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Re: [Pharo-dev] confused about printString and printIt

by stepharong

On Sun, 19 Feb 2017 11:40:04 +0100, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > Ah, you're right: there is a difference between printing a textual > representation on a stream / window and doing the same with the actual > (print)string. I was not yet fully awake I guess. So 'comics' >>> comics whatever it means but (#AAA asClass new name: 'comics') >>> 'comics' I'm sorry but I do not get it at all. Especially since we always wrote that printIt is sending printString. I find that totally broken and I do not understand why this is good. Stef > >> On 19 Feb 2017, at 10:59, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Hmm, I think I do not see it :). >> >> Letâs take it slowly. From what I see, the behavior is the same since >> at least Pharo 3. >> >> Here is a script that seems to reproduce your situation: >> >> Object subclass: #AAA >> instanceVariableNames: 'name' >> classVariableNames: '' >> package: 'AAA'. >> #AAA asClass compile: 'printOn: aStream >> aStream << name'. >> #AAA asClass compile: 'name: aString >> name := aString'. >> #AAA asClass new name: 'comics' >> >> In Pharo 6, we have in a Playground: >> >> <Screen Shot 2017-02-19 at 10.48.55 AM.png> >> >> In Pharo 3, we have this in a Workspace: >> >> <Screen Shot 2017-02-19 at 10.49.26 AM.png> >> >> Calling Print It on an object produces a string out of the contents of >> the stream, and displaying it shows the contents of the stream (so, no >> quotes). Calling Print It on a string produces a string of the string, >> and displaying it shows the quotes of the first string. >> >> You can see this in the String tab of the inspector: >> >> <p1.png> >> >> >> <p2.png> >> >> Does this make sense? >> >> I think this is not inconsistent, but maybe there is a better way. In >> any case, the behavior seems to exist since a long time. >> >> Cheers, >> Doru >> >> >>> On Feb 19, 2017, at 9:06 AM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >>> >>> Hi doru >>> >>> may be I do not see the obvious. >>> I defined a class >>> >>> Object subclass: #MFElement >>> instanceVariableNames: 'name parent' >>> classVariableNames: '' >>> package: 'MyFS2' >>> >>> printOn: aStream >>> parent isNil ifFalse: [ parent printOn: aStream ]. >>> aStream << name >>> >>> name: aString >>> name := aString >>> >>> >>> MFDirectory new name: 'comics'. >>> >>> >>> And when I do >>> >>> >>> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >>> comics/ >>> >>> >>> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>>> 'comics/' >>> >>> >>> Hi Stef, >>> >>> I think I do not understand the issue. >>> >>> Here is the screenshot of a Playground. >>> >>> âcomicsâ -> print-it -> âcomics' >>> >>> <Mail Attachment.png> >>> >>> What am I missing? >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Doru >>> >>> >>>> On Feb 18, 2017, at 6:26 PM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi guys >>>> >>>> I'm working on an introduction chapter for my future book and I do >>>> not like the behavior I see in latest pharo 60. >>>> >>>> And I do not understand the behavior of print-it >>>> >>>> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >>>> comics/ >>>> >>>> >>>> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>>>> 'comics/' >>>> >>>> >>>> Why print it does not produce ''? >>>> >>>> >>>> Stef >>>> >>>> >>>> printIt >>>> "Treat the current text selection as an expression; evaluate it. >>>> Insert the >>>> description of the result of evaluation after the selection and then >>>> make >>>> this description the new text selection." >>>> >>>> | printString | >>>> self >>>> evaluateSelectionAndDo: [ :result | >>>> printString := [ result printString ] >>>> on: Error >>>> do: [ '<error in printString: try ''Inspect it'' to debug>' ]. >>>> self afterSelectionInsertAndSelect: printString ] >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> www.tudorgirba.com >>> www.feenk.com >>> >>> "It's not how it is, it is how we see it." >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >>> <MFElement.st> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> www.feenk.com >> >> "Problem solving should be focused on describing >> the problem in a way that makes the solution obvious." >> >> >> >> >> > -- Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Feb. 19, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] confused about printString and printIt

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Ah, you're right: there is a difference between printing a textual representation on a stream / window and doing the same with the actual (print)string. I was not yet fully awake I guess. > On 19 Feb 2017, at 10:59, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > Hi, > > Hmm, I think I do not see it :). > > Letâs take it slowly. From what I see, the behavior is the same since at least Pharo 3. > > Here is a script that seems to reproduce your situation: > > Object subclass: #AAA > instanceVariableNames: 'name' > classVariableNames: '' > package: 'AAA'. > #AAA asClass compile: 'printOn: aStream > aStream << name'. > #AAA asClass compile: 'name: aString > name := aString'. > #AAA asClass new name: 'comics' > > In Pharo 6, we have in a Playground: > > <Screen Shot 2017-02-19 at 10.48.55 AM.png> > > In Pharo 3, we have this in a Workspace: > > <Screen Shot 2017-02-19 at 10.49.26 AM.png> > > Calling Print It on an object produces a string out of the contents of the stream, and displaying it shows the contents of the stream (so, no quotes). Calling Print It on a string produces a string of the string, and displaying it shows the quotes of the first string. > > You can see this in the String tab of the inspector: > > <p1.png> > > > <p2.png> > > Does this make sense? > > I think this is not inconsistent, but maybe there is a better way. In any case, the behavior seems to exist since a long time. > > Cheers, > Doru > > >> On Feb 19, 2017, at 9:06 AM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >> >> Hi doru >> >> may be I do not see the obvious. >> I defined a class >> >> Object subclass: #MFElement >> instanceVariableNames: 'name parent' >> classVariableNames: '' >> package: 'MyFS2' >> >> printOn: aStream >> parent isNil ifFalse: [ parent printOn: aStream ]. >> aStream << name >> >> name: aString >> name := aString >> >> >> MFDirectory new name: 'comics'. >> >> >> And when I do >> >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >> comics/ >> >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>> 'comics/' >> >> >> Hi Stef, >> >> I think I do not understand the issue. >> >> Here is the screenshot of a Playground. >> >> âcomicsâ -> print-it -> âcomics' >> >> <Mail Attachment.png> >> >> What am I missing? >> >> Cheers, >> Doru >> >> >>> On Feb 18, 2017, at 6:26 PM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Hi guys >>> >>> I'm working on an introduction chapter for my future book and I do not like the behavior I see in latest pharo 60. >>> >>> And I do not understand the behavior of print-it >>> >>> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >>> comics/ >>> >>> >>> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>>> 'comics/' >>> >>> >>> Why print it does not produce ''? >>> >>> >>> Stef >>> >>> >>> printIt >>> "Treat the current text selection as an expression; evaluate it. Insert the >>> description of the result of evaluation after the selection and then make >>> this description the new text selection." >>> >>> | printString | >>> self >>> evaluateSelectionAndDo: [ :result | >>> printString := [ result printString ] >>> on: Error >>> do: [ '<error in printString: try ''Inspect it'' to debug>' ]. >>> self afterSelectionInsertAndSelect: printString ] >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >>> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> www.feenk.com >> >> "It's not how it is, it is how we see it." >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >> <MFElement.st> > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > www.feenk.com > > "Problem solving should be focused on describing > the problem in a way that makes the solution obvious." > > > > >

Feb. 19, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] confused about printString and printIt

by stepharong

I do not say that it is a problem of playground. I'm saying that our tools are breaking an important invariant. Printit should not produce "strings" that are not objects. What I'm saying it that - axiom one printString returns a string. - printIt send printString to the object and why does it no display a string except for objects whose representation is themselves. The problem not to put '' around string is that we get a broken things. In Pharo we have tools that when they should display a string return a "we do not know what" because it is not a literal! 'comics' Printit does not produce comics but 'comics' so why do we have (#AAA asClass new name: 'comics') printit because this is insane. It breaks everyrhing Stef > Hi, > > Hmm, I think I do not see it :). > > Letâs take it slowly. From what I see, the behavior is the same since at > least Pharo 3. > > Here is a script that seems to reproduce your situation: > > Object subclass: #AAA > instanceVariableNames: 'name' > classVariableNames: '' > package: 'AAA'. > #AAA asClass compile: 'printOn: aStream > aStream << name'. > #AAA asClass compile: 'name: aString name := aString'. > #AAA asClass new name: 'comics' > > In Pharo 6, we have in a Playground: > > > > In Pharo 3, we have this in a Workspace: > > > > Calling Print It on an object produces a string out of the contents of > the stream, and displaying it shows the contents of the stream (so, no > quotes). Calling Print It on a string produces a string of >the string, > and displaying it shows the quotes of the first string. > > You can see this in the String tab of the inspector: > > > > > > > Does this make sense? > > I think this is not inconsistent, but maybe there is a better way. In > any case, the behavior seems to exist since a long time. > > Cheers, > Doru > > >> On Feb 19, 2017, at 9:06 AM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >> >> Hi doru >> >> may be I do not see the obvious. >> I defined a class >> >> Object subclass: #MFElement >> instanceVariableNames: 'name parent' >> classVariableNames: '' >> package: 'MyFS2' >> >> printOn: aStream >> parent isNil ifFalse: [ parent printOn: aStream ]. >> aStream << name >> >> name: aString >> name := aString >> >> >> MFDirectory new name: 'comics'. >> >> >> And when I do >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >> comics/ >> >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>> 'comics/' >> >> >> Hi Stef, >> >> I think I do not understand the issue. >> >> Here is the screenshot of a Playground. >> >> âcomicsâ -> print-it -> âcomics' >> >> <Mail Attachment.png> >> >> What am I missing? >> >> Cheers, >> Doru >> >> >>> On Feb 18, 2017, at 6:26 PM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Hi guys >>> >>> I'm working on an introduction chapter for my future book and I do not >>> like the behavior I see in latest pharo 60. >>> >>> And I do not understand the behavior of print-it >>> >>> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >>> comics/ >>> >>> >>> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>>> 'comics/' >>> >>> >>> Why print it does not produce ''? >>> >>> >>> Stef >>> >>> >>> printIt >>> "Treat the current text selection as an expression; evaluate it. >>> Insert the >>> description of the result of evaluation after the selection and then >>> make >>> this description the new text selection." >>> >>> | printString | >>> self >>> evaluateSelectionAndDo: [ :result | >>> printString := [ result printString ] >>> on: Error >>> do: [ '<error in printString: try ''Inspect it'' to debug>' ]. >>> self afterSelectionInsertAndSelect: printString ] >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> --Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >>> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> www.feenk.com >> >> "It's not how it is, it is how we see it." >> >> >> >> >> --Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >> <MFElement.st> > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > www.feenk.com > > "Problem solving should be focused on describing > the problem in a way that makes the solution obvious." > > > > > -- Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Feb. 19, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] confused about printString and printIt

by Tudor Girba

Hi, Hmm, I think I do not see it :). Letâs take it slowly. From what I see, the behavior is the same since at least Pharo 3. Here is a script that seems to reproduce your situation: Object subclass: #AAA instanceVariableNames: 'name' classVariableNames: '' package: 'AAA'. #AAA asClass compile: 'printOn: aStream aStream << name'. #AAA asClass compile: 'name: aString name := aString'. #AAA asClass new name: 'comics' In Pharo 6, we have in a Playground: In Pharo 3, we have this in a Workspace: Calling Print It on an object produces a string out of the contents of the stream, and displaying it shows the contents of the stream (so, no quotes). Calling Print It on a string produces a string of the string, and displaying it shows the quotes of the first string. You can see this in the String tab of the inspector: Does this make sense? I think this is not inconsistent, but maybe there is a better way. In any case, the behavior seems to exist since a long time. Cheers, Doru > On Feb 19, 2017, at 9:06 AM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: > > Hi doru > > may be I do not see the obvious. > I defined a class > > Object subclass: #MFElement > instanceVariableNames: 'name parent' > classVariableNames: '' > package: 'MyFS2' > > printOn: aStream > parent isNil ifFalse: [ parent printOn: aStream ]. > aStream << name > > name: aString > name := aString > > > MFDirectory new name: 'comics'. > > > And when I do > > > (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') > comics/ > > > (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>> 'comics/' > > > Hi Stef, > > I think I do not understand the issue. > > Here is the screenshot of a Playground. > > âcomicsâ -> print-it -> âcomics' > > <Mail Attachment.png> > > What am I missing? > > Cheers, > Doru > > >> On Feb 18, 2017, at 6:26 PM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >> >> >> Hi guys >> >> I'm working on an introduction chapter for my future book and I do not like the behavior I see in latest pharo 60. >> >> And I do not understand the behavior of print-it >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >> comics/ >> >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>> 'comics/' >> >> >> Why print it does not produce ''? >> >> >> Stef >> >> >> printIt >> "Treat the current text selection as an expression; evaluate it. Insert the >> description of the result of evaluation after the selection and then make >> this description the new text selection." >> >> | printString | >> self >> evaluateSelectionAndDo: [ :result | >> printString := [ result printString ] >> on: Error >> do: [ '<error in printString: try ''Inspect it'' to debug>' ]. >> self afterSelectionInsertAndSelect: printString ] >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >> > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > www.feenk.com > > "It's not how it is, it is how we see it." > > > > > -- > Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ > <MFElement.st> -- www.tudorgirba.com www.feenk.com "Problem solving should be focused on describing the problem in a way that makes the solution obvious."

Feb. 19, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] confused about printString and printIt

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Stef is right, there is something strange. Consider the following 4 expressions, each time with the result of 'Print It' inserted: #foo->'foo'. "#foo->'foo'" (#foo->'foo') printString. "'#foo->''foo'''" 'foo'. "'foo'" 'foo' printString. "'''foo'''" In a Workspace (not Playground), the following happens: #foo->'foo'. #foo->'foo' #foo->'foo' printString. #foo->'''foo''' Which makes even less sense. > On 19 Feb 2017, at 09:06, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: > > Hi doru > > may be I do not see the obvious. > I defined a class > > Object subclass: #MFElement > instanceVariableNames: 'name parent' > classVariableNames: '' > package: 'MyFS2' > > printOn: aStream > parent isNil ifFalse: [ parent printOn: aStream ]. > aStream << name > > name: aString > name := aString > > > MFDirectory new name: 'comics'. > > > And when I do > > > (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') > comics/ > > > (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>> 'comics/' > > > Hi Stef, > > I think I do not understand the issue. > > Here is the screenshot of a Playground. > > âcomicsâ -> print-it -> âcomics' > > <Mail Attachment.png> > > What am I missing? > > Cheers, > Doru > > >> On Feb 18, 2017, at 6:26 PM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >> >> >> Hi guys >> >> I'm working on an introduction chapter for my future book and I do not like the behavior I see in latest pharo 60. >> >> And I do not understand the behavior of print-it >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >> comics/ >> >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>> 'comics/' >> >> >> Why print it does not produce ''? >> >> >> Stef >> >> >> printIt >> "Treat the current text selection as an expression; evaluate it. Insert the >> description of the result of evaluation after the selection and then make >> this description the new text selection." >> >> | printString | >> self >> evaluateSelectionAndDo: [ :result | >> printString := [ result printString ] >> on: Error >> do: [ '<error in printString: try ''Inspect it'' to debug>' ]. >> self afterSelectionInsertAndSelect: printString ] >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >> > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > www.feenk.com > > "It's not how it is, it is how we see it." > > > > > -- > Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ > <MFElement.st>

Feb. 19, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] confused about printString and printIt

by stepharong

Hi doru may be I do not see the obvious. I defined a class Object subclass: #MFElement instanceVariableNames: 'name parent' classVariableNames: '' package: 'MyFS2' printOn: aStream parent isNil ifFalse: [ parent printOn: aStream ]. aStream << name name: aString name := aString MFDirectory new name: 'comics'. And when I do (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') comics/ (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>> 'comics/' > Hi Stef, > > I think I do not understand the issue. > > Here is the screenshot of a Playground. > > âcomicsâ -> print-it -> âcomics' > > > > What am I missing? > > Cheers, > Doru > > >> On Feb 18, 2017, at 6:26 PM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: >> >> >> Hi guys >> >> I'm working on an introduction chapter for my future book and I do not >> like the behavior I see in latest pharo 60. >> >> And I do not understand the behavior of print-it >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') >> comics/ >> >> >> (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>>> 'comics/' >> >> >> Why print it does not produce ''? >> >> >> Stef >> >> >> printIt >> "Treat the current text selection as an expression; evaluate it. >> Insert the >> description of the result of evaluation after the selection and then >> make >> this description the new text selection." >> >> | printString | >> self >> evaluateSelectionAndDo: [ :result | >> printString := [ result printString ] >> on: Error >> do: [ '<error in printString: try ''Inspect it'' to debug>' ]. >> self afterSelectionInsertAndSelect: printString ] >> >> >> >> >> --Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ >> > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > www.feenk.com > > "It's not how it is, it is how we see it." > -- Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Feb. 19, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] confused about printString and printIt

by Tudor Girba

Hi Stef, I think I do not understand the issue. Here is the screenshot of a Playground. âcomicsâ -> print-it -> âcomics' What am I missing? Cheers, Doru > On Feb 18, 2017, at 6:26 PM, stepharong <stepharong(a)free.fr> wrote: > > > Hi guys > > I'm working on an introduction chapter for my future book and I do not like the behavior I see in latest pharo 60. > > And I do not understand the behavior of print-it > > (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') > comics/ > > > (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>>> 'comics/' > > > Why print it does not produce ''? > > > Stef > > > printIt > "Treat the current text selection as an expression; evaluate it. Insert the > description of the result of evaluation after the selection and then make > this description the new text selection." > > | printString | > self > evaluateSelectionAndDo: [ :result | > printString := [ result printString ] > on: Error > do: [ '<error in printString: try ''Inspect it'' to debug>' ]. > self afterSelectionInsertAndSelect: printString ] > > > > > -- > Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ > -- www.tudorgirba.com www.feenk.com "It's not how it is, it is how we see it."

Feb. 19, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Seeking support: Vote for Jigyasa Grover for Red Hat International Women in Open Source Academic Awards 2017

by Jigyasa Grover

Kilon, Thanks :) - Jigyasa -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/Seeking-support-Vote-for-Jigyasa-Grover-for-Red-Hat-I… Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Developers mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Feb. 19, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Seeking support: Vote for Jigyasa Grover for Red Hat International Women in Open Source Academic Awards 2017

by Dimitris Chloupis

I voted too , well done On Fri, 17 Feb 2017 at 21:14, Jigyasa Grover <grover.jigyasa1(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Thanks a lot Brad ! > It'd be great if you could kindly urge others to vote for me as well. > Looking forward to the valuable support from all .... > > Best > Jigyasa Grover > > > > -- > View this message in context: > http://forum.world.st/Seeking-support-Vote-for-Jigyasa-Grover-for-Red-Hat-I… > Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Developers mailing list archive at > Nabble.com. > >

Feb. 18, 2017

confused about printString and printIt

by stepharong

Hi guys I'm working on an introduction chapter for my future book and I do not like the behavior I see in latest pharo 60. And I do not understand the behavior of print-it (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') comics/ (MFDirectory new name: 'comics') printString >>> 'comics/' Why print it does not produce ''? Stef printIt "Treat the current text selection as an expression; evaluate it. Insert the description of the result of evaluation after the selection and then make this description the new text selection." | printString | self evaluateSelectionAndDo: [ :result | printString := [ result printString ] on: Error do: [ '<error in printString: try ''Inspect it'' to debug>' ]. self afterSelectionInsertAndSelect: printString ] -- Using Opera's mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/

Feb. 18, 2017