February 2022 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [ANN] Fuel 5.0.0

by Marcus Denker

> On 28 Feb 2022, at 22:04, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > > >> On 28 Feb 2022, at 21:43, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> On 28 Feb 2022, at 20:55, Marcus Denker wrote: >> >>>>> >>>>> Fuel for now just ignores the whole âFirst class Variableâ concept and serialises the ârawâ view of indexed instance >>>>> variablesâ¦ (which is the right thing to do now), but that would not work here anymore. >>>> >>>> Good to know. I'll have to think about how this plays together with the "classic" architecture. >>>> >>> >>> >>> This is why I am in general not a fan of this idea of code trying to be compatible on that levelâ¦ >>> >>> To me what fascinated me about Squeak was not to be slavishly compatible to ST80, but to do >>> and do *more*. To take the philosophy and push it furtherâ¦ but that can *not* be done if one >>> want to 100% backward compatible on an implementation level forever... >>> >>> I think my next talk at ESUG will be âWhy I am not a Smalltalkerâ. :-) >> >> lol :D >> >> I know what you mean. I'll have to see what happens with Squeak 6. Maybe we'll reach a point where it becomes easier to maintain >> two separate versions. As long as there are users in Squeak I want to support them (maybe I'll do a survey >> in the Squeak community at that point, it could also be an option to drop support for Squeak if they don't >> use Fuel). >> > > It was explained to me, when I said âWe did Pharo to have a futureâ, that *nobody* in the Squeak community wants or ever wanted > to have a future. and that this is good for eToys.. I still do not understand that. It just made no sense.But then, in retrospect, not much made sense with Squeak. You will never be able to invent the future if you do not want to have a future. Marcus

Feb. 28, 2022

Re: [ANN] Fuel 5.0.0

by Marcus Denker

> On 28 Feb 2022, at 21:43, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > On 28 Feb 2022, at 20:55, Marcus Denker wrote: > >>>> >>>> Fuel for now just ignores the whole âFirst class Variableâ concept and serialises the ârawâ view of indexed instance >>>> variablesâ¦ (which is the right thing to do now), but that would not work here anymore. >>> >>> Good to know. I'll have to think about how this plays together with the "classic" architecture. >>> >> >> >> This is why I am in general not a fan of this idea of code trying to be compatible on that levelâ¦ >> >> To me what fascinated me about Squeak was not to be slavishly compatible to ST80, but to do >> and do *more*. To take the philosophy and push it furtherâ¦ but that can *not* be done if one >> want to 100% backward compatible on an implementation level forever... >> >> I think my next talk at ESUG will be âWhy I am not a Smalltalkerâ. :-) > > lol :D > > I know what you mean. I'll have to see what happens with Squeak 6. Maybe we'll reach a point where it becomes easier to maintain > two separate versions. As long as there are users in Squeak I want to support them (maybe I'll do a survey > in the Squeak community at that point, it could also be an option to drop support for Squeak if they don't > use Fuel). > It was explained to me, when I said âWe did Pharo to have a futureâ, that *nobody* in the Squeak community wants or ever wanted to have a future. So why waste even 5 minutes on that? Marcus

Feb. 28, 2022

Re: [ANN] Fuel 5.0.0

by Max Leske

On 28 Feb 2022, at 20:55, Marcus Denker wrote: >>> >>> Fuel for now just ignores the whole âFirst class Variableâ concept and serialises the ârawâ view of indexed instance >>> variablesâ¦ (which is the right thing to do now), but that would not work here anymore. >> >> Good to know. I'll have to think about how this plays together with the "classic" architecture. >> > > > This is why I am in general not a fan of this idea of code trying to be compatible on that levelâ¦ > > To me what fascinated me about Squeak was not to be slavishly compatible to ST80, but to do > and do *more*. To take the philosophy and push it furtherâ¦ but that can *not* be done if one > want to 100% backward compatible on an implementation level forever... > > I think my next talk at ESUG will be âWhy I am not a Smalltalkerâ. :-) lol :D I know what you mean. I'll have to see what happens with Squeak 6. Maybe we'll reach a point where it becomes easier to maintain two separate versions. As long as there are users in Squeak I want to support them (maybe I'll do a survey in the Squeak community at that point, it could also be an option to drop support for Squeak if they don't use Fuel). > > Marcus

Feb. 28, 2022

Re: [ANN] Fuel 5.0.0

by Marcus Denker

>> >> Fuel for now just ignores the whole âFirst class Variableâ concept and serialises the ârawâ view of indexed instance >> variablesâ¦ (which is the right thing to do now), but that would not work here anymore. > > Good to know. I'll have to think about how this plays together with the "classic" architecture. > This is why I am in general not a fan of this idea of code trying to be compatible on that levelâ¦ To me what fascinated me about Squeak was not to be slavishly compatible to ST80, but to do and do *more*. To take the philosophy and push it furtherâ¦ but that can *not* be done if one want to 100% backward compatible on an implementation level forever... I think my next talk at ESUG will be âWhy I am not a Smalltalkerâ. :-) Marcus

Feb. 28, 2022

Re: [ANN] Fuel 5.0.0

by Max Leske

On 28 Feb 2022, at 9:27, Marcus Denker wrote: >> On 27 Feb 2022, at 19:34, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> Hi everyone, >> >> I'm happy to announce Fuel version 5.0.0 today. >> >> The changes to 4.0.0 aren't huge but I've had to adjust the format once more. >> >> 5.0.0 comes with full support for stateful traits, i.e. traits with instance variables. You can find the release notes here: https://theseion.github.io/Fuel/releases/5.0.0/. >> > > Nice! As soon as the Pharo11 dev cycle starts, I want to use it and look into the state of serialising clean blocks. > > (Clean blocks are not enabled by default in Pharo10, but I want to push for finishing that soon in Pharo11). That's going to be interesting :). Ideally this will work out of the box. > > Another change I am looking into is to allow Slots on all classesâ¦ we can not not have indexed instance variables > in some classes, but with Slots we can define non-indexed âinstance variablesâ that store somewhere else. > > E.g. we could implement a subclass of Slot that would realise a Variable âsourceâ on CompiledMethod that would > abstract away source code storage mess (just as an example what this can do, not to say that we should do exactly that). > > Or have a Slot that stores into a property API as we have it on all the Structural entities (from classes down to compiledMethod). > > Fuel for now just ignores the whole âFirst class Variableâ concept and serialises the ârawâ view of indexed instance > variablesâ¦ (which is the right thing to do now), but that would not work here anymore. Good to know. I'll have to think about how this plays together with the "classic" architecture. > > Marcus

Feb. 28, 2022

Re: [ANN] Fuel 5.0.0

by Marcus Denker

> On 27 Feb 2022, at 19:34, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi everyone, > > I'm happy to announce Fuel version 5.0.0 today. > > The changes to 4.0.0 aren't huge but I've had to adjust the format once more. > > 5.0.0 comes with full support for stateful traits, i.e. traits with instance variables. You can find the release notes here: https://theseion.github.io/Fuel/releases/5.0.0/. > Nice! As soon as the Pharo11 dev cycle starts, I want to use it and look into the state of serialising clean blocks. (Clean blocks are not enabled by default in Pharo10, but I want to push for finishing that soon in Pharo11). Another change I am looking into is to allow Slots on all classesâ¦ we can not not have indexed instance variables in some classes, but with Slots we can define non-indexed âinstance variablesâ that store somewhere else. E.g. we could implement a subclass of Slot that would realise a Variable âsourceâ on CompiledMethod that would abstract away source code storage mess (just as an example what this can do, not to say that we should do exactly that). Or have a Slot that stores into a property API as we have it on all the Structural entities (from classes down to compiledMethod). Fuel for now just ignores the whole âFirst class Variableâ concept and serialises the ârawâ view of indexed instance variablesâ¦ (which is the right thing to do now), but that would not work here anymore. Marcus

Feb. 28, 2022

Re: Migration of ReferenceFinder

by Pierre Misse Chanabier

I'm assuming you're talking about https://github.com/pavel-krivanek/RefsHunter ? (That's the only one I saw on Pavel's account) From a quick look, it seems like a different implementation which rely on a snapshot of the memory. But I haven't looked very deep at all. Pierre On 2/27/2022 9:23 PM, stephane ducasse wrote: > Thanks Pierre > Do you know how it compares with the port of Pavel Krivanek? > > S > >> On 25 Feb 2022, at 15:20, pmissech <pierre.misse-chanabier(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> >> Hello, >> >> I've migrated the small repository of Reference Finder to github: https://github.com/hogoww/ReferenceFinder/ from Smalltalk-hub. >> If someone is aware of another migration of the repository, licensing or others, please let me know. >> >> Pierre

Feb. 28, 2022

Re: Fwd: ESUG 2022 call for presentations And Call for student volunteers

by HernÃ¡n Morales Durand

The URL in the e-mail http://www.esug.org/wiki/supportesug/becomeasponsor/ points to /wiki/supportesug/becomeasponsor/ not found Cheers, HernÃ¡n El dom, 20 feb 2022 a las 19:27, stephane ducasse (< stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr>) escribiÃ³: > A reminderâ¦ > > S > > Begin forwarded message: > > *From: *"stephane.ducasse(a)free.fr" <stephane.ducasse(a)free.fr> > *Subject: **ESUG 2022 call for presentations And Call for student > volunteers* > *Date: *13 January 2022 at 13:23:44 CET > > ESUG 2022 Serbia 22. â 26.8. > > You can support the ESUG conference in many different ways: > > - Sponsor the conference. New sponsoring packages are described at > http://www.esug.org/supportesug/becomeasponsor/ > - Submit a talk, a software or a paper to one of the events. See below. > - Attend the conference. We'd like to beat the previous record of > attendance (170 people at Amsterdam 2008)! > - Students can get free registration and hosting if they enroll into > the the Student Volunteers program. See below. > > Developers Forum: International Smalltalk Developers Conference > We are looking for YOUR experience on using Smalltalk. You will have 30 > min for presentations and 45 min for hands-on tutorials. > The list of topics for the normal talks and tutorials includes, but is not > limited to the following: > > - XP practices, Development tools, Experience reports > - Model driven development, Web development, Team management > - Meta-Modeling, Security, New libraries & frameworks > - Educational material, Embedded systems and robotics > - SOA and Web services, Interaction with other programming languages > > Teaching Pearls and Show us Your Business > New this year!!! We added two types of sessions in addition to the regular > talks and show us your projects sessions. > > - Show your business 10 min session (Get prepared!!) > - Teaching pearls : we want some session on how to teach some design > aspects. We want your tip and tricks to teach Smalltalk or OOP. > > We expect to have several 10 to 15 min sessions aggregated. > > How to submit? > Make a Pull Request here > https://github.com/ESUG/esug.github.io/tree/source/2022-Conference/talks > > Or but only if you are not connected to the worldâ¦ send an email to > stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr > > Title: [ESUG 2022] Please follow the template below the email will be automatically processed! > Name: > Email: > Abstract: > Bio: > > > Call for Student Volunteers > > Student volunteers help keep the conference running smoothly; in return, > they have free accommodations, while still having most of the time to enjoy > the conference. > > Pay attention: the places are limited so do not wait till the last minute > to apply. > Conference details: > > Send an email to stephane.ducasse at inria.fr and serge.stinckwich at > gmail.com with: > > - title: [ESUG 2022 Student] > - name, gender, university/school, country, email address > - short description of you and why you are interested in participating > > *For which period is accommodation covered?* Accommodation is covered > from Sunday 21 August until Friday 26 August 2022 (including nights from > Sunday to Monday and from Thursday to Friday). Students will be hosted in > student rooms. ESUG additionally covers for the lunches during the week and > one dinner. > > Duties include handling registration as people arrive at the conference, > filling coffee machines, collecting presentation slides for ESUG right > after the presentation is given, being present at an information desk to > answer questions, and generally being helpful. Student volunteering makes > the conference better, takes a fairly small amount of time and doesn't > significantly interfere with enjoying and learning from the conference. > Please Note, this role requires discipline and constant attention to all > attendees. > Information about hotel > > Student Volunteer rooms are booked at (to be announced). If you are > student volunteer, do not book yourself, we have arranged the booking > already! > > >

Feb. 28, 2022

Re: Migration of ReferenceFinder

by stephane ducasse

Thanks Pierre Do you know how it compares with the port of Pavel Krivanek? S > On 25 Feb 2022, at 15:20, pmissech <pierre.misse-chanabier(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > Hello, > > I've migrated the small repository of Reference Finder to github: https://github.com/hogoww/ReferenceFinder/ from Smalltalk-hub. > If someone is aware of another migration of the repository, licensing or others, please let me know. > > Pierre

Feb. 27, 2022

Re: [ANN] Fuel 5.0.0

by stephane ducasse

Great news! > On 27 Feb 2022, at 19:34, Max Leske <maxleske(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi everyone, > > I'm happy to announce Fuel version 5.0.0 today. > > The changes to 4.0.0 aren't huge but I've had to adjust the format once more. > > 5.0.0 comes with full support for stateful traits, i.e. traits with instance variables. You can find the release notes here: https://theseion.github.io/Fuel/releases/5.0.0/ <https://theseion.github.io/Fuel/releases/5.0.0/>. > > > Cheers, > Max (on behalf of the Fuel team)

Feb. 27, 2022