June 2016 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

[pharo-project/pharo-core] 0d38cd: 60068

by GitHub

Branch: refs/heads/6.0 Home: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core Commit: 0d38cdebda872a2ab4016524f089ee578b99319e https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core/commit/0d38cdebda872a2ab4016524… Author: Jenkins Build Server <board(a)pharo-project.org> Date: 2016-06-07 (Tue, 07 Jun 2016) Changed paths: M ConfigurationOfCatalog.package/ConfigurationOfCatalog.class/instance/symbolic versions/stable_.st A ConfigurationOfCatalog.package/ConfigurationOfCatalog.class/instance/versions/version014_.st A ConfigurationOfCatalog.package/ConfigurationOfCatalog.class/instance/versions/version015_.st M ConfigurationOfGTInspectorCore.package/ConfigurationOfGTInspectorCore.class/instance/symbolic versions/stable_.st A ConfigurationOfGTInspectorCore.package/ConfigurationOfGTInspectorCore.class/instance/versions/version314_.st R GT-InspectorExtensions-Core.package/extension/CatalogProject/class/gtBasicExample.st M GT-InspectorExtensions-Core.package/extension/GLMPresentation/instance/gtInspectorBrowserIn_.st R ScriptLoader60.package/ScriptLoader.class/instance/pharo - scripts/script60067.st A ScriptLoader60.package/ScriptLoader.class/instance/pharo - scripts/script60068.st R ScriptLoader60.package/ScriptLoader.class/instance/pharo - updates/update60067.st A ScriptLoader60.package/ScriptLoader.class/instance/pharo - updates/update60068.st M ScriptLoader60.package/ScriptLoader.class/instance/public/commentForCurrentUpdate.st A Tool-Catalog.package/CatalogProject.class/class/GT-InspectorExtensions-Core/gtBasicExample.st Log Message: ----------- 60068 18436 update ConfigurationOfGTInspectorCore to latest version https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/18436 18437 update ConfigurationOfCatalog to latest version https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/18437 18377 ConfigurationOfGTEventRecorder is not in sync with the current package versions https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/18377 http://files.pharo.org/image/60/60068.zip

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] Playground and text evaluation printing result default.

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

The #printString of most objects is not valid Pharo syntax, it makes sense to put those into comments, so that the overall syntax of the workspace/playground is maintained and syntax highlighting can operate normally. A result printed as a comment is also easy to select (by double-clicking next to the $" on the inside). All this makes sense for literal programming (assuming that is what you are after). What is the use case for not doing it like that ? Why do you want the comments gone ? > On 07 Jun 2016, at 13:03, Ben Coman <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: > > On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 2:09 PM, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: >> >> >> Le 5/6/16 Ã 23:00, Tudor Girba a Ã©crit : >>> >>> Hi Stef, >>> >>> The quotes appear only when you add the result in the playground. >> >> >> No need to explain I'm not idiot and I know it. >>> >>> The typical use case for this is to keep track of several results. >> >> No need to explain I'm not idiot and I know it. >>> >>> In this situation you do not want to modify the code to not affect the >>> highlighting and this is why it gets in a comment. >> >> This is fun because I never ever needed it. But this is probably what >> everybody else is doing that since this is the default. >> I just write simple code and tests. Indeed I'm not that smart. >> >> But your tools only embedd your scenario and let the other users forced to >> adapt. >> >> Well you do not want but I do. >> I spent my evening removing quotes while writing tests. >> >> What I hate with the GTTools is that you want to teach me how I should work. >> Sorry but good tools do not do that. >> Good tools empower the users and not constraint them. >> >> I work a lot faster when I do not have to remove the wonderful comments or >> when I have to copy and paste. >> This commenting is breaking the flow of efficient people. May be GT team do >> not work write tests in the >> debugger but I do most of the time and I'm forced by the environment to >> remove quotes all over the places. >>> >>> If you want to copy the content without quotes, you can do: >>> Cmd+p -> popup >>> Cmd+c -> selects the current line and copies the text >>> Esc >>> Cmd+v >> >> Sorry but I do not want. >> I just want to print and modify directly. >> 7 keystrokes vs 2 >>> >>> Perhaps we can add another keybinding like Shift+Enter for adding the text >>> without quotes. > > I just had a play with this, and another option might be <ctrl-enter>, > since the <ctrl> key is still selection from doing <ctrl-P> so there > is not much difference in hand movements between <enter> and > <ctrl-enter> > > cheers -ben > >> >> And why not the inverse. >> By default printing is printing and if you want to do something else then >> you have a special binding. > > > >> Now I'm upset with this general attitude (Oh I will teach how you can be a >> nice user) that I will turn them off >> or go and hack my own settings. Still I'm amazingly sad about this state of >> affair. >> All these story about GT is hurting me because of this attitude: we are so >> smart and we thought a lot and we will teach you >> how you should work... and at the end I the end-user has to adapt. >> Look at the Spotter discussions: you looked for the graal and I was just >> telling to you that I cannot find >> simple information such as class refs! >> >> So what saddens me the most is that >> - you pretend to have end-user trying your tools but I have impression >> that they are not real power users >> or this is yourself and it means that you are never exposed to other >> people. >> I can still not use Spotter because the way I put my hand on my >> keyboard. So should change >> - 1 my hands >> - 2 my brain >> - 3 my keyboard >> - 4 do not use the tools? >> - funnily enough if I would not have complain aggressively then it looks >> like we would have the same than before. >> >> Your flow is not mine and I go faster my way but your tools force me to get >> slow. >> I do not have the time to produce a video but I would even if it would give >> a bad press to Pharo. >> I will do a presentation in the rmod team. Because people do not watch >> themselves why acting. >> >> Good tools empower the users not constraint them. >> >> GTTools feel often like an overengineer guitar that would have hampered >> Jimmy Hendrix to do crazy solos. >> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Doru >>> >>> >>> >>>> On Jun 5, 2016, at 10:20 PM, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi >>>> >>>> I would like to know if there is a setting to remove the "" when printing >>>> the result of an expression. >>>> >>>> I know that playground has been thought to help me, but today I watched >>>> myself removing the comments >>>> >>>> code so often that I would like to get a setting because such wrapping of >>>> results is really boring for me. >>>> >>>> I'm spending my time removing them and I start to wonder why they are any >>>> useful. >>>> >>>> I would help me to write fast tests for example in the debugger. >>>> >>>> Stef >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> www.tudorgirba.com >>> www.feenk.com >>> >>> "What we can governs what we wish."

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] [ANN] Ephemeron Support is Ready

by Max Leske

<3 > On 07 Jun 2016, at 11:32, Guille Polito <guillermopolito(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > Hi All, > > Since this morning, in Pharo #60065, Ephemeron support is in the image. Most of the changes are infrastructural, so far transparent for the users. It is important to notice that even while the support is there, it is not enabled by default. Also, this required changes in the virtual machine that are not yet distributed everywhere. For the ones that would like more detail, I invite you to read the following :) > > * On the infrastructure side > - There is support to create Ephemeric classes and load them from monticello > - There is a new finalization mechanism (by default disabled) that will process Ephemerons using a finalization queue. This will avoid scanning collections in look for weak objects to finalize ,as it happens now with the WeakDependent mechanism in WeakArray. > - System-Finalization features two new classes *Ephemeron* and *EphemeronRegistry*. For the ones that want more details on Ephemerons, you can read the associated paper [1], or the class comment of Ephemeron: > > I represent ephemeric key-value objects. Ephemerons are key-value objects (subclasses of Association) with special semantics during garbage collection. My special behavior can resumed as follows: > > - The garbage collection will iterate my instances only if the key is not referenced strongly by another object. > - Then, if no strong references to the key are found, then the values of this ephemeron are hold weakly. > - Otherwise, the values are hold strongly. > > In this implementation, an Ephemeron can hold more than one value, which are all treated in the same manner. This ephemeron instance knows its container, which allows the ephemeron to remove itself from a container (such as a Dictionary) upon finalization. > > !! Example usages > > In general terms, do not use myself directly. Use instead an Ephemeric container like EphemeronRegistry. An Ephemeron registry will guarantee the collection of keys and values of the object inside the Ephemeron. > > Otherwise, if you want to use it, you can create an Ephemeron as any association: > > ephemeron := Ephemeron key: aKey value: aValue. > ephemeron container: aContainer. > > !! Ephemeron Finalization > > When an ephemeron's key is hold strongly just by the ephemeron itself, the Ephemeron will be mourned (finalized). That means that the VM will: > - put the Ephemeron in the mourning queue waiting for the image to take care of mourning > - make the Ephemeron non ephemeric. That is, the ephemeron instance cannot be reused. > > On the image side, the finalization process will send the message #mourn to an Ephemeron. #mourn will #finalize the Ephemeron's key, and remove the Ephemeron from it's container to allow its collection during a subsequent garbage collection. > > !! More Documentation > > You can read the associated paper to understand better the semantics of ephemerons: > > [1]Ephemerons: A New Finalization Mechanism. Barry Hayes. OOPSLA '97 > > > - WARNING: to be able to use ephemerons, you need to use the *latestVm* that has several fixes for making ephemerons work, and you need to enable ephemerons on the image side by evaluating: > > Smalltalk supportsQueueingFinalization: true. > > - With latest vm and ephemerons enabled, tests should be green, otherwise they are skipped > > <PharoScreenshot.1.png> > > * From the user point of view: > > - The Weak registries were not yet migrated to the new finalization mechanism. > - We expect nothing will change from the user point of view. Just less memory leaks. > > * Next steps (in order) > 1) Bless the latest vm as stable > 2) Enable queueing finalization by default > 3) Replace Weak Registry by Ephemeron Registry. > > > Informed by: Guille

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut

by Guille Polito

For coherence, the vast majority of shortcuts should follow the standard in all applications. Most shortcuts use cmd in mac, and ctrl in unix/win. Then there are exceptions of course. I'd like exceptions to be that, exceptions, and well documented. I'm not against using #alt for particular cases (for example, it is often used in windows/linux for menu navigation). Also, I'd like shortcuts that are meant to be used with #alt to use #alt and not #command. Because #command means the windows key in windows. That said, If the problem are shortcut conflicts, I think it would be nice at some moment to make a step back, look at the big picture and design shortcuts for the entire system instead of patching place over place :). Guille -------- Original Message -------- > > > 2016-06-07 16:12 GMT+02:00 Andrei Chis <chisvasileandrei(a)gmail.com > <mailto:chisvasileandrei@gmail.com>>: > > We can, but I remember there were some discussions and it was > decided to use meta everywhere. > > > > but using meta everywhere does not help if there are conflicts with > other shortcuts. > > > Cheers, > Andrei > > On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 3:49 PM, Nicolai Hess > <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com <mailto:nicolaihess@gmail.com>> wrote: > > > > 2016-06-07 15:08 GMT+02:00 Andrei Chis > <chisvasileandrei(a)gmail.com <mailto:chisvasileandrei@gmail.com>>: > > During Pharo 5 most shortcuts from tools were changed to > use "meta" instead of cmd. > > Cheers, > Andrei > > > Can we change this for spotter ? cmd instead of meta > > ctrl left/right is often used for text components to move to > next/previous word. > > > On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 2:18 PM, Nicolai Hess > <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com <mailto:nicolaihess@gmail.com>> wrote: > > > > 2016-06-07 13:57 GMT+02:00 Nicolai Hess > <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com <mailto:nicolaihess@gmail.com>>: > > > Am 07.06.2016 1:56 nachm. schrieb "Henrik > Nergaard" <henrik.nergaard(a)uia.no > <mailto:henrik.nergaard@uia.no>>: > > > > IIRC the shortcut is not changed, it still is > meta+right(+shift). Only the tooltip was changed > to display the system specific key instead of > âcmdâ so for Windows/Linux this would be âctrlâ. > > No, it changed > > In #40624, for example, it was cmd (alt-key on windows > ) right/shift right > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Henrik > > > > > > > > From: Pharo-dev > [mailto:pharo-dev-bounces@lists.pharo.org > <mailto:pharo-dev-bounces@lists.pharo.org>] On > Behalf Of Nicolai Hess > > Sent: Tuesday, June 7, 2016 12:56 PM > > To: Pharo Development List > <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org > <mailto:pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org>> > > Subject: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut > > > > > > > > Why did the shortcut for dive-in > element/category changed from > > > > cmd+right > > > > cmd+shift+right > > > > to > > > > ctrl+right > > ctrl+shift+right > > > > I know there were some discussions about this > and that the behavior changed some > > > > time ago, but I don't know the rational behind this. > > > > thanks > > > > nicolai > > > > > > > > > >

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut

by Nicolai Hess

2016-06-07 16:12 GMT+02:00 Andrei Chis <chisvasileandrei(a)gmail.com>: > We can, but I remember there were some discussions and it was decided to > use meta everywhere. > but using meta everywhere does not help if there are conflicts with other shortcuts. > > Cheers, > Andrei > > On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 3:49 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >> >> >> 2016-06-07 15:08 GMT+02:00 Andrei Chis <chisvasileandrei(a)gmail.com>: >> >>> During Pharo 5 most shortcuts from tools were changed to use "meta" >>> instead of cmd. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Andrei >>> >> >> Can we change this for spotter ? cmd instead of meta >> >> ctrl left/right is often used for text components to move to >> next/previous word. >> >> >> >>> >>> On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 2:18 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> 2016-06-07 13:57 GMT+02:00 Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com>: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Am 07.06.2016 1:56 nachm. schrieb "Henrik Nergaard" < >>>>> henrik.nergaard(a)uia.no>: >>>>> > >>>>> > IIRC the shortcut is not changed, it still is meta+right(+shift). >>>>> Only the tooltip was changed to display the system specific key instead of >>>>> âcmdâ so for Windows/Linux this would be âctrlâ. >>>>> >>>>> No, it changed >>>>> >>>> In #40624, for example, it was cmd (alt-key on windows ) right/shift >>>> right >>>> >>>> >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > Best regards, >>>>> > >>>>> > Henrik >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-bounces@lists.pharo.org] On >>>>> Behalf Of Nicolai Hess >>>>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 7, 2016 12:56 PM >>>>> > To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> >>>>> > Subject: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > Why did the shortcut for dive-in element/category changed from >>>>> > >>>>> > cmd+right >>>>> > >>>>> > cmd+shift+right >>>>> > >>>>> > to >>>>> > >>>>> > ctrl+right >>>>> > ctrl+shift+right >>>>> > >>>>> > I know there were some discussions about this and that the behavior >>>>> changed some >>>>> > >>>>> > time ago, but I don't know the rational behind this. >>>>> > >>>>> > thanks >>>>> > >>>>> > nicolai >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut

by Andrei Chis

We can, but I remember there were some discussions and it was decided to use meta everywhere. Cheers, Andrei On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 3:49 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > 2016-06-07 15:08 GMT+02:00 Andrei Chis <chisvasileandrei(a)gmail.com>: > >> During Pharo 5 most shortcuts from tools were changed to use "meta" >> instead of cmd. >> >> Cheers, >> Andrei >> > > Can we change this for spotter ? cmd instead of meta > > ctrl left/right is often used for text components to move to next/previous > word. > > > >> >> On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 2:18 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> 2016-06-07 13:57 GMT+02:00 Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com>: >>> >>>> >>>> Am 07.06.2016 1:56 nachm. schrieb "Henrik Nergaard" < >>>> henrik.nergaard(a)uia.no>: >>>> > >>>> > IIRC the shortcut is not changed, it still is meta+right(+shift). >>>> Only the tooltip was changed to display the system specific key instead of >>>> âcmdâ so for Windows/Linux this would be âctrlâ. >>>> >>>> No, it changed >>>> >>> In #40624, for example, it was cmd (alt-key on windows ) right/shift >>> right >>> >>> >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > Best regards, >>>> > >>>> > Henrik >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-bounces@lists.pharo.org] On Behalf >>>> Of Nicolai Hess >>>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 7, 2016 12:56 PM >>>> > To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> >>>> > Subject: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > Why did the shortcut for dive-in element/category changed from >>>> > >>>> > cmd+right >>>> > >>>> > cmd+shift+right >>>> > >>>> > to >>>> > >>>> > ctrl+right >>>> > ctrl+shift+right >>>> > >>>> > I know there were some discussions about this and that the behavior >>>> changed some >>>> > >>>> > time ago, but I don't know the rational behind this. >>>> > >>>> > thanks >>>> > >>>> > nicolai >>>> > >>>> > >>>> >>> >>> >> >

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut

by Nicolai Hess

2016-06-07 15:08 GMT+02:00 Andrei Chis <chisvasileandrei(a)gmail.com>: > During Pharo 5 most shortcuts from tools were changed to use "meta" > instead of cmd. > > Cheers, > Andrei > Can we change this for spotter ? cmd instead of meta ctrl left/right is often used for text components to move to next/previous word. > > On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 2:18 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > >> >> >> 2016-06-07 13:57 GMT+02:00 Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com>: >> >>> >>> Am 07.06.2016 1:56 nachm. schrieb "Henrik Nergaard" < >>> henrik.nergaard(a)uia.no>: >>> > >>> > IIRC the shortcut is not changed, it still is meta+right(+shift). Only >>> the tooltip was changed to display the system specific key instead of âcmdâ >>> so for Windows/Linux this would be âctrlâ. >>> >>> No, it changed >>> >> In #40624, for example, it was cmd (alt-key on windows ) right/shift right >> >> >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > Best regards, >>> > >>> > Henrik >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-bounces@lists.pharo.org] On Behalf >>> Of Nicolai Hess >>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 7, 2016 12:56 PM >>> > To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> >>> > Subject: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > Why did the shortcut for dive-in element/category changed from >>> > >>> > cmd+right >>> > >>> > cmd+shift+right >>> > >>> > to >>> > >>> > ctrl+right >>> > ctrl+shift+right >>> > >>> > I know there were some discussions about this and that the behavior >>> changed some >>> > >>> > time ago, but I don't know the rational behind this. >>> > >>> > thanks >>> > >>> > nicolai >>> > >>> > >>> >> >> >

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut

by Andrei Chis

During Pharo 5 most shortcuts from tools were changed to use "meta" instead of cmd. Cheers, Andrei On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 2:18 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > 2016-06-07 13:57 GMT+02:00 Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com>: > >> >> Am 07.06.2016 1:56 nachm. schrieb "Henrik Nergaard" < >> henrik.nergaard(a)uia.no>: >> > >> > IIRC the shortcut is not changed, it still is meta+right(+shift). Only >> the tooltip was changed to display the system specific key instead of âcmdâ >> so for Windows/Linux this would be âctrlâ. >> >> No, it changed >> > In #40624, for example, it was cmd (alt-key on windows ) right/shift right > > >> > >> > >> > >> > Best regards, >> > >> > Henrik >> > >> > >> > >> > From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-bounces@lists.pharo.org] On Behalf >> Of Nicolai Hess >> > Sent: Tuesday, June 7, 2016 12:56 PM >> > To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> >> > Subject: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut >> > >> > >> > >> > Why did the shortcut for dive-in element/category changed from >> > >> > cmd+right >> > >> > cmd+shift+right >> > >> > to >> > >> > ctrl+right >> > ctrl+shift+right >> > >> > I know there were some discussions about this and that the behavior >> changed some >> > >> > time ago, but I don't know the rational behind this. >> > >> > thanks >> > >> > nicolai >> > >> > >> > >

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] GLMPresentation >> window looks strange

by Denis Kudriashov

And this is not only place. I saw it is common approach to get view from GL presentation. And it makes code analysis so hard. 2016-06-07 10:54 GMT+02:00 Guille Polito <guillermopolito(a)gmail.com>: > Hi! > > We were browsing with Steph users of #announce: and we arrived to the > following method: > > GLMPresentation >> window > self announce: (GLMWindowRequest new > action: [ :aWindow | ^ aWindow ]). > ^ nil > > And we could not stop noticing that, while the announcement, probably > originally meant to decouple the Presentation and the window, is now > coupling them in a non-clear way... I mean, the coupling is there, but is > now hidden in an announcement. > > Also, the usage of the non-local return makes the assumption that the > announcement will be executed on the same process... And that is at most > strange, but also looks buggy. > > Why is this method not a normal accessor? > > Guille > >

June 7, 2016

Re: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut

by Nicolai Hess

2016-06-07 13:57 GMT+02:00 Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)gmail.com>: > > Am 07.06.2016 1:56 nachm. schrieb "Henrik Nergaard" < > henrik.nergaard(a)uia.no>: > > > > IIRC the shortcut is not changed, it still is meta+right(+shift). Only > the tooltip was changed to display the system specific key instead of âcmdâ > so for Windows/Linux this would be âctrlâ. > > No, it changed > In #40624, for example, it was cmd (alt-key on windows ) right/shift right > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Henrik > > > > > > > > From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-bounces@lists.pharo.org] On Behalf Of > Nicolai Hess > > Sent: Tuesday, June 7, 2016 12:56 PM > > To: Pharo Development List <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> > > Subject: [Pharo-dev] GT-Spotter dive in shortcut > > > > > > > > Why did the shortcut for dive-in element/category changed from > > > > cmd+right > > > > cmd+shift+right > > > > to > > > > ctrl+right > > ctrl+shift+right > > > > I know there were some discussions about this and that the behavior > changed some > > > > time ago, but I don't know the rational behind this. > > > > thanks > > > > nicolai > > > > >

June 7, 2016