June 2014 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Smalltalker wanted ! Job opening for Cincom ChannelStream

by stepharo

Hi guys this may help some of you. Apparently some people do not realize that they may find smalltalkers in this mailing-list but I'm happy that they are looking for somebody. Stef Begin forwarded message: From: "Nowak, Helge" <HNowak(a)cincom.com> Subject: [vwnc] Smalltalker wanted ! Job opening for Cincom ChannelStream Date: 11 Jun 2014 15:46:13 GMT+2 To: VW NC <vwnc(a)cs.uiuc.edu> Dear Smalltalkers! Weâre hiring! Cincom is looking for an experienced Smalltalker, a SOFTWARE ENGINEER. Our new colleague shall strengthen the development team for our document output product Cincom ChannelStream (developed in Cincom Smalltalk). Applications are accepted until the position is filled. Â· English: http://documentoutput.cincom.com/software-engineer-cincom-channelstream/ Â· French:http://documentoutput.cincom.fr/2014/06/opportunite-software-engineer-cincom-channelstream/ Cheers Helge P. S. wonder what ChannelStream is? Itâs Document Output Made Simple! Look here: http://documentoutput.cincom.com/

June 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] pharo-contribution ci dead?

by Yuriy Tymchuk

thank you! On 12 Jun 2014, at 17:55, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > On 12 Jun 2014, at 17:43, Yuriy Tymchuk <yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com> wrote: > >> Hi guys, does anybody know about what is happening with pharo-contribution jenkins? I mean, it definitely looks dead, but are there any expectations for recoverage? >> > > strangeâ¦ I have restarted it. > > Marcus

June 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] news from block :)

by Esteban Lorenzano

On 12 Jun 2014, at 12:53, Marcus Denker <marcus.denker(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > On 12 Jun 2014, at 16:06, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: > >>> I like the idea. The current Morph classes are too big. It is >>> difficult to understand them and to find out how to work with them >>> "the right way" (event handling for example or layouting). >>> >>> Can you describe something more about the design. Or is the design >>> a work in progress. >>> >>> Please, I hope the "properties"-Dictionary is only a left over for >>> Morphic compatibility. I never understood why these are >>> used instead of proper selector and objects representing actual >>> properties. >>> >> For some objects you need a hashtable-based object because you may need a property that >> does not make sense all the time or just for some kinds of objects. >> So the extension is not a bad idea per se but we should pay attention. >> > > The PropertySlots will be interesting for thisâ¦ the real negative point of properties as used > in Morhpic is that they do not need to be declared. With property slots, you get the same > memory efficiency, but you are forced to declare that a proper is used. Yeah, but I would not inflate the base morph with something that I might or might not use. I would use a hierarchy instead. Esteban > > Marcus > >

June 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] pharo-contribution ci dead?

by Marcus Denker

On 12 Jun 2014, at 17:43, Yuriy Tymchuk <yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com> wrote: > Hi guys, does anybody know about what is happening with pharo-contribution jenkins? I mean, it definitely looks dead, but are there any expectations for recoverage? > strangeâ¦ I have restarted it. Marcus

June 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] news from block :)

by Marcus Denker

On 12 Jun 2014, at 16:06, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: >> I like the idea. The current Morph classes are too big. It is >> difficult to understand them and to find out how to work with them >> "the right way" (event handling for example or layouting). >> >> Can you describe something more about the design. Or is the design >> a work in progress. >> >> Please, I hope the "properties"-Dictionary is only a left over for >> Morphic compatibility. I never understood why these are >> used instead of proper selector and objects representing actual >> properties. >> > For some objects you need a hashtable-based object because you may need a property that > does not make sense all the time or just for some kinds of objects. > So the extension is not a bad idea per se but we should pay attention. > The PropertySlots will be interesting for thisâ¦ the real negative point of properties as used in Morhpic is that they do not need to be declared. With property slots, you get the same memory efficiency, but you are forced to declare that a proper is used. Marcus

June 12, 2014

pharo-contribution ci dead?

by Yuriy Tymchuk

Hi guys, does anybody know about what is happening with pharo-contribution jenkins? I mean, it definitely looks dead, but are there any expectations for recoverage?

June 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] news from block :)

by stepharo

On 11/6/14 22:33, kilon alios wrote: > well if you keep the overall design of morphic or even improve it. I > have no complain and you have my full support. I thought that you > wanted to remove Morphic and make Spec the standard design for Pharo. > I know what neither Athens or Roassal is a replacement for Morphic. you confuse layers. Athens is an API to draw on a screen. Morphic is a graphics framework. Spec is a ui builder to compose widgets out of smaller widgets. > I remember once I took a look at TreeMorph and I was shaking my head > with sadness, it was really bad :D So yes Morphic is very messy. TreeMorph is just a widget that grows organically. > I also don't claim, just for the record, that the above libraries are > not very useful and that I am not happy that are around and I can use > them. I really appreciate people hard work and I am definitely try to > learn as much as my limited free time allows me to. > > Maybe if you sit down and build a roadmap on the direction you want to > go as a community on the GUI front this will help people contribute as > it will set a clear goal for them. > > > On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 11:25 PM, Esteban Lorenzano > <estebanlm(a)gmail.com <mailto:estebanlm@gmail.com>> wrote: > > > On 11 Jun 2014, at 17:15, kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com > <mailto:kilon.alios@gmail.com>> wrote: > >> Yes personally I really like the overall design of a morph >> embedding nice and easily inside another morph and everything >> made up of morphs. I like the idea of hand , world , etc. >> >> I try to like Spec, but it looks to me quite confusing, I tried >> to follow the tutorial but I cant understand its design and why >> so many methods are needed to setup a spec widget. I also dislike >> the use or pragmas. I will continue learning it but I don't >> prefer it over Morphic for now. AFAIK apart from Spec and >> Morphic there is no other choice. > > Spec is not an alternative to Morphic, is a superset (a way to > nicely build widget components). > So apart from *Morphic*, you do not have any other choice :) > >> >> I also have hard time understanding Roassal and Athens. With >> Morphic its hard at times to figure out whats going on but at >> least it took very little time to understand the overall design. > > Same here. None of them are replacementsâ¦ is a framework for > visualisations (in the case of Roassal) and a framework for > drawing (in case of Athens). One is on top of Morphic and the > other is below it (you can do morphs that are drawn with Athens). > >> >> I don't have a problem with Pharo abandoning Morphic. Afterally >> you all use Pharo far more than I do. I will continue learning >> Spec, Roassal and Athens. But for me Morphic is the most >> beautiful Graphics API I have ever worked with. > > We are not moving out from Morphic any time soon. > Also, moving from an implementation of Morphic does not means we > are going to refuse his general design or all the cool experience > we accumulated in the time. > Think on morphic and block like with Battlestar Galactica from > 1978 and 2003: Same general design, but a complete âre-imaginedâ > taking with us all we learned in the mean time :) > >> >> >> On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 10:55 PM, Esteban Lorenzano >> <estebanlm(a)gmail.com <mailto:estebanlm@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> >> On 11 Jun 2014, at 16:39, kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com >> <mailto:kilon.alios@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >>> excellent news. I really believe in Morphic and I really >>> like its general design. If you we can clean the mud I am >>> sure we will discover quite a diamond underneath. Thanks. >> >> which general design? the pattern in which is based? thatâs >> not enough to keep it :) >> Sorry but there is no easy/efficient way to clean it. >> The only way to clean Morphic is to reimplement it. >> Clean it is just too much workâ¦ and too many design decisions >> where made that time and patches made them obsolete or not >> correct. >> Not to talk about the mix of concepts (bah, the no existence >> of separation between them). >> >> Block is not a clean. Is a revamp. >> >> No offence intended to Morphic: no matter how good was at the >> beginning, *every* system evolves up to a point the effort >> required to maintain it is superior to the effort required to >> reimplement it (with all the experience as a superior step). >> (yeah, yeahâ¦ a lot of people will disagree. But time has >> proven me rightâ¦ and will continue doing it :P) >> >> Esteban >> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 10:25 PM, FranÃ§ois Stephany >>> <tulipe.moutarde(a)gmail.com >>> <mailto:tulipe.moutarde@gmail.com>> wrote: >>> >>> \o/ >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 4:23 PM, Camille Teruel >>> <camille.teruel(a)gmail.com >>> <mailto:camille.teruel@gmail.com>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> On 11 juin 2014, at 15:31, FranÃ§ois Stephany >>> <tulipe.moutarde(a)gmail.com >>> <mailto:tulipe.moutarde@gmail.com>> wrote: >>> >>>> What is bloc ? >>>> I've searched in the pharo-dev list but couldn't >>>> find it :/ >>> >>> A Morphic clean/revamp lead by Alain and Stef. >>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, Jun 11, 2014 at 2:26 PM, stepharo >>>> <stepharo(a)free.fr <mailto:stepharo@free.fr>> wrote: >>>> >>>> looks so exciting... >>>> >>>> From: Alain Plantec >>>> <alain.plantec(a)univ-brest.fr >>>> <mailto:alain.plantec@univ-brest.fr>> >>>> Subject: Bloc news >>>> Date: 11 Jun 2014 14:10:29 GMT+2 >>>> To: StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr >>>> <mailto:stephane.ducasse@inria.fr>> >>>> Cc: Alain Plantec <alain.plantec(a)univ-brest.fr >>>> <mailto:alain.plantec@univ-brest.fr>> >>>> >>>> Name: Bloc-Core-AlainPlantec.15 >>>> Author: AlainPlantec >>>> Time: 11 June 2014, 2:07:16.813171 pm >>>> UUID: d58ae82e-b5dd-41d9-bc31-a48c3e9e5cf1 >>>> Ancestors: Bloc-Core-AlainPlantec.14 >>>> >>>> - BlMorphs manage their submorphs with local >>>> coordinate. >>>> - Drawing and drag&drop has been adapted to >>>> local coordinate >>>> - Consequence: TransformationMorph should not >>>> be useful anymore because each morph has its >>>> own transform (not only TransformationMorph). >>>> Each morph uses its own transform to declare >>>> changed portions of its bounds and to draw its >>>> submorphs. >>>> - The world is no more a special morph: >>>> - the hand is owned by the space >>>> - the canvas and the display/redisplay of >>>> morphs are space responsibilities. >>>> This open the door to several worlds per space. >>>> >>>> Now the current global redrawing mechanism >>>> efficiency is not obvious. >>>> Next actions: >>>> - try to localize as much as possible the >>>> redrawing of morphs, >>>> - dig several Worlds for a space >>>> - start to comment and write a separate >>>> documentation with the help of Stephane :) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > >

June 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] news from block :)

by stepharo

> Same here. None of them are replacementsâ¦ is a framework for > visualisations (in the case of Roassal) and a framework for drawing > (in case of Athens). One is on top of Morphic and the other is below > it (you can do morphs that are drawn with Athens). In the future Bloc will use Athens to display Blocs :) >> I don't have a problem with Pharo abandoning Morphic. Afterally you >> all use Pharo far more than I do. I will continue learning Spec, >> Roassal and Athens. But for me Morphic is the most beautiful Graphics >> API I have ever worked with. > > We are not moving out from Morphic any time soon. > Also, moving from an implementation of Morphic does not means we are > going to refuse his general design or all the cool experience we > accumulated in the time. > Think on morphic and block like with Battlestar Galactica from 1978 > and 2003: Same general design, but a complete âre-imaginedâ taking > with us all we learned in the mean time :) Exactly :)

June 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] news from block :)

by stepharo

> I like the idea. The current Morph classes are too big. It is > difficult to understand them and to find out how to work with them > "the right way" (event handling for example or layouting). > > Can you describe something more about the design. Or is the design > a work in progress. > > Please, I hope the "properties"-Dictionary is only a left over for > Morphic compatibility. I never understood why these are > used instead of proper selector and objects representing actual > properties. > For some objects you need a hashtable-based object because you may need a property that does not make sense all the time or just for some kinds of objects. So the extension is not a bad idea per se but we should pay attention. Stef

June 12, 2014

[pharo-project/pharo-core]

by GitHub

Branch: refs/tags/40021 Home: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core

June 12, 2014