October 2014 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] About ways to participate in community and general negativity

by stepharo

Superb! I'm happily translating a chapter on Artefact to english for the next book that will be announced soon and that sales will go to the pharo association :) Stef > Hi, > > Iâm writing this because Iâm sad about what is happening in this list. > Iâm seeing a lot of general negativity and non constructive ways to discuss things. > Iâm also seeing more and more people using Pharo for their particular interests (which is of course a good thing) but less and less people who contribute back to Pharo. > Finally, Iâm seeing more frequently an attitude of âcustomerâ, more than the conviction than this, Pharo, is also yoursâ¦ > > Please people, we (the pharo âcoreâ team) cannot do everything. We do not have the manpower or the resources to hire manpower. We would like, but we just do not have the resources (is already a blessing that we can work on this, for now: INRIA is paying, but what it pays is *research*, not âpharo the languageâ, so this is a collateral advantageâ¦.) > > So, having an OPEN SOURCE project, with limited resources means that there is a lot of things that depend on the community. > It depends on the community not just to fix, but to enlarge the ecosystem in general too. > > So, I refuse to believe that we cannot be a cool and helpful community. > I refuse to believe that general negativity and bad humor can overcome the joy of participating in this collective effort. > > So, here some recommendations for enhance the way we participate: > > - Be positive. Just âthis is a s**tâ does not help. Even if it is. > - Be propositional. Just âthis is a s**tâ, and not telling what you want/prefer does not help. > - Be proactive. Just âthis is a s**tâ, and not report, discuss and (at least time to time) provide a fix/enhancement does not help. > > In conclusion: not helping does not help :) > After all, this is the âpharo-devâ list. I mean, the list of people wanting to participate from this great, community effort. > > cheers, > Esteban, still grateful of belonging to this community > > > >

Oct. 3, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] About ways to participate in community and general negativity

by Alain Rastoul

Le 03/10/2014 13:44, Esteban Lorenzano a Ã©crit : > Hi, > > Iâm writing this because Iâm sad about what is happening in this list. > Iâm seeing a lot of general negativity and non constructive ways to discuss things. > Iâm also seeing more and more people using Pharo for their particular interests (which is of course a good thing) but less and less people who contribute back to Pharo. > Finally, Iâm seeing more frequently an attitude of âcustomerâ, more than the conviction than this, Pharo, is also yoursâ¦ > > Please people, we (the pharo âcoreâ team) cannot do everything. We do not have the manpower or the resources to hire manpower. We would like, but we just do not have the resources (is already a blessing that we can work on this, for now: INRIA is paying, but what it pays is *research*, not âpharo the languageâ, so this is a collateral advantageâ¦.) > > So, having an OPEN SOURCE project, with limited resources means that there is a lot of things that depend on the community. > It depends on the community not just to fix, but to enlarge the ecosystem in general too. > > So, I refuse to believe that we cannot be a cool and helpful community. > I refuse to believe that general negativity and bad humor can overcome the joy of participating in this collective effort. > > So, here some recommendations for enhance the way we participate: > > - Be positive. Just âthis is a s**tâ does not help. Even if it is. > - Be propositional. Just âthis is a s**tâ, and not telling what you want/prefer does not help. > - Be proactive. Just âthis is a s**tâ, and not report, discuss and (at least time to time) provide a fix/enhancement does not help. > > In conclusion: not helping does not help :) > After all, this is the âpharo-devâ list. I mean, the list of people wanting to participate from this great, community effort. > > cheers, > Esteban, still grateful of belonging to this community > > > > Hi Esteban, Sorry for the long response, but I (like others) feel concerned about your post. I don't see any "negativity" in this forum, I don't understand why you are saying that, but I understand your point of view about people not contributing, being one of them. I think you are too pessimistic (please, drink 2, 3 beers with friends, one for me please - ... cheers :) - talk or forget about what is boring you and then get back with strength). Things are moving slowly, but they are moving in the good direction and thanks to the *dictatorship* leading of Pharo here ;-) , and thanks to people leading projects with Pharo. I think you have to consider that lot of people (may be I'm wrong, and it is just me ?) are here because they like and share the pharo vision of software developmnent, but have to work for a company just to make a living. My company is very focused on productivity and immediate gain. Efficiency against efficacity like our boss "explained" to us... it has some good counterparts like paying my living and my harley :) , and bad ones, like me not liking most of the job I have to do daily, and not agreeing with the "vision" of the company I live with that for now, I ride my bike very often :). Their opinions may looks negative but they are not. To me, people of the rmod team are lucky guys, they work on a sexy technology. May be they feel alone but they are not, may be this technology will fail in next 10 years (I don't think so) but, well, that's life, there will be a reason. Experience is good. I'm still trying to make some smalltalk evangelism (is it goodenglish?) around me at work, and slowly getting people into considering smalltalk (and pharo) as a serious technology (for squeak it was just impossible, sorry), but have not so much time to contribute seriously (and as Pharo moves quite quickly, it requires quite some time just to keeps up to date to last versions). I saw some posts about Glorp, databases and orm (some of my current working skills) and consider getting into this just to help, but on the other hand I have some other personal projects I would like to complete with Pharo. I may look selfish, but that's another point here: Pharo has to have more project going on to succeed. "Pharo's "success stories" is IMHO ***very*** important - and marketing is *****very***** important beeing a developper, I feel a bit sad saying that but that's the f***g reality. Interesting coincidence, I had a discussion today with a collegue about bad succeeding and good falling technologies (like javascript and smaltalk in our talks)... Just to say keep on the good stuff please. And I stop here. Regards , Alain

Oct. 3, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Why version `GLIBC_2.15'?

by Bernardo Ezequiel Contreras

if you are facing the same problem, just search for the following subject [Pharo-dev] ANN - Pre-compiled Pharo VM for Debian Stable in this mailing list. thanks On Fri, Oct 3, 2014 at 3:56 PM, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand <hernan.morales(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I don't know but I would like to read the answer too. > > HernÃ¡n > > > 2014-09-25 21:40 GMT-03:00 Bernardo Ezequiel Contreras > <vonbecmann(a)gmail.com>: > >> hi all, >> i just want to know why the pharo-vm is compiled with `GLIBC_2.15'? >> is there a bug due to glibc's version? >> >> >> thanks. >> >> >> -- >> Bernardo E.C. >> >> Sent from a cheap desktop computer in South America. > > -- Bernardo E.C. Sent from a cheap desktop computer in South America.

Oct. 3, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Catch Response 500 error in ZnClient

by Nicolai Hess

2014-10-03 18:22 GMT+02:00 Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu>: > Hi Nicolai, > > I must have missed that one somehow, I will look into it. > > OTOMH, I think you need to add an #enforceHttpSuccess:true or > #systemPolicy to the ZnClient instance being used. > Great! enforceHttpSuccess:true -> success :) > > Sven > > On 03 Oct 2014, at 17:49, Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de> wrote: > > > > > 2014-08-24 13:10 GMT+02:00 Nicolai Hess <nicolaihess(a)web.de>: > > How to catch a ZnResponse(500 Internal Server Error) ? > > (see fogbugz issue 13905) > > > > I tried to add a > > ifFail:[....] > > block but it does not get called on this response. > > > > > > Nicolai > > > > Anyone ? :) > >

Oct. 3, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Why version `GLIBC_2.15'?

by HernÃ¡n Morales Durand

I don't know but I would like to read the answer too. HernÃ¡n 2014-09-25 21:40 GMT-03:00 Bernardo Ezequiel Contreras <vonbecmann(a)gmail.com >: > hi all, > i just want to know why the pharo-vm is compiled with `GLIBC_2.15'? > is there a bug due to glibc's version? > > > thanks. > > > -- > Bernardo E.C. > > Sent from a cheap desktop computer in South America. >

Oct. 3, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Official academic consortium members

by Clara Allende

Wohoooo :D Le 3 oct. 2014 20:16, "Yuriy Tymchuk" <yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com> a Ã©crit : > Yay :) > > > On 03 Oct 2014, at 19:26, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: > > > > Hi guys > > > > we are really happy to welcome > > > > University of Bern > > Uqbar > > Reveal from Lugano > > > > as official academic member of the pharo consortium. > > I know that some other entities are following the same path and this is > really great. > > > > Stef > > > > >

Oct. 3, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Official academic consortium members

by Yuriy Tymchuk

Yay :) > On 03 Oct 2014, at 19:26, stepharo <stepharo(a)free.fr> wrote: > > Hi guys > > we are really happy to welcome > > University of Bern > Uqbar > Reveal from Lugano > > as official academic member of the pharo consortium. > I know that some other entities are following the same path and this is really great. > > Stef >

Oct. 3, 2014

Official academic consortium members

by stepharo

Hi guys we are really happy to welcome University of Bern Uqbar Reveal from Lugano as official academic member of the pharo consortium. I know that some other entities are following the same path and this is really great. Stef

Oct. 3, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Cmd-o is not opening a new pane?

by Ben Coman

Marcus Denker wrote: > On 03 Oct 2014, at 10:08, Christophe Demarey <Christophe.Demarey(a)inria.fr> wrote: > >> Le 3 oct. 2014 Ã 08:26, Esteban Lorenzano a Ã©crit : >> >>> well, but thatâs something that *now* you cannot do. >>> what people will see now is âcmd+i does one thing in playground, and other thing in other parts of the system". >> Maybe it is me but what I see is cmd+i => inspect. >> I will be more confused to use cmd+o in GT and cmd+i everywhere else. >> > > another argument: everyone agrees that we open too many windows (*far* too many windows) and that we > need to change the IDE to do that less. > > Now if we declare âevery keystroke that used to open a window needs to open a window forever and in all > contextsâ, then it will be hard to solve the window-plagueâ¦ > > Marcus > Maybe we should be opening tabs by default. Its a paradigm that worked for web browsers. -ben

Oct. 3, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Playground

by Ben Coman

Marcus Denker wrote: > > On 02 Oct 2014, at 21:36, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com > <mailto:tudor@tudorgirba.com>> wrote: >> >> >> On Thu, Oct 2, 2014 at 5:19 PM, kilon alios <kilon.alios(a)gmail.com >> <mailto:kilon.alios@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >> Is it just me or is the Playground a big step back in the >> usability of Pharo ? >> >> For me its Gui makes no sense. Gone is the right click menu which >> had tons of useful actions now you only get like a few options. >> The tab thing is weird to say the least with the navigation of the >> tabs being in the opposite side (bottom) of the navigation of the >> internal tabs(top). No more right arrow menu for shortcuts and >> many features that workspace had. >> >> >> I will concede that the contextual menu is incomplete. We will work on >> that. In the meantime, the keybindings work as in the classic workspace. >> > > And one needs to take into account that the âpullâ strategy for menu > items is much better than a âpushâ: Instead of adding just everything > that was there, wait till people > get *really* upset and implement it. This proves that they *really* need > it :-) > > In a way we used that strategy *a lot* for Pharoâ¦ we removed so many > menu entries everywhere. Or Settingsâ¦ the amount of settings that I > removed, I guess >100? > > And the fun thing is: nobody ever complained :-) > > But if I would have asked: you can be sure that someone reacts like âI > never used it but now that you tell me, I want to keep itâ. > (this is true for every unused feature. Just remove and wait. Never ask. > If you ask you will have to keep it. People react to removing unused > features as if you would > take something away from them that was just stored securely for bad > times, as if it would be deeply ingrained in our genes or something). > > Marcus I think that is a fair strategy, as long as attention is paid when the complaints come. In my day job, the project managers don't like us just asking our (internal) clients "do you want this" - since they _always_ just say Yes without having to consider project budget. The project then grows until it is too expensive to pass a cost/benefit analysis at the executive toll-gate. -ben

Oct. 3, 2014