November 2014 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] What is the limit

by kilon alios

>> On mobile, large apps are not staying installed for long as they are all competing for the always too small space. >> If say Twitter will do with is huge size, other apps will be compared to it. Which means that a 30 mÃ©gas app us a monster asking for removal. >> I rooted my phone to be able to remove vendor apps in order to get some more space. who said 30mbs are large for mobile phones ? Twitter is reporting 57mbs memory consumption on my phone. Its a Google Nexus 4 , its 1 year and a half old now. It has 2 gb of Ram, 1 GB is free. Storage wise, both Android and iOS have loads of Games that require at least a 1 GB download. Loads of people usually complain and rage on the comment section why the game does not run on their smartphone that does not stop the game from being highly rated and having hundrends of millions of downloads. I use the famous clean master it reports cleaning 1 GB data at least once per month (is reporting that has cleaned 20 GBs so far) and I dont even use my smartphone that frequently. I use it like 1 hour per day. That data is stuff downloaded by twitter and chrome for caching etc . Most users have no clue how much they download and what exactly.

Nov. 24, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo is mine

by Thierry Goubier

Le 25 nov. 2014 00:01, "kilon alios" <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> a Ã©crit : > >> Select the abstract class for commands, its AlTreeCommand (in Al-TreeMorph package). > > no idea where that is, I also used find class and cant find such class. Where is the Al-TreeMorph package ? I believe this is where I tell you to switch to the devel version :) > also I tried some shortcuts CTRL+F does not work for me, it does nothing. I can open finder manually though. Try to select something. There was an issue at a point, but I don't remember when it was solved. I'll try to update the configuration tomorrow. Thierry

Nov. 24, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo is mine

by kilon alios

> > > >> I'm slowly learning to use baselines and github:// urls..., but the gitfiletree ones are so convenient for development. I used baseline for Nireas because it allows other users to install my app without the need to install git, I have not used gitfiletree because I heard that some people have corrupt commits with it or something similar and I am not experienced enough with git to deal with such issues plus filetree allowed me to use my familiar workflow that I had with python with command line git and github. But a tool like gitfieltree or gitfiletree itself is definetly the future of Pharo and git. Users like me that love git and github need a tool that offers close integration with git and I am certainly glad gitfiletree is around . I think I will give gitfiletree another try as well. >> Select the abstract class for commands, its AlTreeCommand (in Al-TreeMorph package). no idea where that is, I also used find class and cant find such class. Where is the Al-TreeMorph package ? also I tried some shortcuts CTRL+F does not work for me, it does nothing. I can open finder manually though.

Nov. 24, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] What is the limit

by phil＠highoctane.be

On mobile, large apps are not staying installed for long as they are all competing for the always too small space. If say Twitter will do with is huge size, other apps will be compared to it. Which means that a 30 mÃ©gas app us a monster asking for removal. I rooted my phone to be able to remove vendor apps in order to get some more space. Phil Le 24 nov. 2014 22:31, "kilon alios" <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com> a Ã©crit : > I have an OS (Yosemite) thats takes 5 out my 8 GB of Ram. Google Chrome > with opened 20 tabs that consumes around 1 GB of Ram. Games that eat Ram > like peanuts and I do 3d graphics with blender which also can consume GBs > like no tommorow. Music productions was not much diffirent either. I watch > movies which are several GBs each. I have 1 TB drive its already half full > (mainly because of movies). > > 32 mb is nothing. XCode with an empty project cosumes 130 MB. Dont forget > that it loads no libraries like Pharo and definetly is no live coding > enviroment. > > Pharo consumes around 80MBs > > Emacs with zero guis still consumes 40mbs. > > Small is not beautiful its irrelevant. > > Unless you are on a platform that has real problem with sizes. > > On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 10:29 PM, Hilaire <hilaire(a)drgeo.eu> wrote: > >> Pharo 1.4 image = 15MB >> Pharo 3 image = 22MB >> Pharo4 image = 32MB >> >> Don't know about Pharo 2.0 as, skip it. >> >> Is there a limit? >> >> Hopefully I gave up on the idea of tablet use but aren't we loosing the >> sight on small is beautiful? >> >> Hilaire >> >> -- >> Dr. Geo - http://drgeo.eu >> iStoa - http://istoa.drgeo.eu >> >> >> >

Nov. 24, 2014

New Cog VMs available

by Eliot Miranda

at http://www.mirandabanda.org/files/Cog/VM/VM.r3148/. Normal service has resumed after the recent instability due to 64-bit work. CogVM binaries as per VMMaker.oscog-eem.956/r3148 Fix regression in primitive[SmallFloat]Truncated Fix some warnings and some 64-bit issues with the ThreadedFFIPlugin. Fix positive64BitIntegerFor: by fixing new generateSignedShiftRight:on:indent:. Symptom is LargePositiveInteger results from primGetPosition: for SmallInteger values. -- best, Eliot

Nov. 24, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] NativeBoost

by Esteban Lorenzano

both are integrated into the image. while NB has been maintained directly, athens should still be loadable (if not the caseâ¦ we have a problem for the future :P). yes, we are slowly moving in the opposite direction of âall maintained in the imageâ, and eventually we plan/dream to have a small kernel and a bunch of configurations to produce Pharo. now, about NB, we do not have special plans. it is in the image and it will be maintained as part of Pharo. now, since the most common use of NB is for FFI, and NB is not present in all platforms, we are working (Ronie, in this case) in a âunified FFIâ, which will provide a common abstraction layer for several FFI frameworks (NB, OldFFI, Alienâ¦). With that, we can choose which one of the frameworks we use depending on the situation (but ideally, we will maintain just one, the one that fits better in Pharo). Againâ¦ this are just ideas for the future :) Esteban > On 24 Nov 2014, at 23:23, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: > > 2014-11-24 20:41 GMT+01:00 Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de <mailto:astares@gmx.de>>: > Hi, > > were is NB currently maintained? Only within the image as it is integrated > or still with an external config and on STHub? > > The reason why I ask: when I load the latest NB-Core package > from STHub it looks like this one is outdated and back from Pharo3 day > (trying to load it gives problems from changes in Pharo 4). > > So it looks like NB was originally developed external using STHub, then integrated > into standard image and now it is only internally in-image managed. OK. > > But the future goal is as far as I understood to manage more and > more packages using external configs again. > > What is the status and future plan for NB? Will the repo get > synchronized? Or will it stay internal only? > > Thx > T. > > > I was about to ask the same question for Athens, the packages in pharo4 and sthub diverge. > I can merge the sthub and pharo4 version for Athens (and mabe NB), I just don't know what > is the plan for the feauture, manage packages for Athens and NB in the image or on sthub. >

Nov. 24, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] NativeBoost

by Nicolai Hess

2014-11-24 20:41 GMT+01:00 Torsten Bergmann <astares(a)gmx.de>: > Hi, > > were is NB currently maintained? Only within the image as it is integrated > or still with an external config and on STHub? > > The reason why I ask: when I load the latest NB-Core package > from STHub it looks like this one is outdated and back from Pharo3 day > (trying to load it gives problems from changes in Pharo 4). > > So it looks like NB was originally developed external using STHub, then > integrated > into standard image and now it is only internally in-image managed. OK. > > But the future goal is as far as I understood to manage more and > more packages using external configs again. > > What is the status and future plan for NB? Will the repo get > synchronized? Or will it stay internal only? > > Thx > T. > > I was about to ask the same question for Athens, the packages in pharo4 and sthub diverge. I can merge the sthub and pharo4 version for Athens (and mabe NB), I just don't know what is the plan for the feauture, manage packages for Athens and NB in the image or on sthub.

Nov. 24, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo is mine

by Thierry Goubier

Le 24/11/2014 22:45, kilon alios a Ã©crit : > >> Oh, tell me which Configuration you used, it should have worked. > Pharo3 or 4? > > Its both it says host key verification failed, I think it fails because > I have not set up the ssh keys for github on this computer I use just > regular https which prompts me for user name and password. So most > likely its not a problem at your side. This is a good excuse to set up > the keys. :) I'm slowly learning to use baselines and github:// urls..., but the gitfiletree ones are so convenient for development. > >> Don't hesitate to fork it and play all your content with the code. > If it can help you build your dream IDE, I'll be proud :) > > I have already forked because your project is ideal for making a new > browser because of its so minimal GUI. I will remove the tree browse and > maybe try a navigation similar to icon based file navigation or keep > tree view as well as alternative, I have not actually decided exactly > how I want to do this so what better than playing with your code. What I > do know is that I like just as you did already to keep the GUI as > minimal as possible and as compact. I also love that you cleaned up the > menus this definitely stays. > > I see you also link a really nice documentation in the readme , is there > any doc for the shortcuts ? Well, not really :(. Most, if not all of them are in the menus. They are triggered by the selection (and this is a bit annoying at times, because, if you select nothing in the tree, there are very few shortcuts working :() To recover all shortcuts (command class names should be self-explanatory), what you can do is try scoped browsing that way. Select the abstract class for commands, its AlTreeCommand (in Al-TreeMorph package). Choose hierarchy in the contextual menu. In the new browser, find keystroke (under accessing) On keystroke, select implementors. In the resulting browser, you'll get all the command classes which have a shortcut. If you want to explore any command class (have the complete definition, not just accessing>keystroke), just double click on it. You can also navigate the class hierarchy just by the context menu on the superclass name in the class definition text: choose browse to open a browser on the superclass. Interesting note: I didn't find a representation for hierarchy. I don't know why, but it doesn't seems so usefull anymore except as a search scope. Thierry

Nov. 24, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo is mine

by kilon alios

>> Oh, tell me which Configuration you used, it should have worked. Pharo3 or 4? Its both it says host key verification failed, I think it fails because I have not set up the ssh keys for github on this computer I use just regular https which prompts me for user name and password. So most likely its not a problem at your side. This is a good excuse to set up the keys. >> Don't hesitate to fork it and play all your content with the code. If it can help you build your dream IDE, I'll be proud :) I have already forked because your project is ideal for making a new browser because of its so minimal GUI. I will remove the tree browse and maybe try a navigation similar to icon based file navigation or keep tree view as well as alternative, I have not actually decided exactly how I want to do this so what better than playing with your code. What I do know is that I like just as you did already to keep the GUI as minimal as possible and as compact. I also love that you cleaned up the menus this definitely stays. I see you also link a really nice documentation in the readme , is there any doc for the shortcuts ?

Nov. 24, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] What is the limit

by kilon alios

I have an OS (Yosemite) thats takes 5 out my 8 GB of Ram. Google Chrome with opened 20 tabs that consumes around 1 GB of Ram. Games that eat Ram like peanuts and I do 3d graphics with blender which also can consume GBs like no tommorow. Music productions was not much diffirent either. I watch movies which are several GBs each. I have 1 TB drive its already half full (mainly because of movies). 32 mb is nothing. XCode with an empty project cosumes 130 MB. Dont forget that it loads no libraries like Pharo and definetly is no live coding enviroment. Pharo consumes around 80MBs Emacs with zero guis still consumes 40mbs. Small is not beautiful its irrelevant. Unless you are on a platform that has real problem with sizes. On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 10:29 PM, Hilaire <hilaire(a)drgeo.eu> wrote: > Pharo 1.4 image = 15MB > Pharo 3 image = 22MB > Pharo4 image = 32MB > > Don't know about Pharo 2.0 as, skip it. > > Is there a limit? > > Hopefully I gave up on the idea of tablet use but aren't we loosing the > sight on small is beautiful? > > Hilaire > > -- > Dr. Geo - http://drgeo.eu > iStoa - http://istoa.drgeo.eu > > >

Nov. 24, 2014