October 2017 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] Layout for placing widgets

by Stephane Ducasse

Ok then may be we should give a try to use. Tx for the links. Stef On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: >> 2017-10-27 19:13 GMT+02:00 Stephane Ducasse <stepharo.self(a)gmail.com>: >>> >>> I was wondering if there is a layout that we can use to propose >>> alternate placing layout for widgets in spec? >>> >>> Like... >>> attached to the left 10pixels rubber band box or fixed size box >>> 10pixels attached to the right. > > >> On Oct 27, 2017, at 12:59 PM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> Maybe we should check cassowary >> >> https://croisant.net/blog/2016-02-24-ui-layout-constraints-part-1/#ui-const… > > > On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 4:48 PM, Stephane Ducasse <stepharo.self(a)gmail.com> > wrote: >> >> Pavel I do not think that cassowary is good for us. > > > Do you mean Cassowary in particular, or constraint based UI in general? > > My naive first impression is, if Cassowary is good enough for Apple... > https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9846992 > https://www.quora.com/Should-I-use-Auto-Layout > > and Google (search here for "solver")... > https://academy.realm.io/posts/cool-constraintlayout-droidcon-boston-2017/ > > such that "in 2016, both iOS and Android have first-party layout systems > based on Cassowary." > https://www.bignerdranch.com/blog/constraintlayout-vs-auto-layout-how-do-th… > > then it seems worth some analysis, and discussion of better alternatives. > > > Coincidentally, I see a Smalltalk implementation is available... > http://www.squeaksource.com/Cassowary.html > https://constraints.cs.washington.edu/solvers/cassowary-tochi.pdf > > > For balance, some points against AutoLayout, but some alternatives also seem > to use Cassowary solver... > https://www.reddit.com/r/iOSProgramming/comments/4t6kd5/why_i_dont_use_auto… > https://www.bignerdranch.com/blog/constraintlayout-vs-auto-layout-how-do-th… > https://makeapppie.com/2015/10/28/why-stack-views-are-your-best-friend-if-y… > https://cocoacasts.com/working-with-stack-views/ > > > cheers -ben > >

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Layout for placing widgets

by Ben Coman

> 2017-10-27 19:13 GMT+02:00 Stephane Ducasse <stepharo.self(a)gmail.com>: >> >> I was wondering if there is a layout that we can use to propose >> alternate placing layout for widgets in spec? >> >> Like... >> attached to the left 10pixels rubber band box or fixed size box >> 10pixels attached to the right. > On Oct 27, 2017, at 12:59 PM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > Maybe we should check cassowary > https://croisant.net/blog/2016-02-24-ui-layout-constraints-part-1/#ui- constraints On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 4:48 PM, Stephane Ducasse <stepharo.self(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Pavel I do not think that cassowary is good for us. Do you mean Cassowary in particular, or constraint based UI in general? My naive first impression is, if Cassowary is good enough for Apple... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9846992 https://www.quora.com/Should-I-use-Auto-Layout and Google (search here for "solver")... https://academy.realm.io/posts/cool-constraintlayout-droidcon-boston-2017/ such that "in 2016, both iOS and Android have first-party layout systems based on Cassowary." https://www.bignerdranch.com/blog/constraintlayout-vs-auto-layout-how-do-th… then it seems worth some analysis, and discussion of better alternatives. Coincidentally, I see a Smalltalk implementation is available... http://www.squeaksource.com/Cassowary.html https://constraints.cs.washington.edu/solvers/cassowary-tochi.pdf For balance, some points against AutoLayout, but some alternatives also seem to use Cassowary solver... https://www.reddit.com/r/iOSProgramming/comments/4t6kd5/why_i_dont_use_auto… https://www.bignerdranch.com/blog/constraintlayout-vs-auto-layout-how-do-th… https://makeapppie.com/2015/10/28/why-stack-views-are-your-best-friend-if-y… https://cocoacasts.com/working-with-stack-views/ cheers -ben

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Zinc and Zodiac - Synching/Contributing

by Stephane Ducasse

Sven Normally by the end of next week we will have a new file format as well as an automatic transition for older projects. After that I think that using Pharo 70 tools and contributing will be ok. Right now this is working and sometimes blow up a bit :) Stef On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 12:27 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > >> On 28 Oct 2017, at 11:39, Norbert Hartl <norbert(a)hartl.name> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Am 28.10.2017 um 11:21 schrieb Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu>: >>> >>> Torsten, >>> >>>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:12, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi Sven, >>>> >>>> for Zinc there is a new issue: >>>> >>>> >>>> 1. Zinc is using #asBytesDescription. It should not be used as it is deprecated >>>> >>>> https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/401 >>> >>> This change was applied upstream: >>> >>> === >>> Name: Zinc-HTTP-SvenVanCaekenberghe.470 >>> Author: SvenVanCaekenberghe >>> Time: 28 October 2017, 11:10:06.068769 am >>> UUID: 1d831c82-f918-0d00-9306-5dc70a8677c5 >>> Ancestors: Zinc-HTTP-SvenVanCaekenberghe.469 >>> >>> Follow an API change in Pharo: use #humanReadableSIByteSize instead of #asByteDescription in ZnUtils>>#signalProgress:total: >>> === >>> >>>> there is also >>>> >>>> 2. https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/20557 which is not yet integrated. >>> >>> This is waiting for an integrator, I believe people are working on it. >>> >>>> I also proposed some simple but necessary cleanups for Zodiac in Pharo 7: >>>> >>>> 3. Proper categorization in Zodiac-Tests package >>>> - to use "test" category instead of "testing" and better group the tests written >>>> >>>> https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/355/files >>>> >>>> Also it looks like the #setUp in Zodiac tests never send a "super setUp". Which >>>> should be fixed too. >>> >>> Hmm, these are more cosmetic changes, I will have a look at them later on. >>> >>>> I've noticed that both Zinc/Zodiac are not hosted on STHub. You seem to use your own custom >>>> hosting server on >>>> >>>> http://mc.stfx.eu/Zodiac >>>> http://mc.stfx.eu/ZincHTTPComponents >>> >>> I would not call that a custom hosting solution, it is just Monticello. Note that there are also a copies on StHub. >>> >>>> as well as github: >>>> >>>> https://github.com/svenvc/zinc >>>> https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac >>>> >>>> If we just merge the changes from 3. into Pharo 7 they may later be overwritten when >>>> synching also Zodiac again as in 2. >>> >>> Yes, that is true. I have to follow upstream. The GitHub versions also lag a bit sometimes. >>> >>>> So how can we contribute from community side to both projects? Should I fork >>>> https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac and send a PR to it so that you can integrate? >>> >>> Zinc/Zodiac are integral parts of Pharo that are managed externally. The goal is to simultaneously support many Pharo versions, not just the latest. Most production deploys of Pharo use version 4, 5 or 6, but they still need good HTTP(S) support. That is what I am trying to do. >>> >>> The older MC repositories are public, so others can contribute in the proven MC way. I have nothing against git, but I have not yet fully switched, nor do I think that I can if I want to support older Pharo versions. >>> >> You can move to git and commit from time to time in smalltalkhub. Or even automatically. > > I am not yet ready for that. > > Hell, I haven't even contributed to Pharo 7 yet. It seems like things are still in flux all the time. Now it seems the whole filetree will go away. > >> Norbert >>> >>>> Thanks >>>> Torsten > >

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Zinc and Zodiac - Synching/Contributing

by Stephane Ducasse

>> 2. https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/20557 which is not yet integrated. > > This is waiting for an integrator, I believe people are working on it. I do not know how to do it. Else I would do it. >> I also proposed some simple but necessary cleanups for Zodiac in Pharo 7: >> >> 3. Proper categorization in Zodiac-Tests package >> - to use "test" category instead of "testing" and better group the tests written >> >> https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/355/files >> >> Also it looks like the #setUp in Zodiac tests never send a "super setUp". Which >> should be fixed too. > > Hmm, these are more cosmetic changes, I will have a look at them later on. > >> I've noticed that both Zinc/Zodiac are not hosted on STHub. You seem to use your own custom >> hosting server on >> >> http://mc.stfx.eu/Zodiac >> http://mc.stfx.eu/ZincHTTPComponents > > I would not call that a custom hosting solution, it is just Monticello. Note that there are also a copies on StHub. > >> as well as github: >> >> https://github.com/svenvc/zinc >> https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac >> >> If we just merge the changes from 3. into Pharo 7 they may later be overwritten when >> synching also Zodiac again as in 2. > > Yes, that is true. I have to follow upstream. The GitHub versions also lag a bit sometimes. I think that with better tools such solutions will be solved in the future, > >> So how can we contribute from community side to both projects? Should I fork >> https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac and send a PR to it so that you can integrate? > > Zinc/Zodiac are integral parts of Pharo that are managed externally. The goal is to simultaneously support many Pharo versions, not just the latest. Most production deploys of Pharo use version 4, 5 or 6, but they still need good HTTP(S) support. That is what I am trying to do. > The older MC repositories are public, so others can contribute in the proven MC way. I have nothing against git, but I have not yet fully switched, nor do I think that I can if I want to support older Pharo versions. Indeed we should have a process to load MC githubified versions for a while.

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Layout for placing widgets

by Stephane Ducasse

Did you try? I always pay attention to things that should iterate a while and stabilise. Now I may be wrong. I have cassowary on my machine. I worked long time on constraints and I thought that apple has a better model with anchor and rubber band. Stef On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 12:36 PM, Jan Vrany <jan.vrany(a)fit.cvut.cz> wrote: > On Sat, 2017-10-28 at 10:48 +0200, Stephane Ducasse wrote: >> Pavel I do not think that cassowary is good for us. > > Why? > > Jan > >> >> >> On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 2:37 AM, Todd Blanchard <tblanchard(a)mac.com> >> wrote: >> > Does that load as part of Bloc? >> > >> > On Oct 27, 2017, at 12:59 PM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek@gmail. >> > com> >> > wrote: >> > >> > Maybe we should check cassowary >> > >> > https://croisant.net/blog/2016-02-24-ui-layout-constraints-part-1/# >> > ui-constraints >> > >> > 2017-10-27 19:13 GMT+02:00 Stephane Ducasse <stepharo.self(a)gmail.co >> > m>: >> > > >> > > Hi >> > > >> > > I was wondering if there is a layout that we can use to propose >> > > alternate placing layout >> > > for widgets in spec? >> > > >> > > Like >> > > >> > > attached to the left 10pixels rubber band box or fixed size box >> > > 10pixels attached to the right. >> > > >> > > >> > > Stef >> > > >> > >> > >> >> >

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Layout for placing widgets

by Jan Vrany

On Sat, 2017-10-28 at 10:48 +0200, Stephane Ducasse wrote: > Pavel I do not think that cassowary is good for us. Why? Jan > > > On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 2:37 AM, Todd Blanchard <tblanchard(a)mac.com> > wrote: > > Does that load as part of Bloc? > > > > On Oct 27, 2017, at 12:59 PM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek@gmail. > > com> > > wrote: > > > > Maybe we should check cassowary > > > > https://croisant.net/blog/2016-02-24-ui-layout-constraints-part-1/# > > ui-constraints > > > > 2017-10-27 19:13 GMT+02:00 Stephane Ducasse <stepharo.self(a)gmail.co > > m>: > > > > > > Hi > > > > > > I was wondering if there is a layout that we can use to propose > > > alternate placing layout > > > for widgets in spec? > > > > > > Like > > > > > > attached toÂ Â the left 10pixels rubber band box or fixed size box > > > 10pixels attached to the right. > > > > > > > > > Stef > > > > > > > > >

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Zinc and Zodiac - Synching/Contributing

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

> On 28 Oct 2017, at 11:39, Norbert Hartl <norbert(a)hartl.name> wrote: > > > >> Am 28.10.2017 um 11:21 schrieb Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu>: >> >> Torsten, >> >>> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:12, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: >>> >>> Hi Sven, >>> >>> for Zinc there is a new issue: >>> >>> >>> 1. Zinc is using #asBytesDescription. It should not be used as it is deprecated >>> >>> https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/401 >> >> This change was applied upstream: >> >> === >> Name: Zinc-HTTP-SvenVanCaekenberghe.470 >> Author: SvenVanCaekenberghe >> Time: 28 October 2017, 11:10:06.068769 am >> UUID: 1d831c82-f918-0d00-9306-5dc70a8677c5 >> Ancestors: Zinc-HTTP-SvenVanCaekenberghe.469 >> >> Follow an API change in Pharo: use #humanReadableSIByteSize instead of #asByteDescription in ZnUtils>>#signalProgress:total: >> === >> >>> there is also >>> >>> 2. https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/20557 which is not yet integrated. >> >> This is waiting for an integrator, I believe people are working on it. >> >>> I also proposed some simple but necessary cleanups for Zodiac in Pharo 7: >>> >>> 3. Proper categorization in Zodiac-Tests package >>> - to use "test" category instead of "testing" and better group the tests written >>> >>> https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/355/files >>> >>> Also it looks like the #setUp in Zodiac tests never send a "super setUp". Which >>> should be fixed too. >> >> Hmm, these are more cosmetic changes, I will have a look at them later on. >> >>> I've noticed that both Zinc/Zodiac are not hosted on STHub. You seem to use your own custom >>> hosting server on >>> >>> http://mc.stfx.eu/Zodiac >>> http://mc.stfx.eu/ZincHTTPComponents >> >> I would not call that a custom hosting solution, it is just Monticello. Note that there are also a copies on StHub. >> >>> as well as github: >>> >>> https://github.com/svenvc/zinc >>> https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac >>> >>> If we just merge the changes from 3. into Pharo 7 they may later be overwritten when >>> synching also Zodiac again as in 2. >> >> Yes, that is true. I have to follow upstream. The GitHub versions also lag a bit sometimes. >> >>> So how can we contribute from community side to both projects? Should I fork >>> https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac and send a PR to it so that you can integrate? >> >> Zinc/Zodiac are integral parts of Pharo that are managed externally. The goal is to simultaneously support many Pharo versions, not just the latest. Most production deploys of Pharo use version 4, 5 or 6, but they still need good HTTP(S) support. That is what I am trying to do. >> >> The older MC repositories are public, so others can contribute in the proven MC way. I have nothing against git, but I have not yet fully switched, nor do I think that I can if I want to support older Pharo versions. >> > You can move to git and commit from time to time in smalltalkhub. Or even automatically. I am not yet ready for that. Hell, I haven't even contributed to Pharo 7 yet. It seems like things are still in flux all the time. Now it seems the whole filetree will go away. > Norbert >> >>> Thanks >>> Torsten

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] feenk log

by Tudor Girba

Hi, The BlScalableElement is a utility element that zooms the elements inside. Indeed, all elements can be transformed, but this is a low level ability. The ScalableElement allows us to think in terms of elements, and strategies of zooming. The mouse wheel is an event issue that can be added on top. Cheers, Doru > On Oct 27, 2017, at 4:50 AM, Ben Coman <btc(a)openInWorld.com> wrote: > > > > On Thu, Oct 26, 2017 at 4:00 AM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > Hi, > > > On Oct 25, 2017, at 8:11 PM, Sean P. DeNigris <sean(a)clipperadams.com> wrote: > > > > Denis Kudriashov wrote > >> Good initiative. > > > > +1 :) > > > > > > Denis Kudriashov wrote > >> Here is my twitter questions:â¦ > > > > Mine are: > > 1. Is it possible/easy/smooth to zoom in/out? > > We now have BlScalableElement which handles the zooming. The next thing is to attach animations to it. > > and...and...and... can it zoom via the mouse-wheel? Or is support for this planned / what are the issues? > > cheers -ben -- www.tudorgirba.com www.feenk.com "Beauty is where we see it."

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Zinc and Zodiac - Synching/Contributing

by Norbert Hartl

> Am 28.10.2017 um 11:21 schrieb Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu>: > > Torsten, > >> On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:12, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: >> >> Hi Sven, >> >> for Zinc there is a new issue: >> >> >> 1. Zinc is using #asBytesDescription. It should not be used as it is deprecated >> >> https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/401 > > This change was applied upstream: > > === > Name: Zinc-HTTP-SvenVanCaekenberghe.470 > Author: SvenVanCaekenberghe > Time: 28 October 2017, 11:10:06.068769 am > UUID: 1d831c82-f918-0d00-9306-5dc70a8677c5 > Ancestors: Zinc-HTTP-SvenVanCaekenberghe.469 > > Follow an API change in Pharo: use #humanReadableSIByteSize instead of #asByteDescription in ZnUtils>>#signalProgress:total: > === > >> there is also >> >> 2. https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/20557 which is not yet integrated. > > This is waiting for an integrator, I believe people are working on it. > >> I also proposed some simple but necessary cleanups for Zodiac in Pharo 7: >> >> 3. Proper categorization in Zodiac-Tests package >> - to use "test" category instead of "testing" and better group the tests written >> >> https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/355/files >> >> Also it looks like the #setUp in Zodiac tests never send a "super setUp". Which >> should be fixed too. > > Hmm, these are more cosmetic changes, I will have a look at them later on. > >> I've noticed that both Zinc/Zodiac are not hosted on STHub. You seem to use your own custom >> hosting server on >> >> http://mc.stfx.eu/Zodiac >> http://mc.stfx.eu/ZincHTTPComponents > > I would not call that a custom hosting solution, it is just Monticello. Note that there are also a copies on StHub. > >> as well as github: >> >> https://github.com/svenvc/zinc >> https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac >> >> If we just merge the changes from 3. into Pharo 7 they may later be overwritten when >> synching also Zodiac again as in 2. > > Yes, that is true. I have to follow upstream. The GitHub versions also lag a bit sometimes. > >> So how can we contribute from community side to both projects? Should I fork >> https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac and send a PR to it so that you can integrate? > > Zinc/Zodiac are integral parts of Pharo that are managed externally. The goal is to simultaneously support many Pharo versions, not just the latest. Most production deploys of Pharo use version 4, 5 or 6, but they still need good HTTP(S) support. That is what I am trying to do. > > The older MC repositories are public, so others can contribute in the proven MC way. I have nothing against git, but I have not yet fully switched, nor do I think that I can if I want to support older Pharo versions. > You can move to git and commit from time to time in smalltalkhub. Or even automatically. Norbert > >> Thanks >> Torsten

Oct. 28, 2017

Re: [Pharo-dev] Zinc and Zodiac - Synching/Contributing

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Torsten, > On 26 Oct 2017, at 19:12, Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de> wrote: > > Hi Sven, > > for Zinc there is a new issue: > > > 1. Zinc is using #asBytesDescription. It should not be used as it is deprecated > > https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/401 This change was applied upstream: === Name: Zinc-HTTP-SvenVanCaekenberghe.470 Author: SvenVanCaekenberghe Time: 28 October 2017, 11:10:06.068769 am UUID: 1d831c82-f918-0d00-9306-5dc70a8677c5 Ancestors: Zinc-HTTP-SvenVanCaekenberghe.469 Follow an API change in Pharo: use #humanReadableSIByteSize instead of #asByteDescription in ZnUtils>>#signalProgress:total: === > there is also > > 2. https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/20557 which is not yet integrated. This is waiting for an integrator, I believe people are working on it. > I also proposed some simple but necessary cleanups for Zodiac in Pharo 7: > > 3. Proper categorization in Zodiac-Tests package > - to use "test" category instead of "testing" and better group the tests written > > https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/355/files > > Also it looks like the #setUp in Zodiac tests never send a "super setUp". Which > should be fixed too. Hmm, these are more cosmetic changes, I will have a look at them later on. > I've noticed that both Zinc/Zodiac are not hosted on STHub. You seem to use your own custom > hosting server on > > http://mc.stfx.eu/Zodiac > http://mc.stfx.eu/ZincHTTPComponents I would not call that a custom hosting solution, it is just Monticello. Note that there are also a copies on StHub. > as well as github: > > https://github.com/svenvc/zinc > https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac > > If we just merge the changes from 3. into Pharo 7 they may later be overwritten when > synching also Zodiac again as in 2. Yes, that is true. I have to follow upstream. The GitHub versions also lag a bit sometimes. > So how can we contribute from community side to both projects? Should I fork > https://github.com/svenvc/zodiac and send a PR to it so that you can integrate? Zinc/Zodiac are integral parts of Pharo that are managed externally. The goal is to simultaneously support many Pharo versions, not just the latest. Most production deploys of Pharo use version 4, 5 or 6, but they still need good HTTP(S) support. That is what I am trying to do. The older MC repositories are public, so others can contribute in the proven MC way. I have nothing against git, but I have not yet fully switched, nor do I think that I can if I want to support older Pharo versions. Sven > Thanks > Torsten

Oct. 28, 2017