September 2013 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Esug-list] New Mars examples: Package Browser and Test Runner

by kilon

"How about using a C++ interface generator like SWIG? http://www.swig.org/exec.html http://is.muni.cz/th/256594/fi_m/thesis.pdf (note I haven't used this, I've just been browsing around for interest) cheers -ben" its not that simple. Swig is like a template thingy that generates wrapper automagically for programming languages. In this case it would require that Pharo supports C++ libs in some way which I think it does not. For example Swing is quite popular with python , cpython to be exactly , but cpython has an API for wrapping both C and C++ code. So you need a language that already offers support for C++ libs in order to be able to use SWIG. "Depends on what you want you mean by solid. For exploratory visual programming, it's a solid design. For building GUIs from standard components and a clear separation of responsibilities between a morphs constituent parts (*parts* you say? who needs that, we're all morphs!), it's much less solid than say, MVC/MVP. Cheers, Henry " I am nowhere near to classify myself as a "morphic coder" but I am not a big fan of MVC . The idea of dividing an element to 3 things Model , View and Controller and essentially having 3 objects for every graphic element does not resonate with me very well. But in the end as I say I am not in a position to compare it with MVC libs, and I definetly dont like the design of some of the elements. Treemorph looks weird to me, for example it has a selection index but index apply only for visible / not expanded components which for me defys the meaning of having a tree hierarchy moph in the first place. Progress bar has not been easy to figure out either. What I do like about morphic is that everything is a morph and you can make compex guis out of very simple moprhs and the fact that you can do that by mouse. And of course visual coding too. If it was in my hand completely I would made all those morph as simple as possible. I get the feeling that each morph tries to solve too many problems. "Agreed. This week I tried to do morphic the second time in my life. There are a lot of things that I consider to be annoying but then it is also easy to combine and display stuff. Took me not too much time to have a visual representation of my scanner cache tool" exactly and I really like your visual , shows that morphic is plenty capable of making very modern graphics. I see even anti-aliasing which is very nice. I agree that Mars can play a crucial role for people who are already familiar with GTK and Cocoa , certainly it will be one more motivation to use pharo. So definetly Morphic and Mars can hapilly coexist together. Its kinda ironic you know, I was an ex cpython coder, I would love to have a cpython GUI API but there is none. Even on 1/10th of the capabilities of Morphic. All popular GUI frameworks for cpython are C/C++ wrapped libs. And to make things even funnier the standard gui that cpython comes with is called Tkinter and even though it is made in a scripting language its not python , its TK. And cpython is like what 100 times more popular to pharo, 1000 ? So yes I am glad Pharo has moprhic and that is so deep , even if it has its quirks. Actually besides TK I dont know of another dynamic language that has a GUI api written in the language that uses it. And mind you Tkinter is nowhere near Morphic. So definetly shows that Morphic is quite an achievenment. -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/New-Mars-examples-Package-Browser-and-Test-Runner-tp4… Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk Developers mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Sept. 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo Hangout Session scheduled to Wed 2/10

by Esteban Lorenzano

obviously it can continue, if there is people interested :) but I ensure I will be there at least those 5hs :D Esteban ps: I suppose next time I could remember that people work in other stuff and I can make the hangout a saturday :( On Sep 25, 2013, at 2:09 PM, "Esteban A. Maringolo" <emaringolo(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I would like it even later. So I can join after-office (~20:00 UTC). > But I guess that anything beyond 18:00 UTC is too late for those in the west. > > Otherwise 17:00 UTC seems better. > > Thanks! > > Esteban A. Maringolo > > > 2013/9/25 Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm(a)gmail.com> > Hi, > > So... according to the doodle poll, hangout session will be Wed 2/10. > I was thinking on doing it from 12 UTC to 17 UTC, to allow people of the new continent to join... what do you think? > > Esteban >

Sept. 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo Hangout Session scheduled to Wed 2/10

by Esteban A. Maringolo

I would like it even later. So I can join after-office (~20:00 UTC). But I guess that anything beyond 18:00 UTC is too late for those in the west. Otherwise 17:00 UTC seems better. Thanks! Esteban A. Maringolo 2013/9/25 Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm(a)gmail.com> > Hi, > > So... according to the doodle poll, hangout session will be Wed 2/10. > I was thinking on doing it from 12 UTC to 17 UTC, to allow people of the > new continent to join... what do you think? > > Esteban >

Sept. 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] Pharo Launcher link

by Damien Cassou

On Tue, Sep 24, 2013 at 6:14 PM, <btc(a)openinworld.com> wrote: > Just wondering if it would be suitable to link to the Pharo Launcher from > http://www.pharo-project.org/pharo-download. for sure, but I would like more people using, testing, sending feedback, and adding features before. My idea was that Pharo-launcher could be the default download when Pharo 3.0 is released. -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Success is the ability to go from one failure to another without losing enthusiasm." Winston Churchill

Sept. 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Esug-list] New Mars examples: Package Browser and Test Runner

by Pavel Krivanek

Works for me on Fedora 64 bit. I only had to install gtk3.i686 and change library path (to /lib/libgtk-3.so.0), Where can I find the icons directory? Cheers, -- Pavel 2013/9/24 Esteban Lorenzano <estebanlm(a)gmail.com>: > yes... if you have it (for 32bits), you should be ok. > > but maybe you need to change the path. > > On Sep 24, 2013, at 3:28 PM, Goubier Thierry <thierry.goubier(a)cea.fr> wrote: > >> I followed the instructions in another mail. >> >> Basically, it fails trying to load libgtk3 >> >> Thierry >> >> Le 24/09/2013 15:18, Esteban Lorenzano a Ã©crit : >>> you need gtk3-devel? >>> weird... you should be ok without. We need to check that. >>> >>> Esteban >>> >>> On Sep 24, 2013, at 3:22 PM, Goubier Thierry <thierry.goubier(a)cea.fr> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Le 24/09/2013 15:09, Esteban Lorenzano a Ã©crit : >>>>> >>>>> On Sep 24, 2013, at 3:05 PM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> I am wondering. How far are we from dropping Morphic for good? >>>>>> >>>>>> Far. >>>>> >>>>> yes, we still need a lot of work. >>>>> but I'm working on made a release so others can collaborate :) >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> By the way, is this the goal? >>>>>> >>>>>> No I do not think so because they are plenty of experimentations that a native binding >>>>>> will not support. >>>>> >>>>> the objective is to have an alternative. >>>>> now, we are running morphs inside mars windows (with athens, etc.)... so there would not be a problem there :) >>>> >>>> Oh, this is how you are doing it. >>>> >>>> I tried Mars but my 64bits ubuntu makes installing the required libs (gtk3-devel) a bit harder than expected. >>>> >>>> Thierry >>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Stef >>>>>> >>>>>>>> Nope! I should learn how to do that :P I'll try to do it this week. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Tue, Sep 24, 2013 at 9:04 AM, laurent laffont <laurent.laffont(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi Carla, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> this is cool ! Is there a ready Pharo + Mars image built by jenkins server ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Laurent >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Tue, Sep 24, 2013 at 4:42 AM, Carla F. Griggio <carla.griggio(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi everyone! >>>>>>>> I want to let you know that I've just posted a screencast in my blog about the new Mars Package Browser and Test Runner. >>>>>>>> These examples are not really intended as being the definitive package browser or test runner, but to start experiencing how is it to build a real application using Mars and to showcase some widgets. Anyway, it's cool :) The Package browser is not so different to the system browser example I showed before, but the Test Runner is definitely my favorite example so far. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I give more details in the screencast and the blog post. Any feedback is appreciated! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>>>> Carla. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Esug-list mailing list >>>>>>>> Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org >>>>>>>> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;: >>>>>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu >>>>>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Thierry Goubier >>>> CEA list >>>> Laboratoire des Fondations des SystÃ¨mes Temps RÃ©el EmbarquÃ©s >>>> 91191 Gif sur Yvette Cedex >>>> France >>>> Phone/Fax: +33 (0) 1 69 08 32 92 / 83 95 >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Thierry Goubier >> CEA list >> Laboratoire des Fondations des SystÃ¨mes Temps RÃ©el EmbarquÃ©s >> 91191 Gif sur Yvette Cedex >> France >> Phone/Fax: +33 (0) 1 69 08 32 92 / 83 95 >> > >

Sept. 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] How to test the same behavior with different data

by Frank Shearar

Hi Noury, At the moment it's hard-coded to 100 data points. It'd be better to pull that out into some kind of configuration object though. frank On 25 September 2013 11:19, Noury Bouraqadi <bouraqadi(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Frank, > > This sounds cool. But, how do you decide how many data you generate per test run ? > > Noury > On 23 sept. 2013, at 11:19, Frank Shearar wrote: > >> I played around with a combination of data driven testing and random >> data generation a while back: >> * http://www.lshift.net/blog/2011/09/13/checking-squeak-quickly >> * http://www.squeaksource.com/SqueakCheck/ >> >> There is a ConfigurationOf there. It integrates with SUnit by adding a >> new kind of TestCase that knows how to run theories, identified by >> pragmas. It also features the recording of a counterexample to your >> theory by generating a normal test method on the relevant TestCase >> subclass. >> >> I haven't touched the code in a while, but if there's interest I'd be >> happy to hack on it once more. >> >> frank >> >> On 22 September 2013 21:43, laurent laffont <laurent.laffont(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> in phpunit there's a @dataProvider annotation, so one method returns a >>> several data sets for a test method. I'm not sure that's the best design but >>> it's nice to have one unit test result per data set. See >>> http://phpunit.de/manual/current/en/writing-tests-for-phpunit.html#writing-… >>> >>> >>> Translating the example to Pharo that should give something like: >>> >>> TestCase subclass: #DataTest >>> >>> DataTest>>testAdd: a to: b shouldAnswer: c >>> <dataProvider: #provider> >>> self assert: c equals: a + b >>> >>> DataTest>>provider >>> ^ { {0. 0. 0}. >>> {1. 0. 1}. >>> {0. 1. 1}. >>> {1. 2. 3} } >>> >>> It may not be to difficult to implement in SUnit. What do you think about >>> this ? >>> >>> Laurent >>> >>> >>> On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Jan Vrany <jan.vrany(a)fit.cvut.cz> wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> I actually already thought on this as I have similar problems. >>>> So far I just create a bunch of tests, passing the actual set of >>>> parameters to a common test method as message arguments. >>>> >>>> For different framework (not SUnit, but similar spirit), I introduced a >>>> notion of "parameter", each having a domain. When running test, the runner >>>> computes all possible combinations of parameter values and run the test on >>>> each such combination. I would like to have something similar >>>> in SUnit, but there are some issues. This is the feature I would like to >>>> see in SUnit 6.x, but I/we have to finish 5.0 first - I wonder if I ever >>>> find a time to do push it :-( >>>> >>>> >>>> On 21/09/13 11:06, Noury Bouraqadi wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Last ESUG I attended the cool katas session organized by Stephan >>>>> Eggermont and Laurent Laffont. >>>>> That was a good opportunity to step back and think about my TDD practices >>>>> . >>>>> >>>>> To experiment with the style proposed by Laurent, I started writing tests >>>>> for a pong. >>>>> I ended up having groups of nearly identical tests: >>>>> -they use exactly the same objects, send the same messages, >>>>> -but they differ only by values. >>>>> >>>>> An example, is testing the motion of the ball towards different >>>>> directions or collisions with obstacles at different locations or speeds. >>>>> >>>>> Now, I wonder what is the best way to express those similar tests? >>>>> >>>>> In a short discussion before I leave, Stephane told me about tables of >>>>> values. It seem that there is such a support in the ruby world in the >>>>> cucumber framework. Do we have anything similar in Smalltalk world? >>>>> >>>>> BTW, the full ESUG conference was great. Thanx to local organizers, and >>>>> all people that contributed to make it a success. >>>>> >>>>> Thanx, >>>>> Noury >>>>> Ecole des Mines de Douai >>>>> http://car.mines-douai.fr/noury >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> > > Noury > -- > http://twitter.com/#!/NouryBouraqadi > http://car.mines-douai.fr/noury > > Noury Bouraqadi > Ecole des Mines de Douai > http://car.mines-douai.fr/noury > -- > > > > > Afin de contribuer au respect de l'environnement, > merci de n'imprimer ce courriel qu'en cas de necessite > > Please consider the environment before you print > > > >

Sept. 25, 2013

Pharo Hangout Session scheduled to Wed 2/10

by Esteban Lorenzano

Hi, So... according to the doodle poll, hangout session will be Wed 2/10. I was thinking on doing it from 12 UTC to 17 UTC, to allow people of the new continent to join... what do you think? Esteban

Sept. 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] How to test the same behavior with different data

by Noury Bouraqadi

Hi Frank, This sounds cool. But, how do you decide how many data you generate per test run ? Noury On 23 sept. 2013, at 11:19, Frank Shearar wrote: > I played around with a combination of data driven testing and random > data generation a while back: > * http://www.lshift.net/blog/2011/09/13/checking-squeak-quickly > * http://www.squeaksource.com/SqueakCheck/ > > There is a ConfigurationOf there. It integrates with SUnit by adding a > new kind of TestCase that knows how to run theories, identified by > pragmas. It also features the recording of a counterexample to your > theory by generating a normal test method on the relevant TestCase > subclass. > > I haven't touched the code in a while, but if there's interest I'd be > happy to hack on it once more. > > frank > > On 22 September 2013 21:43, laurent laffont <laurent.laffont(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> Hi, >> >> in phpunit there's a @dataProvider annotation, so one method returns a >> several data sets for a test method. I'm not sure that's the best design but >> it's nice to have one unit test result per data set. See >> http://phpunit.de/manual/current/en/writing-tests-for-phpunit.html#writing-… >> >> >> Translating the example to Pharo that should give something like: >> >> TestCase subclass: #DataTest >> >> DataTest>>testAdd: a to: b shouldAnswer: c >> <dataProvider: #provider> >> self assert: c equals: a + b >> >> DataTest>>provider >> ^ { {0. 0. 0}. >> {1. 0. 1}. >> {0. 1. 1}. >> {1. 2. 3} } >> >> It may not be to difficult to implement in SUnit. What do you think about >> this ? >> >> Laurent >> >> >> On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Jan Vrany <jan.vrany(a)fit.cvut.cz> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I actually already thought on this as I have similar problems. >>> So far I just create a bunch of tests, passing the actual set of >>> parameters to a common test method as message arguments. >>> >>> For different framework (not SUnit, but similar spirit), I introduced a >>> notion of "parameter", each having a domain. When running test, the runner >>> computes all possible combinations of parameter values and run the test on >>> each such combination. I would like to have something similar >>> in SUnit, but there are some issues. This is the feature I would like to >>> see in SUnit 6.x, but I/we have to finish 5.0 first - I wonder if I ever >>> find a time to do push it :-( >>> >>> >>> On 21/09/13 11:06, Noury Bouraqadi wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Last ESUG I attended the cool katas session organized by Stephan >>>> Eggermont and Laurent Laffont. >>>> That was a good opportunity to step back and think about my TDD practices >>>> . >>>> >>>> To experiment with the style proposed by Laurent, I started writing tests >>>> for a pong. >>>> I ended up having groups of nearly identical tests: >>>> -they use exactly the same objects, send the same messages, >>>> -but they differ only by values. >>>> >>>> An example, is testing the motion of the ball towards different >>>> directions or collisions with obstacles at different locations or speeds. >>>> >>>> Now, I wonder what is the best way to express those similar tests? >>>> >>>> In a short discussion before I leave, Stephane told me about tables of >>>> values. It seem that there is such a support in the ruby world in the >>>> cucumber framework. Do we have anything similar in Smalltalk world? >>>> >>>> BTW, the full ESUG conference was great. Thanx to local organizers, and >>>> all people that contributed to make it a success. >>>> >>>> Thanx, >>>> Noury >>>> Ecole des Mines de Douai >>>> http://car.mines-douai.fr/noury >>>> -- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> > Noury -- http://twitter.com/#!/NouryBouraqadi http://car.mines-douai.fr/noury Noury Bouraqadi Ecole des Mines de Douai http://car.mines-douai.fr/noury -- Afin de contribuer au respect de l'environnement, merci de n'imprimer ce courriel qu'en cas de necessite Please consider the environment before you print

Sept. 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Esug-list] New Mars examples: Package Browser and Test Runner

by Norbert Hartl

Am 25.09.2013 um 10:25 schrieb Henrik Johansen <henrik.s.johansen(a)veloxit.no>: > > On Sep 24, 2013, at 10:42 , kilon <thekilon(a)yahoo.co.uk> wrote: > >> I agree, Morphic is quite messy but its design is very solid. Its just like >> any huge library need to go under a cleanup phase and be improved. > > Depends on what you want you mean by solid. > For exploratory visual programming, it's a solid design. > For building GUIs from standard components and a clear separation of responsibilities between a morphs constituent parts (*parts* you say? who needs that, we're all morphs!), it's much less solid than say, MVC/MVP. > Agreed. This week I tried to do morphic the second time in my life. There are a lot of things that I consider to be annoying but then it is also easy to combine and display stuff. Took me not too much time to have a visual representation of my scanner cache tool Was pretty much fun in the end. Norbert

Sept. 25, 2013

Jenkins build is back to stable : Pharo-2.0-Tests Â» run 1,vm,win #269

by no-reply＠ci.inria.fr

See <https://ci.inria.fr/pharo/job/Pharo-2.0-Tests/Run=run%201,VM=vm,label=win/2…>

Sept. 25, 2013