July 2013 - Pharo-dev - lists.pharo.org

Re: [Pharo-dev] thisContext and block

by Camille Teruel

On 25 juil. 2013, at 13:12, ClÃ©ment Bera wrote: > Perhaps you should add some value message so that the assertions are actually run, shouldn't you ? I always felt that e-mails lack an unsend command :D > 2013/7/25 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> > For the people following I added a test to show the homeContext of a block > > > | homeContext b1 | > homeContext := thisContext. > b1 := [| b2 | > self assert: thisContext closure == b1. > self assert: b1 outerContext == homeContext. > self assert: b1 home = homeContext. > b2 := [self assert: thisContext closure == b2. > self assert: b2 outerContext closure outerContext == homeContext]. > self assert: b2 home = homeContext. > b2 value]. > b1 value > > > > >> >> >> On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 2:02 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: >> thanks! >> It makes a lot of sense. >> I will play with another example because I want to really understand the outerContext of closure vs the home context. >> >> The outerContext is a link in the static chain. Each block is created inside some context. This is the block's outerContext. If the block is not nested then the outerCOntext will also be the home context But if the block is nested inside another block activation, then the outerContext refers to that block activation, and the block activation's block's outerContext is the home context. So there are as many outerContext steps as there are nesting levels. >> >> | homeContext b1 | >> homeContext := thisContext. >> b1 := [| b2 | >> self assert: thisContext closure == b1. >> self assert: b1 outerContext == homeContext. >> b2 := [self assert: thisContext closure == b2. >> self assert: b2 outerContext closure outerContext == homeContext]. >> b2 value]. >> b1 value >> >> Ignore the "bN appears to be undefined at this point" and evaluate the above. No assert fails. >> >> Draw a picture. >> >> >> Stef >> >> On Jul 23, 2013, at 6:58 AM, ClÃ©ment Bera <bera.clement(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> This is because of compilation optimization. >>> >>> 2013/7/22 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >>> Hi >>> >>> when I execute the following >>> >>> first >>> "Bexp new first" >>> | temp | >>> temp := 2. >>> [ temp. >>> thisContext inspect.] value. >>> ^ temp >>> >>> tmp in the inspector is nil and does not hold 2 and I was wondering why. >>> I thought that thisContext was returning the blockContext >>> In the outercontext of thisContext blockClosure, tmp is also nil. >>> >>> >>> This is because here 'temp.' is evaluated for effect (the value is not stored anywhere) and it has no side effect (reading a variable cannot lead to a modification of state of another object). So the compiler removes it. As it is removed, it is the same as if it was not in the block. So the block cannot access temp. Now write 'temp:= #foo' or 'temp foo' you will get it. >>> >>> first >>> "Bexp new first" >>> | temp | >>> temp := 2. >>> [ temp. >>> temp traceCr. >>> thisContext inspect.] value. >>> ^ temp >>> >>> output 2 on the transcript. >>> >>> In this case 'temp.' is still removed, but the value of temp still need to be copied in the block for ' temp traceCr.'.'temp traceCr' is also evaluated for effect, but has the side effect to output the transcript, so the compiler cannot remove it. >>> >>> Basically the is very few things that the compiler removes, and one of them is variable read for effect, because you are sure it cannot lead to any issue. >>> >>> Stef >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> best, >> Eliot > >

July 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] thisContext and block

by ClÃ©ment Bera

Perhaps you should add some value message so that the assertions are actually run, shouldn't you ? 2013/7/25 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> > For the people following I added a test to show the homeContext of a block > > > | homeContext b1 | > homeContext := thisContext. > b1 := [| b2 | > self assert: thisContext closure == b1. > self assert: b1 outerContext == homeContext. > self assert: b1 home = homeContext. > b2 := [self assert: thisContext closure == b2. > self assert: b2 outerContext closure outerContext == > homeContext]. > self assert: b2 home = homeContext. > b2 value]. > b1 value > > > > > > > On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 2:02 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse < > stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > >> thanks! >> It makes a lot of sense. >> I will play with another example because I want to really understand the >> outerContext of closure vs the home context. >> > > The outerContext is a link in the static chain. Each block is created > inside some context. This is the block's outerContext. If the block is > not nested then the outerCOntext will also be the home context But if the > block is nested inside another block activation, then the outerContext > refers to that block activation, and the block activation's block's > outerContext is the home context. So there are as many outerContext steps > as there are nesting levels. > > | homeContext b1 | > homeContext := thisContext. > b1 := [| b2 | > self assert: thisContext closure == b1. > self assert: b1 outerContext == homeContext. > b2 := [self assert: thisContext closure == b2. > self assert: b2 outerContext closure outerContext == > homeContext]. > b2 value]. > b1 value > > Ignore the "bN appears to be undefined at this point" and evaluate the > above. No assert fails. > > Draw a picture. > > >> Stef >> >> On Jul 23, 2013, at 6:58 AM, ClÃ©ment Bera <bera.clement(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> This is because of compilation optimization. >> >> 2013/7/22 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >> >>> Hi >>> >>> when I execute the following >>> >>> first >>> "Bexp new first" >>> | temp | >>> temp := 2. >>> [ temp. >>> thisContext inspect.] value. >>> ^ temp >>> >>> tmp in the inspector is nil and does not hold 2 and I was wondering why. >>> I thought that thisContext was returning the blockContext >>> In the outercontext of thisContext blockClosure, tmp is also nil. >>> >>> >> This is because here 'temp.' is evaluated for effect (the value is not >> stored anywhere) and it has no side effect (reading a variable cannot lead >> to a modification of state of another object). So the compiler removes it. >> As it is removed, it is the same as if it was not in the block. So the >> block cannot access temp. Now write 'temp:= #foo' or 'temp foo' you will >> get it. >> >> >>> first >>> "Bexp new first" >>> | temp | >>> temp := 2. >>> [ temp. >>> temp traceCr. >>> thisContext inspect.] value. >>> ^ temp >>> >>> output 2 on the transcript. >>> >>> In this case 'temp.' is still removed, but the value of temp still need >> to be copied in the block for ' temp traceCr.'.'temp traceCr' is also >> evaluated for effect, but has the side effect to output the transcript, so >> the compiler cannot remove it. >> >> Basically the is very few things that the compiler removes, and one of >> them is variable read for effect, because you are sure it cannot lead to >> any issue. >> >> >>> Stef >>> >>> >> >> > > > -- > best, > Eliot > > >

July 25, 2013

[pharo-project/pharo-core]

by GitHub

Branch: refs/tags/30299 Home: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core

July 25, 2013

[pharo-project/pharo-core] e8dc17: 30299

by GitHub

Branch: refs/heads/3.0 Home: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core Commit: e8dc17cb1e2f94c6f9802d25be5f5d539505777f https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core/commit/e8dc17cb1e2f94c6f9802d25… Author: Jenkins Build Server <board(a)pharo-project.org> Date: 2013-07-25 (Thu, 25 Jul 2013) Changed paths: A FuelTools-Debugger/extension/DebugSession/class/encodeDebugInformationOn_.st A FuelTools-Debugger/extension/DebugSession/class/serializeTestFailureContext_toFileNamed_.st A FuelTools-Debugger/extension/DebugSession/instance/serializeStack.st M FuelTools-Debugger/extension/Debugger/class/encodeDebugInformationOn_.st A FuelTools-Debugger/extension/SpecDebugger/class/menuFuelStackAction_.st A FuelTools-Debugger/extension/SpecDebuggerToolbar/instance/serializeStack.st M Kernel-Methods/ContextPart.cls/instance/debugger access/errorReportOn_.st A ScriptLoader30/ScriptLoader.cls/instance/pharo - scripts/script134.st A ScriptLoader30/ScriptLoader.cls/instance/pharo - updates/update30299.st M ScriptLoader30/ScriptLoader.cls/instance/public/commentForCurrentUpdate.st M Spec-Debugger/SpecDebugger.cls/class/menu/menuStackAction_.st M Spec-Debugger/SpecDebugger.cls/class/menu/menuStack_.st Log Message: ----------- 30299 11239 ContextPart>>errorReportOn: uses deprecated methods https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/11239 11232 Fuel out stack menu entry is missing https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/11232

July 25, 2013

[update 3.0] #30299

by Marcus Denker

30299 ----- 11239 ContextPart>>errorReportOn: uses deprecated methods https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/11239 11232 Fuel out stack menu entry is missing https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/11232 Diff information: http://smalltalkhub.com/mc/Pharo/Pharo30/main/Spec-Debugger-MarcusDenker.10… http://smalltalkhub.com/mc/Pharo/Pharo30/main/Kernel-MarcusDenker.1534.diff http://smalltalkhub.com/mc/Pharo/Pharo30/main/FuelTools-Debugger-MarcusDenk…

July 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] thisContext and block

by StÃ©phane Ducasse

For the people following I added a test to show the homeContext of a block | homeContext b1 | homeContext := thisContext. b1 := [| b2 | self assert: thisContext closure == b1. self assert: b1 outerContext == homeContext. self assert: b1 home = homeContext. b2 := [self assert: thisContext closure == b2. self assert: b2 outerContext closure outerContext == homeContext]. self assert: b2 home = homeContext. b2 value]. b1 value > > > On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 2:02 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > thanks! > It makes a lot of sense. > I will play with another example because I want to really understand the outerContext of closure vs the home context. > > The outerContext is a link in the static chain. Each block is created inside some context. This is the block's outerContext. If the block is not nested then the outerCOntext will also be the home context But if the block is nested inside another block activation, then the outerContext refers to that block activation, and the block activation's block's outerContext is the home context. So there are as many outerContext steps as there are nesting levels. > > | homeContext b1 | > homeContext := thisContext. > b1 := [| b2 | > self assert: thisContext closure == b1. > self assert: b1 outerContext == homeContext. > b2 := [self assert: thisContext closure == b2. > self assert: b2 outerContext closure outerContext == homeContext]. > b2 value]. > b1 value > > Ignore the "bN appears to be undefined at this point" and evaluate the above. No assert fails. > > Draw a picture. > > > Stef > > On Jul 23, 2013, at 6:58 AM, ClÃ©ment Bera <bera.clement(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> This is because of compilation optimization. >> >> 2013/7/22 StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> >> Hi >> >> when I execute the following >> >> first >> "Bexp new first" >> | temp | >> temp := 2. >> [ temp. >> thisContext inspect.] value. >> ^ temp >> >> tmp in the inspector is nil and does not hold 2 and I was wondering why. >> I thought that thisContext was returning the blockContext >> In the outercontext of thisContext blockClosure, tmp is also nil. >> >> >> This is because here 'temp.' is evaluated for effect (the value is not stored anywhere) and it has no side effect (reading a variable cannot lead to a modification of state of another object). So the compiler removes it. As it is removed, it is the same as if it was not in the block. So the block cannot access temp. Now write 'temp:= #foo' or 'temp foo' you will get it. >> >> first >> "Bexp new first" >> | temp | >> temp := 2. >> [ temp. >> temp traceCr. >> thisContext inspect.] value. >> ^ temp >> >> output 2 on the transcript. >> >> In this case 'temp.' is still removed, but the value of temp still need to be copied in the block for ' temp traceCr.'.'temp traceCr' is also evaluated for effect, but has the side effect to output the transcript, so the compiler cannot remove it. >> >> Basically the is very few things that the compiler removes, and one of them is variable read for effect, because you are sure it cannot lead to any issue. >> >> Stef >> >> > > > > > -- > best, > Eliot

July 25, 2013

[pharo-project/pharo-core]

by GitHub

Branch: refs/tags/30298 Home: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core

July 25, 2013

[pharo-project/pharo-core] 332e8c: 30298

by GitHub

Branch: refs/heads/3.0 Home: https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core Commit: 332e8c4ead04b4a592097e915c355841cc6a9023 https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-core/commit/332e8c4ead04b4a592097e91… Author: Jenkins Build Server <board(a)pharo-project.org> Date: 2013-07-25 (Thu, 25 Jul 2013) Changed paths: A ScriptLoader30/ScriptLoader.cls/instance/pharo - scripts/script133.st A ScriptLoader30/ScriptLoader.cls/instance/pharo - updates/update30298.st M ScriptLoader30/ScriptLoader.cls/instance/public/commentForCurrentUpdate.st M Settings-Tools/DebugSystemSettings.cls/class/settings/debugSettingsOn_.st A Spec-Debugger/SpecDebugger.cls/class/utilities/closeAllDebuggers.st A Spec-Debugger/SpecDebugger.cls/class/window color/patchworkUIThemeColor.st M Spec-Debugger/SpecDebugger.cls/instance/actions/close.st M Spec-Debugger/SpecPreDebugWindow.cls/instance/protocol/initialExtent.st Log Message: ----------- 30298 11236 Proceed action does not close the refresh processes https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/11236 11235 The new debugger is missing some utilities methods https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/11235 11231 Predebugger window too small & not skipped to full debugger https://pharo.fogbugz.com/f/cases/11231

July 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Pharo-users] [Moose-dev] Re: Re: [ann] snapshotcello

by Tudor Girba

This would be so cool :). Doru On Thu, Jul 25, 2013 at 8:47 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr > wrote: > Hi dale > > do you plan to write a visitor on metacello spec? > > Stef > > On Jul 24, 2013, at 9:38 PM, Dale K. Henrichs < > dale.henrichs(a)gemtalksystems.com> wrote: > > > Doru, > > > > Are you going to be at ESUG this year? > > > > I think there are some features of the Metacello Preview that can be of > a great help to your Moose development and I think you and I need to spend > time discussing the ins and outs in detail ... > > > > I have also done a fair amount or work writing tools for tODE that > manipulate sets of configurations using the MetacelloToolBox (Metacello > Preview version), so perhaps your goal of "automatic transitive versioning > of all nested configurations" is not as far away as you think. And again, I > think some deep discussions at a whiteboard and some pair programming is > probably the most efficient... > > > > Dale > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > | From: "Tudor Girba" <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> > > | To: "Pharo Development List" <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> > > | Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 11:24:20 AM > > | Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] [Pharo-users] [Moose-dev] Re: Re: [ann] > snapshotcello > > | > > | Hi, > > | > > | On Jul 24, 2013, at 5:25 PM, Johan Brichau <johan(a)inceptive.be> > > | wrote: > > | > > | > Doru, > > | > > > | > What do you understand with 'levels'? Is it referenced projects? > > | > > | Yes. Nested projects, each being under development :) > > | > > | > Perhaps this is the difference I did not immediately extract from > > | > your description. Re-reading it with this focus makes the > > | > difference clear I think. > > | > > > | > My use of the toolbox is indeed to generate or update a version for > > | > a single project where all 'nested' projects are referenced by > > | > project version. As I understand it, the snapshot version is a > > | > 'flattened' version containing all packages? > > | > > | Yes. > > | > > | My end goal would be to be able to create automatic transitive > > | versioning of all nested configurations, but this requires some more > > | work, and likely some extension at the level of Metacello. So, until > > | this happens, we now have the option of snapshotting all packages. > > | > > | The cool thing is that if you have something like: > > | ConfigurationOfMoose depends on ConfigurationOfGlamour > > | > > | then in the list of snapshotted packages, you will also get the > > | version of ConfigurationOfGlamour. Thus, essentially, you obtain the > > | same thing as if you would load nested configurations. > > | > > | The only problem is that because we lose configuration nesting > > | information, Metacello is unable to resolve possible diamond > > | conflicts. For example, suppose you have a project that depends on a > > | certain version X of Glamour, but also would like to load the whole > > | Moose that loads version Y of Glamour. If you use normal > > | configurations, Metacello should be able to detect the conflict, but > > | if you only have flattened versions, you will likely not detect the > > | conflict so easily. In any case, I think this is acceptable at the > > | moment. > > | > > | Cheers, > > | Doru > > | > > | > > | > > | > I think I get it now. thanks > > | > > > | > Johan > > | > > > | > On 24 Jul 2013, at 12:45, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > > | > > > | >> Perhaps I missed something in the toolbox, but as far as I know > > | >> you cannot create a version of a configuration that is composed > > | >> of multiple sub-projects nested multiple levels deep. > > | >> > > | >> Could you describe the way you are using the Metacello Toolbox? > > | >> > > | >> Doru > > | >> > > | >> > > | >> On Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 10:39 AM, Johan Brichau > > | >> <johan(a)inceptive.be> wrote: > > | >> Hi Doru, Stef, > > | >> > > | >> May I ask what the difference is with the version generation and > > | >> updating methods found in MetacelloToolbox ? I want to > > | >> understand, because I am currently using these of > > | >> MetacelloToolbox to do the things you describe. > > | >> > > | >> Cheers! > > | >> Johan > > | >> > > | >> On 24 Jul 2013, at 09:52, StÃ©phane Ducasse > > | >> <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > | >> > > | >>> > > | >>> On Jul 24, 2013, at 9:11 AM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> > > | >>> wrote: > > | >>> > > | >>>> Hi, > > | >>>> > > | >>>> On Jul 24, 2013, at 8:48 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse > > | >>>> <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > > | >>>> > > | >>>>> > > | >>>>> On Jul 23, 2013, at 11:51 PM, Dale K. Henrichs > > | >>>>> <dale.henrichs(a)gemtalksystems.com> wrote: > > | >>>>> > > | >>>>>> Stef, > > | >>>>>> > > | >>>>>> I haven't completely wrapped my brain around what > > | >>>>>> SnapshotCello does so I don't have an informed opinion ... > > | >>>>>> the fact that you found a need to invent SnapshotCello does > > | >>>>>> speak volumes to the fact that there is a need that is going > > | >>>>>> unmet:). > > | >>>>>> > > | >>>>>> However, I don't like the fact that you end up sending a > > | >>>>>> non-spec message to make this work (#populateSpec:with:). > > | >>>>>> Tools like Versioner will not be able to rewrite a method > > | >>>>>> like this correctly so it is a less than satisfactory > > | >>>>>> workaround to the method literal limit. > > | >>>>> Indeed. May be in the future we could recreate a simple > > | >>>>> compliant spec driven method by interpreting the > > | >>>>> existing configuration trees but this requires some work. > > | >>>> > > | >>>> I do not understand this point. What do you mean by > > | >>>> "interpreting the configuration trees"? > > | >>> > > | >>> I mean going over the configurations with dependencies to > > | >>> recreate the tree structure but with versions. > > | >>> May be this is not needed because for versions we do not need > > | >>> dependencies so just group them per configurations. > > | >>> > > | >>>> > > | >>>> Doru > > | >>>> > > | >>>>>> > > | >>>>>> With that said it _is_ performing a useful function ... > > | >>>>>> > > | >>>>>> I have recently come up with an approach to addressing the > > | >>>>>> method literal limit from a slightly different angle and I > > | >>>>>> would assume that SnapshotCello could be recast to use this > > | >>>>>> "approved approach" when the new techinique becomes > > | >>>>>> available. At that time it would make sense to roll the > > | >>>>>> SnapshotCello funtionality into the MetacelloToolBox... > > | >>>>>> > > | >>>>>> Dale > > | >>>>>> > > | >>>>>> [1] > > | >>>>>> > http://forum.world.st/Loading-problem-in-Seaside-tp4699965p4700161.html > > | >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- > > | >>>>>> | From: "StÃ©phane Ducasse" <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> > > | >>>>>> | To: "Moose-related development" <moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch> > > | >>>>>> | Cc: "Any question about pharo is welcome" > > | >>>>>> | <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org>, "Pharo Development List" > > | >>>>>> | <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> > > | >>>>>> | Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 2:17:50 PM > > | >>>>>> | Subject: [Moose-dev] Re: [ann] snapshotcello > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | Nice to see SnapshotCello coming to live. May be it should > > | >>>>>> | be > > | >>>>>> | integrated to Metacello. > > | >>>>>> | Because everybody may need this cool feature. > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | Stef > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | On Jul 23, 2013, at 10:43 PM, Tudor Girba > > | >>>>>> | <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> > > | >>>>>> | wrote: > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > Hi, > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > Stef and I developed Snapshotcello, a little utility that > > | >>>>>> | > enables > > | >>>>>> | > you to freeze a snapshot of a given configuration based on > > | >>>>>> | > what is > > | >>>>>> | > already loaded in your current image. > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > The idea is simple. You develop against the latest > > | >>>>>> | > versions of all > > | >>>>>> | > packages, and commit your changes for each package. When > > | >>>>>> | > you are > > | >>>>>> | > ready for a release, you assemble your image, and generate > > | >>>>>> | > a > > | >>>>>> | > snapshot version that can be reloaded later. > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > Here is an example of how it can work to take a snapshot > > | >>>>>> | > of a > > | >>>>>> | > development version: > > | >>>>>> | > Snapshotcello new > > | >>>>>> | > configurationClass: ConfigurationOfMoose; > > | >>>>>> | > configurationVersion: #development; > > | >>>>>> | > publishVersion: '4.8-snapshot' > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > You can find more details here: > > | >>>>>> | > > http://www.tudorgirba.com/blog/snapshotcello-take-a-snapshot-when-you-re-re… > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > You can get the code at: > > | >>>>>> | > Gofer new > > | >>>>>> | > smalltalkhubUser: 'girba' project: 'Snapshotcello'; > > | >>>>>> | > package: 'ConfigurationOfSnapshotcello'; > > | >>>>>> | > load. > > | >>>>>> | > (Smalltalk globals at: #ConfigurationOfSnapshotcello) > > | >>>>>> | > loadDevelopment > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > Cheers, > > | >>>>>> | > Doru > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > -- > > | >>>>>> | > www.tudorgirba.com > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > "Every successful trip needs a suitable vehicle." > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > > > | >>>>>> | > _______________________________________________ > > | >>>>>> | > Moose-dev mailing list > > | >>>>>> | > Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch > > | >>>>>> | > https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | _______________________________________________ > > | >>>>>> | Moose-dev mailing list > > | >>>>>> | Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch > > | >>>>>> | https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>> > > | >>>>> > > | >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > | >>>>> Moose-dev mailing list > > | >>>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch > > | >>>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev > > | >>>> > > | >>>> -- > > | >>>> www.tudorgirba.com > > | >>>> > > | >>>> "From an abstract enough point of view, any two things are > > | >>>> similar." > > | >>> > > | >>> > > | >> > > | >> > > | >> > > | >> > > | >> -- > > | >> www.tudorgirba.com > > | >> > > | >> "Every thing has its own flow" > > | > > > | > > > | > > | -- > > | www.tudorgirba.com > > | > > | "Every now and then stop and ask yourself if the war you're fighting > > | is the right one." > > | > > | > > | > > | > > | > > > > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

July 25, 2013

Re: [Pharo-dev] [Pharo-users] [Moose-dev] Re: Re: [ann] snapshotcello

by Tudor Girba

Unfortunately, I will not be able to join :( Doru On Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 9:38 PM, Dale K. Henrichs < dale.henrichs(a)gemtalksystems.com> wrote: > Doru, > > Are you going to be at ESUG this year? > > I think there are some features of the Metacello Preview that can be of a > great help to your Moose development and I think you and I need to spend > time discussing the ins and outs in detail ... > > I have also done a fair amount or work writing tools for tODE that > manipulate sets of configurations using the MetacelloToolBox (Metacello > Preview version), so perhaps your goal of "automatic transitive versioning > of all nested configurations" is not as far away as you think. And again, I > think some deep discussions at a whiteboard and some pair programming is > probably the most efficient... > > Dale > > ----- Original Message ----- > | From: "Tudor Girba" <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> > | To: "Pharo Development List" <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> > | Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2013 11:24:20 AM > | Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] [Pharo-users] [Moose-dev] Re: Re: [ann] > snapshotcello > | > | Hi, > | > | On Jul 24, 2013, at 5:25 PM, Johan Brichau <johan(a)inceptive.be> > | wrote: > | > | > Doru, > | > > | > What do you understand with 'levels'? Is it referenced projects? > | > | Yes. Nested projects, each being under development :) > | > | > Perhaps this is the difference I did not immediately extract from > | > your description. Re-reading it with this focus makes the > | > difference clear I think. > | > > | > My use of the toolbox is indeed to generate or update a version for > | > a single project where all 'nested' projects are referenced by > | > project version. As I understand it, the snapshot version is a > | > 'flattened' version containing all packages? > | > | Yes. > | > | My end goal would be to be able to create automatic transitive > | versioning of all nested configurations, but this requires some more > | work, and likely some extension at the level of Metacello. So, until > | this happens, we now have the option of snapshotting all packages. > | > | The cool thing is that if you have something like: > | ConfigurationOfMoose depends on ConfigurationOfGlamour > | > | then in the list of snapshotted packages, you will also get the > | version of ConfigurationOfGlamour. Thus, essentially, you obtain the > | same thing as if you would load nested configurations. > | > | The only problem is that because we lose configuration nesting > | information, Metacello is unable to resolve possible diamond > | conflicts. For example, suppose you have a project that depends on a > | certain version X of Glamour, but also would like to load the whole > | Moose that loads version Y of Glamour. If you use normal > | configurations, Metacello should be able to detect the conflict, but > | if you only have flattened versions, you will likely not detect the > | conflict so easily. In any case, I think this is acceptable at the > | moment. > | > | Cheers, > | Doru > | > | > | > | > I think I get it now. thanks > | > > | > Johan > | > > | > On 24 Jul 2013, at 12:45, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote: > | > > | >> Perhaps I missed something in the toolbox, but as far as I know > | >> you cannot create a version of a configuration that is composed > | >> of multiple sub-projects nested multiple levels deep. > | >> > | >> Could you describe the way you are using the Metacello Toolbox? > | >> > | >> Doru > | >> > | >> > | >> On Wed, Jul 24, 2013 at 10:39 AM, Johan Brichau > | >> <johan(a)inceptive.be> wrote: > | >> Hi Doru, Stef, > | >> > | >> May I ask what the difference is with the version generation and > | >> updating methods found in MetacelloToolbox ? I want to > | >> understand, because I am currently using these of > | >> MetacelloToolbox to do the things you describe. > | >> > | >> Cheers! > | >> Johan > | >> > | >> On 24 Jul 2013, at 09:52, StÃ©phane Ducasse > | >> <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > | >> > | >>> > | >>> On Jul 24, 2013, at 9:11 AM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> > | >>> wrote: > | >>> > | >>>> Hi, > | >>>> > | >>>> On Jul 24, 2013, at 8:48 AM, StÃ©phane Ducasse > | >>>> <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> wrote: > | >>>> > | >>>>> > | >>>>> On Jul 23, 2013, at 11:51 PM, Dale K. Henrichs > | >>>>> <dale.henrichs(a)gemtalksystems.com> wrote: > | >>>>> > | >>>>>> Stef, > | >>>>>> > | >>>>>> I haven't completely wrapped my brain around what > | >>>>>> SnapshotCello does so I don't have an informed opinion ... > | >>>>>> the fact that you found a need to invent SnapshotCello does > | >>>>>> speak volumes to the fact that there is a need that is going > | >>>>>> unmet:). > | >>>>>> > | >>>>>> However, I don't like the fact that you end up sending a > | >>>>>> non-spec message to make this work (#populateSpec:with:). > | >>>>>> Tools like Versioner will not be able to rewrite a method > | >>>>>> like this correctly so it is a less than satisfactory > | >>>>>> workaround to the method literal limit. > | >>>>> Indeed. May be in the future we could recreate a simple > | >>>>> compliant spec driven method by interpreting the > | >>>>> existing configuration trees but this requires some work. > | >>>> > | >>>> I do not understand this point. What do you mean by > | >>>> "interpreting the configuration trees"? > | >>> > | >>> I mean going over the configurations with dependencies to > | >>> recreate the tree structure but with versions. > | >>> May be this is not needed because for versions we do not need > | >>> dependencies so just group them per configurations. > | >>> > | >>>> > | >>>> Doru > | >>>> > | >>>>>> > | >>>>>> With that said it _is_ performing a useful function ... > | >>>>>> > | >>>>>> I have recently come up with an approach to addressing the > | >>>>>> method literal limit from a slightly different angle and I > | >>>>>> would assume that SnapshotCello could be recast to use this > | >>>>>> "approved approach" when the new techinique becomes > | >>>>>> available. At that time it would make sense to roll the > | >>>>>> SnapshotCello funtionality into the MetacelloToolBox... > | >>>>>> > | >>>>>> Dale > | >>>>>> > | >>>>>> [1] > | >>>>>> > http://forum.world.st/Loading-problem-in-Seaside-tp4699965p4700161.html > | >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- > | >>>>>> | From: "StÃ©phane Ducasse" <stephane.ducasse(a)inria.fr> > | >>>>>> | To: "Moose-related development" <moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch> > | >>>>>> | Cc: "Any question about pharo is welcome" > | >>>>>> | <pharo-users(a)lists.pharo.org>, "Pharo Development List" > | >>>>>> | <pharo-dev(a)lists.pharo.org> > | >>>>>> | Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 2:17:50 PM > | >>>>>> | Subject: [Moose-dev] Re: [ann] snapshotcello > | >>>>>> | > | >>>>>> | Nice to see SnapshotCello coming to live. May be it should > | >>>>>> | be > | >>>>>> | integrated to Metacello. > | >>>>>> | Because everybody may need this cool feature. > | >>>>>> | > | >>>>>> | Stef > | >>>>>> | > | >>>>>> | On Jul 23, 2013, at 10:43 PM, Tudor Girba > | >>>>>> | <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> > | >>>>>> | wrote: > | >>>>>> | > | >>>>>> | > Hi, > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > Stef and I developed Snapshotcello, a little utility that > | >>>>>> | > enables > | >>>>>> | > you to freeze a snapshot of a given configuration based on > | >>>>>> | > what is > | >>>>>> | > already loaded in your current image. > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > The idea is simple. You develop against the latest > | >>>>>> | > versions of all > | >>>>>> | > packages, and commit your changes for each package. When > | >>>>>> | > you are > | >>>>>> | > ready for a release, you assemble your image, and generate > | >>>>>> | > a > | >>>>>> | > snapshot version that can be reloaded later. > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > Here is an example of how it can work to take a snapshot > | >>>>>> | > of a > | >>>>>> | > development version: > | >>>>>> | > Snapshotcello new > | >>>>>> | > configurationClass: ConfigurationOfMoose; > | >>>>>> | > configurationVersion: #development; > | >>>>>> | > publishVersion: '4.8-snapshot' > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > You can find more details here: > | >>>>>> | > > http://www.tudorgirba.com/blog/snapshotcello-take-a-snapshot-when-you-re-re… > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > You can get the code at: > | >>>>>> | > Gofer new > | >>>>>> | > smalltalkhubUser: 'girba' project: 'Snapshotcello'; > | >>>>>> | > package: 'ConfigurationOfSnapshotcello'; > | >>>>>> | > load. > | >>>>>> | > (Smalltalk globals at: #ConfigurationOfSnapshotcello) > | >>>>>> | > loadDevelopment > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > Cheers, > | >>>>>> | > Doru > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > -- > | >>>>>> | > www.tudorgirba.com > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > "Every successful trip needs a suitable vehicle." > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > > | >>>>>> | > _______________________________________________ > | >>>>>> | > Moose-dev mailing list > | >>>>>> | > Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch > | >>>>>> | > https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev > | >>>>>> | > | >>>>>> | > | >>>>>> | _______________________________________________ > | >>>>>> | Moose-dev mailing list > | >>>>>> | Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch > | >>>>>> | https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev > | >>>>>> | > | >>>>> > | >>>>> > | >>>>> _______________________________________________ > | >>>>> Moose-dev mailing list > | >>>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch > | >>>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev > | >>>> > | >>>> -- > | >>>> www.tudorgirba.com > | >>>> > | >>>> "From an abstract enough point of view, any two things are > | >>>> similar." > | >>> > | >>> > | >> > | >> > | >> > | >> > | >> -- > | >> www.tudorgirba.com > | >> > | >> "Every thing has its own flow" > | > > | > > | > | -- > | www.tudorgirba.com > | > | "Every now and then stop and ask yourself if the war you're fighting > | is the right one." > | > | > | > | > | > > -- www.tudorgirba.com "Every thing has its own flow"

July 25, 2013