March 2014 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

[pharo-project/pharo-core]

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Branch: refs/tags/30805 Home: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Inspiration] Toward a better programming

by kilon alios

The last part of my post is opinion yes. My opinion is that visual coding will slowly and steadily penetrate other markets as its has for music and Computer Graphics. Its not a fact, nor I have experience with other sectors to offer a solid opinion on them. Its more like a logical conclusion. I could be wrong but I seriously doubt it. The first part are facts that I have collected with over a decade of personal experience with these fields. Its not that hard to prove just go to youtube and search for coding articles for python or other script languages for 3d apps vs node setups on the same apps. Nodes are actually new to 3d apps, when I first starting using 3d studio max in 2000 there was no nodes back then but there was a C API and Maxscript. Nowdays nodes are heavily used. Reactor has been a dominant tool since 1996 for musicians. If you are musicians that wants to create highly modular audio setups then Reactor and MAX/MSP are 2 most popular choices. This is not a thing I created our of my head and you can ask around for confirmation to my claims. You can ask those people if they find text easier to handle than nodes. So yes I made an opinion with assumptions but I have based it on facts and personal experience. But then in the end it comes down to personal taste. On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 11:51 AM, Sergi Reyner <sergi.reyner(a)gmail.com>wrote: > 2014-03-31 9:26 GMT+01:00 kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com>: > > artist in both sides , music and 3d graphics prefer foremost node setups. >> > > Who? Sources? > > >> Text based coding has prevailed because early computer could not handle >> graphics well. >> > > IÂ´m sure that the fact that text is easily manipulable has had more to do > with it. But I have no sources right now to back up my assertion. > > There is definitely a recent shift to more visual coding and I doubt that >> text code is doing anything else than slowly shrinking in significance. >> > > Where? By who? Shrinking? Sources, please. > > Not that text coding cannot do this, but people associating with it, tend >> to not be designers and you need designers to improve workflow at least on >> the user level. >> > > Are there statistics? > > Languages also will play a less significant role seeing the appearance of >> more and more specialized tools like it has already happened in music and >> 3d industry. >> > > Two sectors out of who knows how many. > > Cheers, > Sergi > > PS: IÂ´m not yelling at you, I just think that you made a lot of > affirmations based on opinion rather than facts. >

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Inspiration] Toward a better programming

by Sergi Reyner

2014-03-31 9:26 GMT+01:00 kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com>: > artist in both sides , music and 3d graphics prefer foremost node setups. > Who? Sources? > Text based coding has prevailed because early computer could not handle > graphics well. > IÂ´m sure that the fact that text is easily manipulable has had more to do with it. But I have no sources right now to back up my assertion. There is definitely a recent shift to more visual coding and I doubt that > text code is doing anything else than slowly shrinking in significance. > Where? By who? Shrinking? Sources, please. Not that text coding cannot do this, but people associating with it, tend > to not be designers and you need designers to improve workflow at least on > the user level. > Are there statistics? Languages also will play a less significant role seeing the appearance of > more and more specialized tools like it has already happened in music and > 3d industry. > Two sectors out of who knows how many. Cheers, Sergi PS: IÂ´m not yelling at you, I just think that you made a lot of affirmations based on opinion rather than facts.

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Inspiration] Toward a better programming

by phil＠highoctane.be

This is mostly for given verticals. Same as sound, with Guitar Rig or Ableton https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMP8onefhoQ But yes, it is cooler to work with the blocks than with code. Now, you need the code to do the block. Phil On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 10:26 AM, kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> wrote: > It has already happened , and there 2 rather huge commercial examples > > a) Native Instrument's Reaktor -> > http://www.native-instruments.com/en/products/komplete/synths-samplers/reak… > > b) Softimage ICE -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=do1kzR6gVYk > > And those are not your everyday examples. Reaktor is THE modular audio > synthesis environment , by far the most popular. With its close competitor > being MAX/MSP. > > Softimage on the other hand has been the dominant 3d app for 80s and 90s > movies,but even for other 3d apps node setups are a must have. Though all > 3d apps come with python APIs and python having a reputation of being very > much liked by people new to coding, artist in both sides , music and 3d > graphics prefer foremost node setups. For example Houdini a very popular 3d > app has full integration with nodes , anything the user can make can be > controlled by nodes. > > Generally speaking I am not a big fan of the infinite "cannot". There is > no way to predict something unless you seriously try it. But in the end any > problem can be overcome. Text based coding has prevailed because early > computer could not handle graphics well. There is definitely a recent shift > to more visual coding and I doubt that text code is doing anything else > than slowly shrinking in significance. The way I see it, text coding has > become less and less managable , visual coding offers really good > alternative managing very complex structures being closely tied to the GUI. > Not that text coding cannot do this, but people associating with it, tend > to not be designers and you need designers to improve workflow at least on > the user level. > > Languages also will play a less significant role seeing the appearance of > more and more specialized tools like it has already happened in music and > 3d industry. > > > > On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 7:40 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> >> >> >> On 29 March 2014 18:35, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Sure he is repeating things. And sure he is reinventing half of what we >>> already have. >>> >>> However, he is likely to get more traction because he reinvents the UI, >>> not the core concepts. You could say it is not an essential contribution. >>> But, it is. >>> >>> >> The general misconception is that visual manipulation with objects can >> fully replace the coding. It won't and never will. Except from very simple >> cases (like computing the average :) >> You can try to visually express things like branching, conditional loops, >> common programming patterns, but i doubt you will find it convenient to >> program it in "visual" way rather than coding. >> >> >>> Doru >>> >>> >>> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 6:28 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com>wrote: >>> >>>> Sure, guy just repeating almost same thesis as in the original Self >>>> demo dated back in '95, >>>> "direct manipulation with objects errr.. data".. >>>> except that now in crappy web-based environment.. and still missing the >>>> point.. >>>> because it is not about data, it is about objects. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 29 March 2014 18:20, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Beautiful demo. This should be our game, yet others are playing it :(. >>>>> >>>>> Doru >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 11:31 AM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu>wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 29 Mar 2014, at 10:38, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> > This is a nice write down: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> http://www.chris-granger.com/2014/03/27/toward-a-better-programming/ >>>>>> > >>>>>> > with a nice demo of a prototype: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6iUm_Cqx2s >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Luckily, the horrible C++ code computing standard deviation in the >>>>>> article can be written quite elegantly and directly in Pharo: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > | input | >>>>>> > input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). >>>>>> > (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sort. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Sven >>>>>> >>>>>> Damn spelling correction ;-) >>>>>> >>>>>> | input | >>>>>> input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). >>>>>> (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sqrt. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>>> >>>>> "Every thing has its own flow" >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Best regards, >>>> Igor Stasenko. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> www.tudorgirba.com >>> >>> "Every thing has its own flow" >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Best regards, >> Igor Stasenko. >> > >

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Inspiration] Toward a better programming

by kilon alios

It has already happened , and there 2 rather huge commercial examples a) Native Instrument's Reaktor -> http://www.native-instruments.com/en/products/komplete/synths-samplers/reak… b) Softimage ICE -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=do1kzR6gVYk And those are not your everyday examples. Reaktor is THE modular audio synthesis environment , by far the most popular. With its close competitor being MAX/MSP. Softimage on the other hand has been the dominant 3d app for 80s and 90s movies,but even for other 3d apps node setups are a must have. Though all 3d apps come with python APIs and python having a reputation of being very much liked by people new to coding, artist in both sides , music and 3d graphics prefer foremost node setups. For example Houdini a very popular 3d app has full integration with nodes , anything the user can make can be controlled by nodes. Generally speaking I am not a big fan of the infinite "cannot". There is no way to predict something unless you seriously try it. But in the end any problem can be overcome. Text based coding has prevailed because early computer could not handle graphics well. There is definitely a recent shift to more visual coding and I doubt that text code is doing anything else than slowly shrinking in significance. The way I see it, text coding has become less and less managable , visual coding offers really good alternative managing very complex structures being closely tied to the GUI. Not that text coding cannot do this, but people associating with it, tend to not be designers and you need designers to improve workflow at least on the user level. Languages also will play a less significant role seeing the appearance of more and more specialized tools like it has already happened in music and 3d industry. On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 7:40 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On 29 March 2014 18:35, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Sure he is repeating things. And sure he is reinventing half of what we >> already have. >> >> However, he is likely to get more traction because he reinvents the UI, >> not the core concepts. You could say it is not an essential contribution. >> But, it is. >> >> > The general misconception is that visual manipulation with objects can > fully replace the coding. It won't and never will. Except from very simple > cases (like computing the average :) > You can try to visually express things like branching, conditional loops, > common programming patterns, but i doubt you will find it convenient to > program it in "visual" way rather than coding. > > >> Doru >> >> >> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 6:28 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com>wrote: >> >>> Sure, guy just repeating almost same thesis as in the original Self demo >>> dated back in '95, >>> "direct manipulation with objects errr.. data".. >>> except that now in crappy web-based environment.. and still missing the >>> point.. >>> because it is not about data, it is about objects. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 29 March 2014 18:20, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Beautiful demo. This should be our game, yet others are playing it :(. >>>> >>>> Doru >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 11:31 AM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu>wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 29 Mar 2014, at 10:38, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> > This is a nice write down: >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> http://www.chris-granger.com/2014/03/27/toward-a-better-programming/ >>>>> > >>>>> > with a nice demo of a prototype: >>>>> > >>>>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6iUm_Cqx2s >>>>> > >>>>> > Luckily, the horrible C++ code computing standard deviation in the >>>>> article can be written quite elegantly and directly in Pharo: >>>>> > >>>>> > | input | >>>>> > input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). >>>>> > (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sort. >>>>> > >>>>> > Sven >>>>> >>>>> Damn spelling correction ;-) >>>>> >>>>> | input | >>>>> input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). >>>>> (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sqrt. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> www.tudorgirba.com >>>> >>>> "Every thing has its own flow" >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Best regards, >>> Igor Stasenko. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> >> "Every thing has its own flow" >> > > > > -- > Best regards, > Igor Stasenko. >

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Inspiration] Toward a better programming

by phil＠highoctane.be

Impressive. Now, let's get back to our work, as "what matters in the end is what people choose to do." And we'll for sure still learn a lot making Pharo a great platform (we do not have Wolfram's 700 individuals engineering force). I'd vote for a Pharo integration like they show for Python and Java. Who knows someone over there? Phil On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 6:21 AM, S Krish <krishnamachari.sudhakar(a)gmail.com>wrote: > > How about impact of this: > > > http://blog.stephenwolfram.com/2014/03/injecting-computation-everywhere-a-s… > > I would agree it is quite complex for any beginner, but utility of a > programming language on these lines seems cut out for the future.. > > > > > On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 6:56 AM, Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com > > wrote: > >> I cannot resist to jump on this. Indeed, we have the moral obligation to >> promote what we have crafted over the year. >> Producing a high-quality video has been on my todo list for quite some >> times already. As you probably know, we did some intent already (videos >> about Roassal, GraphET, and other tools), but we were too young maybe. >> >> Within the next few weeks we will work on a cool video to promote >> Roassal2, and our goal is to reach users beyond the Smalltalk boundary. We >> have everything so far. The moose distribution is a wonderful toolbox that >> can literally blow away any example shown in this video. >> >> As you may have seen, we have worked on Roassal2 which includes a new >> geographical map builder, tabular table importer, GraphET2, fancy curves, >> html and amber exporter. A video carefully orchestrated has the potential >> to kick away Aurora, Light Table, Wolfram and all their friends. >> >> We will soon get there... >> >> Alexandre >> >> >> On Mar 29, 2014, at 2:20 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: >> >> > Beautiful demo. This should be our game, yet others are playing it :(. >> > >> > Doru >> > >> > >> > On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 11:31 AM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> >> wrote: >> > >> > On 29 Mar 2014, at 10:38, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >> > >> > > This is a nice write down: >> > > >> > > http://www.chris-granger.com/2014/03/27/toward-a-better-programming/ >> > > >> > > with a nice demo of a prototype: >> > > >> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6iUm_Cqx2s >> > > >> > > Luckily, the horrible C++ code computing standard deviation in the >> article can be written quite elegantly and directly in Pharo: >> > > >> > > | input | >> > > input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). >> > > (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sort. >> > > >> > > Sven >> > >> > Damn spelling correction ;-) >> > >> > | input | >> > input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). >> > (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sqrt. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > www.tudorgirba.com >> > >> > "Every thing has its own flow" >> >> -- >> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >> >> >> >> >> >

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Roassal 3D empty windows

by phil＠highoctane.be

We can for sure arrange something for you to have access to my machine for tests (via Teamviewer for example) so that you can have a look. Phil On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 3:36 AM, Ronie Salgado <roniesalg(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Sorry for no replying. > > That actually seems to be a shader bug in Roassal3D. I don't have a > machine with a new NVIDIA card for testing, but it seems that I have to add > a more flexible shader loading system that checks for the current hardware > and selects an appropriate shader for it. > > Greetings, > Ronie > > > 2014-03-30 18:04 GMT-03:00 phil(a)highoctane.be <phil(a)highoctane.be>: > >> Well, >> >> On one machine I got the black cube. >> On another one (with a HD4000 integrated GPU), I got a lightgray cube. >> This is also a Windows 8.1 Pro box. >> On that last machine, I do get a blue and a red cube. >> >> I'll try on the other one tomorrow. >> >> Phil >> On Sun, Mar 30, 2014 at 10:06 PM, Alexandre Bergel < >> alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote: >> >>> Hi! >>> >>> Sorry for the late reply. I do not know whether Ronie privately replied >>> or not. >>> The cube is black because light is missing. Check this: >>> >>> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >>> | view | >>> view := R3View new. >>> view add: ((R3CubeShape new color: Color red) element). >>> view add: ((R3CubeShape new color: Color blue) element translateByX: -2). >>> view addInteraction: R3MKControl. >>> view addInteraction: R3KeyControlForMac. >>> view lightingModel: R3MultipassPerVertexLighting new. >>> view open >>> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >>> >>> Alexandre >>> >>> >>> On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:54 PM, phil(a)highoctane.be wrote: >>> >>> > I loaded Roassal3D on my machine (Windows 8.1 Pro). >>> > >>> > Loaded fine. >>> > >>> > Then tried the tutorial basic cube. >>> > >>> > view := R3View new. >>> > view add: R3CubeShape element. >>> > view addInteraction: R3MKControl. >>> > view open >>> > >>> > Shows a cube but all black. >>> > Interaction works (on AZERTY keyboards, WSAD kinds of, well, you >>> know...). >>> > See screenshot. >>> > >>> > Graphics drivers up to date. >>> > Card: NVidia Geforce GTX 770 ( >>> http://www.asus.com/Graphics_Cards/GTX770DC2OC2GD5/) >>> > >>> > Phil >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > On Mon, Mar 17, 2014 at 11:35 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> >>> wrote: >>> > As described in the "NBOpenGL on Windows" thread, I have a windows >>> > machine where NBOpenGL can not create frame buffer objects (driver >>> issue maybe). >>> > >>> > But on another windows machine, there is no error but strange >>> rendering results. >>> > >>> > On that machine, Roassals 3D IDE, still only shows empty windows. And >>> other >>> > demos shows the same strange rendering (see screenshot, includes GL >>> context driver info). >>> > >>> > >>> > (BTW, there is some class name missmatch in NBGLCurveRenderer in this >>> NBOpenGL version. >>> > It referse to NBGLFragmentProgram although there is only a >>> NBGLFragmentProgramARB class >>> > in the system). >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > 2014-03-17 15:55 GMT+01:00 Ronie Salgado <roniesalg(a)gmail.com>: >>> > Hi Nicolai, >>> > >>> > What are your system specs?, specially your graphic card. >>> > Roassal3D requires a graphic card with at least OpenGL 2.0 support. >>> Try updating your graphic drivers >>> > >>> > Greetings, >>> > Ronie >>> > >>> > >>> > 2014-03-17 11:03 GMT-03:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >>> > >>> > Oh... Have you tried to update Athens and NBOpenGL ? Maybe you are using >>> an old version of them. >>> > Maybe an old version of OpenGL is installed on your Window? >>> > >>> > Ronie, any idea what's going on? >>> > >>> > Alexandre >>> > >>> > >>> > On Mar 17, 2014, at 10:55 AM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: >>> > >>> > > Thank you Alexandre, >>> > > this was what I tried under windows, (I wasn't sure if this is still >>> the right way to do it, I >>> > > read it the Roassal3dTutorial.pdf). >>> > > But it doesn't work. Either I am getting empty windows or (with an >>> other >>> > > NBOpenGL version) >>> > > Frame buffer is incomplete: GL_FRAMEBUFFER_UNSUPPORTED') >>> > > >>> > > I tried this once with linux too, and it didn't worked. But I am not >>> sure how long ago :) >>> > > I'll try it again and report back. >>> > > >>> > > (Another note, after downloading the configuration, this: >>> > > (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfRoassal3d) loadDevelopment >>> > > takes awfully long on windows (~ 5 min). >>> > > I am sure it was much faster on linux, any idea how that can be?) >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > 2014-03-17 14:34 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com >>> >: >>> > > Hi Nicolai, >>> > > >>> > > Roassal3d works well with the last Pharo 3.0. >>> > > You just need to execute the following incantation: >>> > > >>> > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >>> > > Gofer new smalltalkhubUser: 'ronsaldo' project: 'roassal3d'; >>> package: 'ConfigurationOfRoassal3d'; load. (Smalltalk at: >>> #ConfigurationOfRoassal3d) loadDevelopment >>> > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >>> > > >>> > > This does not work for you? >>> > > It works well on OSX and on Linux >>> > > >>> > > Alexandre >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > On Mar 15, 2014, at 10:52 AM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> >>> wrote: >>> > > >>> > > > Hi, >>> > > > >>> > > > what could be the reason, that any Roassal3d example from the >>> > > > Roassal3DTutorial.pdf only shows white empty windows? >>> > > > >>> > > > I loaded ConfigurationOfRoassal3d-RonieSalgado.10 and >>> > > > (Smalltalk at: >>> > > > #ConfigurationOfRoassal3d) loadDevelopment >>> > > > >>> > > > Any ideas? >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > regards >>> > > > Nicolai >>> > > > >>> > > >>> > > -- >>> > > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>> > > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >>> > > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>> > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >>> > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > <3D.png> >>> >>> -- >>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Inspiration] Toward a better programming

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

Looking forward to it. Yes, I think you and your team have done a lot to move in the right direction, thanks a lot. If you want to reach a larger audience, try to go as light as possible on the actual Smalltalk code, even if you have to cheat a bit by choosing good looking examples - the effect is more important than the actual syntax, but complex foreign code scares away everyone. On 31 Mar 2014, at 03:26, Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote: > I cannot resist to jump on this. Indeed, we have the moral obligation to promote what we have crafted over the year. > Producing a high-quality video has been on my todo list for quite some times already. As you probably know, we did some intent already (videos about Roassal, GraphET, and other tools), but we were too young maybe. > > Within the next few weeks we will work on a cool video to promote Roassal2, and our goal is to reach users beyond the Smalltalk boundary. We have everything so far. The moose distribution is a wonderful toolbox that can literally blow away any example shown in this video. > > As you may have seen, we have worked on Roassal2 which includes a new geographical map builder, tabular table importer, GraphET2, fancy curves, html and amber exporter. A video carefully orchestrated has the potential to kick away Aurora, Light Table, Wolfram and all their friends. > > We will soon get there... > > Alexandre > > > On Mar 29, 2014, at 2:20 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > >> Beautiful demo. This should be our game, yet others are playing it :(. >> >> Doru >> >> >> On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 11:31 AM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >> >> On 29 Mar 2014, at 10:38, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: >> >>> This is a nice write down: >>> >>> http://www.chris-granger.com/2014/03/27/toward-a-better-programming/ >>> >>> with a nice demo of a prototype: >>> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6iUm_Cqx2s >>> >>> Luckily, the horrible C++ code computing standard deviation in the article can be written quite elegantly and directly in Pharo: >>> >>> | input | >>> input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). >>> (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sort. >>> >>> Sven >> >> Damn spelling correction ;-) >> >> | input | >> input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). >> (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sqrt. >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> www.tudorgirba.com >> >> "Every thing has its own flow" > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > >

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Inspiration] Toward a better programming

by S Krish

How about impact of this: http://blog.stephenwolfram.com/2014/03/injecting-computation-everywhere-a-s… I would agree it is quite complex for any beginner, but utility of a programming language on these lines seems cut out for the future.. On Mon, Mar 31, 2014 at 6:56 AM, Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>wrote: > I cannot resist to jump on this. Indeed, we have the moral obligation to > promote what we have crafted over the year. > Producing a high-quality video has been on my todo list for quite some > times already. As you probably know, we did some intent already (videos > about Roassal, GraphET, and other tools), but we were too young maybe. > > Within the next few weeks we will work on a cool video to promote > Roassal2, and our goal is to reach users beyond the Smalltalk boundary. We > have everything so far. The moose distribution is a wonderful toolbox that > can literally blow away any example shown in this video. > > As you may have seen, we have worked on Roassal2 which includes a new > geographical map builder, tabular table importer, GraphET2, fancy curves, > html and amber exporter. A video carefully orchestrated has the potential > to kick away Aurora, Light Table, Wolfram and all their friends. > > We will soon get there... > > Alexandre > > > On Mar 29, 2014, at 2:20 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > > Beautiful demo. This should be our game, yet others are playing it :(. > > > > Doru > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 29, 2014 at 11:31 AM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> > wrote: > > > > On 29 Mar 2014, at 10:38, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > > > > This is a nice write down: > > > > > > http://www.chris-granger.com/2014/03/27/toward-a-better-programming/ > > > > > > with a nice demo of a prototype: > > > > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6iUm_Cqx2s > > > > > > Luckily, the horrible C++ code computing standard deviation in the > article can be written quite elegantly and directly in Pharo: > > > > > > | input | > > > input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). > > > (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sort. > > > > > > Sven > > > > Damn spelling correction ;-) > > > > | input | > > input := #(2 4 4 4 5 5 7 9). > > (((input - input average) raisedTo: 2) sum / (input size - 1)) sqrt. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > www.tudorgirba.com > > > > "Every thing has its own flow" > > -- > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. > > > > >

March 31, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Roassal 3D empty windows

by Ronie Salgado

Sorry for no replying. That actually seems to be a shader bug in Roassal3D. I don't have a machine with a new NVIDIA card for testing, but it seems that I have to add a more flexible shader loading system that checks for the current hardware and selects an appropriate shader for it. Greetings, Ronie 2014-03-30 18:04 GMT-03:00 phil(a)highoctane.be <phil(a)highoctane.be>: > Well, > > On one machine I got the black cube. > On another one (with a HD4000 integrated GPU), I got a lightgray cube. > This is also a Windows 8.1 Pro box. > On that last machine, I do get a blue and a red cube. > > I'll try on the other one tomorrow. > > Phil > On Sun, Mar 30, 2014 at 10:06 PM, Alexandre Bergel < > alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote: > >> Hi! >> >> Sorry for the late reply. I do not know whether Ronie privately replied >> or not. >> The cube is black because light is missing. Check this: >> >> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >> | view | >> view := R3View new. >> view add: ((R3CubeShape new color: Color red) element). >> view add: ((R3CubeShape new color: Color blue) element translateByX: -2). >> view addInteraction: R3MKControl. >> view addInteraction: R3KeyControlForMac. >> view lightingModel: R3MultipassPerVertexLighting new. >> view open >> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >> >> Alexandre >> >> >> On Mar 17, 2014, at 7:54 PM, phil(a)highoctane.be wrote: >> >> > I loaded Roassal3D on my machine (Windows 8.1 Pro). >> > >> > Loaded fine. >> > >> > Then tried the tutorial basic cube. >> > >> > view := R3View new. >> > view add: R3CubeShape element. >> > view addInteraction: R3MKControl. >> > view open >> > >> > Shows a cube but all black. >> > Interaction works (on AZERTY keyboards, WSAD kinds of, well, you >> know...). >> > See screenshot. >> > >> > Graphics drivers up to date. >> > Card: NVidia Geforce GTX 770 ( >> http://www.asus.com/Graphics_Cards/GTX770DC2OC2GD5/) >> > >> > Phil >> > >> > >> > >> > On Mon, Mar 17, 2014 at 11:35 PM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> >> wrote: >> > As described in the "NBOpenGL on Windows" thread, I have a windows >> > machine where NBOpenGL can not create frame buffer objects (driver >> issue maybe). >> > >> > But on another windows machine, there is no error but strange rendering >> results. >> > >> > On that machine, Roassals 3D IDE, still only shows empty windows. And >> other >> > demos shows the same strange rendering (see screenshot, includes GL >> context driver info). >> > >> > >> > (BTW, there is some class name missmatch in NBGLCurveRenderer in this >> NBOpenGL version. >> > It referse to NBGLFragmentProgram although there is only a >> NBGLFragmentProgramARB class >> > in the system). >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > 2014-03-17 15:55 GMT+01:00 Ronie Salgado <roniesalg(a)gmail.com>: >> > Hi Nicolai, >> > >> > What are your system specs?, specially your graphic card. >> > Roassal3D requires a graphic card with at least OpenGL 2.0 support. Try >> updating your graphic drivers >> > >> > Greetings, >> > Ronie >> > >> > >> > 2014-03-17 11:03 GMT-03:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>: >> > >> > Oh... Have you tried to update Athens and NBOpenGL ? Maybe you are using >> an old version of them. >> > Maybe an old version of OpenGL is installed on your Window? >> > >> > Ronie, any idea what's going on? >> > >> > Alexandre >> > >> > >> > On Mar 17, 2014, at 10:55 AM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: >> > >> > > Thank you Alexandre, >> > > this was what I tried under windows, (I wasn't sure if this is still >> the right way to do it, I >> > > read it the Roassal3dTutorial.pdf). >> > > But it doesn't work. Either I am getting empty windows or (with an >> other >> > > NBOpenGL version) >> > > Frame buffer is incomplete: GL_FRAMEBUFFER_UNSUPPORTED') >> > > >> > > I tried this once with linux too, and it didn't worked. But I am not >> sure how long ago :) >> > > I'll try it again and report back. >> > > >> > > (Another note, after downloading the configuration, this: >> > > (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfRoassal3d) loadDevelopment >> > > takes awfully long on windows (~ 5 min). >> > > I am sure it was much faster on linux, any idea how that can be?) >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > 2014-03-17 14:34 GMT+01:00 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com >> >: >> > > Hi Nicolai, >> > > >> > > Roassal3d works well with the last Pharo 3.0. >> > > You just need to execute the following incantation: >> > > >> > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >> > > Gofer new smalltalkhubUser: 'ronsaldo' project: 'roassal3d'; package: >> 'ConfigurationOfRoassal3d'; load. (Smalltalk at: #ConfigurationOfRoassal3d) >> loadDevelopment >> > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >> > > >> > > This does not work for you? >> > > It works well on OSX and on Linux >> > > >> > > Alexandre >> > > >> > > >> > > On Mar 15, 2014, at 10:52 AM, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> >> wrote: >> > > >> > > > Hi, >> > > > >> > > > what could be the reason, that any Roassal3d example from the >> > > > Roassal3DTutorial.pdf only shows white empty windows? >> > > > >> > > > I loaded ConfigurationOfRoassal3d-RonieSalgado.10 and >> > > > (Smalltalk at: >> > > > #ConfigurationOfRoassal3d) loadDevelopment >> > > > >> > > > Any ideas? >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > regards >> > > > Nicolai >> > > > >> > > >> > > -- >> > > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >> > > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >> > > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > -- >> > _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >> > Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >> > ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > <3D.png> >> >> -- >> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >> >> >> >> >> >

March 31, 2014