January 2014 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] Do you want to accept???????? Discard???????

by Sebastian Sastre

On Jan 12, 2014, at 7:59 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > Cancel is next to Accept in almost any Edit menu, with the command keys L and S respectively. You should have seen this the moment you started coding: This comment brings something interesting to add to the discussion and, Sven, you might not have said that in this way but, with your permission, I want to point out this only to leave a record for all of us to reflect. you see... the problem with what should or shouldn't have the user seen, is that it suggest the user is under evaluation. Worst, it suggest a dualistic way to evaluate it. Is not the user who is under evaluation. It's your product's success in helping the user to do some task with less resistance. The way you evaluate usability is in observing the resistance points (UI fails), or absence of it (UI successes) on tasks the user is trying to achieve. Of course our challenge and opportunity is in embracing this and take a deep breath to resist the temptation to appeal to any of these: http://www.satinderrana.com/blog/2010/07/top-20-excuses-for-broken-code-by-… Pharo rocks and, as all products, has space for improvements (I can give quite some feedback about that menu BTW) What we have here, is an opportunity to put some love in its user experience to make it more awesome for more people sebastian o/

Jan. 13, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 3.0 not responding to mouse or keyboard after launch

by Martin McClure

On 01/12/2014 03:06 PM, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand wrote: > > > > It seems you're missing XPutImage() calls. This is low level but to > check if Xlib is initializing the image structures you can comment out > the stub I do get a bunch of XPutImage() calls, but those are earlier. If I launch one of my development images from a week ago I see all of the windows drawn just as they should be -- the system just doesn't do anything with my input. I'm beginning to think that it's unlikely that the the problem is directly X-related. > Does Gentoo provide a README for updates? Good suggestion, but not really. It's a rolling-release model, so updates of packages happen individually at any time. When you update, you update to the state of the Gentoo world at that particular instant, which could change the very next minute. The update I did last week updated 35 packages. The only affected libraries that Pharo uses are from glibc 2.17, upgraded from 2.16. It *could* be something else (like a change to some config file somewhere) but so far I'm looking at glibc. There *are* release notes for glibc, and I'm reading those now. Thanks, -Martin

Jan. 13, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Arguments to --trace=?

by Martin McClure

On 01/12/2014 03:26 PM, Eliot Miranda wrote: > > > > On Sun, Jan 12, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Martin McClure <martin(a)hand2mouse.com > <mailto:martin@hand2mouse.com>> wrote: > > Anybody know where to find what the acceptable arguments to --trace > on the command line are, and what each means? > > So far, I've tried: > > --trace Lots of output > --trace=0 No output > --trace=1 Looks maybe the same as --trace with no argument > --trace=2 No output > --trace=3 A whaling big lot of very interesting output > > Slightly better descriptions of these would be nice. :-) > > > Cogit>>sendTrace: aBooleanOrInteger > <doNotGenerate> > "traceFlags is a set of flags. > 1 => print trace (if something below is selected) > 2 => trace sends > 4 => trace block activations > 8 => trace interpreter primitives > 16 => trace events (context switches, GCs, etc) > 32 => trace stack overflow > 64 => send breakpoint on implicit receiver (Newspeak VM only)" > traceFlags := aBooleanOrInteger isInteger > ifTrue: [aBooleanOrInteger] > ifFalse: [aBooleanOrInteger ifTrue: [6] ifFalse: [0]] > -- Thanks Eliot, that helps a lot! Regards, -Martin

Jan. 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Arguments to --trace=?

by Eliot Miranda

On Sun, Jan 12, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Martin McClure <martin(a)hand2mouse.com>wrote: > Anybody know where to find what the acceptable arguments to --trace on the > command line are, and what each means? > > So far, I've tried: > > --trace Lots of output > --trace=0 No output > --trace=1 Looks maybe the same as --trace with no argument > --trace=2 No output > --trace=3 A whaling big lot of very interesting output > > Slightly better descriptions of these would be nice. :-) > Cogit>>sendTrace: aBooleanOrInteger <doNotGenerate> "traceFlags is a set of flags. 1 => print trace (if something below is selected) 2 => trace sends 4 => trace block activations 8 => trace interpreter primitives 16 => trace events (context switches, GCs, etc) 32 => trace stack overflow 64 => send breakpoint on implicit receiver (Newspeak VM only)" traceFlags := aBooleanOrInteger isInteger ifTrue: [aBooleanOrInteger] ifFalse: [aBooleanOrInteger ifTrue: [6] ifFalse: [0]] -- best, Eliot

Jan. 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] how to debug NB?

by paolo.bernardi.67＠gmail.com

Il 12/01/2014 19.41, Igor Stasenko ha scritto: > All i can say that callbacks for handling window events need special > handling: > - you basically should prevent VM to do event handling during > handling of event by callback. Do I achieve that when starting in headless mode? (no ui, no messages...)

Jan. 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo 3.0 not responding to mouse or keyboard after launch

by HernÃ¡n Morales Durand

2014/1/12 Martin McClure <martin(a)hand2mouse.com> > On 01/12/2014 07:46 AM, HernÃ¡n Morales Durand wrote: > >> >> xscope is difficult to set up. I wonder if you have started another X >> server in the background and which xscope parameters you've used? >> > > Thanks for the detailed reply! > > Xscope seemed reasonably easy to set up. > > ./xscope -i1 > > then set DISPLAY to :1 before launching Pharo. > > I don't think there's another X server involved -- the Pharo window is > displayed on the correct screen, with the correct initial contents, and > events are being delivered to it (as evidenced by it responding to Alt-. > through output to the terminal) and the mouse pointer is the proper Pharo > shape. But no other visual indication that it knows I'm trying to interact > with it. > > The fact that I'm accessing to X remotely through XRDP and Xvnc could make my set up more difficult. Nice to hear it is easier for local display. > > >> So you may want to give a shoot to xtruss: >> http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/xtruss/ >> >> It is used like strace. >> >> $ xtruss pharo Pharo.image >> > > OK, tried this. It is indeed easier. > > > >> When you move the mouse over the image window, you should get this type >> of output: >> >> --- MotionNotify(root=w#000000DC, event=w#03000002, child=None, >> same-screen=True, root-x=573, root-y=320, event-x=14, event-y=266, >> detail=Normal, state=0x0010, time=0x2D840279) >> --- MotionNotify(root=w#000000DC, event=w#03000002, child=None, >> same-screen=True, root-x=572, root-y=320, event-x=13, event-y=266, >> detail=Normal, state=0x0010, time=0x2D8402F5) >> --- MotionNotify(root=w#000000DC, event=w#03000002, child=None, >> same-screen=True, root-x=571, root-y=320, event-x=12, event-y=266, >> detail=Normal, state=0x0010, time=0x2D8402F5) >> > > Yes, I'm seeing these. > > > >> When you enter focus in the Pharo window's area: >> >> --- EnterNotify(root=w#000000DC, event=w#03000001, child=w#03000002, >> mode=Normal, same-screen=True, focus=False, root-x=1153, root-y=705, >> event-x=582, event-y=614, detail=NonlinearVirtual, state=0x0010, >> time=0x2D894A60) >> >> When you make a click to bring the world menu, this is the event sequence: >> > > > Here's the sequence I get, after all the initial setup. Moving the mouse > into the Pharo window, click, release, and move the mouse out of the > window. Note that I held the mouse button down for a bit -- it wasn't a > quick click. > > > --- FocusOut(event=w#05600001, mode=Normal, detail=Inferior) > --- FocusIn(event=w#05600002, mode=Normal, detail=Ancestor) > --- PropertyNotify(window=w#0000028E, atom=a#360, state=NewValue, > time=0x07C13BCF) > --- PropertyNotify(window=w#0000028E, atom=a#360, state=NewValue, > time=0x07C13BCF) > --- EnterNotify(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600001, child=w#05600002, > mode=Normal, same-screen=True, focus=False, root-x=1465, root-y=684, > event-x=263, event-y=661, detail=NonlinearVirtual, state=0x0000, > time=0x07C141F6) > --- MotionNotify(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600002, child=None, > same-screen=True, root-x=1465, root-y=684, event-x=263, event-y=661, > detail=Normal, state=0x0000, time=0x07C141F6) > --- MotionNotify(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600002, child=None, > same-screen=True, root-x=1465, root-y=683, event-x=263, event-y=660, > detail=Normal, state=0x0000, time=0x07C1422D) > --- MotionNotify(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600002, child=None, > same-screen=True, root-x=1465, root-y=682, event-x=263, event-y=659, > detail=Normal, state=0x0000, time=0x07C14266) > --- MotionNotify(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600002, child=None, > same-screen=True, root-x=1465, root-y=683, event-x=263, event-y=660, > detail=Normal, state=0x0000, time=0x07C1453E) > --- MotionNotify(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600002, child=None, > same-screen=True, root-x=1466, root-y=683, event-x=264, event-y=660, > detail=Normal, state=0x0000, time=0x07C14865) > --- ButtonPress(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600002, child=None, > same-screen=True, root-x=1466, root-y=683, event-x=264, event-y=660, > detail=1, state=0x0000, time=0x07C148CE) > --- ButtonRelease(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600002, child=None, > same-screen=True, root-x=1466, root-y=683, event-x=264, event-y=660, > detail=1, state=0x0100, time=0x07C1514D) > --- MotionNotify(root=w#0000028E, event=w#05600002, child=None, > same-screen=True, root-x=1466, root-y=684, event-x=264, event-y=661, > detail=Normal, state=0x0000, time=0x07C153C5) > --- FocusOut(event=w#05600002, mode=Normal, detail=Nonlinear) > --- FocusOut(event=w#05600001, mode=Normal, detail=NonlinearVirtual) > > It seems you're missing XPutImage() calls. This is low level but to check if Xlib is initializing the image structures you can comment out the stub /* if (!XInitImage(stImage)) fprintf(stderr, "XInitImage failed (but we don't care)\n"); */ in the frightening https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-vm/blob/master/platforms/unix/vm-dis… and recompile? Does Gentoo provide a README for updates? Regards, HernÃ¡n

Jan. 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Do you want to accept???????? Discard???????

by Benjamin

Also, if you open Squeak by example, the first pages (if not written directly on the cover) are the list of the shortcuts Some disappeared, but most of them still exists (and are hidden :P) The latest I discovered (will refactoring the text editor shortcuts): cmd+y It the equivalent of ctrl+t in emacs, aka transposing two characters (if you ask why $y, I would say why not :P) Ben On 12 Jan 2014, at 18:59, Sven Van Caekenberghe <sven(a)stfx.eu> wrote: > > On 12 Jan 2014, at 22:42, Sebastian Sastre <sebastian(a)flowingconcept.com> wrote: > >> On Jan 12, 2014, at 6:57 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> how i discovered it? by holding cmd key and pressing all keys in order. >> >> LOL >> >> XD > > Cancel is next to Accept in almost any Edit menu, with the command keys L and S respectively. You should have seen this the moment you started coding: > > <Screen Shot 2014-01-12 at 22.57.00.png> >

Jan. 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Do you want to accept???????? Discard???????

by Sven Van Caekenberghe

On 12 Jan 2014, at 22:42, Sebastian Sastre <sebastian(a)flowingconcept.com> wrote: > On Jan 12, 2014, at 6:57 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> how i discovered it? by holding cmd key and pressing all keys in order. > > LOL > > XD Cancel is next to Accept in almost any Edit menu, with the command keys L and S respectively. You should have seen this the moment you started coding:

Jan. 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Do you want to accept???????? Discard???????

by Sebastian Sastre

On Jan 12, 2014, at 6:57 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > how i discovered it? by holding cmd key and pressing all keys in order. LOL XD

Jan. 12, 2014

Re: [Pharo-dev] Do you want to accept???????? Discard???????

by Igor Stasenko

On 12 January 2014 21:07, Sebastian Sastre <sebastian(a)flowingconcept.com>wrote: > > On Jan 12, 2014, at 5:53 PM, Igor Stasenko <siguctua(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > And modal popups is clearly against this principle. > Because they > a) make you think > b) draw your energy from what you really should be thinking on.. > > so please explain, how adding yes/no popup to cmd-L command handling helps > maintaining this principle better. > > > Some designers think that dialogs (stateful interfaces) are the enemy of > usability, and I'm in favor of using them as last resort. Also because > users in general, not only programmers, have hard feelings about dialogs > > What I wasn't checking (lack of usability tests I'm watching you... yet.. > again...) was which workflow exactly were you talking about. > > The cmd-L *contains explicit information* about discarding changes so *asking > confirmation is unnecessary*. > > Thanks! :) > (I thought you were talking about changing focus or the selected method on > a browser and discarding changes without asking, sorry if I confused you). > > Usability tests solves all this and a lot more in half a second. > > Ok, I'm experimenting a little here and > > A) Cmd-L is something hidden enough to not be seen by newcomers and > B) I get that you can produce an interesting workflow if you are used to > do something and use cmd-L as a fast way to undo changes > > I wasn't even knowing about cmd-L existence, how anybody knows about it? > > i don't know. i discovered this function back when i met the squeak in 2006.. which btw, frees me from dealing with popups when i start editing the method, but then realizing that this is wrong method or no change is required. Pressing Cmd-L marks text as unmodified, which is important, because if it is modified, then it will throw yes/no popup into your face if you try to navigate away from it. how i discovered it? by holding cmd key and pressing all keys in order. > If you ask me what I do for the same case, I'm used to go to method > versions and revert to the desired one > > > -- Best regards, Igor Stasenko.

Jan. 12, 2014