.syntevo.com/smartgit/ > > and recently a fellow python developer introduced me to Sourcetree > > http://www.sourcetreeapp.com/ > > Both are free for non commercial projects. They require a license for > commercial use but they are relative cheap. They come with diff tools, easy > commit access , branching, merging and tons of stuff to make life easier > for complex scenarios and they integrate well with bitbucket and other > online repositories besides github. > > But even from command line there is a lot of room for automation by > creating bash scripts to make commits one step process. >

Nov. 27, 2014

OSWindow WithOpenGL

by Yuriy Tymchuk

Hi, Iâm trying to load Woden and encounter a problem because it refers to âWithOpenGLâ group of OSWindow configuration and there is not one like that. Has anything changed? What should we use not? Cheers! Uko

Nov. 27, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] SmalltalkHub bugs & hangs :-(

by kilon alios

I forgot to add that git comes with excellent gui clients that are far more powerful and elegant that what Pharo offers currently . If you are user of emacs there is magit , really powerful gui client and very popular among emacs users. For gui client I have used quite a lot SmartGit http://www.syntevo.com/smartgit/ and recently a fellow python developer introduced me to Sourcetree http://www.sourcetreeapp.com/ Both are free for non commercial projects. They require a license for commercial use but they are relative cheap. They come with diff tools, easy commit access , branching, merging and tons of stuff to make life easier for complex scenarios and they integrate well with bitbucket and other online repositories besides github. But even from command line there is a lot of room for automation by creating bash scripts to make commits one step process.

Nov. 27, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] SmalltalkHub bugs & hangs :-(

by Esteban Lorenzano

Hi, > On 27 Nov 2014, at 11:14, Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > SmalltalkHub is slow, so donât click too fast :-( > > While Iâm grateful to developers of SmalltalkHub and previously SqueakSource, I believe as a small community, we cannot afford developing everything by ourselves. We donât have enough man-power. We can see the symptoms since SmalltalkHub is in beta stage since way too long... > > Itâs better to use some mainstream platform such as github. I agree. > Weâll we have support for it in Pharo 4? We already have some support, good enough for a lot of people, but not fopr us :) We will enhance it for pharo4 (the idea is to have monticello git packages using libgit2, something close to Thierryâs work gitfiletree, but using native libs instead osprocess) And weâll continue improving from there. Esteban > It would be interesting also from the communication point of view to make the world a little bit more aware of Pharo. > > Noury > <Screen Shot 2014-11-27 at 11.04.54.png>

Nov. 27, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Pharo4] saveAs now uses save file dialog

by kilon alios

yeap that is a very useful addition, great work Marcus. I have tested works very nicely and the way a beginner user would expect. Maybe it would be better if the file dialog was maximized to cover the entire Pharo window ? This is how other apps are doing this. On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 1:23 PM, Guillermo Polito <guillermopolito(a)gmail.com > wrote: > Great!!! :D > > On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 9:29 AM, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> > wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> One of the things that is very confusing for people using Pharo is that >> there is no way to save the image to another directory >> (or even know in which directory is is saved). >> >> #386 now uses the standard saveAs dialog. (thanks to Nicolai Hess) >> >> Further improvement: >> >> => it should be improved to have a name pre-set (like before, with the >> increasing number) >> => Of course the save as dialog could be improved, but it should be >> usable as it is. >> >> Marcus >> >> >> >

Nov. 27, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Pharo4] saveAs now uses save file dialog

by Guillermo Polito

Great!!! :D On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 9:29 AM, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: > Hi, > > One of the things that is very confusing for people using Pharo is that > there is no way to save the image to another directory > (or even know in which directory is is saved). > > #386 now uses the standard saveAs dialog. (thanks to Nicolai Hess) > > Further improvement: > > => it should be improved to have a name pre-set (like before, with the > increasing number) > => Of course the save as dialog could be improved, but it should be usable > as it is. > > Marcus > > >

Nov. 27, 2014

Some STON Changes

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Hi, Christophe Demarey had a nice idea (and he implemented it too!) that extends the syntax (or more precisely, the usage of the syntax) of STON a bit, and I just integrated it. Thank you, Christophe ! His core idea is to use the colon syntax for Associations. So now you can also write: #foo:1 which will become #foo->1 and vice versa. This does not change the way maps (either for dictionaries or arbitrary objects) work. In practice, this means that there are now 2 closely related expressions: STON fromString: '[ #foo:1, #bar:2 ]'. => { #foo->1. #bar->2 } STON fromString: '{ #foo:1, #bar:2 }'. => a Dictionary(#bar->2 #foo->1 ) In the first case you get an Array of explicit Associations, in the second case you get a Dictionary which uses Associations internally, but that is an implementation detail. And of course you can send #asDictionary to the array. Note that nesting is also possible ;-) #foo : 1 : 2 means #foo->(1->2) Anyway, I think from a Smalltalk perspective this is totally cool. As far as I can see, this addition does not result in conflicts. Another addition that was requested by Christophe that I added was a way to control which instance variables get written and/or the order in which they get written. This can be done by overwriting Object class>>#stonAllInstVarNames Sven

Nov. 27, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] SmalltalkHub bugs & hangs :-(

by kilon alios

You dont need anything installed to work with git , apart from git itself. The workflow is the same as with smalltalkhub + the standard workflow of git. I am using filteree which is already included with Pharo. These are the steps from absolute scratch 1) Download git and install it 2) Create an account in Github 3) add a repository in github 4) open the terminal (git in windows comes with its own terminal, macos and linux have own terminals) you can also optionally create a folder for putting all your git projects inside 5) config git using the git config command to add your email 6) copy the adress of your github repo , its on the right side of your central page of your github repo it has a button next to it to copy it 7) paste the adress after the git clone command and hit enter to clone the repo to your local drive 8) Go to pharo , open monticello and add for you new package a repo , choose gitfilete 9) filetree with open a file browser dialog, navigate to the folder you clone your gihub repo and press open 10) click save as usual to save code , add a commit message, I also copy the commit message to add it also in the git commit 11) go back to the terminal and cd to your git folder of your project 12) I use git status to see which files the filetree has created , Packages have their own folders and so does each class, with also a folder for instance and class side. Each methods has its own file, additional files exist for metadata. 13) git add the package folders. A simple git add of a folder will add all subfolders and files included in the folder. 14) git commit -am "paste here the copied message from monticello, or add your own commit message" 15) git push If you exclude step (8) and (9) the rest is normal git workflow Thats for setting up from there on for committing you will repeat only steps (10) - (15). There is also gitfiletree that automates this manual process but I like being in control to what is commited to my git repo. Gitfiletree has a chapter in Pharo For the Enterprise book. Github has extensive documentation for git and github. Git website also has documentation that is easy to follow and expose how powerful git really is. Its actually very simple and easy to do. On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 12:32 PM, jannik laval <jannik.laval(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Kilon, > > Do you have any documentation on how to use github in Pharo ? > What should I install, how to use it ? > > Thank you. > Jannik > > 2014-11-27 11:29 GMT+01:00 kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com>: > >> My personal opinion on Github and Pharo is that it already works great >> with Pharo. The workflow with filetree is exactly the same as other >> languages that gives the added advantage that you can use all the powerful >> tools you use with other languages for commiting to git and github. I have >> not experienced any kind of issue of problem using github with Pharo nor my >> experience has been any worse than other languages. >> >> With the use of Baseline you dont even need git installed in your system >> to install any Pharo project that use git which is a feature I have not >> seen in other languages. >> >> It should be also relative simple to extend ConfigurationBrowser to >> support github projects via baseline with no need to commit configurations >> to smalltalkhub. >> >> Pharo is already very active in github, many people have ported their >> projects there including me. >> >> Maybe StHub should support also being a portal to github , or uses github >> as its backend though I have no clue how much work that would involve. >> Personally I have completely abandoned smaltlalkhub for github because my >> experience was really bad and I was already very familiar with github. >> >> On Thu, Nov 27, 2014 at 12:14 PM, Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> SmalltalkHub is slow, so donât click too fast :-( >>> >>> While Iâm grateful to developers of SmalltalkHub and previously >>> SqueakSource, I believe as a small community, we cannot afford developing >>> everything by ourselves. We donât have enough man-power. We can see the >>> symptoms since SmalltalkHub is in beta stage since way too long... >>> >>> Itâs better to use some mainstream platform such as github. >>> Weâll we have support for it in Pharo 4? >>> >>> It would be interesting also from the communication point of view to >>> make the world a little bit more aware of Pharo. >>> >>> Noury >>> >> >> > > > -- > > ~~Jannik Laval~~ > Ãcole des Mines de Douai > Enseignant-chercheur > http://www.jannik-laval.eu > http://www.phratch.com > http://www.approchealpes.info > http://car.mines-douai.fr/ >

Nov. 27, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] SmalltalkHub bugs & hangs :-(

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

> On 27 Nov 2014, at 11:14, Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > SmalltalkHub is slow, so donât click too fast :-( > > While Iâm grateful to developers of SmalltalkHub and previously SqueakSource, I believe as a small community, we cannot afford developing everything by ourselves. We donât have enough man-power. We can see the symptoms since SmalltalkHub is in beta stage since way too long... > > Itâs better to use some mainstream platform such as github. > Weâll we have support for it in Pharo 4? > > It would be interesting also from the communication point of view to make the world a little bit more aware of Pharo. I think it is important to have a serious online system written in Pharo and in daily use (you know, eat your own dog food). There is also a difference between the system itself and the way it is deployed/managed. Please do not underestimate how much work this is for something that is used so heavily, like StHub. But yes, we can/should do better. Sven And like others said, you can start using git(hub) anytime you want, many people do. But be prepared to learn lots of new stuff. And you'll lose some in-image tools (a deal breaker for me).

Nov. 27, 2014